Need really _fast_ mouse / high dps m/s mouse

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c01v1p4q

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Aug 6, 2013
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Hello,

really simple: I need a mouse that can mirror fast movements accurately, 3-5 meter per second or more, ideally 10 meter per second. It must not be for right-handed people only, if possible cheap, long-lasting, and as large and heavy as you can get, with low dpi or dpi switch. I already heard about the MX518, but the problem seems to be that there were many models with different sensors sold, some fast some slow. It also has buttons for right-handed people, but I guess I could just disable those or cut them out even, because the shape of the mouse is ambidextrous.

Please don't question the ideal 10 m/s. Human muscles can possibly move faster than that on small scales, just not accurately. I really want something that never ever fails on speed and that is not because I am some riced gamer. I am a sysadmin working with 6 monitors and I make really really fast accurate movements across 6000 pixels or more, that is roughly 5000 pixels of mere extreme acceleration and 1000 of deceleration towards accuracy. Its first hand experience that almost all mice, no matter if expensive or not, cannot keep up with that. It is deeply disturbing to work with shitty mice. 90% of the mice even are so shitty, if you really pushed it you could flick the mouse fast without the sensor picking up much of anything, that is it doesn't move at all. I am about to throw the shit mouse I use now against the wall soon. I had a fast, but not ultimately fast, good old 600dpi mouse before that I could actually work with without getting aggressions. The sensor light was infrared, at least you couldn't see it. It is a shame that they are not sold anymore.
 
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Steelseries Sensei may fit your bill.
Ambidextrous, has a CPU onboard equivalent to a Pentium to increase CPI, has lift height adjustment that lets you set it up for troublesome surfaces, very comfortable, very configurable, can be programmed without a PC using the LCD on the bottom, side buttons on both sides, looks great...

Its a bit light and not large though, but should still be very good for your purpose.
If I wiggle mine left/right as fast as I possibly can, it still maintains its position on screen, using the back of a black a4 cartridge paper book as mouse mat.
I reckon this could be ideal for you tbh.
 
Thanks a lot. That mouse looks pretty reasonable as does the price. It says in the specs that it can work to up to 12000fps and that it reliably tracks 3,81 m/s. The options it has are pretty useful too.

I will probably buy it unless someone knows an even faster mouse.

Oh btw., just to make sure: when you said that if you wiggle it it does maintain its position, you mean that it wiggles in an identical, accurately mirrored way on the screen, rather than that it actually maintains a static position? Or do you mean wiggling in terms of just less than 1cm? The latter would be somewhat an indicator for speed, but if you repetitively move your hand back and forth on less than 5cm you actually cannot move it nearly as fast as you could when flicking the mouse 5-15 cm in just one direction. Its just too much acceleration/deceleration going on, the muscles can't respond as much.
 
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I knew it was good but didnt know it was quite this good at huge acceleration and speed until I tested it for you :)
I wish I could quantify the speed I have tested, but if you move faster when you use it than I did in my test, I'll eat my mouse!

Yep, it moves exactly as you would hope (wildly fast) and then stops where it should.
There has to be some error, but I cant detect it, your mouse surface may impact this.
I have all acceleration turned off.
 
I don't think being able to handle that kind of acceleration and speed is that big of a feat.
The Logitech G700 can handle it perfectly accurate and its sensor is fairly old. I use a G700s now and it also handles it perfectly fine. Even the G7 I had from way back could handle my maximum speed without problems. I think any gaming mouse should be able to handle it.

I tested this with 6 monitors and the mouse set to 1200dpi with no acceleration moving the mouse as fast as I possibly can and it still tracks perfect.
 
I vote for the DeathAdder 2013 because it has an advertised 200 I.P.S. tracking speed and no noticeable positive acceleration like the current Avago laser illuminated sensors do (9500/9800).
 
So I bought the DeathAdder left-handed version, for the reasons that the Steelseries Sensei has a lower m/s rate (3.5m/s instead of about 5 m/s) and that the Sensei has no version for left-handed people. Also what L4d said about acceleration made me concerned, because nothing is more important to me than 1:1 translation of the movements with no acceleration or corruption to it. And I read a review where it was said that the DeathAdder is too huge and chunky, although it looks rather small like any normal mouse. Otherwise the Sensei seemed to be better and seems to have more options, except for the mouse wheel that seems to have deficits, even to the point that people would return the product because of it.

