Phenom II 940 - 96C Under Load??

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Flapjack

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So I'm having a little temp issue, but I'm not 100% sure it's really this hot (I certainly hope it's not).

Basically, I have a new Phenom II 940, stock voltage, stock frequency, running hotter than a whore on dollar night under load (snapshop below).

Here's the specifics on the PC:

- Antec Nine Hundred Two (all fans going, set to medium speed)
- ECS Black Series A790GXM-A motherboard
- Phenom II 940 at stock speed/voltage
- ARCTIC COOLING Freezer 7 Pro Rev.2 cooler

The temp during load is around 96C to 98C. Temp during idle is around 40C to 45C (all four cores running in 800mhz mode).

I checked the seating/contact on the CPU and it seems fine. Fan speed control is also working... when load goes up, CPU fan cranks up.

I also am not getting any crashes or Prime95 errors, however, I certainly am not able to overclock. I've seen these chips do anywhere from 3.4 to 3.8 ghz without issue.

Could this be a motherboard reading issue??

Core Temp

phenom.jpg
 
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Since the CPU doesn't seem to be throttling, and the system is shutting itself down, I'm leaning to a bad/misreading thermal sensor. From the multitude of post I've read about Phenom II cooling, the thermal protection seems to kick in around 65-75C. Have you tried another program to monitor temps? It could be some sort of software incompatibility. I use HWmonitor, but AMD Overdrive should work also.
 
core temp reads directly from the cpu so the motherboard couldnt be effecting it.. could be a bad sensor but i have a feeling its the heatsink not being seated correctly.. or its the heatsink its self thats not able to cool it.. make sure that the voltage is infact set at 1.32v which is what its suppose to be on.. my honest opinion is if you just got this processor and you are know for sure the heatsink is on right then id return it for a new one..
 
I'm guessing that there's something wrong with that thermal sensor. There's no way you'd be getting consistently stable behavior at 96C... as for not being able to overclock, your motherboard might actually be the weak link. But who knows, I've had a hell of the time trying to OC my X3 720. It just doesn't want to budge no matter what I do. Maybe some of the Phenom II chips are just kinda bad. Can you get a replacement for it? (I mean even if just the sensor is bad, that's still a problem worthy of RMA)
 
SicKlown42012 said:
Since the CPU doesn't seem to be throttling, and the system is shutting itself down, I'm leaning to a bad/misreading thermal sensor. From the multitude of post I've read about Phenom II cooling, the thermal protection seems to kick in around 65-75C. Have you tried another program to monitor temps? It could be some sort of software incompatibility. I use HWmonitor, but AMD Overdrive should work also.
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Ok, I'm posting as I'm testing. All three programs (Core Temp, HWMonitor, and AMD Overdrive) all all reporting the same. Started in the mid-40s, now around 96C on all cores.

sirmonkey1985 said:
core temp reads directly from the cpu so the motherboard couldnt be effecting it.. could be a bad sensor but i have a feeling its the heatsink not being seated correctly.. or its the heatsink its self thats not able to cool it.. make sure that the voltage is infact set at 1.32v which is what its suppose to be on.. my honest opinion is if you just got this processor and you are know for sure the heatsink is on right then id return it for a new one..
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CPU core voltage is set to auto, reporting 1.35V. I'll doublecheck the heatsink again. I have another one I can use, too.

RubbingAlcoholic said:
I'm guessing that there's something wrong with that thermal sensor. There's no way you'd be getting consistently stable behavior at 96C... as for not being able to overclock, your motherboard might actually be the weak link. But who knows, I've had a hell of the time trying to OC my X3 720. It just doesn't want to budge no matter what I do. Maybe some of the Phenom II chips are just kinda bad. Can you get a replacement for it? (I mean even if just the sensor is bad, that's still a problem worthy of RMA)
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It's very stable. I mean, I can still type this while Prime95 is cooking all 4 cores. Yeah, the temps are scary... but shouldn't the PC not even be able to boot at these temps?

I doubt it's the CPU. Benchmarks are right at (if not higher) than what the reviews report. The CPU seems to be working just fine. Now if it's reporting an incorrect temp, that's a different story. I guess I'll see when I switch HSFs.
 
