OLED/AMOLED

[monitorrat]

I happen to believe that the display is the most important part of a computer setup and fortunately it is also a much better investment (if you could call it that) that easily outlives the computer it is being driven by. Most people however sees the display as some necessary evil and that the best display is the one which cost the least per inch. With that mindset yes, the advancements are substantial. With my look on it, it's quite sad and thats not something that has so much to do with having much money or not.

You know, this is pretty true. You will even see quite a few photographers buy a few $1200, or even $3000, lenses and $80 filters and so on, and then go around asking what $150 TN panel is good hah.

 

[daveswantek]

Professional OLED-based monitors for broadcasting purposes are already being mass-produced.

Not true; they may be in the process of setting up production, but I know for a fact that the video editing companys in Burbank are still milking their aging Sony CRTs along with a mix of Plasmas. My neighbor is a video editing support engineer with Level 3 Communications in Burbank. He complains constantly that Sony keeps promising OLED and not delivering it. This is a huge issue, because they have dropped support for $30k + CRTs.

LG is selling an OLED TV in the mainstream market

Great! Have you bought one? Why Not?

LG, Samsung, and many other companies are heavily investing in new and larger production lines for OLED displays. You really think that they'd spend billions of dollars on a technology which isn't ready yet for prime time?

Yes; they have to. That is the only way it can ever be ready for prime-time. Keep in mind all of this is for the TV markey which is huge and very high profit. Computers not so much.
Show me any evidence of anyone planning any OLED computer display within the next 5 years. As much as everyone wants something better, it is still a long way off.

I would love to be wrong about this, but I have been seeing and hearing the same BS for over 5 years now. I have learned to believe it when I see it and all I have seen so far is toys, like a 13 inch TV for $3k.

Like I said; keep dreaming

Dave

 

[daveswantek]

So very true. The typical CRT had poor geometry controls, poor pixel pitch, poor quality control, and a huge list of other problems. The average cheap CRT was not much better, if at all, than the average cheap TN panel. Were they capable of all the colors, unlike a TN? Sure, but they sure as hell didn't display them properly. It was very hard to enjoy a low end CRT that had poor color adjustment options, or none at all.

Those of us who had the high end Trinitron screens could barely stand to use other peoples computers because of the blurry distorted little tubes they were using. CRTs had the same low-end high-end split that LCDs do. I'd argue that it was even more severe.

Early desktop LCDs didn't just catch on because they were smaller. They had a lot of advantages in terms of visual quality, not over a high end CRT, but over low end CRTs.

Exactly; I have ben working with desktop computers from the very beginning, and this was my experience as well.

Dave

 

[ar09]

i was reading this stuff on wikipedia, then, why go to all this problem oleds are full of problems. why not just keep lcds and make them better??

 

[kllrnohj]

i was reading this stuff on wikipedia, then, why go to all this problem oleds are full of problems. why not just keep lcds and make them better??

They are making LCDs better, but OLED has inherent advantages over LCDs, like being able to display perfect black levels.

 

[Snowdog]

i was reading this stuff on wikipedia, then, why go to all this problem oleds are full of problems. why not just keep lcds and make them better??

While things aren't as rosy as Elledans pollyanna predictions, they are worth continuing to progress the technology. Once lifespan/price improves enough, they should make a really excellent TV display in about 5 years or so.

As far as monitors go, don't hold your breath. Monitors have the harshest duty cycles. Many Icons never move, they will burn in 10+ hours a day, every day. That is quite a challenge for any direct emitter technology. Unless of course you are happy with a monitor that doesn't warranty against burn in.

 

[Elledan]

Not true; they may be in the process of setting up production, but I know for a fact that the video editing companys in Burbank are still milking their aging Sony CRTs along with a mix of Plasmas. My neighbor is a video editing support engineer with Level 3 Communications in Burbank. He complains constantly that Sony keeps promising OLED and not delivering it. This is a huge issue, because they have dropped support for $30k + CRTs.

http://www.sony.co.uk/biz/view/ShowProduct.action?product=PVM-740&site=biz_en_GB

Great! Have you bought one? Why Not?

I'm not looking at buying a new TV

Yes; they have to. That is the only way it can ever be ready for prime-time. Keep in mind all of this is for the TV markey which is huge and very high profit. Computers not so much.
Show me any evidence of anyone planning any OLED computer display within the next 5 years. As much as everyone wants something better, it is still a long way off.