I also did an experiment and shot myself with a camera moving the mouse marked 10cm on the desk as fast as I could. Even at my fastest movements, I seem to be barely able to do that exactly in between two frames, that is such that you see the mouse in one place and in another in the next frame without any movement caught in the footage. So the speed of that would be 2.4m/s and I guess I can never ever exceed 3m/s even if I just tried to move it as fast as possible without aiming at anything. So if the specs are true, there should be absolutely zero loss of precision with the DeathAdder, even if the surface sucks a bit, as it has a way higher m/s rate than that. I will do an experiment on it and report back.
 
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Glad you got something you like.
btw, the Sensei doesnt come in a left handed version because its a truly ambidextrous mouse, designed to work equally well with both hands as its a mirror image down the centre.
I stated it was ambidextrous on the second line of my post :p
ps the mouse wheel is great, what faults did you read of?
 
Nenu said:
Glad you got something you like.
btw, the Sensei doesnt come in a left handed version because its a truly ambidextrous mouse, designed to work equally well with both hands as its a mirror image down the centre.
I stated it was ambidextrous on the second line of my post :p
ps the mouse wheel is great, what faults did you read of?
Click to expand...

after using the kone xtd, I would agree the sensei mouse wheel feels cheap. I honestly think the whole mouse feels cheaply made.

I've recently tried; imperator, deathadder, m60, g500, sensei, mionix naos 8200 and kone xtd. sensei was one of my least favorites. although one of my largest complaints is how low it sits and I have large hands.
 
ps the mouse wheel is great, what faults did you read of?
Click to expand...
Just German Amazon reviews. It made the impression that they had difficulties in the manufacturing process or something, because some people said it didn't work at all, some said its just very loose and the mouse wheel was really the number one complaint in the negative ones.

sensei was one of my least favorites. although one of my largest complaints is how low it sits and I have large hands.
Click to expand...

That sounds quite concerning. I have an almost equally big ambidextrous mouse and more or less the left-handed version of it. It is about 12.5x6.5cm (4cm height), but I can grab the left-handed version considerably better, which is also a few cm higher. My hand is 10x20cm and 20x20cm with fingers spreaded, so obviously it doesn't fit well. I don't think thats large for males and don't get how why they only sell small and smaller mouses. I guess something like 17x9cm would be ideal.

But if the Deathadder is really too small, I will try to bulk it with instamorph. That is a moldable plastic that becomes like putty if heated above 60°C, but is like regular hard plastic otherwise. Quite interesting.
 
Strange, my Sensei wheel works like a wheel should. It isnt loose, it definitely works and it looks great (lit up like a Tron motorcycle wheel).
Regarding the cheap feel comment above, it is very well made and very solid.
Its lighter than larger claw grip mice but this isnt a detriment, it doesnt need to be any heavier imo, it suits the mouse. Maybe this is why he thinks its cheap, it looks like metal but doesnt weigh as much.
Its robust, the number of times it has hit the deck and not suffered at all.

My hand size is 9.5cmx18.5cm (width=no thumb), fyi
 
I thought the sensei seemed cheap b/c the mouse wheel was slightly loose and noisy. the plastic housing also felt very cheap.

to give you an example the kone xtd, razer mamba and corsair m60 all have nice, smooth, tight and silent mouse wheels.

I've been on the hunt for the perfect mouse for myself.

I have now tried; razer imperator, DeathAdder 3.5G, DeathAdder 2013, Mamba 2012, Corsair M60, Mionix Naos 8200, SteelSeries Sensei, Logitech G500 and Kone XTD.

I would say you in most cases you get what you pay for. The XTD and Mamba 2012 hands down have the most solid construction of this group. Well built housing, silent and smooth scroll wheels, etc. They just feel more solid than the others.

Out of the group I've tried none of them were bad (okay maybe the imperator) but there are a lot of great mice out there. IMHO; for high sensitivity, large hands, claw grip and solid construction. I think the Kone XTD and Mamba 2012 are in a class by themselves.
 
I don't know how I missed the left-handed part of your initial post, but I am glad that you are satisfied!
Your DeathAdder, which has the Avago 3888 sensor, should exceed your needed 3 m/s tracking speed too.:cool:
 
Here is the 12.5x6.5x4cm mouse I was talking about. My hand gets cramped after a time with those mice, usually I have to solder new buttons in after about 6 months. They generally break pretty fast anyway.

