PC gaming dead?! CPR STAT...CLEAR ZAAP!

You people are dancing on the edge of a thread lock. Not that i think there's anyting in here worth saving, as the zealots are out in droves. Keep it polite, or it will get closed.
 
WickedAngel said:
User-built PCs are not nearly as common as pre-builts (Which are useless for gaming). You're still avoiding the point.


_.
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False. Prebuilts are fine for average quality game play. Millions of consolers settle for average quality gameplay, so why wouldnt all the gamers running pre-builts?

Consoles are in some ways the ultimate pre-built. No need to stress over your shrinking e-peen when everone is restricted to the same hardware. Its like gaming communism, but in a good way.

MS will nudge the console closer to what a PC is now. That is probibly good for everyone.
 
From your own article;

In a conference call with financial analysts following the announcement of the results, Nvidia CEO Jen-Hsun Huang attributed much of the growth to increased shipments of Xbox parts to Microsoft. Nvidia won a contract several years ago to supply the graphics processor--the most expensive part of a game machine--for the Xbox.
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urbsnspices said:
False. Prebuilts are fine for average quality game play. Millions of consolers settle for average quality gameplay, so why wouldnt all the gamers running pre-builts?
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Please tell me you're kidding. A 64mb integrated GPU on a platform that shipped with 256mb of RAM isn't going to be playing much of anything other than Solitaire.
 
Please tell me you're kidding. A 64mb integrated GPU on a platform that shipped with 256mb of RAM isn't going to be playing much of anything other than Solitaire.
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Despite this, your sig shows an Inspiron 9300, which as a laptop is technically a "pre-built" and they can be quite capable for games. Not all prebuilts are $399 256mb built in shared memory video cards. Quite a few "pre-builts" come with, or can be ordered with "gaming quality" video cards and substantial amounts of memory. Granted they usually end up costing more than a home-built, but that is a different topic.

I think the decline in PC gaming more more in relation to the fact that most games now are rehashes or clones /w improved graphics.

Face it, it has been a LONG time since we had any revolutionary or innovative games. Some of the niche markets that PC's have always claimed as their own are lacking new products or have significant gaps in production cycles.

Flight sims? not many non-arcadish sims out there (I.E. games like Falcon, Janes F15E and F18). How about Longbow? Hell even though less realistic Gunship 2000 was pretty damn good.

Other sims? Janes 688i was awesome, there used to be a few good Tank sims, but those seem to be dead.

Turned based strategy? Havn't seen any promises for a new Panzer General or Steel Panthers for awhile.

RPG's, there are some, but the Ultima series (well 1-7 anyhow) were great games during their times, Elder Scrolls is probably the best example. But what about non-standard RPGs like Fallout?

Driving? Ok so GTR is good, but it seems there really hasn't but any significant innovations here for awhile.

Space flight? This really took a dive with Wing Commander 3, and has not really made a come back. Sure you have X2, but that style of game is a niche withen a niche. Many people can find it boring. Shoot we h ave the hardware now to really do a Wing Commander style game with huge fleet battles and everything, but no one wants to do a truely mind blowing space game. The sales sucked on the later games because the game sucked. Getting rid of the cockpits and dumbing the controls down to make it more arcade like pushed a lot of people away IMO. This game combined with some RPG and FPS elements could have a ton of potential.

Battletech? Lots of potential here, and MS has the money to make it work if they would give it a chance (and 3-6 years of development time). MS gettings the rights to Battletech was probably the worst thing that could have happened here.

My view: PC games grew during the smaller developer era with shareware and innovative titles. Even without shareware and small developers, PC gamers want more, demand more, than just the same gameplay rehashed with pretty graphics. We want games that truely innovate and bring new features that make us think "hey, now THAT was a cool idea". PC gaming will never be as big as console gaming. Just as a Corvette will never sell as well as a Camry. They all might be games, but they have differnt customers. Right now PC gaming is in a lull because they are selling us a Camry with the shell of a Corvette.

And before someone says "well if you can do better why don't you write your own game"... Well, if you want to provide funding......
 
I agree with the above poster, Consoles and PC's have there place. For those looking for the most technically advanced games, the PC will still be where to go even after the new consoles come out. (Tech meaning graphics, etc.) Why not have both though. The consoles will cost less than a top-tier video card? I see no need to pick one or the other. I just find it funny that people think these new consoles will dominate the PC, in terms of technical prowess, for anything longer than a few months. That won't stop me from getting a console if there are fun games to play on them that are worth the expenditure. My PC, I do a lot more with it then just game. A console has only one function.
 
