PSU's to Avoid

[ElMoIsEviL]

I would add Antec to the list... soo many incompatibilities and then the Neo series which were horrid PSU's (most of the power was converted into heat).

I'd say Antec are middle of the road PSU's.. but for an overclocker they should be in the BAD PSU list.

 

[[Spectre]]

I would add Antec to the list... soo many incompatibilities and then the Neo series which were horrid PSU's (most of the power was converted into heat).

I'd say Antec are middle of the road PSU's.. but for an overclocker they should be in the BAD PSU list.

Antec's in general have been CWT (and previously HEC) PSU's. Not something to actively avoid and not the best...but they are usually widely available and at decent enough prices.

As for efficency on the HE's:

72-79% efficency http://www.silentpcreview.com/article273-page4.html

75-79% efficency http://www.jonnyguru.com/PSU/NeoHE430/

Those are decent to good numbers for efficency so not that much is converted into heat.

 

[Tt Tech]

Antec's in general have been CWT (and previously HEC) PSU's. Not something to actively avoid and not the best...but they are usually widely available and at decent enough prices.

As for efficency on the HE's:

72-79% efficency http://www.silentpcreview.com/article273-page4.html

75-79% efficency http://www.jonnyguru.com/PSU/NeoHE430/

Those are decent to good numbers for efficency so not that much is converted into heat.

With the problems they have with their NeoHE series, people would be rather shocked to find out who made them....

 

[Bbq]

NeoHE = seasonic

 

[[Spectre]]

With the problems they have with their NeoHE series, people would be rather shocked to find out who made them....

I know who makes them

But it is a contract job....Seasonic makes them to Antec's specs/orders.

For instance Sirtech has made PSU's as contract jobs that were labeled/represented beyond their capabilities/correct market position by other companies

 

[Tt Tech]

I know who makes them

But it is a contract job....Seasonic makes them to Antec's specs/orders.

For instance Sirtech has made PSU's as contract jobs that were labeled/represented beyond their capabilities/correct market position by other companies

Sirtech/CWT/Seasonic/HEC

Sometimes it's just not so obvious anymore...

 

[the gamer]

I have had the Thermaltake Toughpower 750watt PSU for a week now and I have had no problems what so EVER!!!.

 

[tcutugno]

Hi,

i have been working with Q-TEC PSU's for the past 2 years....I have never had any problems...& I have never replaced a Q-TEC PSU so I have no idea what possesed you to include Q-TEC in your list

 

[larrymoencurly]

Hi,

i have been working with Q-TEC PSU's for the past 2 years....I have never had any problems...& I have never replaced a Q-TEC PSU so I have no idea what possesed you to include Q-TEC in your list

Maybe because a 550W Q-tec looks like this:

.

But sometimes even junk works well. Here's a picture of me and the Mrs:

Not seen are our nine kids, each who graduated by age 19 from either MIT, Cambridge, or the Sorbonne.

 

[Bbq]

Don't forget the trailer.


What may work for you, might not be of good quality. The L&C 350 that I posted pictures of a while back? Worked fine for 3 years in an overclocked Pentium 4. Just rememeber, you get what you pay for.

 

[larrymoencurly]

Just rememeber, you get what you pay for.

Here's what I've gotten for $15 or less:

300-350W Antecs w/ cases
500W Antec
350W Enermax w/ case
300W Fortron-Source
350W Fortron-Source
300W Delta
350W Ultra/Wintech
300W MaxPower/Key Mouse w/ case

Only one junk PSU in the bunch.

 

[sparks]

as far a companies to avoid that sell power supplies.
ENERMAX SUCKS BIG TIME
my ps went out 2 months of warranty left.
I called to try and get an rma...
they said its out of warranty...I said no I have the receipt.
WELLLLLL its close enough and too old to worry about.
Just buy a new one.
I did...antec

F enermax they suck don't buy anything this pos company sells

sparks

 

[jonnyGURU]

WELLLLLL its close enough and too old to worry about.

Is there more to this story that you're not sharing with us?

