New HL2 E3 Bink Video

Dynamic realistic lighting is great and all, but I think that good textures are the most important graphical part of a game. I think the Max Payne games looked as good as games like Far Cry and Doom III even with older technology, becuase the photo textures were awesome.

I think the Doom III engine (in it's current form) is perfect for dark confined areas, but wouldn't work well for well lit open areas. The Crytech engine did a wonderful job of a tropical island, but was lacking for interiors. The HL2 engine looks perfect for an urban setting. I don't think any of these games would look better with each other's engines, because each engine has strong points and weak points that are customized for the type of game.
 
and then theres the new Unreal technology, which is taking a big dump on everything from a great height.

looks far better than D3 and HL2.

pez
 
Yes, and that dump won't be coming for another 2-3 years. No offense but I'll take 2 kickass game engines right now over a better (and yes it is going to be better than d3 and hl2), currently nonexistant one.
 
Ok, we're at a turning point in rendering history.

Do you guys really want each game "engine" to keep slowly bumping up texture resolutions and sizes, and adding a few more polygon counts here or there? along with a few new "tricks" to show off?


Umm, no.

The point doom3 is at right now is quite essentially a "turning point"

I will take properly rendered lighting and lower res textures over fantastic textures on 80% of my games. Correct lighting will prove to me that a rendered scene is "realistic" far before large textures will.

This turning point we are at is simple.

Think of it as starting all over. Shitty textures, and very little polygons. But now, we are starting over with fully dynamic lighting. So each iteration, things will slowly get better and better. But only with the unified lighting system, the "better" and "realistic" will come at an exponential rate.

Personally, i'm kinda dissapointed id didn't release their ultra mode as much much higher polygon models, and much higher res textures.

But face it, that many layers on that many high res textures whoops the shit out of any system right now. And this game, while appearing to be made only for high end systems, scales great.

So now we're back where we started.

Waiting for the next game to up the polygon count a little, and the texture resolutions up as well. Only now with the lighting already in place, oh my things will get mighty interesting.



Oh, BTW. You guys seem to think the doom3 engine was written for small hallways and corridors only. Why is that? This isn't true, it was just the nature of the game for doom3 and it's style of gameplay. Also, we really don't have the hardware to address these large scale environment-type playing fields with realtime lighting.

They even said themselves that they had to watch which lights would come from where, because certain hot spots could really slow things down.

I can't wait for designers to start really pushing this engine, because I think we all can agree that id defintely held back.
 
Erm, don't compare CS to Doom3. From what I saw, they didn't put the same graphical effort into it. No, this isn't an insult, CS is about the gameplay, not the pretty textures, and they probably want it to run on more low end systems anyway. With single player, you have to sell based on it looks pretty, has great physics, etc, but, with multiplayer, one chief selling point is that you can play it with your friends. If you can't, you probably don't want it...

Anyway, whether or not HL2 has the same lighting stuff (and, btw, I would like to point out here that Doom3 isn't the best demonstration of lighting considering you can't see half of it,) d-: It WILL look better than Doom 3. I could tell just from those demos. High resolution textures, high polygon count people/creatures, neat pixel shader effects, and so on. If their lighting system isn't as state of the art, they've done some neat stuff with it to catch it up.

This trailer doesn't do the game enough justice. I know it's a big download, but, get that CD sized video. It shows you so much more, despite the fact that it is so horribly encoded and a video of a tape recording to begin with.

EDIT: When talking about Doom 3's maps, remember, this was meant to be a sequal to Doom/Doom 2. Those felt just about the same. There were almost no large "outdoor" areas (not that outdoors was really any different to the rendering engine back then. As far as it was concerned, it was indoors with just a slightly larger ceiling texture that covered the whole area and a mostly uniform light map.)
 
And whomever said I'm against HL2; I will be first in line when it's released.

I just like to see big graphic breakthroughts like we've seen with Doom3.

Gameplay makes the game, not graphics. This, for the most part, is true. But with great graphics, comes a great experience.

I'm not sure it's logical to really compair the gameplay of Doom3 to that of the upcoming HL2, like so many people are "trying" to do with illogical opinions. Both games are coming from different directions, and they work from there. Why do I want to drive a buggy around mars for? Just because Unreal2 and soon HL2 have these larger style maps, that every game should? Nope, Doom3 is everything that they said it should be. Sorry to those dissapointed. I'm not sure what kind of game you were expecting in your head, but from all the previews.....what I formulated was pretty much right-on.

Cheers,
 
Nazo said:
(and, btw, I would like to point out here that Doom3 isn't the best demonstration of lighting considering you can't see half of it,) d-: .
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I'm sorry? I thought all the "darkness" along with the flashlight are quite possible one of the best examples.......?? It's real time lighting against every surface and object from a single source. What better example of "real time lighting" could you ask for?
 
Syn Ack, why did you think that was directed specifically at you?

As Dijonase was pointing out, some people look at CS and think since it uses the same engine, HL2 will look the same. I'm merely pointing out that it won't. So you can't use it to compare with Doom 3.

