New laptop is broken. Do I return (for ~$500 "restock fee") or go tech support?

[meyerkev]

So my new P170HM (see sig) hangs like mad. It hangs within 20 minutes of turning on the device 90% of the time, and the only way to unhang it within 5 minutes is to hard reboot the device.

So I have 2 choices:

1) Return it for a ~$500 restock fee plus shipping (they say it's functional because it powers on and boots the OS most of the time), but not bother with tech support and a broken laptop, and buy a different similarly specced laptop elsewhere (non-Clevo, likely M17x r3).
2) Deal with tech support, but if they can't help me, I'm stuck with the (broken) laptop, as no returns are allowed after 30 days.

At the moment, I'm leaning towards biting the bullet, eating the fee, and getting an M17X R3, and then sticking in a random ~120 GB SSD, and some new RAM. I'll still break even (well, a couple hundred out of pocket), and that way I'm not stuck in tech support hell like I was with my MBP for the past three months, and I get a (having played with some friends' Alienwares) better laptop.

What do you guys think?

/And yes, I tried all the known fixes for Vertex 3 hangs. It still hangs(though less often) even after I uninstalled Intel SRT, did the registry fixes, and set AHCI and hotswapping.
//Also, does M17x r3 now have SATA III support? Google search throws up 1/3 yes, 1/3 no, and 1/3 maybe.

 

[CYKOTIKTEK]

It would be a cold day in hell i would pay a restocking fee for something that didn't work right in the first place. Where did you buy it from? There has to be someone there that you can talk to about it being at least partially DOA and you want a refund

 

[nobody_here]

" It hangs within 20 minutes of turning on the device 90% of the time, and the only way to unhang it within 5 minutes is to hard reboot the device. "

"they say it's functional because it powers on and boots the OS most of the time"

conflicting stories

 

[scaarbelly]

You are out of your mind if you pay a $500 restocking fee. Get a full refund or send it back for an rma.

 

[aaronearles]

It would be a cold day in hell i would pay a restocking fee for something that didn't work right in the first place. Where did you buy it from? There has to be someone there that you can talk to about it being at least partially DOA and you want a refund

This. Can you charge back the credit card and then take it in?

 

[Sly]

If it's a defective item, i don't think a restocking fee applies since that one goes straight back to the factory and since it's still within the replacement period, you should have gotten a new unit.

 

[jalaj]

Did you run any hardware diagnostics tests? Also try reinstalling the OS or use a different OS to see if you still get the same results. Are you running at stock factory settings? Like no overclocks or voltage tweaks.

You shouldn't be paying for restocking fees on a defective device from the vendor. Contact your credit card company if the vendor isn't budging.

 

[meyerkev]

" It hangs within 20 minutes of turning on the device 90% of the time, and the only way to unhang it within 5 minutes is to hard reboot the device. "

"they say it's functional because it powers on and boots the OS most of the time"

conflicting stories

It hangs randomly. It just hangs early and often, usually within ~20 minutes of turning the device on, but after the OS turns on (which is their definition of functional). That's how I've been able to make all the various tweaks. Turn on, let it boot, sign in, make tweaks, HANG, restart. HANG, swear randomly at screen

(slightly modifying original post
1) Did you run any hardware diagnostics tests?
2) Also try reinstalling the OS or use a different OS to see if you still get the same results.
3) Are you running at stock factory settings? Like no overclocks or voltage tweaks.

You shouldn't be paying for restocking fees on a defective device from the vendor.
4) Contact your credit card company if the vendor isn't budging.

1) I haven't run any diagnostic tests yet other than HDTune (all green), but it's relatively obvious that it's the SSD hanging. (2 downloads, 1 to SSD, 1 to HDD. SSD one stopped dead, HDD one kept right on trucking overnight without the hang letting up). Which ones would you recommend?
2) 2nd fresh install of Win7 Pro (accidentally used the 32 bit cd the first time around). Other than confirming it booted, never used the stock install.
3) Stock hardware settings. I was going to try to OC the 6970m , but never got around to it.
4) Debit card.



So the OEM tech support people are saying "Wait for OCZ's new firmware." Just because of the 30 day limit, I'm a bit wary of waiting any more than I have to. Does anyone know if it's likely to fix all the OCZ woes?

/Mind you, it's an awesome computer. It handled every single M2:TW battle I threw at it (installed to the HDD, so it's not doing much I/O to the SSD, so that one actually made it 3 hours), and the fingerprint reader is genius. (It's always the little things, isn't it.)

 

[msemcee]

You are out of your mind if you pay a $500 restocking fee. Get a full refund or send it back for an rma.

Pretty much. That's an incredible charge to pay for something that was fubar to begin with.

 

[meyerkev]

Pretty much. That's an incredible charge to pay for something that was fubar to begin with.

Yes, but I know exactly what's gonna happen. They're gonna point to the contract, and ask for their 15%. They will then say that because it successfully boots into Windows that the computer is functional (already happened). They will then point out that their Tech Support can handle it. I will spend lots of money (and time) shipping it there, and maybe getting it fixed, and maybe not. (It sounds like there's nothing they can do about it as it's a Vertex 3 problem). They will also say to wait for the OCZ firmware update, and I will.

Maybe it will help. Maybe it won't. Meanwhile, the 30 day cutoff will pass, and I will be stuck with my busted computer if nothing helps it. So screw it. I pay the fee and $150 in shipping (23 pounds plus insurance from WA), and buy a different computer. At the moment, I'm leaning M17x, as once I put in some new RAM and a (likely Intel) working SSD, it's basically the same computer for $300 cheaper with a better screen, a better (and backlit) keyboard, and better battery life.

/Really wish Anand had done his M17x review before I bought my P170HM.

