New build, could use suggestions

J

J-B

n00b
Joined
Dec 2, 2005
Messages
57
Hi all,

New to the forums. Or at least a new member, I actually browse rather frequently. Anyway, I didn't see an area specifically set aside for introductions so I thought I'd kill two birds with one stone with this thread. My name's Josh, and I'm not a pro or anything, I've just always loved messing with computers (actually started college as a comp sci major but never finished).

Anyway, I need some advice. Christmas present from my wife this year is that I get to build a new PC. I've got a budget of about $1300.00, give or take. It's about three years since I built the last one so I'm due for a total overhaul (Athlon XP and Geforce 3 are getting real tired). I think I've compiled a pretty good list, based around the guide here and at arstechnica, but I'd like to get opinions from everyone and see where I could do better, or save a few bucks etc.

Here's my current wishlist at Newegg...

https://secure.newegg.com/NewVersio...ion=HISTORY&ID=1782932&WishListTitle=New+comp

I'll mostly be using it for gaming and surfing. So tell me what you think. Thanks in advance.
 
haha I can't see your wishlist... mine comes up though! :D

might wanna just list off the parts instead.

$1300 for a new system... mmmmmmmmm
 
Sorry about that. I figured if I saved the wish list it would be visible to other users. Anyway, here it is so far.

COOLER MASTER Centurion 5 CAC-T05-WW Black/Silver Aluminum Bezel, SECC Chassis ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail $54.99

EPoX EP-9NPA+Ultra Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra ATX AMD Motherboard - Retail $105.00


eVGA 256-P2-N516 Geforce 7800GT 256MB GDDR3 PCI Express x16 Video Card - Retail
$299.00

Antec TRUEPOWERII TPII-550 ATX12V 550W Power Supply - Retail
$89.99

AMD Athlon 64 3500+ Venice 1GHz FSB Socket 939 Processor Model ADA3500BPBOX - Retail
$201.00

CORSAIR XMS 1GB (2 x 512MB) 184-Pin DDR SDRAM DDR 400 (PC 3200) Unbuffered Dual Channel Kit System Memory Model TWINX1024-3200C2PT - Retail
$105.00

HITACHI Deskstar T7K250 HDT722516DLA380 (0A31637) 160GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM
$89.50

Microsoft S51-00001 2-Tone PS/2 Wireless Ergonomics Keyboard Mouse Included - Retail
$81.00

LITE-ON Black ATAPI/E-IDE DVD Burner Model SHW-1635S - OEM
2x $39.99 $79.98

Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound - OEM
$5.89

Thermaltake VENUS 12 80mm Ball Cooling Fan/Heatsink - Retail
$36.99

Logitech X-530 70 Watts 5.1 Speaker - Retail $53.99


Anyway, I threw in a UV light and cable sleeve kit and I'm up to $1228.79. What's it look like?

edit: Damn, I just realized I don't have a sound card. Oh well, I can skimp on that, and get and Audigy 2 or something. far more worried about graphics than sound.
 
you could shave off some bucks and get only one burner and a standard dvd-rom, gives you a little more money to play with. might want to check out the power supply guide, some people love antec some hate it, never had any problems with mine. i'm not familiar with the hitachi hd's but you might want to think about a seagate just because they have a 5 year warrantee. i didn't check but does the hd you picked have an 8meg cache? 16meg cache drives are showing up and they're supposed to be pretty fast.
 
I'd go for the XFX 7800gt (450/1050). It comes OC'd out of the box and also OCs on top of that very well. Also has a decent stock cooler
 
Thanks for all the help everyone. I followed Slartibartfast's (Nice name BTW, I love those books) advice and dropped the second DVD burner and went with a standard DVD-rom. that saved me some dollars. Also went with Bored-sarcasm's suggestion of the WD drive instead of the hitachi. I was trying to sqeeze out a few more GBs, but it's probably better to go with a trusted name brand. That saved me some money as well actually.

I like the FSP PSU, but is 500w going to be enough? I was under the impression that the 7800 really ate up the power. And I do want room for improvement in the future. Probably another HDD, and eventually a faster processor. Is that going to leave me some elbow room in the power department?

I checked out the xfx 7800gt. Beautiful card, but way too expensive. That would add another 200 bucks which would put me way over budget. Thanks for the suggestion though.

edit: I do have all my cables, and winXP pro. I was wondering about adding another case fan, but truthfully I haven't look to see if there is another mount in the centurion. I know it comes with a 80mm intake and 120mm exhaust, but beyond that I haven't checked it out. Oh and I decided, also on your advice, that you're right about the sound card. There really isn't any need.
 
I checked out the xfx 7800gt. Beautiful card, but way too expensive. That would add another 200 bucks which would put me way over budget. Thanks for the suggestion though.
Click to expand...

