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Plasma vs. LCD

xxxballa210 said:
I am looking at getting a plasma screen. Is this one a good buy?

http://cgi.ebay.com/Panasonic-TC-P4...ions?hash=item19b60b9f86&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14
Click to expand...

Whether it is a good buy or not is up to you. It's a decent 720p plasma and Panasonic is a good brand. Personnally, I'd be wary buying anything like that on eBay when legitimate websites have similar prices. Check out the cnet page.

http://reviews.cnet.com/flat-panel-...42x1/4507-6482_7-33490639.html?tag=mncol;psum
 
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I havent seen any outfits that are lower than that price, bottom line. Alot of them charge sales tax now...
 
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Honestly the thing that really won me over was the non-glare screen that LCDs have. Whereas the plasmas (When I was looking) all had tremendous glare that really bothered me when viewing them. I know that if I had a Plasma, I'd have to have the room extremely dark just to not get bothered by the glare.

Although newer plasmas are getting better with the anti-glare screens, btu that's something LCDs will continue to dominate in.
 
you can break it down a bit. LCDs produce a much more blown out / overly bright image which makes them look great at best buy or costco etc. Plasma TVs on the other hand produce much richer and darker blacks, which to me are more important then eye-hurting whites. in worst case figures, Plasma TVs use more energy, but average they are about the same. both make heat, so no brainer there.

I was in the same boat as you before, I went to BB picked up a 40" Samsung 550 series LCD, returned it within the week and bought the panasonic, never looked back =) the motion blur and lack of ability to produce "black" really sucks for a TV, as a computer monitor either one works, as something you watch Movies, sports, TV shows, etc, Plasma is a better option IMO. no pixel response time issue(.001ms on a plasma) better blacks and more accurate colours on most new plasmas, full 1080p during fast motion on the new models too, the only LCD that can boast that was the samsung 950 which is a $3500+ unit.

LCD will have more potential later as there is alot of R&D going into it, since it is "cheaper" and it's "new" so people buy it with less hesitation then a plasma. But currently, for under $2000, plasma has the best offerings IMO :)
 
Just a single data point in opposition to plasmas here. When I was shopping every single plasma I saw looked "smeary" (only way I can describe it) to my eyes. Good LCDs looked much better to me, especially in high-motion areas, but even the cheap LCDs didn't have the same smearing problem (they had other problems of course - graininess, poor upscaling, etc).

I recently had the chance to look at one of Samsung's new LED LCDs for a short while - not long enough to notice any flaws, but definitely long enough to see how beautiful the picture was. WOW!
 
magao said:
Just a single data point in opposition to plasmas here. When I was shopping every single plasma I saw looked "smeary" (only way I can describe it) to my eyes. Good LCDs looked much better to me, especially in high-motion areas, but even the cheap LCDs didn't have the same smearing problem (they had other problems of course - graininess, poor upscaling, etc).

I recently had the chance to look at one of Samsung's new LED LCDs for a short while - not long enough to notice any flaws, but definitely long enough to see how beautiful the picture was. WOW!
Click to expand...

The LED LCDs are very nice but pricey. If you can afford it I'd say go for it. I think I may get what you're talking about with the smearing or perhaps granular look. However, bear in mind you're not connected to a dedicated cable or HD connection. The stores are splitting that signal to several TV sets. But, I think I'm on the same page with you on the LED LCDs. Just not sure how the whole Hz thing is going to play out with the LCDs yet. Plus, take some time to watch the LED LCD. I've been reading that the quality is so sharp that you start to notice things you wouldn't have before. Cosmetic blems on news heads and issues on backdrops start to show up that you wouldn't have noticed before.
 
SBMongoos said:
The LED LCDs are very nice but pricey. If you can afford it I'd say go for it. I think I may get what you're talking about with the smearing or perhaps granular look. However, bear in mind you're not connected to a dedicated cable or HD connection. The stores are splitting that signal to several TV sets. But, I think I'm on the same page with you on the LED LCDs. Just not sure how the whole Hz thing is going to play out with the LCDs yet. Plus, take some time to watch the LED LCD. I've been reading that the quality is so sharp that you start to notice things you wouldn't have before. Cosmetic blems on news heads and issues on backdrops start to show up that you wouldn't have noticed before.
Click to expand...

