PWM IC - What's a dangerous temperature?

L

Lukano

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 11, 2003
Messages
344
Finally got my Opteron 165 and PC4000 ram as shown in my sig, so I threw them into my current machine (without needing to reinstall windows I might add, and so far so good) and gave a quick test run.

PWM IC was wavering between 36C after a semi-cold boot according to the bios, up to about 44C stock speeds in windows.

I then shut down and threw the HTT up to 250 but left everything else the same (other than dropping the HTT multi to 4 of course) and so far so good - I hope.

Just as a quick test, I'm going to prime both cores for a couple of hours at this speed and see what it looks like. But I notice that Smartguardian shows idle temp at 38C but PWM IC at 51C which is highlighted red. Chipset's fine at 45.

51C still all well and good, or dangerously high?
 
CPU temps going no higher than 44-45C with both cores priming (using the first revision Arctic Cooling Freezer 64 - non pro, at least until my Scythe Ninja shows up) but PWM IC keeps climbing. Up to 59C now.

edit - 10 minutes in, PWM IC climbing up to 61C. Yeeesh! I'll give it 5 mins while I go grab a drink, but if it's this high when I get back I'm dropping the HTT back to stock for now.

A quick side question - when cooling the PWM IC - do you need to cool the chip itself, the sensor (which I know is in a different location thanks to my previous PWM IC thread) or both?
 
60C is hot, but not hot enough to damage the PWM's, they can take pretty high temperatures. 60C wouldn't even be hot enough to damage most CPU's. You're fine with the temps. If you want to lower the temps of your PWM's then simply try to get more airflow around them, whether that entails better wire management, stronger fans, or an extra fan pointed right at that area of the motherboard.
 
I usually work on the idea that if it's stable, it's ok. But then I tend to repeatedly crash and BSOD any time my PWM IC temps go over 48C :mad: . It got so bad I had to put a Fan over the IC heat sinks - now it stays pretty stable at 32-40c and my overall stability is vastly better.
 
Erasmus354 said:
60C is hot, but not hot enough to damage the PWM's, they can take pretty high temperatures. 60C wouldn't even be hot enough to damage most CPU's. You're fine with the temps. If you want to lower the temps of your PWM's then simply try to get more airflow around them, whether that entails better wire management, stronger fans, or an extra fan pointed right at that area of the motherboard.
Click to expand...

Ok, good to know. I'm waiting on an Antec P180, which once it arrives should solve airflow concerns. It'll also give me a chance to affix a heatsink to the PWM IC itself to try to help with cooling.
 
Lukano said:
Ok, good to know. I'm waiting on an Antec P180, which once it arrives should solve airflow concerns. It'll also give me a chance to affix a heatsink to the PWM IC itself to try to help with cooling.
Click to expand...
You do know that the PWMICs already have heatsinks on them right? :p
 
you also need to remember that the vRegs get less efficient at higher temeratures. the cooler you run them the more stable your power is going to be (to a point of course). your best bet is to point a fan at them. it dosent take much just a little airflow. If you are watercooling this is even more of a concern because you dont have the wash from the cpu fan blowing air onto the PWM ic's.
 
thunderstruck! said:
You do know that the PWMICs already have heatsinks on them right? :p
Click to expand...

The image I was given for my particular DFI board tends to contradict that. PWM IC without any form of passive cooling, and an exposed sensor.

I'm working on partial information here - basically having read a few posts with concern about PWM IC temperatures and methods to cool it to ensure stable and long-lifved overclocks.

A quote from the other thread I started regarding PWM IC's.

ChingChang said:
Location of the PWMIC sensor is here
PWMICsensor.jpg

small yellow thing next to mosfets.

The actual chip is the exposed rectangular chip in the top right corner of the mobo, to the left of the 24 pin power connector.
Click to expand...
 
:confused: My friends who have been building computers for over 10 plus years. Tell ME to stay near 60C . Run your most extensive program to simulate your most difficult use of your system for 2 hours to 5 hours. If no system errors or crashes, your fine. REMEMBER higher heat decreases the life of your system componants! If you can afford to replace them more offten than every 2 years. BURN away!... Since every companant is outdated about every 6 mth's from tech advancemants. It only matters how much you can afford to spend!!!...My old build is 2.5 yrs old, overclocked from 1.74G to 1.9g's ! My new build will have to last 5 yrs to match the value of the old. The more you learn, the HARDER it is to settel for less... ;)
 
DkMn said:
:confused: My friends who have been building computers for over 10 plus years. Tell ME to stay near 60C . Run your most extensive program to simulate your most difficult use of your system for 2 hours to 5 hours. If no system errors or crashes, your fine. REMEMBER higher heat decreases the life of your system componants! If you can afford to replace them more offten than every 2 years. BURN away!... Since every companant is outdated about every 6 mth's from tech advancemants. It only matters how much you can afford to spend!!!...My old build is 2.5 yrs old, overclocked from 1.74G to 1.9g's ! My new build will have to last 5 yrs to match the value of the old. The more you learn, the HARDER it is to settel for less... ;)
Click to expand...

