Opera Says Microsoft EU Browser Offer "Not Enough"

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So Opera's Chief Technology Officer says that Microsoft shipping Windows 7 without IE8 isn’t going to be enough to restore competition. I’ll bet you $5 that the tone would be the total opposite if Microsoft announced tomorrow that it would ship Opera as the default browser. :rolleyes:

"I don't think what Microsoft announced is going to restore competition," Opera's Chief Technology Officer Hakon Wium Lie told Reuters. "I don't think its going to be enough, I don't think it will get them off the hook," he said.
Click to expand...
 
I would love to see MS ship a version that has zero internet capability to the EU so they can STFU.
 
Does it just popup and say, "Welcome to Windows. Please choose an internet browser from the following:
1. IE8
2. Safari
3. Opera
5. Firefox
6. etc."

And then let you download and install whatever you want? I don't live in Europe, so I have no idea what that process is going to be like. If it just lets you DL or install from a disc the installer of your choice, what's the problem? Isn't that what the EU really wants? People that don't want IE will surely choose something else.
 
Dear Opera,

It's not your fault that you fail to compete with IE8 or Firefox. Please take your whining ass somewhere else. Kthxbai
 
if it doesn't ship with a browser, how can you download one, heh

no one forces you to use IE if it is included, it simply allows you to go download whatever browser you prefer
 
Note to Opera: F*** OFF. No one cares about your shitty browser. No cares about IE8. If you want people using your browser write your own freaking OS.
 
Fine, then open Leopard to PCs and they will have some competition.
 
SirKronan said:
Does it just popup and say, "Welcome to Windows. Please choose an internet browser from the following:
1. IE8
2. Safari
3. Opera
5. Firefox
6. etc."

And then let you download and install whatever you want? I don't live in Europe, so I have no idea what that process is going to be like. If it just lets you DL or install from a disc the installer of your choice, what's the problem? Isn't that what the EU really wants? People that don't want IE will surely choose something else.
Click to expand...


No, it doesn't install any browser. The user is now inconvenienced in that he has to load the browser of his choice... so much for the non-savvy to figure out.
 
so let me get this right...

a company that makes software that can do almost everything a normal user needs OOB needs to tone it down because the COMPETITION (who offer FREE software) can't get market share?

ok, so to give everyone a fair and even foothold, MS will now be offering the SU edition, AKA Screw You...it consists of bare minimum network connectivity and a command prompt...

wait, we've just received word that there is a struggling command shell company out there that may not be able to "break into the market because of this BLATANT monopolistic bundle" so now you get a background, no UI of any sort. this will now be the defacto version, if you want more, well, read the name of the software

no wonder MS just buys it's "competition"...it's cheaper than going to court over every component in it's OS's!
 
Nanan said:
I would love to see MS ship a version that has zero internet capability to the EU so they can STFU.
Click to expand...
How about just cutting the EU off from getting any Microsoft products at all, maybe a firebomb or 3,243 as well.
 
Brent_Justice said:
if it doesn't ship with a browser, how can you download one, heh

no one forces you to use IE if it is included, it simply allows you to go download whatever browser you prefer
Click to expand...


As far as I understand it, this is todo with OEM versions of Windows. Thus system-builders can then decide to either put IE* on, FF,Opera,Chrome,... or all of them

Only ones that this would mess with would be those that buy OEM-disks to put on their present systems
 
eeyrjmr said:
As far as I understand it, this is todo with OEM versions of Windows. Thus system-builders can then decide to either put IE* on, FF,Opera,Chrome,... or all of them

Only ones that this would mess with would be those that buy OEM-disks to put on their present systems
Click to expand...

but why can't those system builders put whatever they want on their systems now? IE isn't stopping it...
 
eeyrjmr said:
As far as I understand it, this is todo with OEM versions of Windows. Thus system-builders can then decide to either put IE* on, FF,Opera,Chrome,... or all of them

Only ones that this would mess with would be those that buy OEM-disks to put on their present systems
Click to expand...

