Should I make the Switch to Linux.

C

Codesamurai

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Hello all, first post...so go easy.

I am currently running Win XP pro...on the box listed in my sig(please dont laugh).

It does everything I want it to do..more or less. The biggest things I need in a comp..is a web surfer, gaming (mainly CS 1.6, Jedi Knights II, Jedi Academy, Morrowind), Office apps..and regardless of the "quality" of my comp..it works fine for me.

I have several issues I would like to clarify before I decide to switch or not. I have heard alot about Linux being more secure..where would I find some info on this? I like the idea of no longer being at the mercy of MS...I dont despise them..but I certainley dont like them. if I had a USEABLE alternative..I would very much like to switch.

I have heard alot about Linux being to hard to use, to many choices, too much Knowledge is needed just to start it etc. It seems to me that an OS shouldnt make my life harder..in fact I should barely notice its there. Now I know alot of people who say things are a fan of one OS or the other. My question is there a flavor of Linux out there that installs, and runs as stable (yes I never thought I would say stable in reference to a MS OS.), is as intuitive to use, and offers me the same features? I have no desire to compile my kernel, or recompile to add in server support. I need a desktop OS, stability is my major concern, that allows me to do everyday things (play MP3's, watch DVD's, Surf the web, A little Counterstrike, edit photos..boring stuff that we all do.), and doesnt need a Tome of ancient knowledge to keep running. Dont get me wrong..I have no problems hunting down drivers, or configuring stuff (heck I can still run DOS without help)..but I dont need the hassle of recompiling to get sound, or wondering if my Video card is going to work this time.

I also have some apps that I would need an equivalent too.

MS Office XP pro
MS visual studio (only use the C++ complier..just a hobby)
Nero 5.0 (with incd, backup software..not the garbage version they give away with burners)
Winamp...MUST HAVE MP3's
WinDVD..(for my new DVD drive I am buying..btw STAPLES has a deal on 8x +/- for 85.00..no rebate needed)
Photoshop elements
Obviously a web browser..and a email client
Counterstrike would be sweet..but you can thave everything
SO would the Jedi Knight games, or some type of shooter.

Obviously my hardware is listed in my sig...so I would need the appropriate drivers.

Sorry for the long post. Thanks in advance for any help.

Codesamurai
 
If gaming is a primary concern, stay away.

Everything else is doable, more or less. As far as the programming goes, Linux is a generally more friendly environment to do it in (unless you've got a major hard-on for the point & drool GUI designer in Visual Studio).
 
I also have some apps that I would need an equivalent too.
Now, do you mean, "I need a clone of these programs, or the programs themselves"? Or are you willing to invest some time in learning the new programs?

Regardless, given your requirements, you will want to stick with XP. Linux is great, don't get me wrong, and the desktop is outstanding, but there is no distro that I know of that comes with 3d support, and sound is still in it's infancy ( that's a nice euphamism for saying "IT FUCKING SUCKS" ). A little work, and these issues are resolved, but it took me a while to work them out.

if you do decide to play with linux, try FC1 initially. I know fc2 is out, but it's sorta the bastard stepchild of the bunch. FC3 should be fairly impressive, but fc2 has some...issues.
 
Wow guys,

Thanks for the very speedy replies.

Let me clarify some. I dont neeed clones of those apps. I do need apps that do the same thing though. I have no prob's learning a new app. That sint much of a concern..I was more or less worried about not being able to manipulate family photos, watch a DVD, play MP3's. I have no real tie to any app I currently have. I dont need Winamp..I do need an MP3 player though. Like I said the c++ thing is just a hobby.

The entire NO 3D thing has set me back though. DO you mean no 3D hardware is supported? I guess I am unsure of what you mean by that. I was looking round the Gentoo site (trust me..Gentoo is not for me)..and they had a rather large line about Linux having 3D support of some type contrary to popular belief.

Sound. Hmm. I am no audiphile..but I NEDD my music. I run a set of headphones 99% of the time. The other 1 % is when I use my comp for a jukebox at the House during a party.