I don't think this has much to do with the LED aspect, rather the fact that they purposely build / design their expensive sets better =)

I've never had a problem with the picture being "smeared" on plasma or LCD(except on movement with LCD)
 
Digital Viper-X- said:
I don't think this has much to do with the LED aspect, rather the fact that they purposely build / design their expensive sets better =)

I've never had a problem with the picture being "smeared" on plasma or LCD(except on movement with LCD)
Click to expand...

1) I agree.
2) Smeared: and I'm not sure I'm 100% clear on what he means. But when looking at Plasmas in the store they don't tend to look as sharp as the LCDs. But I do think this may be due to splitting the signal the store is using to so many TV sets so you get signal degradation.
 
Getting close. Found a great deal at BB on the TC-P42S1. $799 with 36 months no interest. The price and finance plan online but the store will match both. That's $24/month including tax for my location. Can't imagine taking that long to pay it off but hey... Even for those on a really tight budget you can probably eak out the minimum $10 monthly payment in bad months with a BB card (either $10 or 1% of balance).

The TC-P42G10 has me thinking though. I'm not sure if the extra features for watching TV/movies/etc (THX, etc) push me toward the G10 but I like the idea of accessing the internet and Panasonic has already added additional internet content. So, yes there are firmware upgrades. At least on the G10. Plus you can watch videos from the SD cards as well as photos.
 
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Make sure there are no penalties for paying credit off early.
And check to make sure the finance company BB use isnt extorting you in other ways.
I hate credit, wont use it, too many lies that translate to more cost you didnt know about and on occasion being blacklisted without your knowledge too!

ie I bought my first playstation on credit as I was studying, the payments were small and easily managable.
The bank missed a payment with no explanation, I wasnt informed by the bank or the credit company and the credit company blacklisted me over £12 !!!
I was furious but it still cost 'me' time, money and aggravation to get the blacklist removed.
This was bought from Toys R Us.

The student loans company did a similar thing too, man I was livid.
Dont trust the feckers.
 
Nenu said:
Make sure there are no penalties for paying credit off early.
And check to make sure the finance company BB use isnt extorting you in other ways.
I hate credit, wont use it, too many lies that translate to more cost you didnt know about and on occasion being blacklisted without your knowledge too!

ie I bought my first playstation on credit as I was studying, the payments were small and easily managable.
The bank missed a payment with no explanation, I wasnt informed by the bank or the credit company and the credit company blacklisted me over £12 !!!
I was furious but it still cost 'me' time, money and aggravation to get the blacklist removed.
This was bought from Toys R Us.

The student loans company did a similar thing too, man I was livid.
Dont trust the feckers.
Click to expand...

No penalty for early payoff on their BB card. 36mo.s/SAC. They have deals all the time like that. Several years experience with their card (3rd bank however, but their SAC is great...never pay interest. Plus theirs is WAY TOO high).
 
Any opinions on Buydig.com? They have the G10 for $895. No tax (apparently changing after 10/1) and free s/h.
 
quick questions, I know there can be uneven back lighting in LCDs, does the problem exist for plasmas?

Same question for backlight bleeding, is it a problem for plasmas? (maybe it's the same thing?)

Can plasmas have dead pixels too? is it as frequent as LCDs?
 
robman_rob said:
quick questions, I know there can be uneven back lighting in LCDs, does the problem exist for plasmas?

Same question for backlight bleeding, is it a problem for plasmas? (maybe it's the same thing?)

Can plasmas have dead pixels too? is it as frequent as LCDs?
Click to expand...

Plasmas do not have backlighting, so there is no issue with uneven or bleeding. On a plasma, the actual pixels illuminate, similar to a CRT. it is also why plasmas achieve so much deeper blacks than LCD, which always have the backlighting trying to get through the panel. Plasmas just turn the pixel off.
 