Which a majority will still install IE8. :D
 
Bone_Enterprise said:
How about just cutting the EU off from getting any Microsoft products at all, maybe a firebomb or 3,243 as well.
Click to expand...

MS cutting off the EU from its products would be like committing corporate suicide....

if that happened, it would take maybe a year, or 2 years tops for w/e alternative OS the EU adopts to become the first major competitor to windows on the desktop....
 
Dr.LaRd said:
so let me get this right...

a company that makes software that can do almost everything a normal user needs OOB needs to tone it down because the COMPETITION (who offer FREE software) can't get market share?

ok, so to give everyone a fair and even foothold, MS will now be offering the SU edition, AKA Screw You...it consists of bare minimum network connectivity and a command prompt...

wait, we've just received word that there is a struggling command shell company out there that may not be able to "break into the market because of this BLATANT monopolistic bundle" so now you get a background, no UI of any sort. this will now be the defacto version, if you want more, well, read the name of the software

no wonder MS just buys it's "competition"...it's cheaper than going to court over every component in it's OS's!
Click to expand...

This is what happens when government begins to interfere where interference isn't necessary.

Microsoft was NEVER a monopoly in that there have always been viable alternatives to Windows. The problem is that NONE of those alternatives was actually Windows.

At any rate don't I hope I'm not the only one that finds it ironic that you have the music and movie industry telling everyone that downloading pirated files from the Internet is killing them yet at the same time the EU figures that it’s just too hard to download a browser.

Another thing that I find ironic is how Microsoft's inclusion of the browser was UNIVERSIALLY a boon to customers. It ended the days of $50 Netscape Navigator.

All the EU is doing is practicing protectionism to help a few browser companies and to be honest since browsers are free I don't see how it's helping them. I guess everyone is still figuring on the cloud taking over and the browser becoming the OS like Netscape and others have envisioned. While it could happen I really don't see the end of local computing either.
 
Well I WAS using Opera but I'm dling the Firefox 3.5 Preview right now because I don't want to be supporting these whiny bitches.

Seriously though, this is retarded someone needs to smack these guys. Firefox is kicking ass and taking names in the browser market so obviously there's not a lack of competition. Watch them go after Firefox next for some different retarded reason, maybe the EU will baby them there too.
 
Want some whine with your cheese?

Opera, your browser sucks ass. I've tried it and it was the worst out of all 4.
 
brucedeluxe169 said:
MS cutting off the EU from its products would be like committing corporate suicide....

if that happened, it would take maybe a year, or 2 years tops for w/e alternative OS the EU adopts to become the first major competitor to windows on the desktop....
Click to expand...

The EU is the world’s largest economy. I don't see any company exiting that market voluntarily.
 
JimmiG said:
How can shipping it without IE not be enough? :confused:
Click to expand...

As I understand it, the EU wants consumer choise. MS have removed that choice by saying they would sell Win7 with no browser

I am guessing the EU is after some kind of app in place of IE where the 1st usage the user is given a choice to d/l the browser of their choice (ie MS don't have to bundle all browsers)


http://www.infoworld.com/d/windows/ec-pursue-antitrust-case-despite-microsofts-ie-decision-299

Stripping out IE from Windows "may potentially be positive," the statement said, as this would allow original equipment manufacturers to offer their customers PCs with a browser of their choice, whether it be IE or a rival browser such as Opera, Mozilla's Firefox, Google's Chrome or Apple's Safari.
However, the statement was less positive about the effect on direct sales of Windows to consumers. "Rather than more choice, Microsoft seems to have chosen to provide less," it said.
Click to expand...


