It's just another way for you to spend way more money then you budget. If you have $200 for headphones then I would look at the Sennheriser 580's or 600's as someone has already mentioned. Both of these phones sound 10 times better when you put them with a decent headphone amp though. These can vary a lot in price depending on how good of amp you want. The PPA someone metioned is a very nice amp but is quite costly ($250+). I don't know anything about the opamp replacements on the Audigy 2...maybe someone else can help you out there.
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Sennheiser Suggestions
- Thread starter aug1516
- Start date
You will *need* a headphone amp if you go with the Senn 580, 600, and 650. I can see maybe getting a 590 and not getting an amp because it runs on 120 ohms. The rest are 300 ohms. Simply put, if you get a pair of decent headphones you will need a dedicated amplifier to drive them properly.
As for the sound card. Sound cards have op amps...operational amps. Much like a headphone amp that also has op amps. The op amps from sound cards, however, suck. That is why I suggested the op amp replacement. I would suggest getting ADA8620s on your Audigy 2 ZS. That should set you back only a few bucks. As for the amps, even the cheaper amps will make the Senns sound better. If a PPA is too much, I'd suggest at least a Pimeta amp. That would set you back about 100 - 150 bucks, depending on parts.
BTW: I got my PPA amp from X86dude and also my soundcard. Actually I just Newegged him the Audigy 2 ZS directly so that he could replace the op amps.
What kind of Grados? Grados are hella nice too. The higher end ones definitely need a headphone amp.
No, you don't really need an amp for the sound card. The sound card has the "op amps" built it...it's just that they suck. You'd ideally want to get them replaced.
Grado just released the PS1 Pro...too bad u'd have to order overseas and I'd imagine them to cost over 500 bucks.
No, you don't really need an amp for the sound card. The sound card has the "op amps" built it...it's just that they suck. You'd ideally want to get them replaced.
Grado just released the PS1 Pro...too bad u'd have to order overseas and I'd imagine them to cost over 500 bucks.
Headphone.com considers the Grado SR225 to be the world's best rock & roll headphone. I haven't heard it personally, but it's supposed to have a strong, forward sound with solid and emphasized bass impact. Grados are open and can be used perfectly well without an amp, but many will recommend one anyway (some headphones need an amp to achieve proper volume and sound, others can simply use an amp to achieve more full, detailed sound - the Grados are in the latter group). They should be a safe bet for the "Use 'em now, maybe buy an amp later" type, if that's you. Should be good for your preferred musical types, though Senns may be better for country or classical. Grados are generally less comfortable than Sennheisers, so keep that in mind if you plan on wearing them for long periods of time.
If I were you, I would not bother with the Audigy2 opamp replacement at this time. If you find that you like headphone-hifi as a hobby, you might want to try that later (or buy a better soundcard, or buy a high quality component CD player, or whatever). Same thing with an amp - I wouldn't recommend one now unless you either demand headphones that "require" a seperate headphone amp OR can pick a pair of headphones and amp that fit your budget. You can spend a ton of money on this stuff if you want. But it's not required to get your foot in the door and see if you like it
If you were willing to stretch your budget a bit, you might be able to get a pair of secondhand Sennheiser HD600s (until recently, the top of the Senn line - many people are ditching their perfectly good 600s cheap to buy the new 650s) and a new "cmoy" style amp or used "meta42" style amp for <$250.Originally posted by Elec
If I were you, I would not bother with the Audigy2 opamp replacement at this time. If you find that you like headphone-hifi as a hobby, you might want to try that later (or buy a better soundcard, or buy a high quality component CD player, or whatever). Same thing with an amp - I wouldn't recommend one now unless you either demand headphones that "require" a seperate headphone amp OR can pick a pair of headphones and amp that fit your budget. You can spend a ton of money on this stuff if you want. But it's not required to get your foot in the door and see if you like it
This is good advice, but some headphones like the Senn 580's or 600's really do NEED an amp to get your money's worth. Since you are on a budget you may want to look at those Grados or the Senn 590's as has already been mentioned.
