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Nvidia NV 50 canned

N

Netrat33

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Aug 6, 2004
Messages
4,894
http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=20034

WE ARE told that Nvidia's next gen chip NV50 has been canned as well as the NV48 chip we reported on earlier in the week. I guess both were not fitting well into Nvidia's picture.
We don’t have any idea as yet what lead to such a decision, but Nvidia does apparently think it's now time to make its next breakthrough chip.

All we know is that Nvidia made a huge u-turn or a right turn in its roadmap as Intel describes it, and we don’t yet know where that leads.

We also know that Nvidia is very dedicated to win the graphic fight and to move away from the deadly embrace with ATI. In the current generation, it's not important what you get as both Nvidia and ATI cards are performing almost identically.

Nvidia still strongly believes that SLI is something that will become very important in the future.
 
lol scrapping a next-gen chip already? it must have been flawed or something....maybe it will feature something amazing...or not
 
FX5600/5800 Part II

At least this time it didn't make it to market.
 
Don't be too sad. When a graphics company scraps a chip's development, it's because they are looking to leap-frog to their next chip.

This is a move made because nvidia thinks the NV48 and NV50's features and performance wouldn't be enough to insure the top spot against ATI. This most likely means they will focus all of their attention on the NV60 (or whatever is next in line), because they think its features and performance will give them the definitive victory.

The main thing this should tell us, is that the NV48 and NV50 didn't bring a big-time performance improvment beyond the current generation. So, IF this rumor is true (big IF), it is actually a good thing. It means they will be pushing the performance even higher on their next product line. We will see in time how it all shakes out of course.
 
this is a good thing.. we wont have to upgrade for a while and nividia will try to bring something new to the table that isnt just an update over the past cards
 
Netrat33 said:
Yea i know I know! For some reason I didn't see it! My bad!
Click to expand...
Plagiarist!!! Plagiarist!!! :eek:


You're gonna be hearing from my lawyer buddy!! ;)
 
This makes me wonder what ATI have planned for this Spring ? Must be a monster to scare off nVidia ? I have heard that the R520 will be a 512mb, with almost 300million trans :eek:
 
Yeah dual core SLI cards with 512 mb ram

Instead of dual sli cards they will have " dual core sli cards " 2 cards = 4 gpu :eek:
 
Yeah, Nvidia developing (or licensing from AMD) some kind of HTT technology and going balls out on the multi-GPU per card and developing a 4 bridge SLI connector for NV60.

The term would be then "Nuking ATI out of the water."
 
Oh well, I guess there doing this so everyone will go SLI... instead of waiting for NVs next top card. :p
 
coz said:
Plagiarist!!! Plagiarist!!! :eek:


You're gonna be hearing from my lawyer buddy!! ;)
Click to expand...

WOOHOO! one for Plagiarism! ;) Made it on the front page

*snicker* ;)
 
the INQ, isn't ALWAYS correct. THEY MIGHT BE SCRAPPING IT!!!

They have a decent record of getting inside information, but it DOESNT ALWAYS pan out to be exactly correct.

Possibilities:

#1 - NV50 is on track and could be completely wrong information

#2 - maybe NV50 is being modified to a new version of it... say NV51.

#3 - NV50 is being scrapped for some totally new architecture, b/c they've change their minds (like the Inq says)

I THINK Nvidia's eyes are on Intel's integrated graphics mobo business. Do you know how many mobo chips that is compared to their current nForce business. Its a HUGE potential market.

So they may be modifying their plans to allow resources to be dedicated to Intel chipset business.
 
I think Nvidia realized that with SLI you don't necessarily need to have refreshes of the same technology to confuse customers like ATI is doing with their current X850/X800 series that don't imrprove upon performance at all, only in clock ratings and availability. I doubt ATI has anything planned for release by next spring as they can't even release their current technology now. They might have something announced, but we all know how that goes....

As for Nvidia, I'm glad that they aren't releasing an NV50 or NV48 as it lessens the strain on purchasing decisions for customers. The X850 offers nothing new in terms of raw performance and I doubt the NV48 or NV50 will either. I think Nvidia is indeed leap-frogging to the next generation card and I think its awesome they are devoting their efforts to that and SLI rather than wasting their time with another rehash like ATI is doing. I would have much preferred that ATI just keep their existing line and instead make it more available. But hey, whatever they need to do to keep up with Nvidia right now....
 
i know ati's performance wasn't anything to write home about in the past but their dual GPU idea had been around just as voodoo2's SLI had come around with rage maxx. so multicore has been around for quite a while.
 
All things considered, I'm thinking that the current top-of-the-line of cards are more than adequate for the best games available today. This may be a pretty unusual time in that regard. Especially noting that the 6800/X800 cards really were a quantum leap forward, I'm not expecting another quantum leap anytime soon.

Honestly, I'm not even sure how long it will be before the next game engine comes out and kicks everything up another notch (Sorry, I really don't watch the Food Network, I promise.) I know we'll be getting more titles on Source and the D3 engine, but I don't know if any of those titles will need more hutzpah. Battlefield 2 (not the engine alone)? The next Unreal Engine? Far Cry's inevitable sequel? Duke Vapor? S.T.A.L.K.E.R.: shadows of the ever-changing sub-title? Perhaps one or two of these will be another revolution, but probably not from what I've seen so far.

