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Phenom updates

Darakian said:
As a consumer the yields shouldn't really matter. Just price and performance.
Click to expand...

I think there's definitely more than an indirect casual relationship there though. Better yields allow the potential for AMD to increase profit. Greater profit margins for AMD means they stay out of bankruptcy. Staying out of bankruptcy means competition between them and Intel continues. More competition means lower pricing schemes getting passed onto the consumer. With a native core design the consumer also gets the potential for faster performance as architecture grows beyond four cores.
 
pxc said:
That is incredibly dumb if true.
Click to expand...

No just incredibly impreceptive of you. Native production design inherently increases the margins of error. As AMD perfects the process, I'm sure they'll have less of these abberations to criticize. In fact, I'll bet anyone a single Phenom processor that Intel will have to deal with these identical problems in a year. Unless you believe a) AMD will benevolently share their experiences and knowledge/secrets with the competition b) Intel is a perfect company who can do no wrong. We already know a lot of people around here believe b) so.....
 
vista_blista said:
I think there's definitely more than an indirect casual relationship there though. Better yields allow the potential for AMD to increase profit. Greater profit margins for AMD means they stay out of bankruptcy. Staying out of bankruptcy means competition between them and Intel continues. More competition means lower pricing schemes getting passed onto the consumer. With a native core design the consumer also gets the potential for faster performance as architecture grows beyond four cores.
Click to expand...

Sure, but, if I can buy a native dual core or a quad with two dead cores at the same price, so long as they have the same performance, I don't truly care which is which.
 
I'd guess the castrated quad would still perform better than the native dual, unless they neutered the cache as well.
 
Darakian said:
More phenom
http://www.dailytech.com/AMD+Sheds+Additional+Phenom+Details/article9237.htm
Click to expand...

AMD might do ok with 65nm quad core phenom competiting with the current Intel Q6600 and Q6700, but how is it going to compete with the new Intel 45nm quad cores? Can the 2.4Ghz L2 512KBx4 + L3 2MB quad core phenom beat a 2.4Ghz 8MB cache Q6600 at stock speed?

I don't have a Q6600, but I am really impressive with OC ability of an average price Q6600, which can OC 50% from 2.4Ghz to 3.6Ghz. Both of my S939 X2 3800+ and Opty 185 can only OC less than 10%. Really disappointed with AMD.
 
RB30 said:
AMD might do ok with 65nm quad core phenom competiting with the current Intel Q6600 and Q6700, but how is it going to compete with the new Intel 45nm quad cores? Can the 2.4Ghz L2 512KBx4 + L3 2MB quad core phenom beat a 2.4Ghz 8MB cache Q6600 at stock speed?

I don't have a Q6600, but I am really impressive with OC ability of an average price Q6600, which can OC 50% from 2.4Ghz to 3.6Ghz. Both of my S939 X2 3800+ and Opty 185 can only OC less than 10%. Really disappointed with AMD.
Click to expand...
'

my 165 ran at 2.6 stock V and 2.89 with more v, and my x2 3800 ran at 2.6 also, I think it could be ur mobo? not sure, almost every x2 cpu I had my hands on OC'd well(was before core 2s came out though)


the FX series comes with an unlocked multiplier and I believe its socket F and probably can or will come in dual socket version like the Quad FX before it ( 2 dual cores)
 
i still dont get it. why why why would people need 8 cores today? i bet dual socket sales would be minimal

i really do hope the phenoms oc phenominally. early batches may not be that good, but i really hope by january they get the work done perfectly

for some reason i really want samsung/some other rich ass idiot to buy amd and pwn intel if they fail this round. i hate to see the little company fighting and fighting, being a year behind in the manufacturing process, and still fighting. i know they have done it time and time again, and caught intel napping so many times, but recently they just arent being able to do it.

i do hope for the best tho.
 