OK...woah here. Let's back down a bit. I think we're jumping overboard. If the guy wants to get good headphones, even a CMOY amp will help him. A CMOY is cheap. 30 - 50 bucks if you search around. And getting the op amps replaced on the Audigy 2ZS(which ranks as one of the best sound cards right now according to the faq) is cheap...like 10 bucks.
I say get those Grados(or any Senns) and get at least a CMOY. You can spend more money on better amps if you get into headphones later on...but at least get a CMOY.
I say get those Grados(or any Senns) and get at least a CMOY. You can spend more money on better amps if you get into headphones later on...but at least get a CMOY.
Personally, I'd keep the Klipsch and use them for the head unit, it has an amp(not the greatest) and a handy volume control. Then get a decent set of efficient phones, I'd go with the Senn HD-590 if you want open or the Audio-Technica ath-a900 if you want closed.
They're both good all arounders, meaning that they do well with just about any type of use and they sound almost as well coming from a less than ideal source as they do from a great one.
Some phones don't do very well with rock, like the hd580 or the akg k501, they're just too laid back. They're some of the best classical phones in the world though, with their detail and great soundstage.
The Grados OTOH, are about as good as you can get for rock, guitar and drums...wow, but aren't all that great for complex stuff that has a lot of different intserments or needs a big soundstage because the closeness in imaging that puts you up on the on the stage for rock is a detriment for listening to a classical piece and their drivers just don't seem to many different things at once as well as some of the other phones.
The hd-590 is a little more forward and has a brighter sound that helps bring the stage a little closer than the other Senns, so it seems to work better for rock.
The a900 IMO is a great closed Grado alternative with a much larger soundstage. I've got the HD-590, HD-580, DT-770, SR-125 and the A900 is my choice for the comp, it does everything well. The impact for rock is only a little less than the Grados, it does classical well, it's soundstage is actually larger than most open phones, the imaging is good enough to tell you where the bad guys are in games. The bass goes deep but it's not overbearing, it's sound quality has been compared quite nicely with the Senn hd-600, it's closed and decreases the fan noise but allows just enough sound in to be able to tell what's going on with the volume at normal listening levels. It'll sound good with whatever you plug it into with it's low 42 ohm impedance and good efficiency and IMO they're the best looking phones on the market.
Can you tell I like'em?
The biggest drawback is that they're imported from Japan and only available from audiocubes.com and with shipping, they'll be just a bit over budget.
http://www.audiocubes.com/
http://www.audiocubes.com/product_i...d=317&osCsid=15d0df700bd107c9177b9a3b85d76160
They're both good all arounders, meaning that they do well with just about any type of use and they sound almost as well coming from a less than ideal source as they do from a great one.
Some phones don't do very well with rock, like the hd580 or the akg k501, they're just too laid back. They're some of the best classical phones in the world though, with their detail and great soundstage.
The Grados OTOH, are about as good as you can get for rock, guitar and drums...wow, but aren't all that great for complex stuff that has a lot of different intserments or needs a big soundstage because the closeness in imaging that puts you up on the on the stage for rock is a detriment for listening to a classical piece and their drivers just don't seem to many different things at once as well as some of the other phones.
The hd-590 is a little more forward and has a brighter sound that helps bring the stage a little closer than the other Senns, so it seems to work better for rock.
The a900 IMO is a great closed Grado alternative with a much larger soundstage. I've got the HD-590, HD-580, DT-770, SR-125 and the A900 is my choice for the comp, it does everything well. The impact for rock is only a little less than the Grados, it does classical well, it's soundstage is actually larger than most open phones, the imaging is good enough to tell you where the bad guys are in games. The bass goes deep but it's not overbearing, it's sound quality has been compared quite nicely with the Senn hd-600, it's closed and decreases the fan noise but allows just enough sound in to be able to tell what's going on with the volume at normal listening levels. It'll sound good with whatever you plug it into with it's low 42 ohm impedance and good efficiency and IMO they're the best looking phones on the market.