It looks on all fronts like we have made a pretty steep climb these past two years, and that IMO we have reached a plateau in terms of hardware and software that will likely hold for a good long time. Although I'm sure benchmarks and FRAPS scores/timedemos will still climb slowly and surely, in the big scheme of things, I don't see the NV50 launch or cancellation as anything more than a small bump or pot hole in the road ahead depending upon which way it goes.
 
if they are holding off on the nv 50 mabe nailing its cause of sli it brings at least another cycle or two to there top end gfx chips soo they dont need to rush the next part out the door soo quickly sli 6800's ultras are the top end till ati or another company can match or beat that sli setup nv has the fastest gfx solution right now but its definately not the cheepest at $1000+ :eek: for now ati has the single card performance crown (here comes a flame war :rolleyes: )now let us not forget teh longhorn is comming and will require p.s. v4.0 to run atleast the last time i checked oh joy for the gfx war :rolleyes: as for nv's chipset business i simply love the fact that amd's love child hyper transport is going to be used on the intel chipset muuuaaah
 
Maybe it's because they saw the x850's and decided that they don't need a refresher card, that might be it or a factor of why. That's just my guess anyways.
 
One thing for sure this will keep some of the Current Geforce 6800 Owners happy knowing they have top of the line cards. :eek:
 
so are the spring-new technology and fall-refresh seasons gone? i mean we won't have "6900 gt" right? though that would be very kewl! :p ;) :D.

hl1 came out in '98, hl2 '04, hl3 should be 2010. as for id's next engine it'll only be a better version of doom, quake1-3, d3 technology. this is denoted by the fact that even voodoo2 can run doom3. id's basically building on top of what they already have step by step. thus the next graphics engine will only be another reiteration of d3's awesome lighting with (crosses fingers) havok physics engine? who knows. id has a lot of competition now from the source engine (which ironically came from hl1, which came from a highly modified version of q1 engine). they're also in competition with UT3 engine, far cry's engine, open source engines, lith engine, etc. the market is much more crowded than before!
 
SulSeeker said:
Yeah, Nvidia developing (or licensing from AMD) some kind of HTT technology and going balls out on the multi-GPU per card and developing a 4 bridge SLI connector for NV60.

The term would be then "Nuking ATI out of the water."
Click to expand...

I can't imagine how expensive such a setup would be. More like nuking the mainstream out the water.
 
i would personally be very, very happy if nVidia actually was saying "hey, let's not dive into the market right now, let's just work on making something really really good and have it available in like a year or two"

I mean, the situation right now is ludicrous. Example:
Go ask Joe sixpack "What's better? A pro or a platinum?"
He'll look at you and say "What are you smoking? One plays golf and the other belongs on an engagement ring"
Ask Bud at the local watering hole "What's better? An XT, an SE or an Ultra?"
Give the poor man a beer for confusing him so badly

I mean, if one company is (like actually is) deciding to back down a step and come up with something well thought out and rational, all the more power to them. I'd love them for it. Who knows, maybe (gasp) our next batch of video card hardware will have sequential numberings that relate to performance without silly suffixes! And if they're doing that, maybe they'll come up with other things, like:
Trying to add features beyond frame rates to a card
Trying to stave off obsolesence for a card (maybe adding RAM to a video card, just like a PC?)
Trying to drop power/heat requirements on the cards
Trying to reduce the size of the cards

I mean, just imagine the sort of paradise we'd be living in. We'd have cards with logical performance metrics, with differing feature sets and finally only the real lamers would say things like "THERE'S A 5% PERFORMANCE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THESE TWO CARDS!1!!!!!! OMFG XXX PWNZ YYY"

Actually, it would really be great if XGI could get its act together enough to compete in the midrange along with ATi and nVidia. Because, as the Americans have demonstrated, a system with just two choices isn't really that great a choice.

*sigh* But alas, that is only a glimmer of hope the horizon. I'm a n00b or a lamer because I don't own card xxx. I'm retarded because I actually bought yyy. I have been "pwned" because your system beat mine by 3fps (or around ~2%) How I wish the graphics card market would change so we could all mature a little.
 
Ballz2TheWallz said:
haha finally revenge for the 9700-9800 series bwhahaha
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lol.. thats funny.. cuz its not true..
nuke ati out of the water.. hell no, ati wont let that happen, they're serious now.
I dont think you would want ati to be nuked either.. prices wars= win
 
drizzt81 said:
yes, it's called Voodoo 6000 ;) 4 GFX cores on one card...
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And an independant 500W power supply just for the video card!!! LOL. Not to far from the truth really haha.

rcolbert said:
Honestly, I'm not even sure how long it will be before the next game engine comes out and kicks everything up another notch
Click to expand...

Stated at the E3 preview for the UT3 engine, they said that the only card that would run the engine at somewhat decent framerates was the GeForce 6800 Ultra. So when that does in fact hit the market the line of video cards that are out now won't cut it for playable framerates.
 