I would love to be wrong about this, but I have been seeing and hearing the same BS for over 5 years now. I have learned to believe it when I see it and all I have seen so far is toys, like a 13 inch TV for $3k.

Like I said; keep dreaming

Dave

http://www.technosome.com/sid-2010-lg-display-15-w-oled-monitor-prototype.htm

5 years just may be enough. And really, haven't you heard the news of a huge shortage of OLED panels? Demand is completely outstripping supply, causing new production lines to be set up ASAP. It's a new billion dollar industry.

 

[Snowdog]

I'm not looking at buying a new TV

Why let that stop you? If you are so hot for OLED, put your money where your mouth is.

That OLED TV will certainly have an HDMI output, meaning you can use it with a computer (if and when you can actually purchase it in your market).

 

[Elledan]

Why let that stop you? If you are so hot for OLED, put your money where your mouth is.

That OLED TV will certainly have an HDMI output, meaning you can use it with a computer (if and when you can actually purchase it in your market).

If my financial situation allowed it, I might. As-is I'm lucky to be able to pay rent each month.

 

[Snowdog]

If my financial situation allowed it, I might. As-is I'm lucky to be able to pay rent each month.

Too bad. I had hopes you would be an early adopter and spend $2500 on a 15" screen.

But the part I was looking forward too a few months later:

Biggest OLED cheerleader angry about burn in. Priceless.

 

[Elledan]

Too bad. I had hopes you would be an early adopter and spend $2500 on a 15" screen.

But the part I was looking forward too a few months later:

Biggest OLED cheerleader angry about burn in. Priceless.

Feh, you mean like burn-in with Plasma TVs? The PDP HDTV downstairs is doing just fine, thank you very much, despite a complete disregard for burn-in by my housemate and I.

In case you haven't realized it yet, one of the innovations in OLED technology has been to decrease the drive voltage, lengthening the lifespan of subpixels. The XEL-1 was gen. 2 tech, we're now at gen 5.5. It's like comparing a '98 passive matrix TFT LCD with a 2010 H-IPS LCD.

Also, burn-in is a reality even with LCDs. It's all about the failure modes of sub-pixels, of which there are legion.

Now, can we stop the personal attacks? It doesn't suit you.

 

[daveswantek]

Feh, you mean like burn-in with Plasma TVs? The PDP HDTV downstairs is doing just fine, thank you very much, despite a complete disregard for burn-in by my housemate and I.

In case you haven't realized it yet, one of the innovations in OLED technology has been to decrease the drive voltage, lengthening the lifespan of subpixels. The XEL-1 was gen. 2 tech, we're now at gen 5.5. It's like comparing a '98 passive matrix TFT LCD with a 2010 H-IPS LCD.

Also, burn-in is a reality even with LCDs. It's all about the failure modes of sub-pixels, of which there are legion.

Now, can we stop the personal attacks? It doesn't suit you.

What attacks? You are just wrong; it is nothing personal.

Do some research, you might learn something.

Dave

 

[johnnysd]

Not true; they may be in the process of setting up production, but I know for a fact that the video editing companys in Burbank are still milking their aging Sony CRTs along with a mix of Plasmas. My neighbor is a video editing support engineer with Level 3 Communications in Burbank. He complains constantly that Sony keeps promising OLED and not delivering it. This is a huge issue, because they have dropped support for $30k + CRTs.




Great! Have you bought one? Why Not?



Yes; they have to. That is the only way it can ever be ready for prime-time. Keep in mind all of this is for the TV markey which is huge and very high profit. Computers not so much.
Show me any evidence of anyone planning any OLED computer display within the next 5 years. As much as everyone wants something better, it is still a long way off.

I would love to be wrong about this, but I have been seeing and hearing the same BS for over 5 years now. I have learned to believe it when I see it and all I have seen so far is toys, like a 13 inch TV for $3k.

Like I said; keep dreaming

Dave

There are always people like you and other posters in this thread that will vehemently deny that a new technology will take over, because of the technical hurdles that those technologies initially face. If we went back in time, I am sure that there were quite a few posts and articles saying that LCD technology could never overtake CRTs in the monitor space because of various cost and production and quality issues. OLED is the same. The panel manufacturers have billions of dollars invested in LCD fabrication technology and as a result they will be 100% behind the technology and very vague on the crossover to OLED so that it does not impact sales.