Can you tell I like'em?
The biggest drawback is that they're imported from Japan and only available from audiocubes.com and with shipping, they'll be just a bit over budget.
http://www.audiocubes.com/
http://www.audiocubes.com/product_i...d=317&osCsid=15d0df700bd107c9177b9a3b85d76160
I agree with the hd580's not being good for Rock. I havn''t listened to country, rap, or pop on them however, so I can't comment there.
I would also go against the recommendation of using the Klipsch's headphone amp. I personally think it sucks. Even my GTXP beats it, and I can imagine a headphone amp costing even half as much as a GTXP to sound quite a bit better.
The dt770's I would recommend you to try because of their bass. I think that for what you call "music" the extra bass would be a benefit . THe bass is extremely overhyped in my opinion, but still better than most headphones that I have listened to. They are of the closed variety, and can be had with a amp for a little more than your budget.
Harkamus, you aren't recommending the A2 upgrade without hearing it first, are you?
And Elec? You havn't heard the sr225's, yet you recommend them?
Sorry guys, just thought I had to step in.
I would also go against the recommendation of using the Klipsch's headphone amp. I personally think it sucks. Even my GTXP beats it, and I can imagine a headphone amp costing even half as much as a GTXP to sound quite a bit better.
The dt770's I would recommend you to try because of their bass. I think that for what you call "music" the extra bass would be a benefit
. THe bass is extremely overhyped in my opinion, but still better than most headphones that I have listened to. They are of the closed variety, and can be had with a amp for a little more than your budget.Harkamus, you aren't recommending the A2 upgrade without hearing it first, are you?
And Elec? You havn't heard the sr225's, yet you recommend them?
Sorry guys, just thought I had to step in.
sorry bout that, I havn't slept in a couple days. I read it as, I just bought this new soundcard and had it sent to X86 for modification. I think it was that you said "Actually I just Newegged him the Audigy 2 ZS directly so that he could replace the op amps." so I took it that you literally recently did send it to him
No, I haven't heard them. I have read HeadRoom's opinions on the 225s, and I trust them quite a bit (they SELL headphones as their primary business and some of their reviews state "These headphones are not very good for the price, buy model XX instead"). I have also been a member over at Headwize for several years and have read lots of comments from people who do own the 225s.
Unfortunately, a lot of stuff in the worlds of computer gear and high-end headphones is hearsay. It's especially bad with headphones, because they're expensive and inaccessible. If I could only recommend headphones I've heard, I'd tell people to get the Sennheiser HD545s I have, because they're a great value (except you can't buy them anymore because they're long since discontinued). If I had 10 grand to buy all the best cans and amps for reference, I would. But I don't. Sorry.
If people were only allowed to comment on headphones they have personally heard, you wouldn't have a third of the discussion you have here, or at Headwize, or Head-Fi. Sometimes you have to go with the group-accepted opinions of products in order to be helpful. This is what I generally try to do, and I only offer opinions as I have heard them (and do try to mention when I am not personally familiar with a product). You won't see me doing what some nameless others on Headwize and Head-Fi do, saying "This headphone is the best ever in the whole world! Everybody should buy them instead of anything else! They're AWESOME!" and then admitting later that he has never heard them but really wants a pair
If I was a true dickhead, you wouldn't KNOW I had never heard the SR225s, cause I wouldn't have bothered to mention that fact. That's really not what I'm trying to do though - I'm not trying to be a "worship me!" expert. I'm just trying to pass along the info I've come across in condensed form to somebody who may not want to look it up himself or may not even know where to look. I enjoy the hobby, and I understand that some people are rabid about it while others just want good phones for <$200. So nothing personal, and don't take it the wrong way, but in this case I don't think I was wrong for restating popular opinion on the Grados.
Whoa. Lots and lots of different opinions.