I'm sorry - I wasn't going to comment on this, but this is a HORRIBLY generalized statement that paints all scenarios and hardware with the same brush.

Yes, 60C is likely fine for the PWM IC in this case, but that can't be said for all components. Video cards can handle running temperatures in excess of 100C in some cases, certain processors range between normalized stock temperatures of 25C to 70C depending on make/model/revision, and secondary components may have a smaller threshold within which they operate. Ie; 45C standard idle, 48C load, 50C too much and cooks.

So not to sound like a pompous jackass, but the advice of veteran computer repair shop techs can't always be taken as the absolute truth. From personal experience, having worked in computer retail and repair for about the same time as your friend - the vast majority of people only know that which they're most familiar with hardware-wise - and are prone to misjudging technology they're unfamiliar with by the same standards. Which isn't always a valid comparison.

(ps - 3 years and counting out of retail/repair in a completely unrelated field, and loving it.)
 
I'd like to add to this discussion of temperature that my P4-m laptop has been happily chugging along at 50-85C for the past 2 years with narry a complaint.
 
Erasmus354 said:
I'd like to add to this discussion of temperature that my P4-m laptop has been happily chugging along at 50-85C for the past 2 years with narry a complaint.
Click to expand...

Which is what I was getting at when I said painting all hardware with a 60C brush is innaccurate as that's well within reason for a P4 chip - yet an A64 on the at the temp would be cooked. (edit - referring to 85C).

But the discussion of appropriate temperature levels for anything but PWM IC's is a bit off-topic for the thread at hand.
 
Does the PWM IC have vendor and part number markings on it? Maybe you can just lookup its datasheet for max temp info on the web?
 
Lukano said:
The image I was given for my particular DFI board tends to contradict that. PWM IC without any form of passive cooling, and an exposed sensor.
Click to expand...
That's the DFI NF4 SLI-DR and don't know where you're looking, but these are the PWMICs.

lpnf4slidr5qi.jpg


Look at the heatsinks.
 
mr-busta said:
Does the PWM IC have vendor and part number markings on it? Maybe you can just lookup its datasheet for max temp info on the web?
Click to expand...

Hmm, good point. When I swap the components over to the P180 next week I'll take a peek.
 
thunderstruck! said:
That's the DFI NF4 SLI-DR and don't know where you're looking, but these are the PWMICs.

lpnf4slidr5qi.jpg


Look at the heatsinks.
Click to expand...

Hey, I didn't make the initial set of directions - I'm just working off of information I was given. I was told that the PWM IC sensor is to the right of the top heatsink you outlined (which were explained to me as the Mosfets, not PWM IC's) and that the bare IC shown slight above and to the left of the ATX slots was the PWM IC itself.

I may have been given wrong information - and in which case - GREAT! It means less work on my end.
 
mr-busta said:
Does the PWM IC have vendor and part number markings on it? Maybe you can just lookup its datasheet for max temp info on the web?
Click to expand...

I am pretty sure the heatsinks are soldered onto the PWM's so you cant look at the markings on the chips.
 
Erasmus354 said:
I am pretty sure the heatsinks are soldered onto the PWM's so you cant look at the markings on the chips.
Click to expand...
Soldered, I doubt it. Epoxied or glued, most likely. Just put some heat on it and twist with pliers, they'll come off. But make sure you have some sort of thermal adhesive to put if back on.

Before you even do that... the PWM IC are NOT the ones with the heatsinks. These are the output MOSFETs, that supply the tons of current to the CPU and the board. PWM IC will be a smaller chip with 8 or more pins on the board.

Lukano... I don't know why you're so concerned with this PWM IC temperature. DFI has probably THE best power supply design of all motherboards since it was made for overclocking, and their design should be able to handle the load. 61C is high for an AMD proc, but for a power supply, 61C is cake walk. Don't even sweat it, unless you're case air flow is not so great.
 
mr-busta said:
Soldered, I doubt it. Epoxied or glued, most likely. Just put some heat on it and twist with pliers, they'll come off. But make sure you have some sort of thermal adhesive to put if back on.

Before you even do that... the PWM IC are NOT the ones with the heatsinks. These are the output MOSFETs, that supply the tons of current to the CPU and the board. PWM IC will be a smaller chip with 8 or more pins on the board.

Lukano... I don't know why you're so concerned with this PWM IC temperature. DFI has probably THE best power supply design of all motherboards since it was made for overclocking, and their design should be able to handle the load. 61C is high for an AMD proc, but for a power supply, 61C is cake walk. Don't even sweat it, unless you're case air flow is not so great.
Click to expand...

Ok, that's good to know. I was concerned likely due to the low threshold settings in Speed Fan and SmartGuardian - which were flagging the sensor as dangerous when it broke 50C. Once I get my P180 and solve the few airflow issues I have - I'll just set that sensor flag higher.

Thanks!
 
DFI Daishi said:
in a thread about vid card vreg cooling this is what someone who works with electronics gear had to say: http://www.hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1028520121&postcount=13

i don't think that your IC is too put out running in the 60s.
Click to expand...



That's right.....on some water coled boards, those PWM's get next to no airlow and will run in the 75c to 90c range all day long under load....no worries mate....
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top