You must have looked at the 7800gtX...I got my xfx 7800gt for ~$330
 
Doh! You're absolutely right. I was looking at the GTX. Newegg's sold out of the gt. I'll check around at some other places, thanks!
 
Okay, I've switched a few other things around, and I'm coming out pretty good. Still can't find anyone who has the xfx in stock though. Christmas is a bad time to go shopping.

Three questions:

Is 500w going to be enough to power everything and leave room for improvement?

The 7800gt requires it's own power source correct? A PCI-e connection? Doesn the FSP have one, because I didn't see it listed on the specs?

And lastly, anyone have any experience with the Venus 12? I plan to OC a bit, but I won't be pushing it really hard, just playing around some.
 
I don't even know what you're having this computer for. What is its main job?

-J.
 
Like I said in my first post, mostly gaming and surfing the net. Most likely the gaming will be the most intensive thing, I don't do video editing or 3d rendering anything like that.

Basically I just want a bad ass gaming rig that I'm not going to have to update for at least several months, maybe a year.
 
J-B said:
Okay, I've switched a few other things around, and I'm coming out pretty good. Still can't find anyone who has the xfx in stock though. Christmas is a bad time to go shopping.
Click to expand...
Monarch computers had the XFX 7800GT for $305 - 30MIR during the Thanksgiving day sale...I bought one, and they said they shipped the new designed one, the one that is black..
now it is retailing for like $325 again..i think
 
Thanks for the tip, man. I actually checked newegg this morning and lo and behold they have them in stock again. It's going to be another week or two before I get to order everything so keep your fingers crossed that it stays in stock.

Okay, I think I'm done with the planning. I dropped the Venus 12 for the Zalman 9500 (saw it in another thread here, looks like it would cool the sahara).

I'll post the final specs later on today, but for now I've got to go get ready for work (I hate having to be at work at 5 AM!).
 
Ah what the hell, I have a few minutes.


LOGISYS Computer CLK12UV 12" UV COLD CATHODE KIT - Retail
$5.99

COOLER MASTER Centurion 5 CAC-T05-WW Black/Silver Aluminum Bezel, SECC Chassis ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail
54.99

Link Depot 18" ATA133 UV Cable 3-Connector Model UV-ATA18-YE-3 - Retail
$3.49

EPoX EP-9NPA+Ultra Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra ATX AMD Motherboard - Retail
Model #: EP-9NPA+Ultra
$105.00

XFX PVT70GUDF7 Geforce 7800GT 256MB GDDR3 PCI Express x16 Video Card - Retail
$309.00

FSP Group (Fortron Source) AX500-A ATX12V 500W Power Supply - Retail
$91.00

AMD Athlon 64 3500+ Venice 1GHz FSB Socket 939 Processor Model ADA3500BPBOX - Retail
$201.00

CORSAIR XMS 1GB (2 x 512MB) 184-Pin DDR SDRAM DDR 400 (PC 3200) Unbuffered Dual Channel Kit System Memory Model TWINX1024-3200C2PT - Retail
$105.00

Update Western Digital Caviar SE WD1200JS 120GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard $74.50

Logitech Cordless Desktop MX3100 967513-0403 2-Tone PS/2 RF Wireless Standard Keyboard Mouse Included - Retail
$87.98

LITE-ON Black IDE Combo Drive Model SOHC-5236V BK OEM - OEM
$28.99

LITE-ON Black ATAPI/E-IDE DVD Burner Model SHW-1635S - OEM
$39.99

Update The Sims 2 International Box Version PC Game EA - Retail

$33.50

Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound - OEM
$5.89

ZALMAN CNPS9500 LED 92mm 2 Ball Blue LED Light Cooling Fan/Heatsink - $58.99

Logitech X-530 70 Watts 5.1 Speaker - Retail $53.99




That's it. Did I miss anything? I was even able to fit the Sims 2 in there for my wife (I figure I gotta do something for her to justify spending all this money ;) ).
final price w/o shipping is $1259.30. Which still leaves me room for shipping.
 
Is there any point in including a floppy drive with this thing? I can't even remember the last time I used the one in my current machine.
 
I'd love to get the 3800 but that's a big jump in price, and I don't really want to cut anything else out of it at this point. I probably will throw in another gig of ram at some point, but again, I'm on a budget, and I think what I've got now gives me a good base system that I can upgrade later.
 
The Epox supports all the 64/64 FX cpus. Not sure about dual core. I didn't see it anywhere so I'm assuming not. But that still gives me quite a bit of upgradability.

How much difference in performance could I expect going from the 3500+ to the 3700+? That's not really a huge hike in price and I could probably figure a way to save enough elsewhere.
 