Okay, for anybody that is curious I bought the TC-P42S1 at Best Buy. They matched the $799 price they have on their site, plus they matched their sites 36 months SAC. I noticed they had some bundle thing going on so I checked it out. $200 off the TV if I get a Blue Ray. I was able to get a Panansonic Blue Ray player that was selling for $249. It came up on sale for $179. So the TV was $599 ($200 off for bundle) and the Blue Ray came up on sale for $179 (showed $229 on shelf). $845 with tax and 3 years SAC.
 
Nice deal.

Plasma vs LCD is a hot debate, with no real answer.

I had a Vizio 42 1080p LCD and a Sony 52 LCD, both were great, got rid of them, needed a new TV for the living room, bought a Panasonic 700u model.
Will never buy a LCD again.

The panny, though, while great, only lasted a short time. Blacks and colors were awesome, Image Retention and possible burn-in were horrendous. i do a lot of gaming, and for this reason alone I got rid of it and bought another TV.
Another issue with the panny was the built-in upconversion (do display sources at native res) was horrible. PS2 games looked bad. Just, bad. Anything older, unplayable.
Also, the panny was HOT.
Dead in the middle of winter I had to turn my heater off because it was too hot in the living room.

I bought a Hitachi 50 inch p50s602. Blacks still great, colors even better than the panny. (and yes, they were both calibrated, by myself, I am an ISF certified calibrationist).
Absolutely no IR or burn-in issues whatsoever. And I have gamed heavily on it.
The built-in upconversion is fantastic. PS2, and older systems look great.
24p supported, deep color support. PS3 looks phenomenal.
I enjoy gaming much more now. PC works fine via HDMI.

Currently still have the Hitachi. Won't replace the TV until it dies, or i win the Lotto and get something twice the size. Still Plasma.

Let us know how you like the panny.
 
uss enterprise said:
Nice deal.

Plasma vs LCD is a hot debate, with no real answer.

I had a Vizio 42 1080p LCD and a Sony 52 LCD, both were great, got rid of them, needed a new TV for the living room, bought a Panasonic 700u model.
Will never buy a LCD again.

The panny, though, while great, only lasted a short time. Blacks and colors were awesome, Image Retention and possible burn-in were horrendous. i do a lot of gaming, and for this reason alone I got rid of it and bought another TV.
Another issue with the panny was the built-in upconversion (do display sources at native res) was horrible. PS2 games looked bad. Just, bad. Anything older, unplayable.
Also, the panny was HOT.
Dead in the middle of winter I had to turn my heater off because it was too hot in the living room.

I bought a Hitachi 50 inch p50s602. Blacks still great, colors even better than the panny. (and yes, they were both calibrated, by myself, I am an ISF certified calibrationist).
Absolutely no IR or burn-in issues whatsoever. And I have gamed heavily on it.
The built-in upconversion is fantastic. PS2, and older systems look great.
24p supported, deep color support. PS3 looks phenomenal.
I enjoy gaming much more now. PC works fine via HDMI.

Currently still have the Hitachi. Won't replace the TV until it dies, or i win the Lotto and get something twice the size. Still Plasma.

Let us know how you like the panny.
Click to expand...

I liked the LCDs but don't think they're as good as the plasmas yet, IMO. Why? I really like the picture on the LCDs but to me the plasmas picture is very nice and looks more life like where the LCDs look some what artificial. Maybe by tweaking the settings would help. I think the plasmas do a better job with motion as well. The plasma seems to have made some nice improvements as well with power consumption, heat issues of the past, etc. Plus, when finding a mode you like between the two types and compare prices the plasmas seem to come out ahead.

When I ended up with the price I found at BB with the 36 months SAC and was clearly told that I had 30 days to return it with NO restocking fee. I knew this was my deal. It all fell together. I'm currently running basic extended cable through Comcast. Picked up a bunch of HD signals which is nice so I can see how this looks in my home and not in the store with 200 other TVs and bright lights. Very nice. Been tweaking my Harmony remote (will likely add more discrete functions later) and figuring out what new cables I need, etc.

You don't live in Denver do you? LOL. I may consider the calibration after break in. I was told to wait a few months. But $300? Hmm. I've also been hearing that I should use ISF 1.38 cables (I think I got that right). I need some new cables but want to get a great deal right now with the budget I have. Local B&M shops charge a premium and especially for Monster.
 