I also wanted to clarify that I am by no means a newbie to computers or OS's. I been runnning DOS since PCjr days. I can write BAT"s, etc. I build my own boxes, Setup my own network...i am no dunce when it comes to these things. If getting things working takes a little work fine..I just dont want the days of win95 when soudn would go out for w eek at a time..then magically start working again. If I have to do some work to get it runnung fine..but having to do it again and again is not for me anymore.

Thanks again...and I'll let yoiu know what I decide.


Codesamurai
 
Well Linux has XMMS which is almost identical to winamp. Openoffice to replace microsoft office. The gimp to replace photoshop.

Xine to play DVD's. No good DVD authoring software for linux that I am aware of. So if you want to burn DVD's i'm not sure that linux is a good idea.


"The entire NO 3D thing has set me back though. DO you mean no 3D hardware is supported?"
It is supported. There are drivers for Nvidia and ATI. Nvidia drivers are further along for linux.

Gaming is a no go for you on those games. What games will work for you are Return to Castle Wolfenstien, Serious Sam, Medal of Honor, Tribes 2, Neverwinter Nights, America's Army, Doom, upcoming Doom 3, Quake 3, UT2003 and 2004 and some others.

For someone who has never used linux before it's going to take you awhile to get going and comfortable in it. So I have two suggestions. Either setup a dual boot system so you can work on getting linux going without ditching windows just yet or stick with Windows XP.

If you want to try linux I suggest Knoppix or Mandrake move as you can burn those to cd, boot from them and run linux from the cd without having to install a thing to your hard drive. Just gives you a quick and easy way to check out linux.
If you want a full fledged distro then I would say Mandrake 10 is your best bet for now.

Edit - I have been playing around with linux for more than 3 years and still can't make the switch to it. There are apps in windows that I need that do not have Linux equivelents. Such as DVD authoring and copying and games.
 
Codesamurai said:
I am currently running Win XP pro...on the box listed in my sig(please dont laugh).
Click to expand...
Now why would we laugh? It's a working system, good for what you run and all... :cool:

Knoppix, dual boot, or even virtualization (VMWare, VirtualPC), or even get an old box to try Linux out is probably what you need.
 
windows xp/2k is very stable compared to 9x windows. if your computer crashes a lot, there's probably more underlying problems.

anyway, i've been playing with linux for a while, mainly my personal web server, nothing big. also, my math/cs department's server at my school runs linux. i'm by no means a guru but perhaps more knowledgeable than an average person. i think linux is great for servers but i wouldn't consider using it for my day to day desktop, especially for a newcomer to linux. there's a lot to learn. one of the main drawbacks is program support. though there may be programs that do the same thing in linux, they are different from what you use in windows. i have gotten quite used to my windows programs, i know lot's of the shortcuts to do things quickly. some things would certaintly be similar on the linux program but it would take me a while to get used to the differences.

if you happened to have a spare box to mess around with that would be perfect. or you could try one of the live cd's, like knoppix

linux is definately worth while to be familiar with, but maybe not for a main rig.
 
I built up a Gentoo box for home to play around with, but never really got the time...

so, I moved it into my office at work, where more and more I'm moving my tasks over to it and finding it more and more pleasurable to not get booted out of things randomly all the time. but I still need my windoze machine. kinda like a safety blanket (for now anyway). as I get more confident though I'll move away from it mostly, exept for my games machine.

All i'm suggesting is by all means set one and get into it but don't throw away your win box yet.
 
I'm all for recommending Linux to people, but I mean, it seems like WIndows meets all your current needs, and it seems like the only real reason to switch is to escape the Microsoft machine. I don't have anything against Microsoft like some people, I use both Windows and Linux (and Tru64 Unix, heh); both serve unique purposes. I game in Windows, and I code/develop and generally work in Linux.

I'm not gonna be delusional by some Linux users; if you do game, you will have to use Windows. Sure, Wine and Transgaming Winex implement Windows API and DirectX APIs for Linux, but not all games are supported. What I would like is for more games to have a native Linux version (a la UT 2004 and such).