But at some point, the technical issues will be resolved, and the panel manufacturers will spend billions of dollars converting over to OLED and then within the space of a year or 2 it will be a mainstream product. LCD technology took over from CRTs in large part because of their brightness and wow factor in the showroom and their advantages in weight and size. I have seen OLED and the wow factor of the display is an order of magnitude greater than LCD. Make no mistake, OLED technology WILL eventually be the predominant display technology, the writing is already on the wall.

 

[Snowdog]

There are always people like you and other posters in this thread that will vehemently deny that a new technology will take over, because of the technical hurdles that those technologies initially face.

Except that isn't what we are doing. We are injecting a little reality into the overly rosy predictions.

I have a reasonable expectation that I will have an OLED TV in 2016 +/- a year.

But the reality is that computer monitors are a brutal usage pattern and the only thing I would hazard to predict is that computer monitors will only come after widespread TV usage.

These are just reasonable expectations based on the available information without resorting to wishful thinking.

 

[daveswantek]

There are always people like you and other posters in this thread that will vehemently deny that a new technology will take over, because of the technical hurdles that those technologies initially face.

No one denies that OLED is the next big thing. What I am saying loud and clear, is that it is not here now, or any time next year. Elledan is claiming that OLED is here now and that is just a pipe dream. Samsung and LG are saying 2014 and they are talking about TVs not computer displays.

I think I will just run down to BestBuy and pickup a 36 inch 4k by 2k OLED display. They are under $200 right.

Dave

 

[Inu]

I want to has one now.

 

[Nielo TM]

We need to make an OLED info thread...

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=681125

 

[Nielo TM]

If they can make these dumb phones with amold or oled, why can't they make
a 24" monitor with this technology?
I needed it yesterday at a reasonable price.
I don't want to hear about 2015.
Why perpetuate this crappy ISP technology?

Because it's too expensive to manufacture OLED using the current method of manufacturing. Simply put, the greater the yield from a single substrate, the cheaper the cost (akin to dies, LCDs and PDPs). So if you use 30" substrate, it's cheaper to create small 4-6" OLEDs than a single 30" OLED screen.

Also, manufactures have poured billions into LCD R&D. So they were reluctant to move away from it without maximizing profit. However, thanks to the recent trend in 3D, LCD manufactures are forced to move towards OLED as LCDs can't produce 3D image without cross-talk.

Rumor has it, Samsung will be releasing 30" and 40" 3D OLEDs next year.


PS: OLED and AM-OLEDs are the same. AM refers to the diving mechanism (Active Matrix).

 

[Nielo TM]

When I was at the LG 2010 demo in London, I should have stolen their 15" LOL

http://wfogcq.bay.livefilestore.com...faSdRP3IB11czoilJz/LG 15 Inch OLED.JPG?psid=1

 

[Omegaslast]

Thread makes me chuckle, since it reminds me of all the people in 2006...2007... 2008.. 2009.. that always said "Im waiting for OLED ITS RIGHT AROUND THE CORNER"

canon had their OLED tv at tradeshows so i guess they were given false hope, but still, kuro plasmas have blacks that disappear into the bezel in a dark room (i have one and i cant tell where the border ends or begins on 2.35:1 movies, or during credits, etc).

People were just so ready for OLED even though it was having huge problems getting off the ground, and had HUGE costs associated with it. Cant say i feel sorry for them.

 

[Nielo TM]

No one denies that OLED is the next big thing. What I am saying loud and clear, is that it is not here now, or any time next year. Elledan is claiming that OLED is here now and that is just a pipe dream. Samsung and LG are saying 2014 and they are talking about TVs not computer displays.

I think I will just run down to BestBuy and pickup a 36 inch 4k by 2k OLED display. They are under $200 right.

Dave

Without a doubt, OLED is the next big thing and very likely be the apex of the direct-view displays.

The current OLED models are basic. They are identical to the current display architecture.

In few years, we'll have transparent OLED with stacked RGB sub-pixels, which will eliminate pixel pitch and will enable us to pack millions of pixels in a small space (e.g. 2" screen), which can be implemented into an designer eye-wear and contact lenses, which can be used to provide fully immersive 3D image.

 

[daveswantek]

The current OLED models are basic.

Current OLED computer displays are nonexistent. current OLED TVs might as well be nonexistent at their current price and size.