Digital Viper-X- said:
the FX series comes with an unlocked multiplier and I believe its socket F and probably can or will come in dual socket version like the Quad FX before it ( 2 dual cores)
Click to expand...
The FX is also supposed to work with the 4x4 platform, but there are some initial indications that the Barcelona FX series may not be completely compatible with the current motherboards. I'm not sure how many 4x4 motherboards were actually released, but I read on another forum that the Asus L1N64 may have issues with Barcelona. The rumor had rightfully upset a few owners, and I honestly hope it was just a rumor or something that will eventually be resolved. Those boards aren't cheap by any measure.
 
64bit_is_here said:
i still dont get it. why why why would people need 8 cores today? i bet dual socket sales would be minimal
Click to expand...
I can give you 2-3 applications right away. Virtualization, F@H and possibly raytracing. I'm sure there are several others. I could easily utilize a 32-core machine (quad-octal) if there was such a beast, and if I was able to afford one, because I am a folder who is currently exploring the possible benefits of virtualization. You'd be surprised how many people/companies would benefit from octal core processors even with their present-day applications (not referring to programs).

i really do hope the phenoms oc phenominally. early batches may not be that good, but i really hope by january they get the work done perfectly
Click to expand...
We'll probably have to wait until sometime in Q1 for good OC chips. Possibly earlier, but until someone gets their hands on a B2 revision core and attempts it, we won't know for sure.

for some reason i really want samsung/some other rich ass idiot to buy amd and pwn intel if they fail this round. i hate to see the little company fighting and fighting, being a year behind in the manufacturing process, and still fighting. i know they have done it time and time again, and caught intel napping so many times, but recently they just arent being able to do it.
Click to expand...
Well, things are turning around slowly but surely with their graphics division (ati). It might take some time but things should eventually improve with their processors once they get the 65nm process ramping. Rumor has it this is already underway, so it boils down to the 45nm part competition in a year's time. This time next year will probably be the make or break for AMD.

The possibility of a corporation like Samsung acquiring AMD presents a few problems, not the least of which are political. I harbor some doubt the US government would permit such an acquisition, simply for the fact that it might pose a strategic compromise in the long run. An AMD acquisition would not be as bad as say, a hypothetical buy-out of Intel or IBM, but AMD likely possesses sufficient key technologies that would raise some concern in Washington, and understandably so.

Then there's the more mundane question of whether or not Samsung or anyone else FTM would maintain AMD's current stratified roadmap combination of high-end, mid-range and value products. We simply don't know. What if Samsung purchased AMD and the executives decided the high performance parts were too inefficient from a design to final production perspective, and they opted instead for a 'value only' approach for their new processor division to stay financially competitive? What then??
 
I hate to say it,but a part of me feels as though I am watching a train wreck,every time I come through here.
 
64bit_is_here said:
for some reason i really want samsung/some other rich ass idiot to buy amd and pwn intel if they fail this round. i hate to see the little company fighting and fighting, being a year behind in the manufacturing process, and still fighting. i know they have done it time and time again, and caught intel napping so many times, but recently they just arent being able to do it.

i do hope for the best tho.
Click to expand...

Samsung is a DRAM chip maker primarily and not in the business of making CPU. One foreign company remotely close of going after Intel or AMD few years ago is the Taiwanese VIA. At that time, it has a large market share in the chipset business and was buying up companies to poise itself for developing CPUs. Unfortunately, nVidia came up with its own graphic chipsets and took away VIA's market share. VIA's stock fell from the height of over TWN$600 to the current low TWN$20. VIA has never recovered since. Nowadays, it can only go after the low energy low speed appliance CPU market.
 
APOLLO said:
There were rumors of Samsung possibly interested in AMD not too long ago.

http://www.tmcnet.com/usubmit/2007/07/23/2805900.htm
Click to expand...