In terms of 3D: out the gate, I think XOR != OR is right; there is no Linux distro that has 3D rendering enabled or automatically configured for you. For my Radeon 9600XT, I had to install ATi drivers, update my OpenGL libraries, reconfigure my X configuration, then I finally had Direct Rendering enabled. Not quite as easy as the "Install Catalyst/Detonators/whatever" drivers huh?
And yes, Nvidia drivers are lightyears ahead of ATi's.

Stability: yes, Linux is stable, I haven't faced many circumstances that totally hosed the system. But then again, I've been using Windows XP for a few years, and barring the time when my memory was defective, have never had a problem with it.

Now, for software substitutes:

Office XP Pro: OpenOffice (Or Ximian Open Office) are the basic equivalent of Office, without Access. I find them to be a little slow though (and I compiled it with features for my system too), but they get the work done.

Visual Studio - sad to say, I don't like any of the IDEs in Linux (Anjuta, Kdesktop's okay, I use it sometimes). Of course, I usually do all my programming in Vim, so I don't really care.

C++ compiler: GCC (GNU C Compiler) can compile C, C++, Objective C, and some others (GCJ can do Java, etc).

Nero - XCDRoast, Eroaster, K3B (my favorite) are GUI apps for burning. CDRecord and CDRDao are commandline tools and they're all pretty good for writing discs.

Winamp: there's a lot of music players in Linux. ZINF, XMMS, Rhythmbox, Amarok, Muzik, Juk, and on and on and on. However, they don't have a replacement with all the features of Foobar.

WinDVD: Xine, Ogle, Mplayer, VLC, and probably more can play DVDs and video formats.

Photoshop Elements: This is where I think Linux is really weak. You will not find something with the power of Photoshop proper, but there is the GIMP 2.0. The GIMP, however, is, I find, harder to use and not as intuitive as Photoshop (don't know about Elements). You'll probably have to learn how to use these.

Webbrowser: Mozilla, Firefox, Netscape Navigator, Opera, Lynx, Links, Konqueror, Epiphany, Galeon, take your pick for a browser. I like Firefox/Firebird most of all, of course.

Email: Ximian Evolution, Mozilla Thunderbird, Mutt, Pine, Sylpheed, Sylpheed-Claws, Xfmail, spruce, and more.

Games: I think I made my point clear. I think some have been able to run steam and CS, and some running Jedi Knight, but don't ask me; I game in Windows.

What I like most about Linux is freedom of choice and configurability. Unlike Windows, which hides a lot of the workings, Linux gives you a lot of control in what you want to do with the system. Oh yeah, and my Linux install with most of what I need on the system is slightly bigger than a base Windows XP install.
 
Lots to agree with here. IMHO linux is one hell of a great OS. It's not for everyone however. It's difficult to learn(if your an old bastard like me) and for a workstation(home desktop) it needs a lot of polishing.

I believe that you would be better off with windows os for gaming. May I also suggest knoppix or a dual boot system with say fedora and a command line only interface. Yeah the gui is cool but linux is better learned in command mode.
 
try it, never hurts to try and learn.

knoppix works straight off a the cd to play around with, and if you are really worried about your data, i'm sure you can find a cheap used 10 gb ide drive to use for a dual boot set-up.

if gentoo is out as an option, i'd recommend suse (but everyone has a different opinion).
 
"Choice" in Linux actually equates to "six hundred different names of programs that do the same thing," with no indication of one that is most common or preferred when getting support. Don't get me wrong, choice is good, but choice usually involves choosing between things that are at least somewhat different. :p

But let me point out a few things:
  • OpenOffice does not only not include an Access equivalent, but also does not include an Outlook equivalent. In fact, there is no program in Linux that can compare to the scheduling integration, calendaring, and e-mail capabilities of Outlook. Ximian Evolution is a great replacement if you only use the e-mail, but then again (in Windows), so is Outlook Express. Also, you will not get the integration between e-mail and other office programs like you get in MS Office. If you don't know what I mean by that, then it's likely you don't use it anyway, so it may not be an issue with you to start with. It's worth keeping in mind, though.
  • As has already been pointed out, there is no Photoshop equivalent. Gimp is nice, but not easy, and not as powerful as PS.
  • People are going to recommend the GCC compiler over MS Visual Studio. What they are not going to tell you is that GCC is just the compiler itself, while Visual Studio is a compiler and an IDE, along with other granular interfaces. GCC alone will not provide you with this, meaning that you will have to relearn how to set up and compile things using the command-line, and you will have to edit things on your own, by hand.
  • For CD/DVD burning, music playing, video watching, web browsing, Linux has more than enough capability to handle those things for you. All you have to do now is find the program that is easiest for you to take advantage of the capabilities (expect many different suggestions).
  • You'll have to jump through hoops to get most games to play, though there are a few out there who are beginning to make playable *nix versions. This may increase in frequency in the future.
  • 3D capabilities are there in Linux, but you have to set them up yourself.