They are identical to the current display architecture.

As long as size, image retention, and calibration are not a consideration.

Claiming that it is here, just because you want it to be, makes no sense at all. The latest press releases from Samsung and LG say 2014, not next year.

Some of this stuff sounds like hallucinations, are you guys smoking something?

"identical to the current display architecture"

That is the best one I have heard yet.

Dave

 

[daveswantek]

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=681125

Yes; AVS is a great resource. Here is the last post in that thread:

From what I gather re: OLED ETA, next step up from Kuro PQ/performance-wise will be plasma (again) in 2010-11, years and years before OLED makes it to 50" -60".

Dave

 

[steal]

Not true; they may be in the process of setting up production, but I know for a fact that the video editing companys in Burbank are still milking their aging Sony CRTs along with a mix of Plasmas. My neighbor is a video editing support engineer with Level 3 Communications in Burbank. He complains constantly that Sony keeps promising OLED and not delivering it. This is a huge issue, because they have dropped support for $30k + CRTs.




Great! Have you bought one? Why Not?



Yes; they have to. That is the only way it can ever be ready for prime-time. Keep in mind all of this is for the TV markey which is huge and very high profit. Computers not so much.
Show me any evidence of anyone planning any OLED computer display within the next 5 years. As much as everyone wants something better, it is still a long way off.

I would love to be wrong about this, but I have been seeing and hearing the same BS for over 5 years now. I have learned to believe it when I see it and all I have seen so far is toys, like a 13 inch TV for $3k.

Like I said; keep dreaming

Dave

A 1080p display around 20" is an "OLED computer display", as you put it. Do you really think we won't make the jump from 15" to 20-24" in five years?

I suppose five years from now they'll still be producing only 15" displays, or something.

 

[Snowdog]

A 1080p display around 20" is an "OLED computer display", as you put it. Do you really think we won't make the jump from 15" to 20-24" in five years?

I am sure they will crack that size soon. But who is going to pay $2000 for a 20" monitor that gets burn in 6 months?

 

[Nielo TM]

Current OLED computer displays are nonexistent. current OLED TVs might as well be nonexistent at their current price and size.

The fact of the matter is they do exist (from professional monitors to small displays aimed at the elite).

As long as size, image retention, and calibration are not a consideration.

Claiming that it is here, just because you want it to be, makes no sense at all. The latest press releases from Samsung and LG say 2014, not next year.

Some of this stuff sounds like hallucinations, are you guys smoking something?

You're one those who reads what he/she wants to and completely misunderstand the post

"identical to the current display architecture"

That is the best one I have heard yet.

Dave

Again, you failed to understand it

The current AM-LED system are similar to AM-LCD with RGB pixels embedded in strip format.

 

[Nielo TM]

Yes; AVS is a great resource. Here is the last post in that thread:



Dave

You obviously haven't read the whole thread or know the situation facing manufactures regarding 3D.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=18849860&postcount=1525


Due to the high pixel response and hold time of VA based LCDs, it's not possible to create clean S3D image. Samsung have tried various methods (e.g. dual-scanning, fine-tuning OD, BFI etc.) but thus far, such methodologies only reduced the appearance of cross-talk, which is still far from tolerance levels or to levels comparable to DLP/LCoS and PDP (Panasonic VT).


If manufactures want to expand the 3D sector, they have to eliminate cross-talk completely as it causes eye fatigue and discomfort. So OLED is the solution as hold-time can be reduced via BFI and doesn't suffer from prolonged pixel lag. OLED is also the answer to affordable auto-stereoscopic displays with multiple view points.

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/samsung-42-oled-tv-20100602718.htm


PS: In terms of 2D performance, LCD is closing in on OLED and PDP.

 

[Snowdog]

Current OLED computer displays are nonexistent. current OLED TVs might as well be nonexistent at their current price and size.

The fact of the matter is they do exist (from professional monitors to small displays aimed at the elite).

You failed to get Daves distinction: "COMPUTER" displays.

What exists are ridiculously expensive mini TVs and Video monitors in 15" and under class and that is all. And even these are so low volume it is more publicity stunt than product, just like the Sony 11" TV that was eventually discontinued with no replacement.

As far as 3D, yes OLED will do it better than LCD, as will Plasma. The 3d gimmick won't be necessary to sell OLED and OLED won't be necessary to sell 3D to those that want it.