For a 3700+ CPU, you get 1 MB cache. There is a slight improvement in terms of single percentages when it comes to certain tasks but in your daily uses, you won't see much of a difference. The reason is because the A64 platform really isn't cache-dependent.

-J.
 
Thanks for the info. Doesn't really sound worth it. I figure with the Zalman I should be able to OC a bit and get a bit more out of it, without alot of risk. I just don't want to push it, because pretty new to OCing.

Money should be here by friday, then it's "Move wish list to cart" and wait in horrible anticipation. Actually I'm already waiting in horrible anticipation. ;)
 
Thought alot about what Wesley1357 posted and I'm thinking about going with the Abit K8n mobo, because it supports dual core. In fact, I'm thinking about dropping the wireless keyboard and mouse and just going ahead with the X2 3800+. It would be really sweet to have the wireless set-up, but it's not something that's really neccesary.

I'm not sure. Any thoughts anyone?
 
Indeed it's not necessary as the only reason to use wireless is to throw your mouse like it's a football. ;)

I've been wired for a long time and I kept my cords either taped down or hooked to something so it doesn't move any further. But of course, I'm a competitive gamer, so I demand wired products to ensure 100% reliability.

-J.
 
You make a good point about gaming. Is there noticeable lag in wireless? I've always used wired, and I still have the same cheaps ass keyboard I've been using flawlessly forever. I just thought it would be pretty cool. But now I'm rethinking that position.
 
Well, I can say it's not as noticeable as it first was. The Logitech G7 has improved ten folds over past wireless mice. Yet some say glitches occur and for me, I have only tested the MX1000, I somewhat still notice the lag. Since I play Quake 3 and 4, I am in need to twitch my mouse repeatedly. After the USB polling rate discovery became publicized, there's no way to go wireless. I'm not sure how much signals per second can be sent from the mouse to the receiver but be rest assured it's a lot slower than a wired mouse (250+ times a second if you apply the usb polling rate trick). I have mine at 500 - why would I go wireless?

http://www.softpedia.com/get/Tweak/System-Tweak/USB-Mouserate-switcher.shtml

Of course, this is all talk. The best way to judge it effectively is if you try it first hand.

-J.
 
I hear ya. thanks for the info and the link. In any case, I think I'll go with the dual core and stick with my current keyboard/mouse, and maybe give wireless a shot later. For now, I want that power! :D

edit: Just had another thought...With the dual core, I shouldn't have any need to OC, at least for now. Maybe I should drop the Zalman as well and just go stock HSF? Or at least drop to something else.

Damn this thing is going through so many changes. Is it weird that I enjoy this part (the planning and picking out) as much as actually using the computer?
 
From what I've always heard if you're not OC'ing then the stock coolers on the A64 are fine, and some people say you can OC with them fine. I wouldn't worry about the wireless stuff, sometimes they have driver issues. I would keep the floppy just in case you have a serious meltdown or something, the redundancy is useful. You may never use it but you may find yourself really wanting one at some point. Besides they're like what, $15?

(btw thanks about the name - d adams RIP)
 
With the default retail HSF, the safest overclock you could do is about 200 MHz. Anything over is pushing it. Stability is not guaranteed - that's up to you to test. :)

J-B said:
Damn this thing is going through so many changes. Is it weird that I enjoy this part (the planning and picking out) as much as actually using the computer?
Click to expand...

Nope, I find it fun too, even though I dread at the thought of never getting those cool stuff. ;)

-J.
 
Thanks gentlemen. I think I'll look around and try to find something a little less expensive or maybe just go stock for now. I think I can restrain myself from OC for now. I'll be too busy playing all the games I've missed over the last year or so since my current PC became totally obsolete. I also have a system with a Sempron chip. Maybe I'll play around with it and learna bit more before I try to OC the expensive stuff.

Hmmm...I'm not getting any replies over in Disk Storage System, so I'll pose the same questions here....

Would there be any problem using an IDE in the same system with the SATA drive?

If not, which one would be better to put the OS on? Because the SATA will be considerably bigger (better for storage), but also as I understand it considerably faster (which I'm thinking would be good for the OS).

And would it be better to connect the HDD to the primary connection on the mobo, and leave the opticals on the secondary, or vice versa?
 
Would there be any problem using an IDE in the same system with the SATA drive?

If not, which one would be better to put the OS on? Because the SATA will be considerably bigger (better for storage), but also as I understand it considerably faster (which I'm thinking would be good for the OS).

And would it be better to connect the HDD to the primary connection on the mobo, and leave the opticals on the secondary, or vice versa?
Click to expand...

Never installed a SATA drive but I know people who use both without any problems.

Put the OS and programs on the SATA, leave the ide for storage. sata is significantly faster

I dunno about the ide controller but I doubt it will matter. You might end up with some wonkey drive letters in windows though.
 