Yeah, it will be a big leap for Samsung to go into CPU business. If Samsung doesn't have any new expertise to infuse AMD, then buying out AMD will be worse for both of them. More AMD people will leave the company, and it will be less productive. Remember what happened to BenQ buying out Siemen's cell phone division? A profitable BenQ bought Siemen's cell phone division for name sake and some half baked cell phone technology that resulted in BenQ nearly went bankrupt and had to cut the string on the endless money loosing pit hole.
 
Manny Calavera said:
I hate to say it,but a part of me feels as though I am watching a train wreck,every time I come through here.
Click to expand...

Exactly. This is going to be AMD not meeting demand thru christmas, and a lot of people buying Intel instead. Quite honestly I feel the pool of people who really need quad parts is very, very small, and Intel already has that segment covered. AMD offering what amounts to a speed bump but at the cost of having hard to find processors is just not incentive enough. Everyone knows whats going to happen in the retail space. These things will be hard to get and will therefore carry a price premium that kills any real value. :(
 
Unless performance is spectacular,they will carry no price premium.They will be priced
low,and availability will also be low initally

I still plan on building a new gaming system,based around the Phenom X4 (9600 or a 9500)

Hopefully,I will be able to oc the damn thing past 3Ghz... :eek:
 
Manny Calavera said:
Unless performance is spectacular,they will carry no price premium.They will be priced
low,and availability will also be low initally

I still plan on building a new gaming system,based around the Phenom X4 (9600 or a 9500)

Hopefully,I will be able to oc the damn thing past 3Ghz... :eek:
Click to expand...

They will carry a price premium because they will have low availability.
 
Ethug said:
They will carry a price premium because they will have low availability.
Click to expand...



LOL,maybe at Newegg,but not everywhere... :D AMD needs to sell these things,they must be priced to move,and move fast !! They desperately need to recoup R & D costs,
and quickly pay down the back breaking debts they carry.
 
Manny Calavera said:
LOL,maybe at Newegg,but not everywhere... :D AMD needs to sell these things,they must be priced to move,and move fast !! They desperately need to recoup R & D costs,
and quickly pay down the back breaking debts they carry.
Click to expand...

Have you ever worked retail, anywhere?
 
APOLLO said:
I can give you 2-3 applications right away. Virtualization, F@H and possibly raytracing. I'm sure there are several others. I could easily utilize a 32-core machine (quad-octal) if there was such a beast, and if I was able to afford one, because I am a folder who is currently exploring the possible benefits of virtualization. You'd be surprised how many people/companies would benefit from octal core processors even with their present-day applications (not referring to programs).

We'll probably have to wait until sometime in Q1 for good OC chips. Possibly earlier, but until someone gets their hands on a B2 revision core and attempts it, we won't know for sure.

Well, things are turning around slowly but surely with their graphics division (ati). It might take some time but things should eventually improve with their processors once they get the 65nm process ramping. Rumor has it this is already underway, so it boils down to the 45nm part competition in a year's time. This time next year will probably be the make or break for AMD.

The possibility of a corporation like Samsung acquiring AMD presents a few problems, not the least of which are political. I harbor some doubt the US government would permit such an acquisition, simply for the fact that it might pose a strategic compromise in the long run. An AMD acquisition would not be as bad as say, a hypothetical buy-out of Intel or IBM, but AMD likely possesses sufficient key technologies that would raise some concern in Washington, and understandably so.

Then there's the more mundane question of whether or not Samsung or anyone else FTM would maintain AMD's current stratified roadmap combination of high-end, mid-range and value products. We simply don't know. What if Samsung purchased AMD and the executives decided the high performance parts were too inefficient from a design to final production perspective, and they opted instead for a 'value only' approach for their new processor division to stay financially competitive? What then??
Click to expand...

good points indeed:). i do know that there will be political implications, but honestly i think amd would do really well if injected with a load of cash, but yeah, we dont know for sure. samsung, however, are very eager to get into the microprocessor business:p

good to hear the phenoms launching at 2.6. i still think releasing their value products in the beginning is not the ideal strategy, i guess its because of their inability to produce 3g phenoms in decent quantities, not because of a strategy to release low end chips first.

the motherboards do look sexy tho:D
 
fud said AMD will launch 2.2 to 2,8 ghz chips, Phenom FX will be 2.8ghz this november :O

lets hope hes right for once :p
 
Ethug said:
Have you ever worked retail, anywhere?
Click to expand...