We are mainly arguing minutia. OLED is certainly coming. It is just the realists here recongnizing it will be a long time yet before they have real affordable consumer TVs in desirable sizes (40+ inches) and even longer before the build OLEDs for the harsh usage pattern of COMPUTER monitors.

Especially on computer monitors, don't hold your breath. I figure my current monitor will die (it has about 3 years of warranty left) and I will be several years into my next LCD before there is a reasonable OLED computer monitor available.

 

[Nielo TM]

It's going to a while before we start seeing practical OLED PC monitors. I think we all universally agree on that.

Hopefully someone will find a way to print OLED instead of the current expensive process.


PS: I wasn't aware this thread is exclusive to OLED monitors.

 

[daveswantek]

It's going to a while before we start seeing practical OLED PC monitors. I think we all universally agree on that.

Hopefully someone will find a way to print OLED instead of the current expensive process.

This happened reciently. I didn't save the link, and I do not rember the Company. It was covered on Daily-Tech a couple of months ago. This is a big step forward, but it is only in the lab so far.

PS: I wasn't aware this thread is exclusive to OLED monitors.

The OP said "24" Monitor"; I take that to mean computer display, and I clearly drew this distention in my replies. Small TVs are here now at a very high price, computer monitors, not so much.

We all want it to happen, but like it or not OLED development is moving slowely. With all of the money that has gone into the developent process, we will probubly be looking at high prices for years after they do come to market.

I have been watching this industry for a long time, so I have learned to have more realistic expectations.

Dave

 

[Nielo TM]

I am aware of the company in question. The race for commercially viable printable OLED is highly competitive with few big names (including Universities) currently in the process of developing such technology.

However, the push for 3D will also mean push for OLED. But manufacturing OLEDs using traditional process is very expensive (hence the price tag). However, that will change once printable OLED is perfected.

It will also save millions (perhaps billions) in efficiency savings and taxes as manufacturing LCDs is quite wasteful and damages the environment.

 

[Elledan]

I am sure they will crack that size soon. But who is going to pay $2000 for a 20" monitor that gets burn in 6 months?

[quotation needed]

 

[daveswantek]

[quotation needed]

It's covered in the AVS link that Nielo TM posted:http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=681125

Dave

 

[Joe42]

Not everybody have HDTV's yet even.

 

[Elledan]

It's covered in the AVS link that Nielo TM posted:http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=681125

Dave

I browsed through that topic and it seems to be completely positive about OLED in every regard. Maybe you can point me to the part you're referring to?

 

[Nielo TM]

Scientists have discovered several methods to extend OLED lifespan beyond LCD and PDP. However, translating that into a production lines is challenging.

But Samsung seems keen on producing standard AM-OLEDs with 60,000 hours by next year.

 

[Snowdog]

Scientists have discovered several methods to extend OLED lifespan beyond LCD and PDP. However, translating that into a production lines is challenging.

But Samsung seems keen on producing standard AM-OLEDs with 60,000 hours by next year.

Unfortunately you have to watch the games they play with their estimates. Some of the biggest claims come from dupont, but when they reveal more details you realize we still have a way to go:

DuPont Displays Surpasses Million Hour Milestone for Lifetime of New OLED Material

Historically, performance of blue light-emitting materials has been the most challenging, however, DuPont Gen 3 solution blue materials are demonstrating world-class performance. One of the Gen 3 blue materials has color coordinates of (0.14, 0.12), a current efficiency of 6.0 cd/A, and a lifetime of 38,000 hours from 1000 cd/m2, which is one of the longest blue OLED material lifetimes publicly reported. A second material has been developed with exceptionally deep blue color coordinates of (0.14, 0.08), a current efficiency of 3.9 cd/A, and a lifetime of nearly 7,000 hours. Due to its deep blue color, the lifetime of this material at the luminance required for a 200 cd/m2 display is calculated to be approximately 41,000 hours.

Now that first blue material with a 38000 life is great. Problem is it really isn't that blue, it is way off sRGB/BT.709 blue specs. It really is not an acceptable blue.

The second blue purported as "deep blue" isn't that deep, it is actually just barely adequate for sRGB/BT.709 and it lasts "nearly" 7000 hours.

Note the headline "Million hours" but when we get back to usable blue, we are back down to a mere 7000 hours. From the under 7000 hour life, they are estimating that they can get eek out 41000 display hours. This is base on assumptions about the blue content of average video. If Samsung 60000 hour claims is based on similar assumptions, it may still only signal a 10000 hour blue.

