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Overclockability of Shuttles?

N

n64man120

2[H]4U
Joined
Jan 11, 2004
Messages
3,498
I'm going to be buying new parts in June for a rig for college and I'm trying to decide between full size or Shuttle. Clearly I'm interested in Shuttles since there so small and convienient. However, I'm into case mods, volt mods, overclocking, etc. How well do shuttle mobo's overclock and such compared to high end mobos from say Abit and Asus?

I'm also going to watercool it and I understand it's difficult but very do-able. Pretty much I'm wondering if I'd be sacraficing anything with a Shuttle besides not being able to do a hardcore wiring job to show off.

So how well do you think a Shuttle will satisfy a [H] enthusiast?
 
I used a SB65G2V3 to OC a Mobile Celeron 1.5 to 3GHz. :) But in general, their OC abilities are a little lower than a normal desktop. They do a nice job for their size and sound level, but just don't expect anything earth shattering.
 
They can overclock rather well and some do the volt mods and fancy stuff. The only real limitation is HEAT as the cooling solution is rather limited. It's pretty darn effective but has a limit of course.
 
You should be able to overclock it pretty decently. And if you do watercooling well you shouldn't have too many heat problems either.
 
For the size/convenience/coolness, the marginal tradeoff in performance is worth it, imo.
 
I had a SB75G2 with a 2.8C that ran at 3.4Ghz rock solid during the whole time I owned it which was roughly one year.
 
Comering to Full size PC Shuttle XPC has smaller OC-ing potential. Though they can OC.
Only question is why? If You gett Shuttle it will preform as Full size PC.
Even with smaller model of newer CPUs You will have preformance needed to work normaly. Only give it nice amount of memory and decent grafic card.
CPU power doesn't mean so much exept for jobs as encoding, rendering etc.
For gaming grafic card will be more important.
For DTP amount of RAM and fast HDD are important more then CPU power.
All applications will like more RAM.
Some Applications will prefer good multitasking CPU and some explosive single task CPU. So for some applicatins go Intel way and for others AMD way although all newer CPUs doo good job.

SFF PC's are mostly running hoter as Full size counterparts. Stressing it with OC-ing makes situation even worse. Although it's simple to make some mods to improve cooling in SFF.


My SN95G5 allows me to OC 3000+ Winchester from 1800 to super stable 2350 MHz.
With some more additional Voltage and with better memory it could goo higher.




MD
 
Yea, I know performance wise it would be the same... besides not hitting as high of an OC. The problem is that I'm really into working on the insides doing super clean wiring and all that sort of stuff. Trying to decide if the tradeoff to a SFF is worth it.

As far as watercooling it, I've seen rad's inside the SFF but there tiny. If I was to get a 77 Boneville for example it would have to be external. How well do you think it would work putting the rad/pump/res in a separate enclosure right next to or underneith the SFF... and having quick disconnects between the two?
 
if you go over to sudhian forums, you may get a better answer about water cooling. Their SFF Tech section is all about SFF systems. I've seen some crazy stuff over there. I think the water cooling system that looked to be the easiest/best performing was mounting the radiator (I can't remember what rad it was) on the outside of the case where the normal exhaust fan is. That way, you don't have to do too much engineering, the looks aren't affected too badly, and you still can fit a decent rad on there.
 
ICE cooling is very powerfull. Though need sufficient amount of air and then it becomes bit louder. ICE Cooling is not a limiting factor in OC-ing Shuttle XPC.

People use Exos Koolance models(new Exos II) and koolance water blocks and it works with Shuttle.
Also self made cooling with quickons would work good just take PIV waterblock even for AMD CPU cause ICE is mounted even there with mounting bracked used with normal PIV.
People also build full internal WC with Black Ice micro radiator DD 12 V pump and koolance PIV blocks and koolance grafic card blocks.

Though cooling can be improved with few tricks (read my post over cooling a G chassis XPC)

External WC is bit unpractical and makes less sence with SFF factor IMHO.




MD
 
I'm a bit familiar with the design of Shuttles, and the rear Rad. would only be 80mm square. I don't think this would be sufficient for the high OC's I'm going for after waterblocks go on the CPU and Videocard.

Any other oppinions on my external setup Idea above?

Also, It also occurred to me that shuttles don't leave much room for several HDD's or SLI if I chose to go that route in the future.

Though decision :rolleyes:
 
It sounds like you just need to go with a normal box. An SFF just won't have the kid of expandability or space you need to make a project like this efficient.
 
Yea that's what I'm thinking. I was only gonna go SFF for college convienience but after talking to a few people it seems a tower isn't much of a hassle.
 
Well Yo udoo not know what You are going to miss.