Judging from what you seem to be looking for, I would opine that Linux is not going to be your cup-o-tea in this case. You are going to have to be very hands-on with not only the installation of the OS, but the proceeding configuration and setup. It won't be constantly hands-on, but it will be for longer than it would be in XP, because the two OSes are laid out differently, with different tools for administering and setup/configuration. You would find that "switching" would become very uncomfortable and frustrating for you, especially if you are used to the idea of "an OS should be barely noticable."

HOWEVER, since you say you are interested in tinkering with C++ occasionally as a hobby, it may not hurt for you to maybe set up a dual-boot some time in the near future with Linux, because you'll find that its C underpinnings would be very educational for you. Not only that, but you can get to know the OS, in case you want to make the transition at a later date. Sometimes setting things up in it can be fun, so you may want to give it a try. Also, having dual-boot allows for the best of both worlds (well, so does VMWare, but that costs money). :)
 
Thanks alot guys,

I do have a crappy old WD 17 GB hd kicking around...its only ata 33..but hey..the price is right.

This computer I am using is simply a stopgap system. I want a Hammer...and a kick butt system. I even have the money for it. I just am waiting till PCI-e is out..and the new Hammer's are out and running for awhile. I guess the reason I am telling you this is I plan to build a new comp in the next year or so...and would like to be able to leave MS behind also. I would like to have some stupid fast system...loaded with Hardcore hardware and software..that would simply scare off anyone who dare touch it.

I wanted to clarify that I am not unhappy with XP. I have found it ROCK stable. I think alot of it has to do with my "mature" hardware. Most of the kinks have been worked out as they say with the KT266, the Duron is what it is...and it still runs the doors off a Celery at 2.6. Which would lead to another set of questions. How well does Linux do at "cutting" edge hardware and such? Been learning more everyday, and I am not one to jump into things quickly. SO I can wait as long as it takes.

I guess I wonder why no distribution has attacked the Desktop market with abandon. Seems it could be ripe for the picking. I mean if Apple can make BSD work..and it works very nice I think...why cant a Linux company do the same? Turn on your G4..loaded with jaguar..and everything works. Is their no distribution out there that can do the same thing? And no one has a development suite at all? No IDE? Do they have debuggers at least, or are we talking simply the compilers?

I can live with most of those apps.
I couldnt care less about Access, or Outlook but thank you for the heads up.(do need an Express type of deal)
GIMP. Seen it run...not near as handy as Elements (which is 90% of PS)
MP3 players. Not hooked on any one of them. As long as one works..Im good.

I will look into the other apps listed.

PS..I have downloaded the Knoppix ISO..and will give it a run tonight. Hopefully my next post will be under a Linux OS..just for Kicks.



Thanks again

Codesamurai
 
Well guys..here I am...under Knoppix

I have to say I am pretty impressed so far. Only been a couple of Hours...mainly messing around (cant quite figure out why Mozilla cant handle the banners on this site)..checking out different tools. Looking for different stuff available. I am sure you are failiar with Knoppix..its got KDE, KDevelopment (seems rather rudimentary..only glanced at it), open office, Mozilla..obviously. I guess I am pretty impressed with all the "features" it has. Default I counted about 3 types fo MP3 players. A scad of image manipulation/editing prgrams, Tons of text editors, a slew of System tools. Funny thing came to me while I was looking stuff over....why do I have to pay extra for BASIC stuff wiht a MS product?