Cool. I didn't think there would be any problems, but I figured I would ask those more knowledgeable than myself. So here's the new new new system specs:



LOGISYS Computer CLK12UV 12" UV COLD CATHODE KIT - Retail
2x 5.99 $11.98

COOLER MASTER Centurion 5 CAC-T05-WW Black/Silver Aluminum Bezel, SECC Chassis ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail
$54.99

Link Depot 10" Floppy UV Cable, 2-Connectors Model UV-FLP10-YE - Retail
$2.29

Link Depot 18" ATA133 UV Cable 3-Connector Model UV-ATA18-YE-3 - Retail
$3.49

Generic 73CT-01-0418-BK Cable Tie, BLACK, 4 inch, 18 lbs., 100 pcs / Pack - $4.99

ABIT KN8 Ultra Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra ATX AMD Motherboard - Retail
$105.00

eVGA 256-P2-N516 Geforce 7800GT 256MB GDDR3 PCI Express x16 Video Card -$299.00

FSP Group (Fortron Source) AX500-A ATX12V 500W Power Supply - Retail
$91.00

AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+ 1GHz FSB Socket 939 Dual Core Processor Model ADA3800BVBOX - Retail
$322.00

CORSAIR XMS 1GB (2 x 512MB) 184-Pin DDR SDRAM DDR 400 (PC 3200) Unbuffered Dual Channel Kit System Memory Model TWINX1024-3200C2PT - Retail
$105.00


NEC Black 1.44MB 3.5" Internal Floppy Drive - OEM
$7.75

Western Digital Caviar SE WD1200JS 120GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM
$74.50

LITE-ON Black IDE Combo Drive Model SOHC-5236V BK OEM - OEM
Model #: SOHC-5236V BK OEM

$28.99

LITE-ON Black ATAPI/E-IDE DVD Burner Model SHW-1635S - OEM
Model #: SHW-1635S

$40.99

Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound - OEM
Model #: ARCTIC SILVER 5
$5.89

Logitech X-530 70 Watts 5.1 Speaker - Retail
Model #: 970114-0403
$53.99


Subtotal: $1,211.85

So I still have a little room to play. Could go ahead and get another keyboard/mouse (wired), or I could get a slightly larger HDD. Or I could try to find a cheaper HSF for the CPU. I'll just continue to play a bit and see.
 
i dont think you'll need a floppy for this setup. go out and get a 512 memory stick at best buy or some other place. i use mine all the time, and there's tons of room on it for everyday things.

and i have the logitech wireless media play mouse, and have no problems when it comes to gaming or everyday applications. plus i can pause, seek, and adjust the volume with it.
 
Can you tell me if you're a pro-gamer (or competitive gamer) or a casual gamer / regular player? Usually pro-gamers notice the difference between wired and wireless while casual players don't really see much of a difference and they end up saying, "So what?" The same for LCD vs. CRT. Casual players see no flaws in gaming on a LCD while pro-gamers are irritated by them.

-J.
 
Damn, several replies at once. Okay...


Thought about the RAM. I'm not sure if I should go with a bigger HDD or more RAM. That's kind of a toss-up. I'm upgrading from 512 MB right now, so from perspective this system is going to fly anyway. And I'm thinking I'll probably need more than just 120GB of space at some point, with games and apps getting bigger and bigger all the time. But then again...i dunno. I'm torn on that.

An NEC drive? Lite-on and plextor are the only two brands I've used for burners (CD, this is my first DVD). Always got good results from both of them. Is there a big difference between lite-on and NEC?

Wasn't sure about the floppy. I personally haven't used one in ages, the last time was making a restore disk in Partition Magic probably four or five years ago (which I never used anyway). But I thought there might be some reason they were still around. The memory stick is a good idea, I'll keep that in mind for future reference.

edit: Oh, I guess I'm a casual gamer. I play alot of games (or did before my vid card stopped being able to handle them), but rarely any online or competitive play.
 
Could probably get another gig of ram if I downgraded it to Corsair Value select instead of XMS. Since I'm not going to be OC it, it should be okay, right?
 
RAM > HD, IMO. ;)

NEC is just plainly faster and has no compatibility issues while Lite-On does with some modes.

You are correct - regular RAM works just fine if you're not overclocking. Believe it or not, you can also overclock regular RAM but of course not as great as XMS.

I don't use floppy - no idea if I ever will.

-J.
 
i have an external usb floppy drive. i want before to get rid of the floppy, i wanted my computer to look cooler without a floppy, just have the dvd burder. why use floppies at all?!
the only reason i got the external is for in case i need to use "the floppy" for updating bios, or in case someone give a office file in a floppy. at this point in time, i update bios tru windows. and i burn any files to dvd/cd discs.
 
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