Flapjack said:
Ok, I'm posting as I'm testing. All three programs (Core Temp, HWMonitor, and AMD Overdrive) all all reporting the same. Started in the mid-40s, now around 96C on all cores.


CPU core voltage is set to auto, reporting 1.35V. I'll doublecheck the heatsink again. I have another one I can use, too.


It's very stable. I mean, I can still type this while Prime95 is cooking all 4 cores. Yeah, the temps are scary... but shouldn't the PC not even be able to boot at these temps?

I doubt it's the CPU. Benchmarks are right at (if not higher) than what the reviews report. The CPU seems to be working just fine. Now if it's reporting an incorrect temp, that's a different story. I guess I'll see when I switch HSFs.
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yeah the system should be completely unusable and shouldnt even be able to boot.. 69C is the absolute maximum the cpu should run at and shouldnt even start up above that.. so that would mean the sensor is either 1. configured wrong.. 2. bad.. 3. stuck.. id still try to see if you could rma it.. either with who ever you bought it from or contact AMD directly..


just out of curiousity.. what is your motherboard cpu sensor showing? should be able to see it in the bios or using speedfan..
 
I'm pretty sure the BIOS says the same. I'll check tomorrow, though. I'll try SpeedFan as well.

All I know that the temp rise seems to be working. It'll start in the 40s then start climbing as soon as I put a load on the CPU.
 
Ok guys, I figured something was wrong. The fact that I couldn't even get the slightest OC out of this pretty much cinched it.

I took the Arctic Cooler Freezer Pro 7 Rev 2 off and put the stock AMD cooler on. Here's the result after 30 minutes of Prime95 on all four cores:

phenom2.jpg


It made a quick blip up to 79C then settled down to 75-75C.

I guess I need a new cooler. I wonder why it wasn't making good contact... I could tell by the thermal paste that it wasn't.
 
those temps still arent right at all.. your low temp should be the absolute maximum that processor runs at.. i still have a feeling there is something wrong with the die sensor..
 
sirmonkey1985 said:
those temps still arent right at all.. your low temp should be the absolute maximum that processor runs at.. i still have a feeling there is something wrong with the die sensor..
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So should I contact AMD, or NewEgg? It's been more than 30 days...

I need this computer to be running. I'm worried about how long the RMA process will take.

I do have a Athlon 64 X2 4400+ in my old PC. Will that work with my ECS A790GXM-A until I get my RMA'd 940 back?
 
i would contact AMD if your passed the 30 days.. their RMA is pretty quick.. 2 weeks tops usually.. the 4400+ as long as its am2 will work on that board with no issues.. its also possible AMD may know whats wrong and be able to recommend a way to fix it or just to rma it..
 
DAMN!

AMD's site SUCKS!!! I can't believe the hassle I'm having. I could not register a new account in Firefox. No error message or anything. I just wouldn't take any username/password I entered in the registration page.

So I opened IE8 and could at least register. I log in and go to register my product. It asks for the OPN number of the CPU, which of course, is not listed in the pull-down menu. I pick the closest one and hit "continue". I am able to change the OPN code to match my CPU and register it.

Next, I click on "continue warranty request" and click the button to enter my problem description. No matter how long or short I make it, after clicking "save", I cannot continue because the "I agree" check boxes are grayed out.

WTF!?!
 
It's been a while since I updated this thread. I never did get AMD's site to work, nor was able to get a reply to the issues I was having trying to register. Very odd...

At any rate, the stock CPU cooler fell off today. The tab on the plastic yellow bracket for my ECS motherboard just snapped off (pic below) and the PC nearly instantly shut down due to overtemp protection (good job, ECS).

Now the hottest the PC gets is 69 on each core at full load with Prime95. Occasionally it'll bump up to 96.5, but temps are pretty steady there. Much better than before. I think I'm going to consider this resolved. Maybe I'll even try to overclock it now. I've heard the 940s can go up to 3000 if you're lucky. :cool:

(pics are clickable)



 
yeah those temps are so screwed up its not even funny.. but yeah i guess you might as well try.. the 940 tops out at 3.8ghz.. it wont go any higher unless under extreme cooling.. it will do about 3.4ghz on the stock cooler.. anything higher and you need aftermarket cooling..
 