WickedAngel said:
From your own article;





Please tell me you're kidding. A 64mb integrated GPU on a platform that shipped with 256mb of RAM isn't going to be playing much of anything other than Solitaire.
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Go visit dell.com. Not sure what you consider pre-built rigs but I would think these qualify. Here is the base video card and the upgrade for the cheap models this month:
video cards
Not [H]ard but do-able. The current games released on both the console and pc should be do-able. On top of it all you can buy a pre-built 'gaming' computers all over, even from Dell. From Dell, these include a 256MB 6800 of some ilk. All I am saying is that the PC market has responded to the needs of its users. Consoles are still the ultimate plug and play option and save you from the possibility of [H]ardware envy.
 
-Sean Casey said:
Despite this, your sig shows an Inspiron 9300, which as a laptop is technically a "pre-built" and they can be quite capable for games. Not all prebuilts are $399 256mb built in shared memory video cards. Quite a few "pre-builts" come with, or can be ordered with "gaming quality" video cards and substantial amounts of memory. Granted they usually end up costing more than a home-built, but that is a different topic.
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This laptop is capable of running games because I already knew that it wouldn't be useful for doing so at stock. Most people wouldn't have this knowledge. Most people would think that 256mb would be adequate because most people don't know dick about computers. They wouldn't have upgraded the CPU either, which I did. They wouldn't realize that RAM could be bought for half the price somewhere aside from Dell, therefore they would leave it at the lowest option or, at most, dive into the 512mb ring.

The X300 was the default card, which wouldn't even come close to being adequate for running modern games smoothly.
 
WickedAngel said:
From your own article;
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Yes, a growth of $32.5 million over the $427.3 million the previous year.
One liners are great for jokes, arguments require the whole picture.

Do you have any facts to back up your claim?
So far it has been me posting articles and you pulling snippits from them trying to make a case.
 
I said the Xbox accounted for a large portion of their profits. 7.6% of their total profits justifies such a claim.

You've been responding to that 110% comment this entire time and it was obviously a joke. I'm not sure if you've noticed, but 110% isn't a feasible number in the realm of actual profits that are held. Stand-alone card sales are not their big puller in terms of profits. They make money by striking deals with companies such as Dell/Hewlett Packard/Compaq/Microsoft. The latest and greatest $700 cards aren't going to be the meat of the sales simply because of the price points that they demand.

Your "Location" is correct; you're definately living under a rock.
 
WickedAngel said:
I said the Xbox accounted for a large portion of their profits. 7.6% of their total profits justifies such a claim.

You've been responding to that 110% comment this entire time and it was obviously a joke. I'm not sure if you've noticed, but 110% isn't a feasible number in the realm of actual profits that are held. Stand-alone card sales are not their big puller in terms of profits. They make money by striking deals with companies such as Dell/Hewlett Packard/Compaq/Microsoft. The latest and greatest $700 cards aren't going to be the meat of the sales simply because of the price points that they demand.

Your "Location" is correct; you're definately living under a rock.
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WickedAngel said:
110% sure is more like it.

ATi/Nvidia make far more on consoles than they do with their stand-alone graphics cards. There is no comparison between the two.
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"Xbox accounted for a large portion of their profits" is nothing like "ATi/Nvidia make far more on consoles than they do with their stand-alone graphics cards"
Don't try to retroactively change your argument.

You're the first to say anthing about 110% in anything other than a joking manner.
 
Reading comprehension is our friend. I didn't change anything. I still stand by it. Their profits come from licensing and wide-scale distribution for pre-built computers.

This is boring, though. Going in circles with me isn't going to change the truth; the PC industry is regurgitating sequels to the same stale genres and it's showing in sales. Twist the sales statistics all you want. Make excuses. It won't change the PC sales racks that are packed full of floodware and "Me Too" FPS/RTS games with no substance.
 
WickedAngel said:
Reading comprehension is our friend. I didn't change anything. I still stand by it. Their profits come from licensing and wide-scale distribution for pre-built computers.

This is boring, though. Going in circles with me isn't going to change the truth; the PC industry is regurgitating sequels to the same stale genres and it's showing in sales. Twist the sales statistics all you want. Make excuses. It won't change the PC sales racks that are packed full of floodware and "Me Too" FPS/RTS games with no substance.
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I made no comments on the state of gaming, PC or console.
You stated a fact: "ATi/Nvidia make far more on consoles than they do with their stand-alone graphics cards. There is no comparison between the two."
And I gave evidence as to it's falsness.

You immediately agreed you were wrong about ATi, but when the same evidence is given for Nvidia you try to ignore or change it.

You are the only one making circles or personal insults.
 
