Radeon 2900XT = Nvidia 5800

P

POPEGOLD

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Dec 18, 2005
Messages
1,117
Ok lets call it

the 2900XT is still born

a flop

and a dissapointment...

The r650 will be alot better.... passing on this r600
 
That is what I am thinking. Already bought my next gen card, so I am not too concerned. I just hope their next one can beat nvidia's next one so I can buy a cheap card when I go SLI.
 
Ati's r600 core will be better and clock much higher adn run cooler at 65nm

80nm is just too big for it
 
I don't think the HD 2900XT isn't that bad. Comparing it to the the 5800 is streteching it abit.


Its only proves significantly behind the GTS if the following conditions are true.

High Resolution 1920 x 1200 or greater. (i.e. 23 inch + LCDs)
High dosages of FSAA & AF are used.


I think plenty of people will by the HD 2900 given the right price. It also looks appealing with CF too.
For people with 1280 x 1024 LCDs (17,19 inch) LCD's , its hard to say which one is faster.


## The following describes HD2900XT's performance.

HD2900XT Performance()
{
if((FSAA=on)&&(AF=on))
{
performance = sucks;
end of story;
}
else
{
if((FSAA=on))or(AF=on))
{
performance = not so good;
​
}​
else
{
performance = resonable;​
}
}
​
}

#####End of Description####

I think the problem with ATI is that they didn't think "out of the box" when the were looking at there R600 generation options. Nvidia designed the G80 architecture and decoupled the "shaders/(stream processors)" clock speeds with the rest of the chip. (don't think ATI expected that one comming when guessing what nvidia was up to)
 
I wouldn't call it a 5800, its not nearly as far behind the competition.

The 5800 was so slow that Valve chose to run it in DX8.1 mode for HL2 instead of DX9. I don't see the 2900xt lagging nearly that far.

Hell, if they slash prices to $300 I might consider one. You know, if it came with a free PSU and a coupon for $50 worth of electricity...
 
Phew, thank god it flopped. Otherwise I would have cried if it beat my pair of $700 cards :(
 
Martyr said:
how is it a flop you fucktards, it was just released.
Click to expand...

exactly, now look at the calendar, look at what the date is, and realize how long the GF 8s have been out for. Realize how often ati has postponed the r600, and how much time they had to get their drivers ready for this release....
 
DrFreeze said:
exactly, now look at the calendar, look at what the date is, and realize how long the GF 8s have been out for. Realize how often ati has postponed the r600, and how much time they had to get their drivers ready for this release....
Click to expand...

the r600 should have put the smack down on the 8800GTX.... but it cant ...with all the delays...it makes it a flop
 
i dont think its a flop. possible imature drivers (of course im not blaming it totally) and it overclocks well. comparing it to a 5800 is pretty low. wasnt it the 5 series that said dx9 but yet sucked ass in dx9 titles? im sure the 2900xt wont suck in dx10 games as bad as the 5 series did with dx 9. i think the card is decent long over due too but still we got something.
 
Now that's pretty low...lol.

But... ATI has come close with their HSF before. I don't know how loud that fan is at full bore. I do know that my GTX's isn't in the same ball park as the 1900xtx that it replaced.
 
R600 isn't quite as bad as NV30. Maybe if ATi had strapped an obscenely loud fan to R600, clocked it to 1000MHz, and charged $600 for it, maybe then you could call it NV30.

Not to mention one of NV30's biggest mistakes was its 128 bit memory bus, R600 has quite the opposite problem, it has more memory bandwidth than it could possibly ever use.
 
^eMpTy^ said:
R600 isn't quite as bad as NV30. Maybe if ATi had strapped an obscenely loud fan to R600, clocked it to 1000MHz, and charged $600 for it, maybe then you could call it NV30.