 

[sparks]

Nope
that is what they guy told me on the phone.
"WELLLLLL its close enough and too old to worry about."

so it had only 2 months of warranty left and since it was so old that I should
just buy a new one.

so their warranty is when they say its too old I guess.

and like I SAID F enermax

I hope this crap company goes out big time and soon


sparks

 

[[Spectre]]

This thread is not an appropriate place for this discussion.

 

[sparks]

WHAT ?????????


psu's to avoid!!!


I said don't buy any psu with the enermax label on it.
Then I stated why they should avoid them.

sparks

 

[[Spectre]]

PSU's dieing outside of warranty from unsubstantiated reasons and your issues with a company not extending a warranty for you are not appropriate for this thread. Every company has PSU's that die outside of the warranty period.

 

[Farva]

PSU's dieing outside of warranty from unsubstantiated reasons and your issues with a company not extending a warranty for you are not appropriate for this thread. Every company has PSU's that die outside of the warranty period.

and dont forget about psu's that do die during the warranty time so power supplies will either die before...OR...after the warranty is up.

 

[[Spectre]]

and dont forget about psu's that do die during the warranty time so power supplies will either die before...OR...after the warranty is up.

This thread is for PSU's with systemic problems, deficencies not individual issues. End of story.

 

[Tt Tech]

PSU's dieing outside of warranty from unsubstantiated reasons and your issues with a company not extending a warranty for you are not appropriate for this thread. Every company has PSU's that die outside of the warranty period.

His psu died within warranty period, but they just told him to buy a new one.

But yeah, that stuff isn't supposed to be in this thread though....

 

[meinzorn]

How about Logisys power supplies.. are they anything good.. they are really low priced... and it isn't on the list.

the reviews on newegg don't seem to complain about them much. anyone know much about them?

 

[Bbq]

How about Logisys power supplies.. are they anything good.. they are really low priced... and it isn't on the list.

the reviews on newegg don't seem to complain about them much. anyone know much about them?

I'd avoid them. You get what you pay for. Newegg reviews are also bad places to look. You need someone who knows what they're doing. Someone like JonnyGuru.

 

[RogueTrip]

I've owned my Powmax Demon Chrome 480w PSU for about 2 years now, i opened it up a couple months ago and resoldered the PCB, and shortly after had to rebuild the 120mm fan with some air compressor oil, but never gave me problems, just know most electronics start having solder cracks and just as i suspected it did.

I run about 9 fans in my case, 2 hdds, a dvdrw and cdrw drive, a 3GHz @ 3.3GHz, PCI-e 7800GT and never had to worry about power

I've also had to rebuild my KDS 17" CRT monitor that had bad solder connections on the coils on the yoke, but after having it for about 7 years would never say its a bad monitor, it still looks as good as the day i bought it!

 

[jonnyGURU]

I've also had to rebuild my KDS 17" CRT monitor that had bad solder connections on the coils on the yoke, but after having it for about 7 years would never say its a bad monitor, it still looks as good as the day i bought it!

I wouldn't say KDS is a bad monitor either. They're #2 for a reason.

But since this is the power supply forum... How's the power supply in it?

 

[Randolphjo]

Sorry Mod. Since it was said (repeatedly - as a blanket statement) that Thermaltake PSU's were crap, I asked about a specific one that was certified by a well-known graphics card manufacturer. The model I mentioned wasn’t listed in the PSU’s to avoid or recommended lists.

I'll edit my post myself.

 

[[Spectre]]

Ok last time this thread is for PSU's to avoid. Not warranty service or is this PSU good or which PSU should I buy.

I am going to prune the offtopic posts.

 

[Xponential]

Well, I'm glad you took the Ultra X2 off the list. Yes, I was one of the suckers who bought an X-Connect pretty soon after it was introduced and watched it fail miserably (luckily it didn't take any of my hardware with it).

The X2 though is a completely different story from the original X-Connect. I couldn't be happier with this PS.