Lets narrow this down to 2 or 3 sets. Maybe the Grado's and a couple of the Sennheisers.
I will probably wait on the amp, since what I've heard on here is a good one will cost $150 - $200 and when you add in the cost of the headphones, that is twice my budget.
So I want something I can listen to just fine now and add an amp later. I don't want to buy a cheap amp now, because that seems like a waste of money, when I might get a good one later.
Also:
I want some more info on this amp replacement for the Audigy ZS, if it's only $10 or so, I might consider it.
Anyone have ideas on what I can do to make my current speakers sound better? - or at least get rid of the constant staticy buzz whenever they are on.
Lets narrow this down to 2 or 3 sets. Maybe the Grado's and a couple of the Sennheisers.
I will probably wait on the amp, since what I've heard on here is a good one will cost $150 - $200 and when you add in the cost of the headphones, that is twice my budget.
So I want something I can listen to just fine now and add an amp later. I don't want to buy a cheap amp now, because that seems like a waste of money, when I might get a good one later.
Also:
I want some more info on this amp replacement for the Audigy ZS, if it's only $10 or so, I might consider it.
Anyone have ideas on what I can do to make my current speakers sound better? - or at least get rid of the constant staticy buzz whenever they are on.
So that probably adds 10 or 20 bucks, depending on how many you need. Have you had a chance to listen & compare between an original stock Audigy2 and your modded one? I noticed a difference between my old SB Live and an Audigy2, but I'm not sure if replacing the opamps would really make that big of a difference quality-wise (might sound different just based on being different opamps, since they all have their own sound - but different and better vary from person to person). Did you have the caps replaced too, or just the opamps?
EnderW: You're right on with the price range for a good new amp. You should be able to find a used one for less, if used doesn't bother you. High end headphone gear generally holds its value pretty well, if you keep it in good condition. You might be able to sell something several years later for 1/2 to 2/3 of the original price if it's fairly common and nearly full price if it's rare, in high demand, or discontinued. Because of this, it's not so painful to upgrade or replace down the road as it is with computer gear (where your $3000 rig is worth $300 in less than 4 years).
I would recommend looking at (buying from) headphone.com or toddthevinyljunkie.com, as both have 30 day money back policies. You buy 'em, you use 'em for a month, and if they're not working out or not what you really wanted, you can send them back and get a refund or try something else. I've personally gotten great service from Headroom (headphone.com) and specifically Todd (formerly of headphone.com, currently of toddthevinyljunkie.com).
Not quite. The default Opamp I use for this mod is the Analog Devices 8620 They sell for 12$ each, in Harks case I changed all of the opamps used for the outputs.
3 X 12= 36$
Add shipping and my fee and the total price is closer to 60$ then 10$
In my opinion you are much better off buying a better sound card
then paying someone to mod a sound card in such a manner. If you have the skill to perform such a mod yourself the tighter bass more detailed midrange and clearer highs make this mod a must-do for any Audigy2 Audigy2 Zs owner.
Just the opamps. The major portions of the card that would benefit from upgraded caps have SMP components. IMHO As soon as we start talking about witch SMP cap is the best we get into serious Idiotphille territory.
I don't think so.
But then again I am in a position to know better.
A Meta Mint will fetch $70 and is a great entry level amp that will fit into his budget pretty well.
Are you talking personal experience here or is this all based on something you read again?
I have no reply to this part of your post, other then to say I agree. Both Headroom and Todd have a great return policy.
Now back to a generic reply not targeted at anyone.
Do yourself a favor and go audition some cans. You may just find that the HD580s kick ass for rock and metal.
Even without an amp the HD580s sound much better to me then the Grateos that were mentioned. But then again I will take muddy balanced sound over bright poorly detailed sound any day of the week.Originally posted by Harkamus
HD 580s at 300 ohms need an amp.
Originally posted by X86Dude
Not quite. The default Opamp I use for this mod is the Analog Devices 8620 They sell for 12$ each, in Harks case I changed all of the opamps used for the outputs.