Extensively from 1987 to 1991 in a Mom and Pop computer store.Then again from 2003 to present day as a part time tech for a chain here in town called PcCyber.As well two short stints at BB over the last 6 years.
 
Manny Calavera said:
Extensively from 1987 to 1991 in a Mom and Pop computer store.Then again from 2003 to present day as a part time tech for a chain here in town called PcCyber.As well two short stints at BB over the last 6 years.
Click to expand...

well then, you should understand that AMD won't be able to stop newegg and everyone else from price gouging like mad if supply is limited :p
 
now Fud reports that Phenom AM2+ chips will be the main focus @ 2.2-2.6 Ghz with the FX chips @ 2.8, =p common november!!!
 
Ethug said:
well then, you should understand that AMD won't be able to stop newegg and everyone else from price gouging like mad if supply is limited :p
Click to expand...

True but the bulk is going to go in pre-built systems and they won't be price fixing. Hp, Dell, ect. need to move units not make every last dollar.
 
^^^
:confused:
What? These quads are not going into budget systems.... they are going into extreme gaming or workstation machines. you will be paying top dollar for such machines
 
ok from what ive read this is the line up confirmed so far:

Phenom FX

FX-91.... Core: Agenda FX (4 core) 2.4-2.6 1800mhz ht. socket F from Q1 2008

FX-90.... Core: Agenda FX (4 core) 2.2-2.4 1600mhz ht. socket F from Q1 2008

FX-80.... Core: Agenda FX (4 core) 2.2-2.4 1600mhz ht. socket AM2+ from Q1 2008

FX ??.... Core: Deneb FX (4 core) ??? ???mhz ht. socket AM2+/AM3 from H2 2008

Phenom X4
GP-7100.... Core: Agenda (4 core) 2.2-2.4 1800mhz ht. AM2+ from Q4 2007 89w

GP-7000.... Core: Agenda (4 core) 2.0-2.2 1600mhz ht. AM2+ from Q4 2007 89w

45nm:

???????.....Core: Deneb (4 core) ???? ????mhz ht. AM2+/AM3 from H2 2008

???????.....Core: Propus (4 core) ???? ????mhz ht. AM2+/AM3 from H2 2008

the difference between propus and deneb is the cache


Phenom X3

??????.....Core: Toliman (3 core) ???? ????mhz ht. AM2+ from Q1 2008

???????.....Core: ???? (3 core) ???? ????mhz ht. AM2+/AM3 from H1 2009

Phenom x2
GP-6800.... Core: Kuma (2 core) 2.4-2.8 2100mhz ht. AM2+ from Q1 2008 89w

GS-6650.... Core: Kuma (2 core) 2.2-2.6 1900mhz ht. AM2+ from Q1 2008 65w

GS-6550.... Core: Kuma (2 core) 2.0-2.4 1800mhz ht. AM2+ from Q4 2007 65w

GE-6600.... Core: Kuma (2 core) 2.3 1600mhz ht. AM2+ from Q1 2008 45w

GE-6500.... Core: Kuma (2 core) 2.1 1500mhz ht. AM2+ from Q1 2008 45w

GE-6400.... Core: Kuma (2 core) 1.9 1400mhz ht. AM2+ from Q1 2008 45w

???????.... Core: Regor (2 core) ??? ?????mhz ht. AM2+/AM3 from H1 2009

All the cores are named after Stars this time and not cities (A64) or horses (AXP)
 
shadow_419 said:
True but the bulk is going to go in pre-built systems and they won't be price fixing. Hp, Dell, ect. need to move units not make every last dollar.
Click to expand...