Not to mention one of NV30's biggest mistakes was its 128 bit memory bus, R600 has quite the opposite problem, it has more memory bandwidth than it could possibly ever use.
Click to expand...


its like putting a 8 lane super highway in the middle of a 1000 person town
 
^eMpTy^ said:
R600 isn't quite as bad as NV30. Maybe if ATi had strapped an obscenely loud fan to R600, clocked it to 1000MHz, and charged $600 for it, maybe then you could call it NV30.

Not to mention one of NV30's biggest mistakes was its 128 bit memory bus, R600 has quite the opposite problem, it has more memory bandwidth than it could possibly ever use.
Click to expand...

Which is interesting because it does really poorly in memory bandwidth tests. I'll bet that's a driver issue.
 
Obi_Kwiet said:
Which is interesting because it does really poorly in memory bandwidth tests. I'll bet that's a driver issue.
Click to expand...


yeah...that puzzles the hell out of me.... hows can it lose that bad in bandwidth tests when it has the greatest bandwidth... its like a porche losing to a kia in a off the line 1/4 mile drag race

the drivers are real immature..... and they got it to half decent levels and released it...

thats my theory...and it will improve over the next few driver releases at a decent clip
 
POPEGOLD said:
yeah...that puzzles the hell out of me.... hows can it lose that bad in bandwidth tests when it has the greatest bandwidth... its like a porche losing to a kia in a off the line 1/4 mile drag race

the drivers are real immature..... and they got it to half decent levels and released it...

thats my theory...and it will improve over the next few driver releases at a decent clip
Click to expand...

doesn't have fillrate.
 
^eMpTy^ said:
R600 isn't quite as bad as NV30. Maybe if ATi had strapped an obscenely loud fan to R600, clocked it to 1000MHz, and charged $600 for it, maybe then you could call it NV30.
Click to expand...

The Techreport did a sound test and the R600 was still pretty loud. I never owned an FX5800, but i did own a 1900xtx afterburner (I can't imagine anything worse than that). The FX must have been really really freaking loud. While the R600 is not obscenely loud enough to dethrone the all-time champ, ATI is moving in the wrong direction.
 
POPEGOLD said:
Ok lets call it

the 2900XT is still born

a flop

and a dissapointment...

The r650 will be alot better.... passing on this r600
Click to expand...

Couldn't it be better compared to the last gen (x1800)? It was late and sucked compared to the nVidia card, but the refresh (x1900) kicked major ass.

I can only hope...
 
KENNYB said:
The Techreport did a sound test and the R600 was still pretty loud. I never owned an FX5800, but i did own a 1900xtx afterburner (I can't imagine anything worse than that). The FX must have been really really freaking loud. While the R600 is not obscenely loud enough to dethrone the all-time champ, ATI is moving in the wrong direction.
Click to expand...

the fx literally sounded like a leafblower.
 
yea I heard the 2900xt is really good for doing high res... This is what I need. I game at 1920x1200 on a 23" wide screen flat panel monitor :D and soon 2x 20" 1680x1050 and I need a gpu for my new c2d system.
 
Martyr said:
the fx literally sounded like a leafblower.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I think people think that's an exaggeration. But it really is the loudest thing I've ever heard in a computer case. I actually have 2 FX 5800 Ultras (I'm a bit of a collector) and I managed to go 5 minutes with one in my case before I couldn't stand it anymore.
 
I wouldn't call the 2900 a flop.... Although I certainly wouldn't say it's something to drool over like we'd all hope for. I think the main problem is drivers. Once the 7.5 and 7.6 Catalyst drivers come out, I think we'll see a relatively decent boost in performance. But unfortunitly, I think the main thing that's holding this card back is power. I think 65nm R650 will be a lot better.
 
I knew a girl once that could suck start a leaf blower!! She was too damn loud too!!
I remember the 5800fan almost made me react the way fingernails scratching a chalkboard did. You know the thing that bothers me was their were some who really overhyped this 2900 card to get people wound up to buy it and that is just wrong.....


WZ
 
The 2900XT is nowhere near the NV30 in terms of failure. The NV30 offered horrible performance with a broken architecture that could only provide the performance it did have by clocking the chip so high it registered over 72db in sound.