Please don't confuse what I have with my possibly backing the EU in this desision, I don't (I do back the EU over the last one w.r.t. to inter-interoperability esp networking which has lead to SAMBA being given some protocol infomation)
 
Took the words out of my mouth.

soulesschild said:
Dear Opera,

It's not your fault that you fail to compete with IE8 or Firefox. Please take your whining ass somewhere else. Kthxbai
Click to expand...

Jutsu said:
Note to Opera: F*** OFF. No one cares about your shitty browser. No cares about IE8. If you want people using your browser write your own freaking OS.
Click to expand...

whrswoldo said:
What a chode, yet another reason why I will not be using Opera :p
Click to expand...

whrswoldo said:
Maybe they can make a "STFU whiny Opera bitches" model that ships with Opera and prevents the installation of other browsers ;)
Click to expand...
 
Microsoft should just stop selling windows in the EU for like 2 weeks and say, find a better alternative. They will freak out in two weeks and say come back and we'll get off your back.
 
It's really a very simple reason why the EU is defending Opera and punishing MS. Opera is based in Europe, MS is American. The EU wants to do whatever it can to punish American companies
 
Ok, so I guess Alpine should sue EVERY car manufacturer because the build radio's into their cars...
 
I find it soooo amazing that companies that give away FREE products can cause such a fuss over "Fairness"

Your product is FREE! You get NOTHING out of additional market share......NOTHING
 
heatlesssun said:
This is what happens when government begins to interfere where interference isn't necessary.

Microsoft was NEVER a monopoly in that there have always been viable alternatives to Windows. The problem is that NONE of those alternatives was actually Windows.

At any rate don't I hope I'm not the only one that finds it ironic that you have the music and movie industry telling everyone that downloading pirated files from the Internet is killing them yet at the same time the EU figures that it’s just too hard to download a browser.

Another thing that I find ironic is how Microsoft's inclusion of the browser was UNIVERSIALLY a boon to customers. It ended the days of $50 Netscape Navigator.

All the EU is doing is practicing protectionism to help a few browser companies and to be honest since browsers are free I don't see how it's helping them. I guess everyone is still figuring on the cloud taking over and the browser becoming the OS like Netscape and others have envisioned. While it could happen I really don't see the end of local computing either.
Click to expand...

I remember paying $90 for the Netscape Navigator suite way back when. It did include a 2 1/2 inch thick user manual so it was totally worth it. :rolleyes:

I also remember MS coming out a couple months later with a free browser. As I recall I had my girl friend kick me square in the "nads" for that bonehead move! Money was pretty tight back then...blaahhh :p
 
*Bangs head on desk.* If I said what I'm really thinking at this moment I'm pretty sure I would get in trouble so here is the slightly PC edition of my thoughts: Bloody hell! Opera, the reason you have a bad market share is because you're browser is the worst piece of shit I've used since the early versions of Netscape. I would rather explore the internet through FTP than deal with it. You are just helping the EU screw over every single customer in that region. If you were capable of making a competent piece of software and spent more time working on it you might actually have a chance. Instead you get to live on because of the horrible browsers you make and sell on other platforms.

Hey maybe the EU should sue Nintendo to force them to allow other companies to make Wii browsers besides Opera, lets see how quickly Opera changes its tune than.
 
Someone made a decent analogy regarding cars.

Should Alpine or Kenwood sue a car manufacturer for coming pre-installed with a factory radio?
Correction: Should they sue Honda for using a Honda stereo (MS with IE) but not sue Toyota for using a Toyota stereo (Mac with Safari)?

Hopefully that made sense and is a viable argument.
 
Shambler said:
Someone made a decent analogy regarding cars.

Should Alpine or Kenwood sue a car manufacturer for coming pre-installed with a factory radio?
Correction: Should they sue Honda for using a Honda stereo (MS with IE) but not sue Toyota for using a Toyota stereo (Mac with Safari)?

Hopefully that made sense and is a viable argument.
Click to expand...

Car analogies usually don't work, but I like that one.
 
This is getting ridiculous...