3 X 12= 36$
Add shipping and my fee and the total price is closer to 60$ then 10$
In my opinion you are much better off buying a better sound card
then paying someone to mod a sound card in such a manner. If you have the skill to perform such a mod yourself the tighter bass more detailed midrange and clearer highs make this mod a must-do for any Audigy2 Audigy2 Zs owner.
Ok, thanks for the info
I wasn't sure which opamps you were using or how many exactly were on the card (I have an Audigy2 but didn't really want to open my box and pull it out to look). I had a year of analog and a year of digital electronics in high school before defecting to the software side and a Comp. Sci. major in college. I'm looking to get into DIY stuff sometime soon, and I'm reasonably handy with a soldering iron, so I'll probably give the mod a shot before the Audigy2 is put to pasture (whenever that is).I hear ya. I always wonder a bit when people are talking about thousand dollar interconnects or green dye to paint on their CDs...
True, you do build and sell the damn things
I was thinking more along the lines of a mid-to-high end PIMETA or basic PPA as a "good" new amp. Certainly a MINT or even a cmoy is better than no amp at all for the high end Senns, but a new HD580 and a $70 mint amp would put him over $200. Used might be a remedy to this situation, of course Some of both. My HD545s are worth roughly what I paid for them in 2000, based on a couple recent auctions and sales I've seen. Probably due to the fact that they were pretty good for their time and are no longer readily available. My 2AA Total Airhead amp is probably worth around half of what I paid for it in 2001, maybe a little less. Probably due to newer revisions from Headroom and the recent wide availability of quality custom DIY amps (something else of which you are in a position to know better). The Grado models haven't really changed since I got into headphones and seem to have held their value well. Same with the HD580s and 600s, though the introduction of the 650s seems to be persuading some people to pass their 600s along. Etys regularly go for around $200 used when they cost less than $300 new. I try to keep an eye on the Headwize and Head-Fi for sale/trade forums since there is some great stuff offered at good prices simply because somebody wants to try a different setup. I may not come by all my knowledge firsthand, but I'm neither stupid nor a fanboy.
Yep. I've also heard good things about Jan Meier's Meier Audio: http://www.meier-audio.de/
Now back to a generic reply not targeted at anyone.
Do yourself a favor and go audition some cans. You may just find that the HD580s kick ass for rock and metal.
Heh. I'm hoping to soon. Christmas money is suggesting a new pair of cans and I recently found out there is a hi-fi store near here whose web page claims they carry Sennheiser and Grado. I'm hoping they allow auditions
OK. Thanks for all the help guys. I'm gonna try and find a local shop where I can listen to these in person.
A Few More Questions:
1) Would replacing those amps in the Audigy do anything for my current speakers?
2) Are the GMX A-2.1 bad speakers? Is there anything I can do to get rid of this contant, low-level static?
A Few More Questions:
1) Would replacing those amps in the Audigy do anything for my current speakers?
2) Are the GMX A-2.1 bad speakers? Is there anything I can do to get rid of this contant, low-level static?
Yes, indeedy. I have had the pleasure of dealing with Dr. Meier (he has a Ph.D, you know?
). Admittedly my DT 770s were backordered at the time, but that only set me back a week. He's a great guy and very knowledgeable in the field of headphones. BTW, if you get some Beyerdynamics, be prepared to have them shipped from the factory, to Jan, and then to you. Beyerdynamics are made in Germany, and Jan is situated there.Originally posted by Harkamus
Yes, indeedy. I have had the pleasure of dealing with Dr. Meier (he has a Ph.D, you know?
DOCTOR Meier eh? I never knew. I always enjoy his posts for a couple reasons. One is that he somehow always manages to get the latest and best gear to play with and post info on, and the other is that he has a great sense of humor. He recently posted about some new cans he had received, but to please not expect detailed info for a little while because he managed to get an Orpheus for 2 weeks and was somewhat distracted as a result
Sounds like a good plan.
