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Questions about RAID

D

DarkCyber

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
May 14, 2003
Messages
1,273
I'm looking at building a dns server and need some advice on RAID. What do I need to look for in my motherboard? I know nothing RAID.

I know there are different kinds of RAID, but don't know what they do.

I'm wanting to run RAID to keep a backup of my main drive. If I run RAID, will it keep a real time backup of the main drive? And if the main drive fails, will the pc work off of the second drive or will the pc just crash and then I have to change drive 2 and make it drive 1.

Thanks!
Darkcyber
 
Link because I'm too lazy to type it all out


Also, I'd get an actual RAID card rather than a mobo that supports RAID. That way, if you move the array to another system, all the data will still be there.

In addition to that, RAID is not a backup solution... its redundancy. You're looking at RAID 1 (mirroring drives). This works well in the event of a HDD failure. If one drive fails, the other drive continues to work and run the system. However, if you delete something from the drive, it will be deleted from both drives. RAID is not a backup.
 
Originally posted by animeguru
Link because I'm too lazy to type it all out


Also, I'd get an actual RAID card rather than a mobo that supports RAID. That way, if you move the array to another system, all the data will still be there.

In addition to that, RAID is not a backup solution... its redundancy. You're looking at RAID 1 (mirroring drives). This works well in the event of a HDD failure. If one drive fails, the other drive continues to work and run the system. However, if you delete something from the drive, it will be deleted from both drives. RAID is not a backup.
Click to expand...

which is exactly the link I would have used ;)
an additional one that should be reviewed
RAID I: The Lesser Levels

including
Different “Categories” of RAID

In general, on we need to distinguish between three different categories of RAID, namely:

1. Standalone RAID solutions for mass storage in the backplane of servers (fiber channel-attached) or Network-Attached Storage (NAS) connected via Firewire or Gigabit Ethernet.

2. RAID functionality via separate Host Bus Adapter (HBA) cards using PCI, PCI-X (64bit / 66 MHz) or PCI-Express (3GIO) interface.

3. RAID controller integrated on the mainboard level. Often called RAID-lite because of limited functionality, except for dedicated Server boards. RAID on Mainboard (ROMB).
Click to expand...
 
Originally posted by Ice Czar
which is exactly the link I would have used ;)
Click to expand...

Heh, you always post those links, I've started to bookmark them since the questions come up so frequently. ;)
 
yeh thats how it starts, next thing you know....your a mod :p
 
Ok, thanks for the info. I guess redundancy is probably what I meant to say. I want the server to continue running if the main hd fails. I can always back up my data on a regualr schedule.

Any particular RAID card that anyone would recommend? Brand or model?

And does it matter that I'm planning on running Linux on this server? i.e. are there certain RAID cards that work better with Linux?

Thanks!
Darkcyber
 
well you want to make sure that the card you selected had the appropriate Linux drivers available

I think all cards will do RAID 1 (mirror)
and if Im not mistaken (never having built one) you dont need alot of throughput for a DNS server, so a simple 32bit 33MHz card will do

so Id say a Promise or Highpoint
 
Damn Ice, you're slacking man. :p


IDE RAID Card Roundup - A little out of date, extremely lengthy article, probably more than you'll ever need to know about IDE RAID and what card is best for your price/project.

The prices are probably different now, but you'll get a good sense of what the major manufacturers have to offer and how they perform.
 
Originally posted by animeguru
Damn Ice, you're slacking man. :p
Click to expand...

Ah shucks :p

Actually I dont think he needs that much throughput for a simple DNS server (but I could be wrong) That is a good (but old) comparision of IDE RAID for say low level NAS, or Database
some of those are PCI 64bit 66MHz or 32bit 66MHz cards
 
True, but there is some good info there on the Highpoint RocketRAID controller which is probably what he'll wind up going for since its such a budget card. That way he'll know what to expect of it.
 
Ok, another question about raid. For windows now...if I get a raid card install 2 160 gig drives to it, I assume the raid card comes with software to make it mirror the first drive or how do you get it to mirror the first drive?

I have a promise card that came with my Western Digirtal 160 gig hd, I don't assume that will do it...will it?

Thanks!
Darkcyber
 
probably it just a controller not a hardware RAID card
basicly its a matter of semantics regarding IDE RAID Hardware and Software mirror or stripe, since most cards have to have the CPU do the mirror or stripe (1 or 0)

but to directly answer your question if you used the controller and built a mirror with the OS, youd have to employ dynamic disks and they have drawbacks (recovery, no reversion back to basic disks without 3rd party software ect see below)

if you did it in hardware with a card the RAID BIOS would handle building the array, the OS would require a driver, but as mentioned it would still use the CPU to do it, but you get to keep basic disks instead of dynamic, performance either way would be about the same
but managing dynamic disks is a learning curve balanced against $20 or $30 for a basic dual channel IDE RAID card

personally Id pop for the $$$
hardware still has distinct advantages
(like breaking, migrating and rebuilding a mirror)

Dynamic Disks
Description of Disk Groups in Windows Disk Management
Dynamic vs. Basic Storage in Windows 2000
Basic and Dynamic Disks @ Windows & .net Magazine
HOW TO: Recover an Accidentally Deleted NTFS or FAT32 Dynamic Volume
Dynamic Disk Hardware Limitations (No firewire, USB, removable or laptop)
HOW TO: Set Up Fault-Tolerant Sets on Dynamic Disks in Windows 2000
Dynamic Disk Numbering and the DmDiag.exe Tool
HOW TO: Regenerate a Dynamic Mirrored Volume in Windows 2000
Restrictions on Extending or Spanning Simple Volumes on Dynamic Disks

Limits of Dynamic Disks in Windows 2000
LDMDump (Freeware utility) @ sysinternals
LDM Database @ Linux-NTFS project
LDM FAQ @ Linux-NTFS project
 
Originally posted by animeguru
Also, I'd get an actual RAID card rather than a mobo that supports RAID. That way, if you move the array to another system, all the data will still be there.
Click to expand...

I've moved a software mirror from a Windows XP Pro box to a Windows Server 2003 one, imported the dynamic disks, and it was going no problem :)
I wouldn't like, do RAID 0 or RAID 5 software, but RAID 1 doesn't seem to be a problem, especially with the way Windows works it. Exact copies. You can actually pull one of the drives, dump it in another machine to get data off of it, and drop it back in the original machine and it's going again. I don't think I'd do it on a gaming machine (CPU performance impact), but on a server or *maybe* a workstation, it's not a bad idea at all.
 
from what I hear Linux software RAID is even better
but its hard to beat true SCSI Hardware RAID
for effciency and CPU impact

especially when the stripe width increases (0 or 0+1)
not directly related to mirrors but hey :p

can you tell Im bored?
 
Just to be the black sheep here:

This is a dns server, right? Instead of trying to keep a single machine up, why not put a second machine in a different geographic location, and designate it as the backup dns server for that domain?

You get better redunancy, as now you have 2 of everything, not just harddrives.

Just a thought.
 
No, not talking about a server now. I'm talking about my regular pc which runs Windows XP Pro. I thought I put in the post I did today it was about Windows...maybe I didn't :)

My 160 gig hd took a crap last night and lost everything. Can't even get it to show up in the bios. So, I have a second 160 gig hd that I've put in and I'm starting from the beginning.

Western Digital is sending me a new 160 to replace the bad one. And when I got it in I thought about hooking the two up with raid and mirror it so if this happens again I don't loose everything. This pc is my general pc and I do play Quake 3, Halo,...etc. on it.
 
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