I mean how common is a digital camera? Everyone has one...yet I dont have a way at all to edit them with XP. WHy do I not have a choice for a browser (which I foudn at least 3 of in Knoppix)..or Mail tools..or even a basic word processor? I can see not giving away full fledged office suites..but come on.. a basic word processor? And why is it once I pay ALOT of money for an OS..you give me updates for a certain time..but then I am left in the cold ? Maybe I am just griping...

What I can tell you is that if this is all it takes to get a Linux system up and running..well I may just yet give MS the boot..and find some new games to play. I havent tried my sound yet..as I cant open my CD drive while its on..so I am off to find some MP3's.

Thank you guys for all of your help.

If its not too much trouble...maybe you guys could give me some linkage for Distro reviews? I am looking at Fedora, Debian, and Suse. Mandrake seems to be a love hate thing...people think its great..or it blows. I tend to shy away form anything that polarizes people like that..cause most fo the time..they are both right.


Codesamurai.
 
cant quite figure out why Mozilla cant handle the banners on this site
Click to expand...

They use flash. While you can get Flash for linux, the way the license is prohibits them from shipping it with Knoppix (same goes for ATI/Nvidia 3D drivers)
 
Hay, man, good on you! Nice to hear you feel pretty comfortable with it. And it's awesome to see you posting from the live CD!

I know how you feel today—I just recompiled my kernel for the first time in two-and-a-half years of using Linux (not exclusively or primarily, which is why I never bothered to before). It feels nice to get something done like that and see it work.

I would suggest you set yourself up with a nice dual-boot, mostly as a way to test out different distributions and find out which are more to your liking. For downloading ISO files, I would say the best place to go is LinuxISo_Org. They'll have all the more common distros right there for you to download from. I am currently using Fedora Core 2 as my main Linux install (on the laptop, dual-booting with XP). A good source for info about that OS can be found at FedoraFAQ.org. The distro you're currently using, assuming you are using Knoppix, is based on Debian, another very nice, clean, user-friendly distribution. If user-friendliness is your thing, and you don't want to just look at these two, you can take a look at Mandrake. Other distros of note are ones like the very sturdy and most Unix-y Slackware, and the hands-on but very optimizable Gentoo. You can also go super-Windows-y with it, and try out Lindo—err... Linspire or (one I have a soft spot for) Lycoris LX.

Whatever you choose, and I didn't mention all of them (I'm sure everyone has their opinion as to what is best), take your time picking one that most suits you. I've pretty much stuck with Fedora/Red Hat for things like workstation stuff, and Slackware for more server-like stuff. I've dabbled in Debian and Lindows and Lycoris, but I think Fedora and Slack are at the top of my list for my needs. That doesn't necessarily make them perfect for yours, though. You have the extra drive, see if you can get a dual-boot set up and try out a few distros.
 
Debian user freindly?!?!? Well not imo. I think it is the most stable of all the linux distro's. I like redhat/fedora because it is very well documented and has a huge user base. What ever you choose I'm sure you will have fun :)
 
Hm..I've been thinking about making the switch also but couldn't decide which distro to try. From what you said it seems like Knoppix comes with a lot of programs. I don't really like that though, I like picking what goes on my computer and if I have no use for it I don't want it on my computer at all, you know what I mean? The first thing I do after a format is uninstall all the useless stuff that comes with XP. Which distro is user friendly but comes "barebone"?
 
Something to consider before switching fully to linux is trying out applications you would ALSO be able to use in Linux and see if they meet your needs in Windows. Get software like:

OpenOffice.org (office suite)
Firefox (browser)
ThunderBird (email)
The Gimp (image editor)

Understand that media playback in Linux is phenomenal. Programs like XMMS or mplayer will satisfy essentially all of your audio/video format needs, from wmv to mpeg to avi.

Also, there is WINE. If there is a windows application you MUST HAVE, you could consider using WINE and trying to get your application to work. I've had limited success with this, but it's been a while.
 