Sorry, but no. You didn't prove me wrong about Nvidia. In their quartery reports they were only specific about the portion of sales that consoles contribute. They didn't categorize things like licensed products, major manufacturer deals, and stand-alone card sales.

You completely failed to address the latter part of my post. Shall I assume you know that the PC gaming industry is fading into obscurity?
 
WickedAngel said:
Sorry, but no. You didn't prove me wrong about Nvidia. In their quartery reports they were only specific about the portion of sales that consoles contribute. They didn't categorize things like licensed products, major manufacturer deals, and stand-alone card sales.

You completely failed to address the latter part of my post. Shall I assume you know that the PC gaming industry is fading into obscurity?
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Fading into obscurity?
Wouldn't go that far.
Running backwards, falling down stairs and generally acting like Hollywood (milking every penny they can something before throwing it away to bring out the new-and-improved-exact-same-thing-but-in-a-different-shade-of-the-same-color)?
Yes, absolutely yes.


As for the ATi/Nvidia thing, ATi seperated it no more than Nvidia did.
But I now get that your definition of "stand-alone card" is strictly refering to retail packaged, on the shelf cards.
I was including cards sold as part of pre-built machines, as neither are truly stand-alone.

So, let's just leave it at PC game market sucks, and graphics companies make $700 uber-cards for publicity.
 
WickedAngel said:
1. "Online distribution" can mean any number of things.

2. You're doing exactly what you're criticizing me for in ignoring the concrete numbers that are being counted for sales.

3. Console games are sold online as well.

Feel free to continue on with your pathetic rant, though. Denial is the only excuse for your opinions on the subject.
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1. Wow you just don't even get it do you. Online distribution doesn't mean a number of things. Online distribution, no physical copy of the game it is bought and downloaded.

2. I am not ignoring any numbers what are you even talking about? I didn't even state an opinion except that you had no facts and kept ignoring things,

3. We are not talking about physical games sold online and shipped to your house, obviously that number is included in the figures, lmao. NPD tracks data from stores, why wouldn't the stores have a record of what is physically shipped? We are talking about online distribution, meaning no physical copy of the game ie STEAM. When you can't even grasp that I see continuing this is pointless.

The best part is bolded, I never stated an opinion yet denial is my only excuse, I'm sorry I have to go dry my eyes you are too funny.

You are definetly the king :D

It'd be one thing if you carried on a real discussion or argument.. But it's easy to look over the posts and see how hard it is for you to concede even one point, obviously everyone in the world is wrong.
 
I don't concede when I'm not wrong, and I'm not wrong here.

I was wrong about ATi and I immediately said so.

Everyone in the world isn't wrong; just you.

1. Yes, online distribution does mean any number of things. It includes downloadable expansion packs and subscriptions to online services. It's amazing that you can't seem to understand this. That's why nobody counts those figures when they're totaling sales for each market.

2. You obviously are ignoring the numbers, because both Kadarom and I have already settled this while you're still in the dark on the subject.

3. Console subscriptions are sold online. Xbox Live being the most notable (Since over one-million people have used it one point or another). Those subscriptions are part of that two-billion in uncounted sales figures.
 
1. Ok I see we are seriously into semantics, isn't that the same thing, NO PHYSICAL GOODS. That is all I am saying.

Other than that I'll repeat HOW can I be ignoring anything when I've never stated an opinion either way except that you originally had a weak argument with no facts.

So meh, whatever.

and for 3. you said console games are sold online, not subscriptions, I'm well aware of subs. So the only way I could take that was you implying (physical) online sales were not accounted for.
 
WickedAngel said:
Please tell me you're kidding. A 64mb integrated GPU on a platform that shipped with 256mb of RAM isn't going to be playing much of anything other than Solitaire.
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Oh this is rich! FYI, even a 64MB integrated GPU (shared SDRAM memory too) can still play counterstrike pretty well in software mode (hi res too), ask the d*mn guys at the office who kept installing the game over the network! And those were the cheapest PC's the management could find!

auxout said:
Other than that I'll repeat HOW can I be ignoring anything when I've never stated an opinion either way except that you originally had a weak argument with no facts.
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Actually, i don't think he's got a solid base for an argument. Considering how his posts are at odds with each other, my impression is that he's only now making his mind up as the thread goes on.
 
I guess it isn't fair of me to expect you to see sarcasm on the internet, but I figured you would get the hint when I listed Solitaire.

We're talking about the future of the industry. Selling hardware that is only adequate for games over five years old doesn't really fit into any definition of the word "future".

None of my posts are at odds with eachother. I would go through each of my posts to outline the point for you, but I'm all out of crayons so I couldn't display the messages at a level you could understand.
 
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