This is why it can work for TV but would be crushed by computer usage. There is lots of blue in my icons, my interface and my sky blue wallpaper, it would quickly eat an OLED screen.

 

[Snowdog]

[quotation needed]

On the pricing, the price I posit is actually much cheaper than anything expected soon. I don't expect this is what you disagree with.

On 6month burn in( I suspect this is what you disagree with as you are largely in denial about burn in):

You first need to recognize that a 40000 hour TV claim only translates to under 7000 hours of blue OLED life.

A typical computer monitor can easily see 8hours/day with lots of static blue/white elements.

6months = 183days *8 hours = 1464 hours.

1464/7000 = ~20% life used up.

20% wear on select areas of the screen will definitely show up as burn in.

All OLED TVs will continue to have giant warnings about burn in and will not cover warranty claims related to burn in.

So if you drop ridiculous dollars on the first 20" OLED TV and use it as a monitor, it is very likely you will burn in within 6 months and you will be SOL.

 

[steal]

You know, I really have to question these burn-in issues people are suggesting are such an issue with OLED displays. I've had a HTC Droid Incredible for about two months now, with an AMOLED display, and I've experienced nothing of the sort.

Now, I'm certainly not staring at a static image for 8+ hours a day, but at the same time, I have played games with static HUDs, GUIs, health bars, or onscreen controls for 2-3 hours at a time without a break, and I've seen no image retention or burn-in whatsoever.

So, what's it take for real pixel burn-in on an OLED display? Has anyone even demonstrated burn-in on any of these devices? From my experiences, honestly, it seems like all of this is just a bunch of FUD until proven otherwise.

I also own a brand new plasma (Panasonic 50G25) and image retention is VERY prevalent on this display, and seems to pop up even after a half hour or so of a static image being displayed on the screen. Even though the IR is never permanent, I've never seen anything of this sort on the AMOLED display on my Incredible, so to me, it seems that even the most modern PDP's are much, much worse in terms of IR/burn-in than AMOLED is.

I should also add that the Nexus One has been out for around six months now and I've never seen any reports of burn-in on that device either. The Droid Inc and Desire also use AMOLED displays, and Samsung is gearing up to take a very large portion of the smartphone market with their Galaxy S line, which uses their S-AMOLED displays, and is being sold on hundreds of different carriers around the world, including every major carrier in the United States.

If burn-in is such a big problem for these types of displays, then why haven't we heard anything about it, or seen any warnings about it? I'm positive that may people have used these devices for many things that may place a bright, long-term static image on the displays, perhaps while using the built-in Google GPS Navigation on a long trip, gaming with a hud/status bar, or simply having the Android status bar up on their display for a long period of time.

So, again, why haven't we heard about it?

 

[Snowdog]

You know, I really have to question these burn-in issues people are suggesting are such an issue with OLED displays. I've had a HTC Droid Incredible for about two months now, with an AMOLED display, and I've experienced nothing of the sort.

First you have to realize Plasma suffers from two things:
1: Short term image retention, caused by charge buildup in cell walls.
This has nothing to do with BURN IN and is unique to plasma and it happens in hours, it can also be reversed quickly.

2: Phosphor burn in through the same mecahnism as CRT. But this takes thousands of hours for plasma, but charge based IR constantly reminds people to take it easy on their plasmas, so people seldom get real burn in on their plamas. Phosphor essentially wear equally among the color and their 60 000 hour lifetime is essentially the same for each color and thus it is TEN times more resistant to burn in than an OLED.

OLED does not have a short term image retention issue. Thus you wont see IR until it is real Burn In and too late, but it is much more susceptible to real burn in. But you will never see burn in as the result of a marathon gaming session.

Why you don't see burn in complaints yet for OLED Phones/PMPs. Because screen time is an order of magnitude lower on these devices compared to a working computer monitor. Make a phone call, 30 seconds into the call take a glance at the screen, chances are it is dimmed out significantly or completely out. Or if you use it as an MP3 player it likely does the same before the first song is finished. On average a PMP/Phone will see less screen time in a week than computer monitor does in a day.

So the burn in like I am suggesting you would see after 6 months on a heavily used OLED computer monitor would typically take 3-5 years on a Phone/PMP, after which point no one will care.