...Thats not the point. What good does that do the self assemblers on this forum?
 
why does the top end have to go to socket F? whats different about it? im pretty sure no one will buy it if they have to get a diff board for it. kinda makes me mad.
 
tvdang7 said:
why does the top end have to go to socket F? whats different about it? im pretty sure no one will buy it if they have to get a diff board for it. kinda makes me mad.
Click to expand...

there will be am2+ that run faster, its just that they have not been officialy confirmed yet
 
Not only have true AM2+ boards been officially confirmed, but demonstrated. And from what I understand are now selling in parts of Europe.
 
j1979 said:
ok from what ive read this is the line up confirmed so far:

Phenom FX

FX-91.... Core: Agenda FX (4 core) 2.4-2.6 1800mhz ht. socket F from Q1 2008

FX-90.... Core: Agenda FX (4 core) 2.2-2.4 1600mhz ht. socket F from Q1 2008

FX-80.... Core: Agenda FX (4 core) 2.2-2.4 1600mhz ht. socket AM2+ from Q1 2008

FX ??.... Core: Deneb FX (4 core) ??? ???mhz ht. socket AM2+/AM3 from H2 2008

Phenom X4
GP-7100.... Core: Agenda (4 core) 2.2-2.4 1800mhz ht. AM2+ from Q4 2007 89w

GP-7000.... Core: Agenda (4 core) 2.0-2.2 1600mhz ht. AM2+ from Q4 2007 89w

45nm:

???????.....Core: Deneb (4 core) ???? ????mhz ht. AM2+/AM3 from H2 2008

???????.....Core: Propus (4 core) ???? ????mhz ht. AM2+/AM3 from H2 2008

the difference between propus and deneb is the cache


Phenom X3

??????.....Core: Toliman (3 core) ???? ????mhz ht. AM2+ from Q1 2008

???????.....Core: ???? (3 core) ???? ????mhz ht. AM2+/AM3 from H1 2009

Phenom x2
GP-6800.... Core: Kuma (2 core) 2.4-2.8 2100mhz ht. AM2+ from Q1 2008 89w

GS-6650.... Core: Kuma (2 core) 2.2-2.6 1900mhz ht. AM2+ from Q1 2008 65w

GS-6550.... Core: Kuma (2 core) 2.0-2.4 1800mhz ht. AM2+ from Q4 2007 65w

GE-6600.... Core: Kuma (2 core) 2.3 1600mhz ht. AM2+ from Q1 2008 45w

GE-6500.... Core: Kuma (2 core) 2.1 1500mhz ht. AM2+ from Q1 2008 45w

GE-6400.... Core: Kuma (2 core) 1.9 1400mhz ht. AM2+ from Q1 2008 45w

???????.... Core: Regor (2 core) ??? ?????mhz ht. AM2+/AM3 from H1 2009

All the cores are named after Stars this time and not cities (A64) or horses (AXP)
Click to expand...

http://www.vr-zone.com/articles/AMD_Revised_Desktop_Model_Number_Structure/5330.html

Some of the information on there is old, the Phenom Series has been split down into 2 Series, the 9 Series for Quad Core and 7 Series for Dual Core with Athlon 6 Series for the Dual Core's based on K10/Bareclona technology.

http://www.vr-zone.com/articles/Quad-Core_Phenom_Models_&_Clocks_Revealed/5331.html#Scene_1

That's for the Phenom 9 Series. Quad Core

http://www.vr-zone.com/articles/AMD_Triple-Core_Is_Phenom_7-Series/5327.html

That's for the Phenom 7 Series, Tri Core

http://www.vr-zone.com/articles/AMD_Adds_Kuma_&_Lima_To_Athlon_Brand/5336.html

That's for the Athlon 6 Series, Dual Core

That's the most recent roadmaps I have seen on AMD's desktop Quad Core, Tri Core and Dual Core's based on K10/Bareclona technology.
 
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