No. this is purely a source "upgrade."
It will change the voice of the card but it will not have any effect on your external accessories.
I can't or should I say won't offer an opinions about these speakers because I have not heard them.
As far as the static goes.... is this a hum or the normal noise most computer speakers have?
IMHO, the best "all around" headphone is the Sennheiser HD570's and HD 590's. I have the HD 590 personally.
Yes, there are other brands such as Sony, AKG, Grado, but they lack one thing the sennheiser's have. Ultimate Comfort! You can litteraly wear these things for Hours without even noticing them, where as with the closed headphones your ears get hot, sweety, and sometimes it kills to wear them over 2 hours. The open ear headphones also create a sound of "depth" and makes it sound like the sound is comming from the middle of your head....... which is the KEY to sound, whereas closed headphones may "force" the sound into your ears.
Another + is the fact they you can still hear things around you. This is a plus to me, maybe a "-" to others.
As for the sound of the HD590's, these are GODLY! THey can go deep with base, and they can do pitch highes. All in a perfect balance. Most of the sony's ive listened to are a little to overpowering in the base for me.... but that's my Opinion.
Another thing i love about these, is that they DO NOT require a lot of power to make them sound perfect. Thus making them a great choice for a computer, whereas some of the others may require ALOT of power. (bassicaly, impedance is what determins power, the lower the impdedance, the lower the power required.)
Styleish? maybe to some, not to others. You decide.
Another Major plus for me is the cord. First off, the cord is detachable....... A major plus... (just incase you get it stuck on something... it won't break, just come out). The cord is replaceable... very cheap. The cord is straight, not coiled. So you get the MAXIMUM length it says. Very lightweight, not even noticible. Also, it connects to the left phone, so you don't have 2 cordes.
If you can get them for 200$, ide get them. Any less and its a steal.
Note: the only reason i added the HD570s is because they are 1/2 the price of the HD590's. This makes them very attrictible for just 100$, even if their sound is not perfect.
http://www.bigbangelectronics.com/portable_electronics/corded_headphones.asp has some for 205$ with a 25$ rebate and free shipping. Ive done business with bigbangelectronics before, they are good.
P.s., the Beyerdynamic head phones are almost identical to these, except they require alot more power to sound good.
~Hope this helps
Yes, there are other brands such as Sony, AKG, Grado, but they lack one thing the sennheiser's have. Ultimate Comfort! You can litteraly wear these things for Hours without even noticing them, where as with the closed headphones your ears get hot, sweety, and sometimes it kills to wear them over 2 hours. The open ear headphones also create a sound of "depth" and makes it sound like the sound is comming from the middle of your head....... which is the KEY to sound, whereas closed headphones may "force" the sound into your ears.
Another + is the fact they you can still hear things around you. This is a plus to me, maybe a "-" to others.
As for the sound of the HD590's, these are GODLY! THey can go deep with base, and they can do pitch highes. All in a perfect balance. Most of the sony's ive listened to are a little to overpowering in the base for me.... but that's my Opinion.
Another thing i love about these, is that they DO NOT require a lot of power to make them sound perfect. Thus making them a great choice for a computer, whereas some of the others may require ALOT of power. (bassicaly, impedance is what determins power, the lower the impdedance, the lower the power required.)
Styleish? maybe to some, not to others. You decide.
Another Major plus for me is the cord. First off, the cord is detachable....... A major plus... (just incase you get it stuck on something... it won't break, just come out). The cord is replaceable... very cheap. The cord is straight, not coiled. So you get the MAXIMUM length it says. Very lightweight, not even noticible. Also, it connects to the left phone, so you don't have 2 cordes.
If you can get them for 200$, ide get them. Any less and its a steal.
Note: the only reason i added the HD570s is because they are 1/2 the price of the HD590's. This makes them very attrictible for just 100$, even if their sound is not perfect.
http://www.bigbangelectronics.com/portable_electronics/corded_headphones.asp has some for 205$ with a 25$ rebate and free shipping. Ive done business with bigbangelectronics before, they are good.
