Radeon 9X00: Core vs Mem, Synchronous?

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jmcmike

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jul 26, 2002
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506
OK, so today I'm thinking that perhaps I may be able to push the core of my 9800 Pro higher if I back down on the memory speed. I think I may be misinterpreting the scant white dots in the 3DMark03 Nature scene (waterfalls always get me) as a core problem rather than a memory problem. (As the core scales up, it pushes the memory harder etc)

So anyway, I'm going to try setting the memory at stock and see how high the core can go.

So my quesiton is what is the general concensus (if there is one) for Radeon 9X00 cards and core vs memory overclock? I have always pushed the memory first to get the most bandwidth for high res and AA but perhaps my thinking is outdated. What do you think?

Furthermore, I have read on a couple web sites that the Radeons were designed to run with synchronous core and memory speeds but this doesn't seem to make sense given that they are not synchronous from the factory.

Thoughts?
 
Blech!

Wrong again... I can't get this core any higher that 410 without seeing some white spots in the water of the 3DMark03 nature demo, regardless of the memory speed.

UGH I keep thinking there is some way to get this core higher. I guess I'm just envious of so many others who are running 450+ on their cores.

I'm thinking I might remove the shim and re-apply a tinner layer of AA to the core. What do you think?
 
I think you were suppost to remove the shim when you put your VGA silencer.

I must have gotten one hell of a card. Everyone was saying powercolor sucked, but I went with them anyways and holy shiznat i love it. 445/400 stock is shw33t.

Their is a program, ATItool. Google it. It oc's each mem and core untill it detects artifacts and then decreases it by 10 mhz. Im sure you could go higher, but Im to lazy to do 5 mhz increments to find my max.
 
The white dots are artifacts.

It indicates the memory is hot (might be clocked too high).

Overclocking the core excessively will lock up or reboot the pc. Or it could throw u back to desktop.

BBA 9800 Pro's overclock on the core highest.

Sapphire 9800 Pro's overclock the best on the memory.

The core overclock on the R350 is much more relative to performance then memory bandwidth.
 
Originally posted by ZigZagZeppelin
The white dots are artifacts.

It indicates the memory is hot (might be clocked too high).

Overclocking the core excessively will lock up or reboot the pc. Or it could throw u back to desktop.
Click to expand...
I hear what you're saying and I have read as much but as I said, with my memory at stock speeds, with ramsinks and an intake fan blowing over them, my core can't go past 410 without seeing these artifacts. Furthermore, since I can take the memory to 380 before I see typical memory artifacts, I am sure that these white dots are not a memory issue but rather from the core.
 
Originally posted by Cloud15x
I think you were suppost to remove the shim when you put your VGA silencer.
Their is a program, ATItool. Google it.
Click to expand...
Well the instructions didn't say anything about that. Nevertheless, although I am pretty sure I have good core contact (see this thread) I am thinking of removing it anyway in despiration.

As for ATITool, Google only shows 4 hits and none of them are relevant.
 
Ya I had the same problem as you everything ran fine EXCEPT white dots on the water. Took the core down some and bam no more white dots. That is a good core test I think. Too bad I have to wait for a couple minutes till it gets to that test. But at least the core has been taxed for a couple of minutes and should show signs of failure by then. I just go up 5 on each till I see problems in 3dmark03 and then back down 5-10 for everyday. Good Luck.
 
Cool, nice to know I'm not crazy. It seems that I could push alot further except for these little dots. Still, it's enough of a red flag to know it's running too fast. I never stick with any speeds that are not 100% stable and artifact free. Even then I only crank up the clocks w/ Powerstrip right before I start a game.

So I don't know. I can't help but wonder if I'm doing something wrong. With this cooler I should be able to get more, unless I just lucked out (in?) with a poor core (gee that rhymes)
 
What brand 9800 Pro is it first of all?

The Sapphire cores don't clock too high I know, the ATI retail cores REALLY clock high.

At any rate it could be a number of factors. Have your case temps risen much since putting the Pro in there? Could be heat, poor contact or just a poor clocker.