Yes, I was kidding about the "you can't see it" thing really. Doom 3 does neat stuff with lighting, but, in the end, you have to admit it got a little bothersome always being in the dark.
 
Nazo said:
It WILL look better than Doom 3. I could tell just from those demos. High resolution textures, high polygon count people/creatures, neat pixel shader effects, and so on. If their lighting system isn't as state of the art, they've done some neat stuff with it to catch it up.
)
Click to expand...

Are you contradicting yourself here, man??? I don't get it.


"It WILL look better than Doom 3. I could just tell from those demos"


What the hell kind of proof is that? Hah :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

And I know what video you were talking about. That was a graphic demonstration, not actual gameplay. There is a big difference between what they show you "we can do" and what they will actually have in the game.
 
Wait, I'm sorry, what? The crappy quicktime video encode of a video tape recording from a bad angle is a graphics demonstration? You know, the one where they show off how the physics will work, the neat vehicles (including the one that can move over water and land freely) and some of the neat stuff you can do with the weapons.... No gameplay eh? Well, if that is graphics only, I can't wait to see real HL2...

I meant the demos in the first video, not this high resolution one that takes a few small scenes from those.
 
Nazo said:
Why did you think that was directed specifically at you?

As Dijonase was pointing out, some people look at CS and think since it uses the same engine, HL2 will look the same. I'm merely pointing out that it won't. So you can't use it to compare with Doom 3.
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Sorry, I get lost on whose talking to who here.

Those people who base HL2 off CS, well those people shouldn't even be talking since it's quite obvious their opinion is meaningless for this discussion.
 
Nazo said:
Wait, I'm sorry, what? The crappy quicktime video encode of a video tape recording from a bad angle is a graphics demonstration? You know, the one where they show off how the physics will work, the neat vehicles (including the one that can move over water and land freely) and some of the neat stuff you can do with the weapons.... No gameplay eh? Well, if that is graphics only, I can't wait to see real HL2...

I meant the demos in the first video, not this high resolution one that takes a few small scenes from those.
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I was talking about the 700+MB one. I have all the others at home, I'll have to dig back through them.
 
That's what I meant. ~700MB quicktime .mov file of a recording from an E3 demonstration. That demo does NOT show off graphics. It's far too low quality clearly. If they want to show off graphics, they need to use something like that Bink, but carefully done since we've already discussed the issues it has with making things look a little lower quality than they should. Besides, they EXPLICITELY say stuff like "now I'm going to show you some of how the physics work" or something close enough. If that's showing off only graphics, that person doing the demonstration was really confused...

Look carefully enough in that video and you can get glimmers of how the graphics will look. This new bink video shows off bits and peices of some of the same scenes, but really I have to say that it's not their best work. Lol, I could make them a better one if they'd just give me access to that thing. *hint hint* ^_^ Actually, I couldn't. I'd be driving that go-kart type thing all the time instead of doing what I was supposed to be doing. Oh well.

EDIT: The demo's filename is "hl2_fulldemo_e32004.mov" It is 708MB.
 
Nazo said:
That's what I meant. ~700MB quicktime .mov file of a recording from an E3 demonstration. That demo does NOT show off graphics. It's far too low quality clearly. If they want to show off graphics, they need to use something like that Bink, but carefully done since we've already discussed the issues it has with making things look a little lower quality than they should. Besides, they EXPLICITELY say stuff like "now I'm going to show you some of how the physics work" or something close enough. If that's showing off only graphics, that person doing the demonstration was really confused...

Look carefully enough in that video and you can get glimmers of how the graphics will look. This new bink video shows off bits and peices of some of the same scenes, but really I have to say that it's not their best work. Lol, I could make them a better one if they'd just give me access to that thing. *hint hint* ^_^ Actually, I couldn't. I'd be driving that go-kart type thing all the time instead of doing what I was supposed to be doing. Oh well.

EDIT: The demo's filename is "hl2_fulldemo_e32004.mov" It is 708MB.
Click to expand...


i dont even have to argue your post

alls i haev to do is quote it.

i dont under stand how its NOT THEIR BEST WORK in the 700mb .mov

im lost

please explain because after reading your last post im fully convinced you lack any education on the matter at al ?!?!? et al?!
 
Syn Ack, to that last thing, I was referring to their copy of HL2 that they did all that demonstration stuff with. It was a joke. I could seriously do a better encode than that bink video though. One that doesn't kill the colors.

Now, your question befor that wasn't terribly clear. Just which part was it you didn't understand? When did I say anything to the effect of "it's not their best work." All I was saying is that such a crappy encode of a crappy recording is NOT what you call a graphics demonstration. They even clearly said in the demonstration as they were doing things that they were showing off stuff like the physics and gameplay. I don't recall any discussion of it's graphical capabilities in there anywhere. I'd say it does a pretty decent job of giving us an idea of what we are looking at too. Kind of makes me think of the old Half-Life gameplay with a sort of Deus Ex (original, not second) like setting in some ways though more apocalyptic, plus vehicles. ^_^ Got to have those vehicles. (I still say that looks like a LOT of fun.)
 
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