If 600 MHz OC isn't much how much is it needed?
G4 and G5 series XPC havbe 92 mili on Radiator and it's damn effective.
P chasis has 3 HHD's mounting places and optical drive m.p. and integrated memory card reader. So DVD RW 3x 300 GB 16 MB HDD's. 2 GB RAM and top processor aint enough?
What haslle? P series Shuttle XPC are toolless assambly design that I can put together in max. 30 minutes?
What cable neat setup? Pseries and any newer Shuttle has all cableas preinstalled and neatle connected to frame. No cable Spagetti in there.
People run PIV northwooods 2,4 PIV at 3,4 GHz in Shuttle.
People run AMD Winchester 3000+ (1,8 GH) at 2500MHz in Shuttle.
Is that not good OC?

On fan full settings 92 mili Shuttle ICE is more efficient ad Thermalright XP120 with 120 mid fan in any normal case.

Wanna have DVD reader and DVD RW well why Yo ucan't on fly copy DVD.

So just say normal tower setup is cheeper and that's it. It has also more space - doo You use all that space? Like normal mobo has 4 memory slot's - doo You use more then two sticks? With 4 sticks most of mainboards go to DDR333 or higher letancies. Is 2 GB not enough?

Well if SFF is not enough for You You need Server case and server mainboard.






MD
 
Now I lost you on a few things due to typos and abbreviations...

When you say 92mm Rad are you talking abou that ICE cooling system or some watercooling setup. You make it sound like they come stock with watercooling but I was under the impression no SFF's had this.

I'll assume P series is the newest, or best SFF barebone available.
 
Wouldn't you like something you could throw in your suitcase and take home with you during breaks?

You could always go with a mATX micro-tower case. That way you could still do the wire mods, use a normal power suppy, fit an extra drive and squeeze in a decent WC setup. Only thing you wouldn't be able to use is SLI, which other than benchies is pretty pointless. Best of all, the new Alviso chipset should be ready in time for college and, with a custom waterblock, those Dothans would overclock like freakin' mad! :cool:

Some case ideas:
http://forums.extremeoverclocking.com/showpost.php?p=1569512&postcount=7

This would be sick for showing off (although it needs a handle and it also kind of screams "steal me"):
http://www.cubedpc.com/thecube.htm
 
ICE uses heatpipe cooler. There is a CPU block (with some fins on it but not activly cooled) and there is a radiator. Connecting those two element there are 4 heatpipes (copper pipes with some water in vacum)
Heat pipes efectivly take away heat from CPU block and give it away to high fin surface of a radiator( call it a heatsink if You wont).
Water boils in vacum on app. 3x lower temps. So water damps rize and go away from heat source towards a cooler place (in this setup radiator) . Damps travel thru a midle of a heat pipe. Once reaching cooler place water condensates and runs down back over a inside surface of a heat pipe. That's why even calling a radiator condenser would be correct. It's effective heat transfer principal.
I heatsink part of a Shuttle ICE (Integrated cooling engine) radiator cause air is travelling thru it like on WC setup radiators and fins are very close to each other also like on many WC radiators. Also fins on ICE heatsink are not touching CPU block like with some heat pipe asisted heatsink. Hence heatsink is cooling heat transfer device and not CPU it self directly. One more reason why I call it radiator.


Name by Shuttle are done with plain system. Every XPC SFF is begining with S for shuttle. Second letter is chipset (B=Intel, N= Nividia, K= Via , S = SiS etc.) then there is a model nummber and then Chassis type and version of chasis type. Affter it sometimes comes version nummber.
Like SN95G5 V2 is NForce model 95 G chassis 5th generation version 2 (new mainboard).
P chasis like SN25P is higher and complitly diferent from G chasis. It has zone cooling can handle more hardware has stronger PSU (350 watt) etc.
Cooling is more optimized and it's mostly quieter.



MD
 
I assume this new P model is the one being spoke about alot with little availability. Good thing I'm not building this rig till June, but the setup of the Shuttle P sounds pretty sweet. I guess it's down to that or a average desktop.
 
The P chassis is the latest and greatest, and quite frankly, it's pretty darn good. A little large than the standard shuttles, better thermal solution, room for three HDDs... I suggest you read the reviews at SFFtech.com, I found them very helpful.

There are a few LGA775 P series options available, but the newest Socket 939 P chassis with the nForce 4 chipset is not available. That one will likely be around by June, though.
 
This new P series NForce Shuttle seems very very interesting after reading the sfftech article. My only concerns would be

A) Noise level (Sound Nazi)
B) Temp levels (Heat Navi... I like my rig at mid 30's and was hoping for low 20's with H20)
C) With all these shrouds to route cooling and so on, it seems as if it would be very difficult to impossible to watercool it unless you hacked the Shuttle up severly.
D) No SLI support since the idea of increasing performance by 80% for a reduced price in futue sounds intriguing
E) Don't really dig the 8in1 reader and Floppy slots since I dont need them

Despite all this I'm still strongly considering it though
 
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