 

[Jasonx82]

Did it start hanging right out of the box? Or did you do any upgrades to it?

 

[meyerkev]

Did it start hanging right out of the box? Or did you do any upgrades to it?

Put on a fresh copy of Win7 first thing, and then installed everything off the Drivers/Utilities CD it came with, along with some necessary programs (Chrome, MSE). It first hung about 80% of the way through the driver CD. (But that might be due to restarting every 2 minutes after I installed a new driver.)

Also, the Hitachi HDD is new, but it's working just fine (as evidenced by my grabbing and installing 40 GB of Steam games onto it during an overnight hang. No clue how or why that worked). I can take it out, but I'm reasonably certain it's not the problem.

 

[DanNeely]

This. Can you charge back the credit card and then take it in?

Agreed. When the CC company tells them they can either make good on their product or eat a $3300 chargeback and not have the busted hardware to try and repair and resell, a $0 restocking fee RMA should be coming. Even if it doesn't, the CC companies warranty means you still get your money back. And if the company gets too many charge backs their bank will cancel their merchant account and they won't be able to charge CCs at all.

 

[MrCrispy]

And for good measure, let them know you'll be contacting the BBB as well as other websites/papers. Hell you could even file a suit in small claims court and dispute their definition of functional. Its standard practice for any boutique builder for the machine to pass a burn-in test. If it doesn't its defective, no questions asked - that's the kind of standard you should hold them to.

 

[Blazestorm]

Is it a Sager or Clevo? Because Sager has a 30 day money-back deal, you can return it for any reason and get a full refund minus shipping fees.

 

[meyerkev]

Agreed. When the CC company tells them they can either make good on their product or eat a $3300 chargeback and not have the busted hardware to try and repair and resell, a $0 restocking fee RMA should be coming. Even if it doesn't, the CC companies warranty means you still get your money back. And if the company gets too many charge backs their bank will cancel their merchant account and they won't be able to charge CCs at all.

Debit card. I'm out of luck.

And for good measure, let them know you'll be contacting the BBB as well as other websites/papers. Hell you could even file a suit in small claims court and dispute their definition of functional. Its standard practice for any boutique builder for the machine to pass a burn-in test. If it doesn't its defective, no questions asked - that's the kind of standard you should hold them to.

That's the thing though. It passed the burn-in test just fine and I've got a nice piece of paper saying so with various benchmark scores. (Is a Furmark score of 2361 good or bad?) I have no idea why it's hanging now. I installed a new OS (twice), but the only programs I had on there beyond the stock OS were the drivers/utilities they gave me, Chrome, and MSE when it hung for the first time.

Is it a Sager or Clevo? Because Sager has a 30 day money-back deal, you can return it for any reason and get a full refund minus shipping fees.

Clevo through Ava-Direct. I bought it ~May 15th, and it showed up last Saturday.

So I've been in contact with them, and I basically said "If you turn off the countdown clock (30 day return limit) for returns, you get one chance at tech support (and since it sounds like an OCZ problem, and not a them problem, I don't think they can do anything). If it doesn't work or you don't turn off the countdown clock, I return it, and we can argue over the fee then."

/It sounds like this isn't their fault, it's just an OCZ SSD issue that everyone's having. Am I annoyed that the very expensive computer that I bought from them doesn't work. Yes. Am I annoyed that the extra money I spent buying all the parts (except the second HDD) through them to avoid issues like this was wasted? Yes. Am I curious as to why this wasn't caught (or why their OS install didn't have any problems)? Yes. Is it their fault entirely? No.

 

[MrCrispy]

Even if its just the ssd they sourced it for you, and you should ask them for a replacement within the laptop's warranty. If I buy a Dell and the ram is bad, Dell doesn't ask me to contact e.g. Crucial.

That is pretty terrible customer service for an $$$ purchase.

 

[meyerkev]

Eh, fark it. I'll just return it and not bother with the ongoing tech support issues (and if I ever go Clevo again, I'll do it through Sager). If it's busted now, it'll be busted later (as my MBP's 3rd, going on 4th MB along with several hundred in related repairs will testify), and I just don't want to deal with it. Does it suck? Oh yes.

Any reccs as to a similarly specced laptop (non-Clevo)? I'm leaning M17x r3 after Anand's review (5 hours of idle battery!! My MBP doesn't get that), and if no one has any horror stories, I'll buy it once my Clevo is returned. (Thought I've heard it's not 6 GB/s SATA. Truth or lies?)

 

[Blazestorm]

I believe my Sager 8130 came with 6GB/s Sata, cause I stuck a C300 128gb in there and it performed at the SATA 3.0 specs they listed.

I also didn't have any freezing issues even though I heard a lot of people were having issues with it, it runs perfect for me and boots super fast.

I've been really happy with the Sager 8130 so far at least..

 

[xBanzai89]

Eh, fark it. I'll just return it and not bother with the ongoing tech support issues (and if I ever go Clevo again, I'll do it through Sager). If it's busted now, it'll be busted later (as my MBP's 3rd, going on 4th MB along with several hundred in related repairs will testify), and I just don't want to deal with it. Does it suck? Oh yes.

Any reccs as to a similarly specced laptop (non-Clevo)? I'm leaning M17x r3 after Anand's review (5 hours of idle battery!! My MBP doesn't get that), and if no one has any horror stories, I'll buy it once my Clevo is returned. (Thought I've heard it's not 6 GB/s SATA. Truth or lies?)

I've done charge backs through my debit card. Get a hold of your bank and see what they say. At the time I had a small local bank, so even they do it.

I would be calling them constantly till I get someone who would solve my issue as well. $500 restocking fee is total BS on something that isn't working properly. They put that OCZ SSD in there, so it is part of their product they sold you.