That's good to know. I'll have to experiment with it. Now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure I saw the 3.0ghz speeds with watercooling. I'm pretty sure I saw a few 3.0s on the NewEgg reviews, but who knows how stable they were.

If I shoot for 3.4 to 3.6, what voltage do you recommend? Right now, I'm at stock voltage.

Oh, and the cooler is a Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus. I'm pretty impressed with the mounting system. Much more confidence inspiring that the POS plastic clip that just broke on me...
 
Flapjack said:
That's good to know. I'll have to experiment with it. Now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure I saw the 3.0ghz speeds with watercooling. I'm pretty sure I saw a few 3.0s on the NewEgg reviews, but who knows how stable they were.

If I shoot for 3.4 to 3.6, what voltage do you recommend? Right now, I'm at stock voltage.

Oh, and the cooler is a Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus. I'm pretty impressed with the mounting system. Much more confidence inspiring that the POS plastic clip that just broke on me...
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the 940 does 3ghz stock dude.. i think your talking about 4ghz and thats primarily the C3 955 and C3 965..

3.4ghz you can do at about 1.37v but should be able to do it near stock voltage.. 3.6 might be around 1.4-1.46v and 3.8ghz is about 1.5-1.52v.. id say bump the voltage to 1.45v and raise the multiplier 1 step at a time.. stability test each time and do that til it fails.. then ya know you need to raise the voltage..
 
I know. But with completely changing not just the cooler, but also the entire mounting mechanism, do you really think there is something wrong with the CPU? Should I keep trying to return it?

I'll try AMD's site again tomorrow. Maybe it'll work now...
 
That's just... I don't even know. Are you sure you're not reading temp in Fahrenheit? I've got a Phenom II X4 965 and it idles at 26-28C. Overclocked to 3.96 on air it doesn't go over 54C at full load.
 
Improbable Joe said:
That's just... I don't even know. Are you sure you're not reading temp in Fahrenheit? I've got a Phenom II X4 965 and it idles at 26-28C. Overclocked to 3.96 on air it doesn't go over 54C at full load.
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no i think he has a processor with a bad core temp sensor or a motherboard thats screwing the sensor up..
 
Improbable Joe said:
That's just... I don't even know. Are you sure you're not reading temp in Fahrenheit? I've got a Phenom II X4 965 and it idles at 26-28C. Overclocked to 3.96 on air it doesn't go over 54C at full load.
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Oh no. In BIOS, temps were 40C/104C at idle. I had the same 40C reading in AMD OverDrive.

I'm baffled. I'll have to see what I get out of the overclock. I'd like to see if it runs stable over 60C.
 
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These temps can't be right...A Phenom II will shut down when it goes 65c+ to protect itself right?...Can it be a crazy CPU?
 
TeeJay said:
These temps can't be right...A Phenom II will shut down when it goes 65c+ to protect itself right?...Can it be a crazy CPU?
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There must be something wrong with the temp sensor. The CPU is 100% stable. It was stable as high as 96C, under load with four cores in Prime95. Anything more than that (OC-wise) and the workers would randomly stop after a few minutes.

So if an OD'd chip can run happily along at 96C, then something's probably wrong with the CPU.

Explain this to me. The temps in the mobo and software (eg: AMD OverDrive) seem to be the same. Don't these chips have an on-die thermistor of some sort? If so, is the motherboard getting it's temperatures readings from the CPU?
 
Get it up to 90 degrees, turn off your PC and open it up and take the cpu heatsink off and feel the CPU. I think you should be able to determine if it really is that hot from a quick touch.
 
Bootleg Usher said:
Get it up to 90 degrees, turn off your PC and open it up and take the cpu heatsink off and feel the CPU. I think you should be able to determine if it really is that hot from a quick touch.
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Well, with a heat sink on, it'll cool down pretty quick. Even if the HSF didn't have four screws and just had a clip, I seriously doubt I'd be able to unclip the HSF fast enough to tell if it was really that hot. I'd be better off using my thermal gun to see what the temp is. The HSF should be within a few degrees of what the CPU is.

I think the point is, if the CPU were really at 96C, it would not be functioning. Yet, it can run four thread of Prime95 at the "max heat generation/low RAM" setting and still purr along.
 