I just wish they would make way bigger mice.

why_so_tiny.png
 
I used the Deathadder 3500 I bought today at work. First of all, the accuracy due to tracking speed is amazing (close to 100%). You only really get to know the difference across 6 monitors. I tried my best to move faster than the mouse could handle, but I simply could not.
The size is average and the form is not especially well designed (unlike the mouse I used at work before). It's not really comfortable, but on the other hand not such that it will flip out of your hand and destroy itself.
I set it to 450dpi with the linux tool initially, because only multiples of that are supported, and thought it was too slow. But quickly it became obvious to me that the accuracy increase is worth it and the mouse will not become less accurate at all because of moving it around more and faster. You can disable all the annoying lights.
The most annoying 'feature' is that the left/right buttons are inversed hardware-wise and therefore also inversed in programs that rely on hardware mapping, such as VNC and rdesktop (the archlinux rdesktop is patched with the -M switch luckily). I don't know what they had in mind when they did that.

It is comparably heavy, but could be heavier. I possibly can't crush it with one hand. Very good quality. Due to the still-too-small size however, it is annoying that the buttons already click halfway on the mouse and not just on the far end.

I am thinking about buying another one.
 
c01v1p4q said:
I used the Deathadder 3500 I bought today at work. First of all, the accuracy due to tracking speed is amazing (close to 100%).
Click to expand...

I also have a Razer DeathAdder, the original and the newer 2013 with 6400 dpi and I'm at the point of my life where I hate Razer products.

Despite the great tracking and nice feel of the mouse, the quality of their products is terrible and their drivers require you to create an account before you can install them. There's product reviews and buyer comments complaining about manufacturing issues with Razer products back in 2009 and they were still selling the same problematic, unfixed equipment in 2013.

Every single Razer product I've owned has failed just a few months past warranty and I've RMA'd at least 3 products with them. In fact, I'd say every Razer product I've owned has failed on its own before they were 'used up' with the exception of this DeathAdder 2013... but it's rather new still. I have a Lycosa that causes PC's to blue screen randomly, a DeathAdder with the double click issue, and all other products have been binned.
 
I am glad that neither of my Lycosa keyboards supposedly caused any bluescreens, and my Lachesis 3G from 2009 works the same as when I bought it despite being lightly banged on tables, but my bought used from the A.V.S. forum Copperhead would randomly not track.

My first Lycosa randomly does not type certain letters or does not let shift capitalize, but I missed the opportunity to R.M.A. it when Razer offered it for free, and my mirror edition has no faults other than its known 2 K.R.O. one where certain keys cannot be pressed together.
 
Mh, that sounds bad. Judging from the outside it is very good quality, but if they use the same cheap electronic components that other mice use on the inside (except for the sensor) then it is reasonable to assume the mouse will fail within 1-2 years. To my experience, the first point of failure is always either the wireless link or the cable breaking. Buttons wear out faster of course, but you can solder new ones in as well as a USB cable (but you can't do anything about wireless failure).

I guess nowadays you can't expect anything of products past the warranty time. They do it on purpose. I have a keyboard and printer that is nearly 20 years old, merely because everything that was produced past 2001 broke after 2-5 years. The original HP Laserjet 5 I have, 20 years heavily used in offices, still sales for as much as a new laser printer, because it will probably survive another decade, has higher capacities, cheaper cartridges and what not. It is just sad. But they realized that such long-lasting products are killing the market. While you may get a printer for as little as 10%-25% of the inflation-adjusted prices 20 years ago, getting the same product quality is either impossible nowadays, or will just disproportionally cost you more than 10 times as much. Not to mention that you often simply don't know if the deal is just a ripoff or actually a quality product. Business products are often the best indicator that they will at least last 5 years, because they are made for 5 year warranty contracts and not 2 years.

Doing simple electronics repairs often can get you maybe 50% more lifetime. But there is no use if all the components are so crappy that they essentially will break at the same time.

Just having a product that works acceptable in the first place is worth much though.
 
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OK, to whoever finds this:

Deathadder 3.5G left handed version

Middle mouse button BROKE after less than 9 month of everyday usage.

I am going to take it apart now and solder a new button in. Using the warranty for this is of course extreme nonsense because then I would lose my mouse for several weeks without proper replacement... It is perfectly typical for the cheapo mouse buttons to wear out that way: they start to click less often when you press them and you have to press harder which destroys them even faster. Looking at the wear and tear now I suspect it will last around 2 years (if you repair it once in a while), maybe 5 years if you are lucky, before it fails beyond repair. Just like any other product nowadays ... really sad.

Oh, and btw. type "deathadder mi..." into google this seems to be quite common.


EDIT: Took it apart, soldered in a middle-click button from one of the dozen broken mice I have in storage ... and found quite a surprise on the inside:

deathadder_logic.jpg
 
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