As much as i would like to.. i wouldn't switch fully to linux.. i've had so many problems that i was never able to fix.. i went to forum after forum and nothing... i dual boot linux.. and will soon have a machine completly for linux.. but yeah i wouldn't make a complete switch.. unfortunatly MS has me by the ballz.. plus gaming is a no no in linux, you could try WINE which i have, and it doesn't work well, tried to fix it by going to different forums.. and nothing.... but for everything else it's fine.. I use Mandrake linux by the way
 
since there is so much controversy, I will add my 2cents here too.

First i am a long going linux user but i do have a partition for windows , just for the gaming. It might take time to learn but overall Linux is a much better experience in the long run then windows. replacement applications for the ones you were after? Well Knoppix has tons of them and there are always different things you can do. Certain things need to be installed seperately (like Java and Flash) but once you have them installed its beautyfull to use. I am a hardcore Fedora/redhat user and made the "debian" step only a few days ago. On my system i now run debian testing with XFCE4 and some added little things. The system uses after boot with mozilla, rhythmbox, evolution open 130MB ram. that is pretty nice.
Someone pointed out that Evolutions scheduling etc is not up to par with Outlook, well the integration part, yes true, but if you dont have a server then its nearly perfect. And now that Novell gave away the Exchange connector you can even connect to an exchange server.

About Linux in general, the learning curve is steep for a few days (maybe weeks) but my question is always: how long have you worked with windows and felt comfortable? I suggest most people to give Linux at least a try, especially because of the nice worms nowadays.

feel free to PM me about any Linux questions, i'd be happy to answer them.

3D under linux works great with my ATI card even though the installation was not as easy as in windows. the nvidia driver should be quite easy to install.

//Vic
 
I recommend against Debian.

All the software/libraries it comes with are too old. You'll have to download and compile lots of things to get up to current versions. Every little thing you compile has a million dependencies that you need to download, build and install first before you can even compile. It's all part of the fun, but if you don't have the bandwidth to download everything, you'll be in hell.

Printing in Linux sucks. CUPS blows. Just because a printer is supposed to work with cups, doesn't mean it will. There are too many dependencies just to get a printer to work. If you got the right printer, you may get lucky. Plan on spending lots of time on this and research on your printer.

To get the nvidia video card drivers to install, you need to install the kernel headers, download the drivers, disable x and build them. This isn't all that bad except when you specify the directory to the kernel headers, you don't specify the full directory because the build script actually adds part of it for you, so if you add the full thing, it won't be able to find the directory.

e.g. (using windows dir as a base[poor analogy])
The build script asks you for the headers directory. Say the headers are in c:\nvidia\video\headers . If you tell it that, it will think that the headers are in c:\nvidia\video\headers\video\headers . So instead, you have to tell it c:\nvidia .
You'll see all kinds of weird things like that which will waste your time.

I've gotten usb gamepads to work on debian, but not any usb scanners.

To play DVDs encoded or not on debian is a pain.

The included dvd software packages install the programs improperly and you have to rename files because they don't have the correct files names. Getting audio to work for dvd movies can be a real pain. I could go into a lot more detail, but if you get Debian, expect to spend a lot of time getting movies to play. Also to get dvds to play at full size, you will need to install the nvidia drivers.

Burning software is easier to setup, but for it and playing dvd's, your drives have to be configured a certain way.

Also, zero of the dialup utilites work except ppxp. It's the only one that would allow me to view any webpages once connected to the net.

I also had to download and build gtk2 to install a lot of programs. That was a pain.

Whenever you try to compile a major program, expect to go hunting for libraries and spend hours setting it up.

A lot of features/programs don't work unless you recompile the kernel.

I also never found a good firewall. I had to write a script to configure iptables. Another pain.

The biggest pain is getting everything to work when you are not logged in as root. Never accomplished that, so I was forced to use root all the time. Damned permission setting for devices is a pain.

Configure apt to work with multiple CD drives is a pain.

Now even though everything is a pain, once you get all/most of your necessities setup, it's worth it because you learn.

If you get Debian, most of the extra software packages are too old and you will go through hell trying to bring it up to date.

The cool thing about having to compile all your programs is you can download the programs quicker.

If your hardware doesn't work 100% on linux, it's going to piss you off.

Linux may be more secure, but configuring it to be more secure is another thing.

If I ever get another distro, it will be whatever one has the newest versions of everything.