 

[Makalu]

The "Dangerous! They don't even pretend to meet the ATX/AMD/Intel specs!" warning next to Aspire power supplies caught my eye and I think it warrants some clarification. I'm asuming that the ATX specification in question refers to the ±10% regulation of the +12v rails that the Aspire website lists for some (but not all) of their models. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think it's just some sort of a ploy designed to account for the way they overrate their wattage and not the actual physical line regulation circuitry (and hence no actual out of spec dangers). For what it's worth I compared the specs for one at both Aspires and Youngyears (the manufacturer) websites. The Aspire/Apevia site lists +12v ±10% load regulation here:

http://aspireusa.net/product.php?pid=18&xcSID=70d678f86f4c5e5605d686c5e65f8291

And what I'm pretty sure is the identical unit is actually listed with +12v at a ±4% regulation here:

http://www.youngyear.com/products/data/product/116/psiv-600-2.htm

And ±3% on the 3.3v and 5v rails...all of which are under the ±5% ATX specification. So regardless of which website is the truth, if either,the question is if they will actually operate within ATX specs. Is there any evidence of Aspire psu's supplying voltage 10% off? (that'd be 10.8v or 13.2v) or even consistently over ±5%?

 

[Bbq]

I'm asuming that the ATX specification in question refers to the ±10% regulation of the +12v rails that the Aspire website lists for some (but not all) of their models.

Actua ATX spec is + - 5%. Aspire uses 10%, so they can boost the wattage rating, thus, the ability to sell something more than it really is, and for guillable people to buy it.

 

[Makalu]

Actua ATX spec is + - 5%. Aspire uses 10%, so they can boost the wattage rating, thus, the ability to sell something more than it really is, and for guillable people to buy it.

Well I think the keyword in question is "dangerous" and if boosting wattage ratings is the criteria for the list of psu's to avoid then the list of psu's to not avoid is gonna get pretty damn short...i'll do the honors of submitting antec

 

[Bbq]

Well I think the keyword in question is "dangerous" and if boosting wattage ratings is the criteria for the list of psu's to avoid then the list of psu's to not avoid is gonna get pretty damn short...i'll do the honors of submitting antec

Not quite.. I'm talking in the style of them rate WELL out of spec. Out of 5% can easily damage your parts, and even that is already very high. Since they do 10%, the fluctuations can be much higher still, making for a much higher rating. Not only that, but they just plain lie. Their OEM is ATNG, which isn't known for super high quality power supplies.

Lots of manufacturers don't rate honestly. It's a fact of life. How do they over-rate?

1. Lying. They just say their supply is 600w instead of really it being 500 *ahem coolermaster xtreme 600*

2. ATX Spec. Just like Aspire. They rate using +- 10% instead of the 5%, making it easier to boost ratings.

3. Temperatures: They rate at 25 degrees, or some other low number. It is never 25 degrees in a computer case, so as the heat builds up, the de-rating curve kicks in, and you're losing power.

4. De-rating curve. You'll see a derating curve with the output going lower as the temperature goes up. If your 600w power supply has a de-rating curve of 2w / 1 degree, and they rate at 25 degrees, then at 50 degrees (about normal temperature inside a computer), you're only holding a 550w power supply.

5. Older ATX specs. They have tons and tons of amps on the +3.3 and +5, which helps boost the power rating, but only minimal amps on the +12, where it realy counts. Your computer doesn't really use +3.3 and +5 much, mostly +12. Just look at some power supplies, like the older ones made by thermaltake. 18a on +12, with over 30a on the +3.3 and +5.

6. Rating system. It's easier to build a power supply that's more efficient at 230v than at 120v, so that's what some manufacturers do, they build two versions, use the spec sheet from the 230v version on both, and call it a day.

I hope you learned a thing or two during this overly-long description of how power supply manufactuers lie.

 

[Makalu]

Not quite.. I'm talking in the style of them rate WELL out of spec. Out of 5% can easily damage your parts, and even that is already very high. Since they do 10%, the fluctuations can be much higher still, making for a much higher rating. Not only that, but they just plain lie. Their OEM is ATNG, which isn't known for super high quality power supplies.

