Re: Creative sues Apple

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thrawn42

Limp Gawd
Joined
Aug 7, 2004
Messages
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Steve said:
Kyle passed this link to Apple’s latest lawsuit on to me so I thought I would share. Apple is being sued by Creative over the way the iPod “uses navigation by menus and organisation of music on a portable music player”.



The dispute is over Creative's Zen patent, awarded in August 2005, which covers navigation by menus and organization of music on a portable music player. Creative applied for the patent in 2001 and, since having it confirmed, has been threatening to sue Apple over its iPod.



You guys probably already know this but I like to smack around the Mac folks as much as the next guy and take cheap shots when I can. I like to poke fun of their 2% market share and the notion that Mac users all have elitist attitudes but isn’t it about time people quit abusing the whole lawsuit thing? The iPod has been out how long, basically unchanged, and you haven’t sued until now? Didn’t someone else try this crap last year? For crying out loud, quit with the lawsuits already. Want to beat them at their own game, make a better music player.
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Hey Steve. Creative already has come out with a better MP3 player. It's called the Zen Vision: M.
 
illgiveumorality said:
And they had a better starting ground to work off of: The iPod interface.
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Considering the facts behind this lawsuit, it should be more than obvious that what you just wrote is a complete falsehood.
 
Creative is a firggin joke and so are there line of products!

The iPOD is better because it's an iPOD and not a creative fuckup!

I don't have much love anymore for Apple, but I have even less for Creative.

What was better than Creative's money maker back in the day? Aureal's line of Vortex and Vortex 2 sound cards, among a few other company's chips as well! Whats better than Creative's money maker today? HDA/AuzenTech's X line! Creative will always be a second rate company trying to live off the success of others work, kinda like microsoft with apple! ;)

Sorry, had to rant and rave about that! Flame away if ya like! :D
 
Creative is a firggin joke and so are there line of products!

The iPOD is better because it's an iPOD and not a creative fuckup!

I don't have much love anymore for Apple, but I have even less for Creative.

What was better than Creative's money maker back in the day? Aureal's line of Vortex and Vortex 2 sound cards, among a few other company's chips as well! Whats better than Creative's money maker today? HDA/AuzenTech's X line! Creative will always be a second rate company trying to live off the success of others work (See Aureal) while producing subpar equipment with proprietary EAX , kinda like microsoft with apple! ;)

Sorry, had to rant and rave about that! Flame away if ya like! :D
 
Lighthammer said:
Creative is a firggin joke and so are there line of products!

The iPOD is better because it's an iPOD and not a creative fuckup!

I don't have much love anymore for Apple, but I have even less for Creative.

What was better than Creative's money maker back in the day? Aureal's line of Vortex and Vortex 2 sound cards, among a few other company's chips as well! Whats better than Creative's money maker today? HDA/AuzenTech's X line! Creative will always be a second rate company trying to live off the success of others work (See Aureal) while producing subpar equipment with proprietary EAX , kinda like microsoft with apple! ;)

Sorry, had to rant and rave about that! Flame away if ya like! :D
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Yeah maaaaan. You tell Creative where they sit.

Don't they know that blind brand loyalty holds more water if you post
it twice??!!!!!!!!!1111
 
thrawn42 said:
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Three things:

First off, it would be nice if you sounded less like a salesman for Creative.

Secondly, it would be nice if you had a clue about the product you're comparing it to. The general storage space on the iPod is not hidden in any way.

Third, radio sucks, and all my music is either AAC or LAME. I don't watch videos on a 2.5" screen, regardless of how many colours it has. Sure, if you need FM, the Creative thingie is obviously a better choice, but this is a flawed comparison. For the people who don't need or want a radio, it is not an advantage to have one. The same thing goes for video formats and whatnot.



Also, the iPod is lighter and just over half as thick. Sorry, but I'll stick with iPod.
 
I dunno if people are generally aware of this, but creative invented the hard disk mp3 player with the original nomad. It was still in the shape of a panasonic shockwave mp3 player, not the square form factor we're used to today, but they did come up with it first. Their navigation interface has remained largely the same, with minor tweaks, since then. The ipod's navigation is remarkably similar, but that's just because it makes sense and is incredibly intuitive to design a GUI that way. I'm not saying i support lawsuits for something trivial like this, but if you want to get down to brass tacks, creative did it first, and that's that.


Edit: Linky
 
Actually, the PBJ-100 was the first commercially available hard drive-based portable music player, and it was designed by DEC/Compaq. So no, Creative wasn't first. Besides, Creative didn't create their first hard drive-based products. Samsung did.
 