SBMongoos said:
Any opinions on Buydig.com? They have the G10 for $895. No tax (apparently changing after 10/1) and free s/h.
Click to expand...

Just ordered the 54" G10 from Buydig for a friend. Awesome deal with the $200 rebate plan. Buydig itself was great. That was my first experience and it was very positive. The delivery was free with the guys actually carrying it in from a small truck (that only had TVs on it) and waiting until I turned on the TV to check it. You actually pick when the delivery is specifially and arrange a day and time frame (before noon or after). When it arrived, the box didn't even have as much as a scratch on it. ...supposedly also had a drop sensor somewhere too. Luckily, I didn't have to return anything. ...but, that also means I didn't have to test their customer service. Just looking at their receipt though, they charge a pretty high restock fee and not sure if they'd waive it.

Anways, seen you got the 42" S1. Congrats! The new generation of NeoPDP Panasonic screens are awesome! For the price, it's hard to beat it and hard to justify spending a lot more for the same size in a LCD. By the way, they got a lot of calibration settings on avsforum if you're interested or haven't checked it out yet.
 
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PynkFloydd said:
Just ordered the 54" G10 from Buydig for a friend. Awesome deal with the $200 rebate plan. Buydig itself was great. That was my first experience and it was very positive. The delivery was free with the guys actually carrying it in from a small truck (that only had TVs on it) and waiting until I turned on the TV to check it. You actually pick when the delivery is specifially and arrange a day and time frame (before noon or after). When it arrived, the box didn't even have as much as a scratch on it. ...supposedly also had a drop sensor somewhere too. Luckily, I didn't have to return anything. ...but, that also means I didn't have to test their customer service. Just looking at their receipt though, they charge a pretty high restock fee and not sure if they'd waive it.

Anways, seen you got the 42" S1. Congrats! The new generation of NeoPDP Panasonic screens are awesome! For the price, it's hard to beat it and hard to justify spending a lot more for the same size in a LCD. By the way, they got a lot of calibration settings on avsforum if you're interested or haven't checked it out yet.
Click to expand...

I opted for the S model since I could get the features I wanted to play with (IPTV) through the Blu-ray. When I checked Buydig.com all I could find was that once you open the box it's yours and you cannot return and have to deal with the manufacturer. So I started looking some more. I didn't see any glaring picture difference between the S and the G in a local store. But not sure it was fair as your in a bright store, the TVs are sharing signals and I think the S model had been professionally calibrated. If I remember correctly.

I'm all setup at this end now. Just need a few cables. It looks like if I want the sound from the TV to play through my AV receiver I can only use an optical cable. Am also considering a small stand to put the TV on so I can put my center channel in front of it. Not sure what else to do with it based on my setup.

You have the link for the calibration settings at the AVS Forum?
 
Where's a great place to snag killer prices on cables? My HiFi has component and not HDMI so I have to work around that. Been looking at http://www.accessories4less.com currently. Also, not sure what to think of Monster. Any recommendations? Looks like I need two component cables and apparently one optical (from TV to stereo for audio - you know in case you want the big sound during a football game).
 
SBMongoos said:
You have the link for the calibration settings at the AVS Forum?
Click to expand...
Checkout post # 1534 in the owner's thread, there's a link to a PDF download that'll help you set up your TV.

SBMongoos said:
Where's a great place to snag killer prices on cables? My HiFi has component and not HDMI so I have to work around that. Been looking at http://www.accessories4less.com currently. Also, not sure what to think of Monster. Any recommendations? Looks like I need two component cables and apparently one optical (from TV to stereo for audio - you know in case you want the big sound during a football game).
Click to expand...
Brand new HDTV and you're not going to use hdmi? You can bypass your hifi receiver and plug the hdmi cable directly into your TV, then run an optical audio cable into your receiver. HDMI should be at least a small visual improvement over component. My way isn't necessarily as convenient but i recommend you make a sincere effort to compare both hdmi and component before choosing one over the other.

And as IDversusEgo pointed out, Monoprice is a one-stop shop for dirt cheap high quality cables, heck they even have inexpensive TV wall brackets. Most of the pro's at AVS have been buying their stuff here for years, especially the cables.
 