I also think the linux directory tree is odd. Libraries are all over the place and it makes a mess; not to mention library conflicts because things get installed into the same directory.

Debian is not user friendly.

Linux installation tutorials suck. They are all too general.
 
I'm also in the process of switching my main system (workstation) to Linux. As has been suggested in this thread, it's hardly something which can be done overnight. My solution was therefore to follow these steps:

- set up a secondary system with Linux (SuSE 9.0) and install VNC on it, so that I can use it from the workstation. This way I can gradually shift tasks from the Win2k workstation to the Linux system, with always the option of falling back on the 'old' way of doing things if the switch doesn't work out for certain tasks.

- once I've reached the point where I've got enough experience with using a Linux (desktop) system and I've migrated all critical tasks/applications to the Linux system, I'll switch the tasks of the Win2k and Linux system, so that the Linux system becomes the workstation and and the Win2k system is used for things like certain applications for which there is no suitable alternative on Linux and hardware which refuses to play nice with any OS other than Windows (like my scanner).

I don't play games on any of my systems, however, so things might not be as easy for you. I would advice against dual-booting, though, as this has the nasty potential to screw up things (possibly resulting in data loss), and it doesn't motivate you to boot to Linux if you've to shutdown Windows every time you do this. Using a second system or vmware or similar might be a better solution.

Just keep in mind to take things slowly, as there are always things (of varying importance) which you forget about.
 
first of all, i am sorry that you had bad experience with linux. second i do think you went over the top with linux sucks, CUPS sucks, because YOU couldnt get it to work. Mandrake 10 has recognized anything i trew at it so far.. and as far as debian, i agree it not for newcomers however the libraries and softwrea is almost fully up to date.. use TESTING, never use stable... stable is meant for servers that need to run 100% at all times... Its like installing OpenBSD , its still behind (apache 1.3.29 in the default install) but its meant for security and stability.

Then again, if i think how much work i have with the windows boxes at work or at clients with patching, (every week??) and communications problems, etc. I am glad i have at least some servers that run linux.

Dont get me wrong, i am NOT a zealot, i just like to have choice and if it doesnt work for someone doesnt mean it wont work for anyone... i dare you to buy a noname modem or anything else, install it in windows and tell me that it wil work on EVERY windows machine.....
:)
//Vic
 
Didn't mean to say linux sucks, but my experience with Debian sucked. I was using woody and had all 7 CDs worth of old programs/libs.

When I can just connect 99% of existing printers and click a button to add it, adjust its settings and print to it from any program, then I will say linux printing doesn't suck. The point to the OP is that "printing might not work at all"

I just found debian to be unproductive.

Program wise:

Openoffice is awesome. I use it on Windows too.
Xcdroast did its job, but require scsi emulation for CD burner
Could not find an editor that was like EditPlus for windows. I love that program.
Xmms was close enough to winamp.
Ogle and Ogle front-end did its job of playing DVDs (once I renamed files and made drive /dvd
(xine wouldn't install because I didn't have a new enough KDE)
Opera worked great, but could never get the flash plugin to work. (Fonts were horrible)
Firefox worked great.(Fonts were horrible)
Gaim is awesome.
ppxp was the only working dialup utility. xppxp front-end worked too.
hdparm did its job of setting dma.
apache worked great as did squirrelmail.
Konqueror was a pos; even for a file manager.
apt is a great package manager, but I don't like how it has to be configured to work with each cd drive.
 
Johnie said:
Hm..I've been thinking about making the switch also but couldn't decide which distro to try. From what you said it seems like Knoppix comes with a lot of programs. I don't really like that though, I like picking what goes on my computer and if I have no use for it I don't want it on my computer at all, you know what I mean? The first thing I do after a format is uninstall all the useless stuff that comes with XP. Which distro is user friendly but comes "barebone"?
Click to expand...

Well Knoppix does'nt install anything to your hard drive. It is an OS that is run off of a CD. It does'nt install anything. The good thing about linux distros such as SuSE, mandrake and others is you can pick and choose every app installed during the install process. So you only get what you want. But with Linux noobs you never really know what you need or what you don't. So I just install everything.
 