Lots of manufacturers don't rate honestly. It's a fact of life. How do they over-rate?

1. Lying. They just say their supply is 600w instead of really it being 500 *ahem coolermaster xtreme 600*

2. ATX Spec. Just like Aspire. They rate using +- 10% instead of the 5%, making it easier to boost ratings.

3. Temperatures: They rate at 25 degrees, or some other low number. It is never 25 degrees in a computer case, so as the heat builds up, the de-rating curve kicks in, and you're losing power.

4. De-rating curve. You'll see a derating curve with the output going lower as the temperature goes up. If your 600w power supply has a de-rating curve of 2w / 1 degree, and they rate at 25 degrees, then at 50 degrees (about normal temperature inside a computer), you're only holding a 550w power supply.

5. Older ATX specs. They have tons and tons of amps on the +3.3 and +5, which helps boost the power rating, but only minimal amps on the +12, where it realy counts. Your computer doesn't really use +3.3 and +5 much, mostly +12. Just look at some power supplies, like the older ones made by thermaltake. 18a on +12, with over 30a on the +3.3 and +5.

6. Rating system. It's easier to build a power supply that's more efficient at 230v than at 120v, so that's what some manufacturers do, they build two versions, use the spec sheet from the 230v version on both, and call it a day.

I hope you learned a thing or two during this overly-long description of how power supply manufactuers lie.

I want evidence that Aspire psu's supply 12 volts outside the 5% specs. I want to see one drop to 10.8v. Just because they use a 10% tolerance to overrate their wattage is meaningless and not any more dangerous than outright lying like Cooler Master, who isn't on the list.

I have to admit that no I didn't learn anything from your list but it's always nice to see pretty much all of it in one place (continous vs. peak wattage comes to mind). The Aspire unit in my example is a Youngyear, not an ATNG.

 

[Bbq]

I want evidence that Aspire psu's supply 12 volts outside the 5% specs. I want to see one drop to 10.8v. Just because they use a 10% tolerance to overrate their wattage is meaningless and not any more dangerous than outright lying like Cooler Master, who isn't on the list.

I have to admit that no I didn't learn anything from your list but it's always nice to see pretty much all of it in one place (continous vs. peak wattage comes to mind). The Aspire unit in my example is a Youngyear, not an ATNG.

Since they use 10%, that means that even if something fails miserably at 10.8, it would still pass in aspire.

As for the 10%,

the voltages were way out of spec (the 12V dropped to 10.65V with only a 192W load on the combined 12V rail, (click)

Of course, even though it's within the ATX spec of a max-low of 11.2, a drop of .42 with a 243w increase, it's still more than i would trust. Again, quoted from JonnyGuru

What I'm trying to say, is that Aspire isn't extremely horrendous to the point of a suicidal triple murder, but for that pricerange, there's plenty of power supplies that are better.

And I messed up on the YoungYear, I keep confusing aspire and Cool-max.

 

[DoomRulz]

I noticed you wrote dangerous next to Aspire in your list...how come?

When you say they don't meet Intel/AMD specs, what does that mean, exactly?

 

[Bbq]

I noticed you wrote dangerous next to Aspire in your list...how come?

When you say they don't meet Intel/AMD specs, what does that mean, exactly?

They over rate horribly, they rate at the regulation of +- 10%, while intel and amd spec is +- 5%, they have a medeocre oem. Scroll up a bit. Aspire breaks pretty much all those rules. Espeically just flat out lying.

 

[Makalu]

Since they use 10%, that means that even if something fails miserably at 10.8, it would still pass in aspire.

I'm not quite sure what you are saying but hmm well I just don't think that Youngyears' quality control there in Outer Mongolia is shipping out units that don't meet the 5% tolerance. I agree that they are over-priced and mediocre quality and the brand name deserves to be on the list of psu's unsuitable for high-end/overclocked systems. I don't think that they deserve a dangerous warning (arguments could be made for Deer or L&C and some others though) and the "They don't even pretend to meet the ATX/AMD/Intel specs!" could mean to some that they don't meet the specs and that's the danger implied.

