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RAID array question

D

dwschultz

n00b
Joined
Aug 8, 2015
Messages
10
Ok, I am new to creating a RAID array. I am a experienced PC builder, but this is the first time I am going to do this.

My setup:

AMD A88X chipset (Bolton D4)
OS is on a bootable SSD
Two Seagate Surveillance HDDs that will be a RAID 0 array
OS is Windows 8.1 x64

Questions:

1. Do I need to change the SATA controller mode to RAID in the BIOS and access the RAID Option ROM...meaning is it necessary for me to create the RAID 0 array in firmware if the array is strictly for data storage and will NOT be used for boot?

2. If the answer is NO to question #1, then is it even necessary to load the AMD AHCI/RAID driver for the chipset? Will the Microsoft AHCI driver do?

I understand that I will need to load the AMD RAID Expert Utility no matter what, even if it is just to create the array after the fact? I don't know how else I would create the array if not for the utility, other than via the BIOS/RAID Option ROM.

Sorry for the noob type questions, but it pays to ask FIRST before wasting time.

Thanks.
 
If raid whether on the boot drive or not, set Bios to raid. Unless you are using a plugin raid controller and not builtin raid off of the motherboard.

My question to you though, raid 0 = drive striping (usually for speed) = no backup at all, one drive goes the whole thing goes. Given it seems you are doing some kind of surveillance setup, is that a good idea?

Just sayin :)
 
If raid whether on the boot drive or not, set Bios to raid. Unless you are using a plugin raid controller and not builtin raid off of the motherboard.

My question to you though, raid 0 = drive striping (usually for speed) = no backup at all, one drive goes the whole thing goes. Given it seems you are doing some kind of surveillance setup, is that a good idea?

Just sayin :)
Click to expand...

Hello and thanks for your reply. In answer to your question, these HDDs are extremely high reliability 2M hour MTBF 24x7x365 drives designed for use in a multi-drive environment. I realize there is no fault tolerance in a RAID 0 array, but the risk is relatively minimal and the surveillance data is not critical. You are correct in that this is a NVR setup. It is a also a Mini-ITX mobo and gives me exactly 4 SATA headers. The only other option would be RAID 5, for use with THREE HDDs and the fourth header used for the SSD. A add-on card is a no-go since the single PCI-E x16 slot is occupied by a dual port Intel 350-T2 Ethernet server adapter.

So, back to the original post questions. My understanding is that:

I have to set the SATA controller to RAID in BIOS....

Which leads to the next two questions:

1. Will I need to build the RAID 0 array via the RAID Option ROM or can I wait until I am inside Windows and use the AMD utility?
2. In addition, given that the controller will be in RAID mode from the get-go, must I have a pre-install driver handy even though I do not intend to boot from the array?

The drives are both 2TB in size. This will yield a 4TB array...any considerations around that I need to be aware of? I know that a MBR drive cannot exceed 2TB, so if the RAID Option ROM can only create MBR drives then must I go the UEFI setup route?

Thanks again.
 
Yes, you need to enable raid in bios and yes you need to use the rom option (likely during boot) to format and configure the Raid.

On board raid is not known for being the fastest, though you will likely get some speed benefit.

Even the best drive can take a dump (I've been running raid 0 for years I know) anything critical should be backed up.

Any other questions please feel free.
 
I'm not familiar with AMD boards but for Intel boards when you set it to RAID in the bios, during boot there will be a RAID screen - you can just watch it go by or hit a few keys to make changes. In my past cases, I usually just hit Control-I when it comes up then setup the raid array however I like, click whatever to save, then exit to reboot. When Windows gets installed, the array will show up as just another drive to install on. Any additional software (such as Intel Rapid Storage Technology - IRST) is just to fine tune cache or other settings but I've had machines run fine without them (maybe not optimally though).
 
Elf_Boy said:
Yes, you need to enable raid in bios and yes you need to use the rom option (likely during boot) to format and configure the Raid.

On board raid is not known for being the fastest, though you will likely get some speed benefit.