The 2900XT is simply a part that performs lower then it should with power issues. Very large difference, the architecture is not inherently flawed.
 
^eMpTy^ said:
Yeah, I think people think that's an exaggeration. But it really is the loudest thing I've ever heard in a computer case. I actually have 2 FX 5800 Ultras (I'm a bit of a collector) and I managed to go 5 minutes with one in my case before I couldn't stand it anymore.
Click to expand...

Actually, i've been interested in acquiring an FX just to hear it for myself. The 1900xtx is the loudest card i've ever owned.
 
KENNYB said:
Actually, i've been interested in acquiring an FX just to hear it for myself. The 1900xtx is the loudest card i've ever owned.
Click to expand...

I've heard both. There really is no comparison, the 5800 Ultra is much louder. Back in the day someone recorded the sound of the fan spinning up, you might be able to find a wav file of it somewhere.

I did some googling and found that an X1900 XTX under full load runs around 46dB at 3 feet away...the FX 5800 Ultra was 60 dB at 3 feet away...

Remember that dB is a logarithmic scale, and every 3 decibels or so represents a doubling of the noise level...so 60 - 46 = 14, 14 / 3 = 4.67...so the FX 5800 Ultra was roughly FIVE TIMES LOUDER than an X1900 XTX...

Ah, the good ole days...
 
snowysnowcones said:
I wouldn't call the 2900 a flop.... Although I certainly wouldn't say it's something to drool over like we'd all hope for. I think the main problem is drivers. Once the 7.5 and 7.6 Catalyst drivers come out, I think we'll see a relatively decent boost in performance. But unfortunitly, I think the main thing that's holding this card back is power. I think 65nm R650 will be a lot better.
Click to expand...

It's still a flop, for the exact reason you said in the last sentence. It doesn't matter that even IF we get on par, or slightly greater performance than the GTS, with better drives, we're still using about 100 watts more power. That's a lot of power wasted. Plus, the GTS is available for less than the 2900 most places. It's a flop, and unless the refresh is PERFECT, I think ATi might be a little fucked.
 
^eMpTy^ said:
R600 isn't quite as bad as NV30. Maybe if ATi had strapped an obscenely loud fan to R600, clocked it to 1000MHz, and charged $600 for it, maybe then you could call it NV30.
Click to expand...

Exactly what I thought abour R600, if AMD would gone through with the plan 2900XT vs 8800GTX and it would have costed 550$, the verdict would have been clear Flop on my part. AMD did save what was left by introducing 2900XT with a 400$ pricetag and stated it was competing with 8800GTS IMO. Not a flop, but definetly a let down, as people were waiting for GTX killer.

PRIME1 said:
Actually this thread passed the border during the night and now the Mexican army is pointing guns at it and yelling "we don't need no stinkin' badges"
Click to expand...

Haha LoL, theres been quite a few of these border passer thread since R600 launch :D
 
djBon2112 said:
It's still a flop, for the exact reason you said in the last sentence. It doesn't matter that even IF we get on par, or slightly greater performance than the GTS, with better drives, we're still using about 100 watts more power. That's a lot of power wasted. Plus, the GTS is available for less than the 2900 most places. It's a flop, and unless the refresh is PERFECT, I think ATi might be a little fucked.
Click to expand...

a flow would mean it sells for shit. since it was just released, anyone calling it a flop is talking out their proverbial ass.
 
There's another parrallel to the fx5800 that I don't think anyone else has mentioned (besides me).

I BELIEVE this is ATI's first 32-bit (128) precision card, all of their past few generations have been 24-bit (96) precision. Just like the fx5800 was Nvidia's first card with full 32-bit precision on the whole pipe.

The difference is Nvidia has had 3 generations since to work on the huge amount of additional processing that must be done. And figure out ways to maximize the performance for it. Thats why the 2900 is so hot, so power hungry, etc.
 
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