Black Morty Rackham said:
Secondly, it would be nice if you had a clue about the product you're comparing it to. The general storage space on the iPod is not hidden in any way.
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Really? So you can see all of the files in non-music storage on your iPod while you're on the go?

Third, radio sucks, and all my music is either AAC or LAME. I don't watch videos on a 2.5" screen, regardless of how many colours it has. Sure, if you need FM, the Creative thingie is obviously a better choice, but this is a flawed comparison. For the people who don't need or want a radio, it is not an advantage to have one. The same thing goes for video formats and whatnot.
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Ahh I'm sorry. What was I thinking? More features that don't hinder a technology in any way but rather enhance it don't make a product better. :rolleyes:

And yes, terrestrial radio for the most part does suck. Being able to do voice recordings and record things off of FM is still a nice feature though.

Also, the iPod is lighter and just over half as thick. Sorry, but I'll stick with iPod.
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As far as I'm concerned that's really the only thing that iPod has over the Zen Vision M. The difference is negligible though and really nitpicking when it comes down to it.
 
Actually, the PBJ-100 was the first commercially available hard drive-based portable music player, and it was designed by DEC/Compaq. So no, Creative wasn't first. Besides, Creative didn't create their first hard drive-based products. Samsung did.
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Wow, totally didn't know about the PBJ-100. And while you're right about the creating technicality, I guess I was just trying to quell the "Creative stole the ipod from apple" murmurings.
 
So superior yet so little market share :)

Having so many features doesn't mean shit if it can't capture the market.

Personally I rather go the iRiver, Cowen or Toshiba route if I were to pass on the iPod.

Is Creative still doing their "Lets price our products higher so more people will buy it!" strategy?
 
Personal experience. I've had Creative replace 3 Zen's on me. And my roomate just had a replacement on one of the micro zen colours. I purchased an Ipod to DJ with (the first one EVER, moving wheel) and it's still going strong. No replacement battery.

I dont care which mp3 player has *better* features. FM tuners recieving low signal and low quality music is a huge turnoff. The market speaks for it's self. The countless MILLIONS of users that bought Ipods can't be wrong. Don't pull the, "It's the new fad, so everyone's buying them" line either... as the fad wouldn't have started if the product behind it was poor.

Extra formats? Awesome! Well, no... as Mp3 at anything above 128kbps is just fine for almost any user (if they're wearing the Ipod headphones, you know they're alright with low quality music anyways). For me, the iPod supports a full range of VBR and CBR bitrate MP3's and AAC's.

I hope creative wins this lawsuit. Why? Well, maybe they can use the cash they earned to actually develop a GREAT product, and give the iPod a run for it's (literal) money.


Most importantly... Apple should countersue, as the Vision M's menus are IDENTICAL to the first Ipod Photo, that IIRC was released much in advance of the M.
 
the only real beef i have with apple is that you have to interface with iTunes or some other program rather than just copying the music over like if it were a flash drive. That, and the iPod is way more expensive than it is worth.

I remember my old Archos Jukebox 6gb. Worked like a champ. Actually, it still works.
 
^^ Least. The best price I could find for a Vision M was 284 on Amazon. Apple, I believe, using their student discount offers them for 250.

Awesome DIVX support tho :/


So superior yet so little market share
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Kinda like the Apple Notebooks.
 
thrawn42 said:
Really? So you can see all of the files in non-music storage on your iPod while you're on the go?
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Oh, was that what you were talking about. Well, you didn't specify. Anyway, calenders go in the calenders, text items in the notes section, and so on and so forth. I don't see a problem. I don't see the need to access files the iPod can't process while on the go.



Ahh I'm sorry. What was I thinking? More features that don't hinder a technology in any way but rather enhance it don't make a product better. :rolleyes:
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Yes, that's the basic idea. More features only improve a product if you actually use those features. I wouldn't use those features, so the idea that the Creative product would be a better choice for everyone is preposterous. I wouldn't use the radio, so what do I care if it has one?


As far as I'm concerned that's really the only thing that iPod has over the Zen Vision M. The difference is negligible though and really nitpicking when it comes down to it.
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It's half as thick. I think that's a non-trivial difference.




Wow, totally didn't know about the PBJ-100. And while you're right about the creating technicality, I guess I was just trying to quell the "Creative stole the ipod from apple" murmurings.
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Oh, right. Carry on. Creative didn't technically rip Apple off. At least not from the start. :p




the only real beef i have with apple is that you have to interface with iTunes or some other program rather than just copying the music over like if it were a flash drive. That, and the iPod is way more expensive than it is worth.
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It's a technical necessity. In order to save battery time, the iPod uses a database to access the music. If you can add the music to the hard drive without adding it to the database, it'd be kinda hard to do that.
 
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