The Aspire unit that dropped out of specs in your quote there is a Real Power unit I think like all the ones that come in Aspire cases and I don't know what tolerance claims they make about it lol. The two Aspire Youngyear's that Jonnyguru tested (DarkSide 600 and Beast 680) didn't drop out of specs during the normal system tests...they just shutdown when attempting to draw the claimed wattage.

I think the danger and the comment should both be removed unless someone proves that they don't meet Intel specs because marketing departments spend big bucks spreading misinformation about power supplies and ya'll shouldn't be doing it for free

Or at least let people add other trivial bits of info about various brands...

See...even while i was writing this someone reads "They don't even pretend to meet" and reads it as "They don't meet". Big difference.

 

[Bbq]

I'm not quite sure what you are saying but hmm well I just don't think that Youngyears' quality control there in Outer Mongolia is shipping out units that don't meet the 5% tolerance. I agree that they are over-priced and mediocre quality and the brand name deserves to be on the list of psu's unsuitable for high-end/overclocked systems. I don't think that they deserve a dangerous warning (arguments could be made for Deer or L&C and some others though) and the "They don't even pretend to meet the ATX/AMD/Intel specs!" could mean to some that they don't meet the specs and that's the danger implied.The Aspire unit that dropped out of specs in your quote there is a Real Power unit I think like all the ones that come in Aspire cases and I don't know what tolerance claims they make about it lol. The two Aspire Youngyear's that Jonnyguru tested (DarkSide 600 and Beast 680) didn't drop out of specs during the normal system tests...they just shutdown when attempting to draw the claimed wattage.

What I'm trying to say is that Aspire, even if it's below 5%, out of ATX spec, would still be a-ok by aspire, since they rate at 10%. Don't forget the included supply in the X-Qpack. Thats the one that pretty much crapped out at about half of the rated.

 

[454Casull]

I'm not quite sure what you are saying but hmm well I just don't think that Youngyears' quality control there in Outer Mongolia is shipping out units that don't meet the 5% tolerance. I agree that they are over-priced and mediocre quality and the brand name deserves to be on the list of psu's unsuitable for high-end/overclocked systems. I don't think that they deserve a dangerous warning (arguments could be made for Deer or L&C and some others though) and the "They don't even pretend to meet the ATX/AMD/Intel specs!" could mean to some that they don't meet the specs and that's the danger implied.

The Aspire unit that dropped out of specs in your quote there is a Real Power unit I think like all the ones that come in Aspire cases and I don't know what tolerance claims they make about it lol. The two Aspire Youngyear's that Jonnyguru tested (DarkSide 600 and Beast 680) didn't drop out of specs during the normal system tests...they just shutdown when attempting to draw the claimed wattage.

I suppose that's better than going past +/- 5%, eh?

 

[Makalu]

What I'm trying to say is that Aspire, even if it's below 5%, out of ATX spec, would still be a-ok by aspire, since they rate at 10%. Don't forget the included supply in the X-Qpack. Thats the one that pretty much crapped out at about half of the rated.

What I'm trying to say is that the units aren't out of spec and therefore Aspires claims are irrelevant. The Epower that Jonnyguru tested dropped out of specs...why isn't it on the list? The Real Power in the Xqpack is on the list but no danger warning next to it...why is that?

I suppose that's better than going past +/- 5%, eh?

lol well yes no power is better than bad power


Danger! PC Power and Cooling doesn't even pretend to meet the Intel dual 12v rails spec nor the 240VA safety limit!...so what? lol

 

[madmat]

What I'm trying to say is that the units aren't out of spec and therefore Aspires claims are irrelevant. The Epower that Jonnyguru tested dropped out of specs...why isn't it on the list? The Real Power in the Xqpack is on the list but no danger warning next to it...why is that?



lol well yes no power is better than bad power


Danger! PC Power and Cooling doesn't even pretend to meet the Intel dual 12v rails spec nor the 240VA safety limit!...so what? lol

The way you keep protesting the whole Aspire thing makes me wonder if you're on their payroll..."Methinks he doth protest too much"