P.s., the Beyerdynamic head phones are almost identical to these, except they require alot more power to sound good.
~Hope this helps
I'm sorry to say this, but I cannot recommend either the HD570 or the HD590 - at least not at their current discount street prices. The HD590 is one of the worst $200 headphones that I've ever heard: Incoherent, shrill and murky all at the same time. The HD570 is even worse than the HD590, though not by much - and the HD570 still isn't worth anywhere near its $100 average price. Every one of the $200 open-air headphones I've listened to, including Sennheiser's older HD580, sound much better than that HD590 to my ears.
Yes e4g1e, with a sennheiser hd580, 600, or 650 with a good amp, they most likely will sound better ( i have never tried them, as it was a little to much money for me). The only thing is the hd 570's and 590's are directed more towards the people who are not "Working" with their headphones, but mearly using them. They are directed at the people who might like cheaper price and comfort better then the "perfect" sound (such as 1 detachable cord, instead of 2 fixed cordes). They are also a little cheaper.
I want to see someone use a hd580 on a ipod, or walkman, ^_^.
______________
as if its worth the extra 100$ to go from a 570 to 590, thats a tough choice.
To me, it obviously was worth it. Becase if you think of it, if you can get like 5 years out of your headphones (very reasonable from what ive seen), then thats what.... 20$ per year for better sound? The choice is yours.
But, if you travle a lot, or bring them to places where they might get stolen... the 570's might be a better "travel" headphone.
I want to see someone use a hd580 on a ipod, or walkman, ^_^.
______________
as if its worth the extra 100$ to go from a 570 to 590, thats a tough choice.
To me, it obviously was worth it. Becase if you think of it, if you can get like 5 years out of your headphones (very reasonable from what ive seen), then thats what.... 20$ per year for better sound? The choice is yours.
But, if you travle a lot, or bring them to places where they might get stolen... the 570's might be a better "travel" headphone.
If you really must know, Sennheiser is going to release a new line of Headphones that were at CES, the HD595, HD555 and HD515. Here's a thread and a better one
I am sorry, but the HD580s regularly go for about $150 retail, which is less than the HD590, and they sound better even when unamped, they are a more neutral pair of headphones, they are harder to drive, but far superior.
The HD580, 600 and 650 all have detacheable cords and many upgrade cables that make them sound even better than with the stock, although the stock 650 is supposedly good enough.
good choice enderW. Just note: those headphones might not be "broken in", and thus might not display their true potential. Another thing is, they might not have them hooked up to a good source. I was at a tweeter, and they had all their headphones connected to this crapy PORTABLE CD PLAYER!!!!!!!!! OMG.
also, if you want more opinions, check out www.audioreview.com
they have unbiased reviews, but their prices are not the best that ive seen.
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DE-j, sennheiser has updated their website and now display the new ones (they are calling their old ones V1).
To me, they look much diffrent............. gonna have to check them out someday.
also, if you want more opinions, check out www.audioreview.com
they have unbiased reviews, but their prices are not the best that ive seen.
________________
DE-j, sennheiser has updated their website and now display the new ones (they are calling their old ones V1).
To me, they look much diffrent............. gonna have to check them out someday.
Well, my standards are different from yours. You see, I don't like excessive treble response the way those particular Senns 570 and 590 deliver. Moreover, the HD570 is actually less efficient than even the HD580 or HD600. On all of the portable players that I've tried, the HD570 actually produces less output volume than either the HD580 or the HD600; in fact, the HD570's loudness out of current portable music players is nowhere near adequate for anywhere but a dead-quiet room. And when the HD570 is underpowered, it becomes very thin and shrill sounding.
The HD500 is exactly the opposite of the over-aggressive mid-treble response that's typical of the HD570 and HD590: weak, muddy and grainy.