Even the best drive can take a dump (I've been running raid 0 for years I know) anything critical should be backed up.

Any other questions please feel free.
Click to expand...

Thanks. So, set SATA controller in BIOS to RAID and setup the array in the option ROM. I guess the next and final question is whether I need to have a pre-install driver handy for an AMD A88X chipset on Windows 8.1 x64. Your thoughts?

Thanks!
 
You will have to set the controller mode to RAID. AMD boards have one or two SATA ports that can be set to AHCI independently. I cannot recall the precise option name. The reason for this is due to incompatibilities with AHCI drivers and RAID drivers. There are some work around to make a non-RAID drive work in this manner. But usually when you try and boot to an AHCI volume after switching the controller mode the system will BSOD. This is why I use a RAID 0 stripe for all motherboard reviews. I can connect single AHCI volumes to the system as necessary for testing purposes which works fine. I've only done this with Windows 7, I haven't tried it with Windows 8/8.1.

Once in RAID mode you can either enter the RAID BIOS and configure the array of you can use the utility in Windows. Like Intel's IRST software it creates an array which can be made Bootable and is managed by the onboard option ROM. It doesn't need to be configured by the array to be recognized by it. You will have to format the array as GPT to use it as a single volume.
Hope that helps.
 
Dan_D said:
You will have to set the controller mode to RAID. AMD boards have one or two SATA ports that can be set to AHCI independently. I cannot recall the precise option name. The reason for this is due to incompatibilities with AHCI drivers and RAID drivers. There are some work around to make a non-RAID drive work in this manner. But usually when you try and boot to an AHCI volume after switching the controller mode the system will BSOD. This is why I use a RAID 0 stripe for all motherboard reviews. I can connect single AHCI volumes to the system as necessary for testing purposes which works fine. I've only done this with Windows 7, I haven't tried it with Windows 8/8.1.

Once in RAID mode you can either enter the RAID BIOS and configure the array of you can use the utility in Windows. Like Intel's IRST software it creates an array which can be made Bootable and is managed by the onboard option ROM. It doesn't need to be configured by the array to be recognized by it. You will have to format the array as GPT to use it as a single volume.
Hope that helps.
Click to expand...

It helps out greatly!

So, from my understanding at this point I don't need to bother with the Option ROM. I actually intend nuke and pave when I perform the upgrade of the server.

So, I simply set the SATA mode to RAID in BIOS and install Windows 8.1 to the SSD per normal (as if the array did not even exist yet). I would then install the AMD RAID Driver (an optional download on the AMD website) and further the AMD RAID Xpert Utility in order to create and configure the array for the 64K stripe size I intend to use. I would then use Windows Disk Management to create a GPT partition so that all of the 4TB logical drive is usable, followed by a normal (not quick) format.

Correct? Did I get anything wrong?

Obviously I would have figured this all out by trial and error but again I want to save time and get the details up front.
 
You got it. If your going to reinstall the OS then you've got it all. But I believe you can still quick format the volume in disk manager.
 
dwschultz said:
Hello and thanks for your reply. In answer to your question, these HDDs are extremely high reliability 2M hour MTBF 24x7x365 drives designed for use in a multi-drive environment. I realize there is no fault tolerance in a RAID 0 array, but the risk is relatively minimal and the surveillance data is not critical. You are correct in that this is a NVR setup. It is a also a Mini-ITX mobo and gives me exactly 4 SATA headers. The only other option would be RAID 5, for use with THREE HDDs and the fourth header used for the SSD. A add-on card is a no-go since the single PCI-E x16 slot is occupied by a dual port Intel 350-T2 Ethernet server adapter.

So, back to the original post questions. My understanding is that:

I have to set the SATA controller to RAID in BIOS....

Which leads to the next two questions:

1. Will I need to build the RAID 0 array via the RAID Option ROM or can I wait until I am inside Windows and use the AMD utility?
2. In addition, given that the controller will be in RAID mode from the get-go, must I have a pre-install driver handy even though I do not intend to boot from the array?