Gouda said:
And an independant 500W power supply just for the video card!!! LOL. Not to far from the truth really haha.



Stated at the E3 preview for the UT3 engine, they said that the only card that would run the engine at somewhat decent framerates was the GeForce 6800 Ultra. So when that does in fact hit the market the line of video cards that are out now won't cut it for playable framerates.
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Not to meantion the board wil need like 30 molex connectors.
SLI is not the answer...
 
Video cards seem to be getting bigger and bigger is size these days, I wonder how big the next video card will look like from nvidia. When are they going to start making video cards with nano technology...
 
Moloch said:
lol.. thats funny.. cuz its not true..
nuke ati out of the water.. hell no, ati wont let that happen, they're serious now.
I dont think you would want ati to be nuked either.. prices wars= win
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lol actually yes ati is resorting to brute force this means they need a new architecture and that takes hella long to do so yes i belive they should be nuked out of the water
 
As much power GPU's consume these days, not to mention the elaborate cooling solutions to deal with the heat they put out, I think they need to take a break and ditch the 6 month product cycle. We have more than enough graphical horsepower to play games at 1024x768, even 1280x1024 resolution with the details cranked. I personally think they need to go back to a 1 year product cycle for the high end, and maybe a 6 month refresh for the mid to value segments. And they need to get rid of the confusing names!! That goes for nVidia as well. People gripe about ATI's Platinum Edition, yet I don't hear anything about nVidias Ultra Extreme Edition despite the fact that it's almost as rare. What's up with that?

Besides, it's probably more cost effective to skip a refresh and focus on the next gen part anyway. Just take the minor speed bump in ATi's latest parts. Nothing to get excited about, and no doubt it cost ATi money they could have put towards their next gen part.

I think the big 2 really need to begin focusing more on efficiency, rather than a brute force approach. Take AMD versus Intel for a great example. AMD is clobbering Intel in many benchmarks with far lower power consumption, and greater efficiency from a CPU running at a full 1Ghz slower. I would be embarrased if I were Intel and had a competitor beating me with a CPU running at lower clockspeeds.

I would venture a guess that the big 2 may be looking at 24-32 pipes for their next gen cards. No doubt they are designing such cards, whether they are released as next gen or not remains to be seen, but I bet they'll be here before long.

Then there's the issue of price. These high end GPU's are selling for some extreme prices. Even the 6800 Ultra's, and the extremely (no pun intended) hard to find Extreme Ed are selling for ridiculously high prices right along with ATi's latest. The only two cards that ATi should have released were the X800, and the X800XL. The others were released, in my opinion, to close the performance gap between nvidia's GPU's and their own in certain applications. If ATi were smart, they'd vastly improve the OpenGL performance of their cards with their next product release.

ATi blew nVidia out of the water with the release of the 9700 Pro. This time around nVidia has the overall best performing card for the price with the 6800GT. Who knows who will have the most desirable product next time. I relaly don't care who has the absolute best performing card. I'm interested in the card that gives me the best bang for my buck without breaking the bank. If it renders a game at 1024 resolution with 4xaa and 8-16 aniso, I'm thrilled. My next monitor will be runnign at 1280 resolution, so my next GPU purchase should be able to handle 1280 at 4xaa and 8-16 aniso.
 
Ballz2TheWallz said:
lol actually yes ati is resorting to brute force this means they need a new architecture and that takes hella long to do so yes i belive they should be nuked out of the water
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How are they using brute force?
Because they had an extremly good architecture from the last product, unlike nvidia, so they they didn't need to make a whole new card?
You're funny, apparently their "brute force" is working very well for them- benchmarks++
Only a !!!!!! would believe such silly things, ati is here to stay aslong as nvidia is making GPUs!
 
Yeah, maybe Nvidia just realized NV50 would be a waste of time, development effort, and money.. Like ATI should have done with the, "hey look were pushing the limits of overclocking", X850..or maybe they should have just skipped X800 (either way their current strategy and market presence makes no sense).
Nvidia probably forsees the current chip easily carrying them into late 2005.

Hell, with the option of SLI, this current generation could go on for a long time. For example, someone buys a single 6800GT PCIe right now. Lets say he decides to upgrade to an SLI capable PCIe motherboard in May 2005. So he gets his new upgrade and buys another 6800GT for SLI (assuming the two are compatible, etc etc). Nvidia didnt have to put out anything new, he got an instant upgrade, and they sold 2 of the same card to the same person within a 9 month period. Its a win-win situation.
Even better is the same as above, except take me with my current 6800GT AGP upgrading to SLI next year. 3 cards, 9 months, bigger winner.
 
Ballz2TheWallz said:
lol actually yes ati is resorting to brute force this means they need a new architecture and that takes hella long to do so yes i belive they should be nuked out of the water
Click to expand...

The NV40 didn't take that long, so I don't know where you're getting that. And also nobody is really going to be able to guess why it was canned if it actually was, you're not going to essentially waste hundreds of millions of dollars in spent R&D and money they could have gotten for some of the dumb simple answers people are presenting
 
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