My BBA Pro can't hit high memory overclocks, 380-385 is it. But my core can hit 490. Stock hsf on air.

http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k3=1854315
 
Originally posted by ZigZagZeppelin
What brand 9800 Pro is it first of all?

The Sapphire cores don't clock too high I know, the ATI retail cores REALLY clock high.

At any rate it could be a number of factors. Have your case temps risen much since putting the Pro in there? Could be heat, poor contact or just a poor clocker.

My BBA Pro can't hit high memory overclocks, 380-385 is it. But my core can hit 490. Stock hsf on air.

http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k3=1854315
Click to expand...


Not so true about the Retail cores , mine won't go much higher then 440 and i'm on water. My memory on the other hand I havn't seen how far I can push it. I'm able to get 380 , but I've only tested my 9800 1 time with those speeds. Guess it's just luck of the draw on how far you can push your card.
 
Originally posted by ZigZagZeppelin
What brand 9800 Pro is it first of all?...
Have your case temps risen much since putting the Pro in there? Could be heat, poor contact or just a poor clocker.
Click to expand...
It's a BBA.

The case temps are fine, plenty of ventilation. Side intake fan blowing over the card. VGA Silencer on the card exhausting hot air out the back of the case.

I'm thinking that it's just a bad sample. (Actually typical for me, I'm not very fortune in that regard.) Just the same, I am far to crazy to give up yet. :D
 
Originally posted by Swat
Guess it's just luck of the draw on how far you can push your card.
Click to expand...
Yep, probably so in this case. Still, since I've basically already voided the warranty, I may as well remove the shim and she what it gets me. I've heard it can be done rather painlessly and safe with dental floss.
 
White specs are generally memory, I agree with the above.
However, keep in mind it is not JUST the memory in this equation. The memory controller is on the core, if the memory controller cannot take the current speed, memory errors will occur during transfer, causing what seems to be memory problems. Try overclocking system RAM vs overclocking the northbridge/fsb. It depends on the system, but the same errors can occur with both configurations.
 
Old man, I believe were talking about graphic cards not cpus.

And anyways how would you overclock your memory without overclocking your fsb?
 
white dots for me always mean core is too high... when my ram is too high i get diamonds all over the screen and have to restart (even 1 mhz too high on the memory) with vga silencer i get 455 on core and still 370 on memory, the vga silencer didnt effect the memory overclock at all
 
VGA silencer needs to make VGA Silencer2 for 9800Pros where it covers all ram on the gpu side and comes with a passive top ramsink like the 5900 ultra's have.
 
Originally posted by Icewindius
Its not supposed to, it cools the GPU core, not the freaking memory
Click to expand...

yeah... and it lowers the overall case temperature and takes heat away from the area. have you not read any of the reviews? reviews show that they can overclock the memory more because there is less heat...
 
Point One: I get white dots with this core at anything higher than 410 with the memory at stock speeds Furthermore, this memory will currently hit 380 without artifacts, even with the core at 410. This tells me that the white dots, at least in my case, are related to the core. They seem to show up on pixel shaders with transparency such as with the water in the nature demo.

Point Two: Attaching the VGA Silencer to my card got me 5 more MHz out of the memory (from 375 to 380) I believe this is the result of two things. 1) Hot air is no longer blowing out of the cooler over top of the front side memory chips. 2) The card is overall cooler because alot of heat is now being ejected out the back of the case.
 
and i have to say I love my card cuz i dont have the ballz to fux with a 300 bux card
 
Originally posted by jmcmike
Blech!

Wrong again... I can't get this core any higher that 410 without seeing some white spots in the water of the 3DMark03 nature demo, regardless of the memory speed.

UGH I keep thinking there is some way to get this core higher. I guess I'm just envious of so many others who are running 450+ on their cores.

I'm thinking I might remove the shim and re-apply a tinner layer of AA to the core. What do you think?
Click to expand...


BEFORE ANYONE REMOVES THE SHIM ON A 9800 SERIES CARD CHECK FIRST IF THE SHIM IS LOW THEN THE CORE.

Cause when I checked my shim was low then the core (well the thing in the middle) and saved me from removing it, also saved my the void of warranty.

BTW all the 9800 series cards I seen have the shim lower.
 
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