The drives are both 2TB in size. This will yield a 4TB array...any considerations around that I need to be aware of? I know that a MBR drive cannot exceed 2TB, so if the RAID Option ROM can only create MBR drives then must I go the UEFI setup route?

Thanks again.
Click to expand...

Okay, the drives are big, the drives are tough.

Are the drives SPEC'ED for use in a RAID array?

If not, your array is likely going to fall down and go boom. Sooner, rather than later.

I'd triple-check this BEFORE you go RAID-happy.
 
Chas said:
Okay, the drives are big, the drives are tough.

Are the drives SPEC'ED for use in a RAID array?

If not, your array is likely going to fall down and go boom. Sooner, rather than later.

I'd triple-check this BEFORE you go RAID-happy.
Click to expand...

Kids these days..........

Back in my day we put any old drive into an array. We didn't have fancy RAID edition drives. :cool:

In all seriousness, the Western Digital drives have a TLER command that can be enabled on any drive via a utility. I've even used green drives in this manner with success. As for other brands. I don't know. I haven't kept up with mechanical drives all that much lately.
 
One, he's not using Western Digital drives.

Two, it's always a smart idea to double-check the equipment.

Three, doing a bit more reading, the Seagate drives he's using *are* spec'ed for RAID usage.
 
Chas said:
One, he's not using Western Digital drives.

Two, it's always a smart idea to double-check the equipment.

Three, doing a bit more reading, the Seagate drives he's using *are* spec'ed for RAID usage.
Click to expand...

I didn't catch what drives were in use originally.
 
Dan_D said:
I didn't catch what drives were in use originally.
Click to expand...

Yup.

The drives, to reiterate, are Seagate Surveillance series. These drives have the following attributes:

1. 5900 RPM, 3.5"
2. Optimized for up to 32 simultaneous camera streams recording, with NO skipped frames
3. Designed for use in enclosures with up to 8 HDDs.
4. 2 Million Hour MTBF, specifically engineered for 24x7x365 operation with continuous writing activity. The mechanicals are enterprise level.

They are big, tough, and RAID ready! ;)
 
Dan_D said:
You got it. If your going to reinstall the OS then you've got it all. But I believe you can still quick format the volume in disk manager.
Click to expand...

Thanks again. That will make life a hell of a lot easier to know the nits and nats up front.

For safety reasons I will do a real format and not the quick one. Just my OCD kicking in!

As an aside, I did consider the various SSD options such as the Samsung 845DC Pro. I stopped considering them once I figured out that the 800GB variation would set me back $900. WOW! Ok, I get they are designed for write intensive situations and the endurance is measured in Petabytes...but holy shit $900?....:eek:
 
What MoBo are you using? (specific model and manufacturer)

Some have windows based utilities for setting everything up... but you need to have already installed windows to use it.

Use the Rom option during boot. Easier and much less hassle.

It'll show the drives, you aggregate them and format them. Quick and easy.

Win 8 may well recognise the raid with no need for a driver -- if not before you start go to the MoBo's website and download the Raid Driver. Put it on a USB/CD/DVD and have it handy just in case.

Always sucks to get the install started and find out you need to get another computer to DL a driver you need.

Once you have the Raid defined as far as windows will be concerned it is a single drive.

If you are really worried about performance then get a separate PCIE Raid card (a decent one). LSI and other companies sell some pretty good ones for about $200. Anything less then $200ish will perform along the lines of the onboard RAID.
 
Least with my Gigabyte AMD board control-F gets you into the ROM which is made by promise to set up your array pre-OS.
Your board manufacturers site should have the driver for you to load off a USB.

I set mine up this way with raid1, now AMD does have their browser based setup called Raidxpert.
Not positive you can set up the array after the OS is installed like Intel or if it's just a program to check the raid array status/smart, etc.

I did have a drive go offline due to a bad cable, replaced and used Raidxpert to check/verify and it did.
 
As long as your not making the raid the boot drive you can set it up after installing windows.

Some boards have more then one sata controller so you want to be sure which one your plugging into.
 
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