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Flapjack said:
Well, with a heat sink on, it'll cool down pretty quick. Even if the HSF didn't have four screws and just had a clip, I seriously doubt I'd be able to unclip the HSF fast enough to tell if it was really that hot. I'd be better off using my thermal gun to see what the temp is. The HSF should be within a few degrees of what the CPU is.

I think the point is, if the CPU were really at 96F, it would not be functioning. Yet, it can run four thread of Prime95 at the "max heat generation/low RAM" setting and still purr along.
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96F and 96C are 2 different things.. 96F would be 35C which is a damn good temp.. 96C would be 204F.. the thermal limit is 69-72C and the downclock limit is 62-64C.. this is why we use celcius as a standard instead of Fahrenheit for PC's..
 
Yeah, I keep say "F" when I mean "C". Sorry. Celcius is something I only refer to when talking about CPUs. I talk Fahrenheit the other 99% of my life.

I'll go back and correct the "F"s later...
 
Flapjack said:
Yeah, I keep say "F" when I mean "C". Sorry. Celcius is something I only refer to when talking about CPUs. I talk Fahrenheit the other 99% of my life.

I'll go back and correct the "F"s later...
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no problem.. just didnt want one of the trolls here try to attempt to make a fool out of you like they try to do..

just curious if your CPU is showing up as 96C whats your socket temp showing?
 
sirmonkey1985 said:
the 940 does 3ghz stock dude.. i think your talking about 4ghz and thats primarily the C3 955 and C3 965..

3.4ghz you can do at about 1.37v but should be able to do it near stock voltage.. 3.6 might be around 1.4-1.46v and 3.8ghz is about 1.5-1.52v.. id say bump the voltage to 1.45v and raise the multiplier 1 step at a time.. stability test each time and do that til it fails.. then ya know you need to raise the voltage..
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Yes, another typo... sorry. :)

I'll play with the OC later today and see what I can get out of it. Thanks.
 
Ok, I finally just gave in and called AMD. They're RMA'ing the CPU for me and even gave me a pre-paid FedEx label. Still, it's going to be a few weeks. I decided to buy a cheap CPU to get me by until the replacement comes back. Will this work?

AMD Athlon II X2 245 Regor 2.9 GHz 2x1 MB L2 Cache Socket AM3 65W Dual-Core Desktop Processor - Retail ADX245OCGQBOX
http://www.amazon.com/AMD-Athlon-Dual-Core-Desktop-Processor/dp/tech-data/B002GLDF58/ref=de_a_smtd

Here's my motherboard. It says "AM3 Ready" in the description, but I'm running DDR2 RAM.

ECS A790GXM-A (V1.0)
http://www.ecs.com.tw/ECSWebSite/Pr...x?DetailID=901&CategoryID=1&MenuID=20&LanID=0

A quick reply would be awesome.
 
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Well, no replies so I went ahead and ordered the AMD Athlon II X2 245 Regor 2.9 GHz just so I'd have something by tomorrow. I'll be damned if I don't have a PC up and running when SCII comes out! :)
 
Ok, so the X2 245 works just fine. Idles at 24C and sits at 34-35C at full load. The old CPU goes out Monday.

How quick is AMD's turnaround usually?
 
the 245's a nice chip.. not sure how long AMD takes but at least you can have some fun overclocking the 245 while you wait.. :p
 
yeah 3.6 is pretty normal for those processors.. takes a little more work to overclock them due to the locked multiplier but its fun none the less..
 
Well, I've play around with the CPU and cannot seem to get it to overclock... not one bit. In fact, it seems to be running at a speed other than advertised when I set everything to "Auto". I'm showing a HT bus speed of 210mhz with the AMD Overdrive software which brings the CPU (with a 14.5 multiplier) to 3045mhz... not 2900.

I've played with various options in the BIOS of the ECS motherboard, but nothing seems to affect the speed of the CPU once I get into windows.

Even funnier is that I had no issues overclocking the Phenom II 940 (other than stability). It ran at pretty much whatever speed I set it to, until I put a load on it of course.

I know there are no clock multiplier adjustments on the 245, but you would think changing the FSB from 200 to 230 would result in a 3335mhz CPU speed (I also used the settings to limit memory and HT bus speed to 200mhz). It still showed that oddball 3045 speed.

I've read through the sticky for OC'ing the new AMD CPUs, but none of those tactics seems to be taking effect in BIOS.
 
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