Opera: I make steering wheels, and I think it's totally unfair that Ford ships steering wheels on all of their cars. No one buys my steering wheels!

MS: Fine, we'll ship our cars without steering wheels, though you can choose to use our steering wheel for free. We'll have it sitting in the back seat.

Opera: That's not enough! You should place my steering wheel in there too! And bolt it on as well....
 
Shambler said:
Someone made a decent analogy regarding cars.

Should Alpine or Kenwood sue a car manufacturer for coming pre-installed with a factory radio?
Correction: Should they sue Honda for using a Honda stereo (MS with IE) but not sue Toyota for using a Toyota stereo (Mac with Safari)?

Hopefully that made sense and is a viable argument.
Click to expand...

Damn, someone beat me to it. Nice job!
 
I work at (not for) the Redmond campus and on my way home every day there is a giant public park to the right of the freeway. The Opera guys, right here in the homeland of IE put a huge red banner up for all to see that says "Want to be a real Internet explorer? Opera.com"

I've tried their browser and I thought Firefox's memory hogging issues were bad (but it is still my primary browser). I had a simple page open (and by simple I mean consumer reports) and Opera was eating up 140MB of my RAM and after messing around with it I didn't see what the "wow" was when I already have Firefox.

Opera...quit your whining. It took Mozilla a while to catch on when they got something good. Make your product not suck and maybe it'll catch on.
 
This is getting crazy, what exactly is it that Opera wants that would make it nice. Other than pre-loading it on windows. We already bitch enough about all the crap-ware on all the computers. Now they want every browser to be pre-installed on a computer? WTF.

Let the OEMs put what ever the heck they want to on the PC. Load it up. I will still continue to build mine. I like the fact for convenience sake that when my computer is built, and behind a firewall. I don't have to download calculator, or notepad, or anything else. Sure I could download notepad++ but is it really necessary right away?

And I do like the car analogy. And stopping monopolistic behavior is what is supposed to be good for the end users. Right now this 'monopolistic' behavior is what made all browsers free. While innovation might have slowed down, I kind of like the fact that it is free.
 
Dear Opera.

Shut the heck up, you jealous abhorrent monstrosity.


When they started this, I uninstalled Opera from all of our company computers and installed IE. We don't deal with companies that can't hide their professional jealousy.
 
SirKronan said:
Does it just popup and say, "Welcome to Windows. Please choose an internet browser from the following:
1. IE8
2. Safari
3. Opera
5. Firefox
6. etc."

And then let you download and install whatever you want? I don't live in Europe, so I have no idea what that process is going to be like. If it just lets you DL or install from a disc the installer of your choice, what's the problem? Isn't that what the EU really wants? People that don't want IE will surely choose something else.
Click to expand...
Then by that logic, Google needs to place a popup on their homepage that asks if you'd like to use Yahoo or Bing searches.

brucedeluxe169 said:
MS cutting off the EU from its products would be like committing corporate suicide....

if that happened, it would take maybe a year, or 2 years tops for w/e alternative OS the EU adopts to become the first major competitor to windows on the desktop....
Click to expand...
Exactly. You think their consumers would be happy about that? Hell no.
Bye-Bye tax revenue from Windows sales as well.

They'd come crawling back. Microsoft can drop all support that they don't currently provide.

heatlesssun said:
The EU is the world’s largest economy. I don't see any company exiting that market voluntarily.
Click to expand...
Actually USA is #1 and China is #2... If we keep outsourcing stuff to them, in the next 10 years they'll pass us though.

Shambler said:
Someone made a decent analogy regarding cars.

Should Alpine or Kenwood sue a car manufacturer for coming pre-installed with a factory radio?
Correction: Should they sue Honda for using a Honda stereo (MS with IE) but not sue Toyota for using a Toyota stereo (Mac with Safari)?

Hopefully that made sense and is a viable argument.
Click to expand...
I was actually going to use a spark plug analogy, but well done ;)
 
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