I'd stick to windows for gaming pourposes

My two cents, take it for what its worth: Linux/BSD is a better server OS then a desktop OS. And Windows is a better desktop OS then a server OS.
 
Well,

I have gotten some MP3's to play... (funny..knoppix could read off my Windows partition)..but the osund was comlete ASS. Crackles, pops, other weirdness.

Like I said with my "mature" hardware...getting the basics up and running is no problem. Everything is detected right away...all drivers seem to work fine (cept the quality of sound..not sure if its the driver..but the same MP3's sound fine under winamp). Detected all my USB devices..no sweat. My Rio MP3 player..not sure if it will work or not..havent tried.

SO all in all I am very impressed with knoppix. Its god awful slow right now..(thanks to my old as Mitsumi 8x4x4x CD drive), but Mozilla worked, Office opened and seemed fairly familiar..noticed a KDevelopment "suite"..seemed rather bland (not a bad thing).

Still trying to figure out how to get programs to install....but not in to big of a hurry till I pick a distro..adn put it on my spare HD.

I see alot fo different window managers, X systems, Office suites...so I have to go through and decide which ones I want..and which I dont. Then I will probably decide on a distro (leaning towards Fedora, and Debian simply because of my experience with Knoppix..would love to try Gentoo if they made a base install that you could change around after) later. Seems they arent too far apart.

I am also not going to pick a distro on how hardcore it is. I see alot fo "infighting" as it were about how "Mandrake is too bloated"..or "Slackware is the only real Linux". This doesnt make sense to me. Seems Linux is Linux...and how someone chooses to implement it should be the most important concern..not what distro they have. I guess I dont understand the "distro" wars at all. What works for some...wont necessarily work for someone else. I do know I am getting real fed up with MS the more I think about it. The stuff that these distros come with is just unreal. You would have to spend thousands in extra money to get the equivalent apps. The you look at the price of upgrades, new apps..and you are looking at a very serious hit to the wallet. I dont mind buying apps...but if I spend $50 on a anti virus program..should I have to pay more every year to get the new stuff too? Maybe I am just cheap. It seems more a moral stand than anything though. I dont want a free ride..I also dont want to need vaseline everytim I "need" an upgrade...like when they no longer support an app I am using.

Thanks again guys...and I'll keeep you posted.

Codesamurai.
 
Well guys I made the switch.


Here I am on a single partition install of Fedora Core 2. Going to give it a run for a couple of weeks, adn see what happens. Found my Vid fine, soudn wasnt automatically detected..so I haev a project there. Completely wiped out my Windows partition (I did make backups of all my apps though...just in case..lol), adn am going for the gold as it were with Linux. I simply couldnt resist anymore..the more I thought about it..the more I wanted to switch. Well I am off to setup Ximian and other apps. Thanks for all the help.

Codesamurai
 
The easiest way to get sound working would be to switch to a 2.6.x kernel. I have no idea whether Fedora Core 2 uses a 2.4.x or 2.6.x kernel, so you might have to do extra work if you want to use a 2.6.x kernel.

2.6.x is nice; ALSA (Advanced Linux Sound Architecture) can be built into the kernel or as a module from the kernel configuration, and it supports ATAPI cd/dvd writing so you don't have to use SCSI-emulation to burn cds, and, with 2.6 kernel headers, supports the NPTL (native POSIX thread library), among other new features over 2.4.x.

To find out your kernel, type this in at the command line:

Code: 
$ uname -a

It should produce output similar to this:

Code: 
Linux canti 2.6.5-gentoo #4 SMP Wed May 19 21:50:55 EST 2004 i686 Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 2.40GHz GenuineIntel GNU/Linux

The 2.6.5-gentoo is the kernel I'm using; this will be different for you because you use Fedora core, and I use Gentoo with gentoo development kernels.
 
Well.. I am using the same Kernel. Just checked it out at command line. 2.6.5 i686 athlon on i386. So I know I can work on it. The only sound configuration utility I found is the default one..but I am working on it. I did enable Java for the browser..but am still working on flash..so this site works works right. After I egt that going..I will work on the sound.

Codesamurai.
 
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