SJetski71 said:
Checkout post # 1534 in the owner's thread there's a link to a PDF download that'll help you set up your TV.

Brand new HDTV and you're not going to use hdmi? You can bypass your hifi receiver and plug the hdmi cable directly into your TV, then run an optical audio cable into your receiver. HDMI should be at least a small visual improvement over component. My way isn't necessarily as convenient but i recommend you make a sincere effort to compare both hdmi and component before choosing one over the other.

And as IDversusEgo pointed out, Monoprice is a one-stop shop for dirt cheap high quality cables, heck they even have inexpensive TV wall brackets if that's what you need. Most of the pro's at AVS buy their cables here, even the super long 50ft lengths.
Click to expand...

I knew someone was going to get me on this one. I'm migrating over slowly due to budget. Been using Comcast Basic Extended for years. So I'm only SD except for what the plasma picks up as HD, etc., directly through the cable. No box. So, for the very near future I'm not doing HDMI. I have some more research to do as well. I've been doing well with Comcast for years myself. But I need to get clear and understand what they really offer and compare them to Direct TV. I'm doing the Triple Play now with Comcast and they have me, currently, at $65 (temporary competitive offer against Direct TV) for cable, high speed internet and VoIP. I'm pretty happy right now but DO plan to change this soon. Direct TV and Comcast are getting more competitive so I'm seeing more bang for the buck. I'm thinking about sticking with Comcast but need to find out about their boxes. I've heard some are good and some are okay. Have a buddy of mine who claims his signal for HD was better before adding the Comcast box. Not sure what model he is using.

If it's cool I may find some cables and post them here. Unless it simply makes sense to buy them at Monoprice and simply by the length I need for optical, component, etc.
 
SBMongoos said:
If it's cool I may find some cables and post them here. Unless it simply makes sense to buy them at Monoprice and simply by the length I need for optical, component, etc.
Click to expand...
Definitely do, we'll be able to tell if they're decent or not, and if you're getting fleeced.

Or if you want to save time you can straight up buy them from monoprice, unless you're now starved for cash you should checkout their "premium" RG6 component cables first.
 
SJetski71 said:
Definitely do, we'll be able to tell if they're decent or not, and if you're getting fleeced.

Or if you want to save time you can straight up buy them from monoprice, unless you're now starved for cash you should checkout their "premium" RG6 component cables first.
Click to expand...

The prices I've seen so far seem VERY good. Almost makes me think something is wrong but I know we get conditioned to buy "brands" and often pay just for that.

I'm attaching a PDF file that is a scan of the cart at Accessories4less.com. This will show the cables and prices. I don't need all of these cable but threw them in the cart for convenience to review.

PDF here: http://www.yourwns.com/files/cables.pdf

Would you recommend using audio optical over RCA for the Blu-ray (to the AV Recv'r)?
 
All of those cables in that PDF that are under $10 are perfectly fine. The slightly higher priced ones are probably overkill, especially that $30 spdif cable (the $3 ones work fine ;))

As for which digital cable to use, RCA spdif or optical spdif, it really doesn't matter as long as you have either port on the back of your cable box and the back of your receiver. Receiver's tend to have more optical spdif inputs, and some cable boxes may not have RCA spdif inputs. So maybe visually doublecheck your equipment before buying. The more common one to use is optical spdif.
 
SJetski71 said:
All of those cables in that PDF that are under $10 are perfectly fine. The slightly higher priced ones are probably overkill, especially that $30 spdif cable (the $3 ones work fine ;))

As for which digital cable to use, RCA spdif or optical spdif, it really doesn't matter as long as you have either port on the back of your cable box and the back of your receiver. Receiver's tend to have more optical spdif inputs, and some cable boxes may not have RCA spdif inputs. So maybe visually doublecheck your equipment before buying. The more common one to use is optical spdif.
Click to expand...

So far these cables are only between my HiFi equipment and TV. I don't even have a cable box. When the time comes to get a box then I'll use the HDMI between the cable box and the TV and then run an optical out from the TV to the receiver for audio. Maybe it would be good to know what cable box options I have from Comcast so I can try to get a good one and then get the appropriate cables. I see your point in that I'll need to run other cables from the cable box to the recv'r.
 
SBMongoos said:
So far these cables are only between my HiFi equipment and TV. I don't even have a cable box. When the time comes to get a box then I'll use the HDMI between the cable box and the TV and then run an optical out from the TV to the receiver for audio.
Click to expand...
Or you can bypass the TV's audio and directly plug the optical from the cablebox to the receiver. Use whatever method is most convenient, especially if it means using less remote controls (or less cables).
 
SJetski71 said:
Or you can bypass the TV's audio and directly plug the optical from the cablebox to the receiver. Use whatever method is most convenient, especially if it means using less remote controls (or less cables).
Click to expand...

Exactly. I think for now I'll go between the TV and the recv'r and worry about the cable box later as I'm not sure when I'm going to upgrade my service. The prices seem so reasonable on the cables I think I'm fine with that.

I have a Harmony 880 remote which I'm happy tweaking and will do the job. May grab the Harmony One down the road.
 
I just tested out my G15 yesterday(thinner G10), the vieracast thing is usefull if you don't have any other access to the internet(I do have an HTPC) the quality was actually great on the youtube stream.

I've never had a problem with panasonic upscaling, infact I found it to be on the better side of the selection, I watch SD Stargate Atlantis on it and it looks better then any LCD i've ever used to watch SD content.
 
I got to see the 50" G15 in action. Nice! I like the slimmer panel.

Not sure I get your comment on the internet and having HTPC. Or are you just saying you'd rather do this on your PC with HD than Vieracast?
 
SBMongoos said:
I got to see the 50" G15 in action. Nice! I like the slimmer panel.

Not sure I get your comment on the internet and having HTPC. Or are you just saying you'd rather do this on your PC with HD than Vieracast?
Click to expand...

I'm saying it's easier to do it with my pc which has a keyboard =) I mean viera cast is useful for the average user which probably won't setup an HTPC. For me it's not really a big deal, I was more drawn to the $1279 pricetag then the vieracast :D
 
Digital Viper-X- said:
I'm saying it's easier to do it with my pc which has a keyboard =) I mean viera cast is useful for the average user which probably won't setup an HTPC. For me it's not really a big deal, I was more drawn to the $1279 pricetag then the vieracast :D
Click to expand...

Gotcha. I'm extremely pleased with the picture on these sets.

I didn't want to spring for the extra $ for the G. I was intersted in the VieraCast however but with how the deal worked out at BB and that the VieraCast in on the Blu-ray with the USB capability and SD (also play movies off of SD via Blu-ray) I was very happy.

The only possible downside now is wanting to play with this thing and tweak it.
 
Quick question about cables:

I spoke with someone over the weekend who has several years (20-30) in audio/video and has his degree in such as well. He tells me it's worth using ISF 1.38 certified cables. Says Monster has them and it's worth the money and difference you will see/hear.

Are these other cables at Monoprice comparable or is the thought that it doesn't matter that much. This fellas argument was you knew what you were getting. That the certification made it clear as it was a standard. That you're cables wouldn't crap out on you and that they were sure to handle all the signals and speed required.
 
SBMongoos said:
Quick question about cables:

I spoke with someone over the weekend who has several years (20-30) in audio/video and has his degree in such as well. He tells me it's worth using ISF 1.38 certified cables. Says Monster has them and it's worth the money and difference you will see/hear.

Are these other cables at Monoprice comparable or is the thought that it doesn't matter that much. This fellas argument was you knew what you were getting. That the certification made it clear as it was a standard. That you're cables wouldn't crap out on you and that they were sure to handle all the signals and speed required.
Click to expand...

0.o Monster is the biggest rip off next to buying volcano insurance

anyway, you might want to look into a breaking in your tv set =) there is a thread on AVS forums about it
 
Digital Viper-X- said:
0.o Monster is the biggest rip off next to buying volcano insurance

anyway, you might want to look into a breaking in your tv set =) there is a thread on AVS forums about it
Click to expand...

I understand what you mean by breaking it in. I also understand it makes since to break it in for about three months before having it calibrated. But I'm not sure what breaking it in has to do with buying cables?
 
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