Need complete headphone system

M

Monkeypillow

Gawd
Joined
Aug 30, 2006
Messages
880
For games, music, movies, everything.

My soundcard is giving me nothing but trouble (static in games, but not (to my knowledge) in anything else). The sound sucks anyway.

For a while I used onboard optical to the headphone output of my receiver, but that doesn't allow for positional audio -- still, that's the best sounding it's ever been.

If I need separate solutions for music and games, that's fine, but I need to know.

I currently have a pair of Sennheiser HD595s, and plan to get a pair of HD600s or HD650s (opinions?). For music, I want good, accurate sound.

I would like some closed phones as well, for games. Maybe some Audio-Technica ATH-A700s. For games, I'm more interested in crisp, powerful sound.

It might be nice to have a set of speakers as well, but it's not a priority.

I'm looking for suggestions for products (headphones, amps, DACs, soundcards, speakers, etc.) that would suit me, as well as suggestions for what programs and settings to use to ensure the most true-to-the-source listening experience.

All help is appreciated. :)
 
Yes, I'm in the US. I don't really have a budget, so I'd like to see different options at different price points.
 
Why would you like closed headphones for games? Open headphones are better for their bigger soundstage.

I suggest the AD2000 or W5000 from ATH. Awesome headphones, but expensive. For cheaper, I would say K701, K601, D2000, or DT770. Ultrasone Proline 750 is another pricey one that's amazing.

For headphone amps and DAC's, well, the simplest and best bang for the buck would probably be the Audio-gd Compass. Amazingly well-built, extremely transparent sound for the price. Get it at its current promo price!

For separate headphone amps, I would vote for the M^3, Heed Canamp, Headamp AE-2, pretty much any Eddie Current amp, or any Millet amp.

For 2ch DACs, I would shoot for an Adcom GDA-600 or 700, any Stello DAC, almost any KECES DAC, any Shanling, any Bada, or any Oritek.

If you prefer soundcards, let me know. Also, you have to tell us if you want a soundcard as a transport or as a DAC.

Or you could stick with a preamp/surround processor. Let me know if you want this.

Also, they aren't necessary, let me know if you're interested in a separate preamp.

As for speakers... you have to give a budget and if you want passive versus powered. Otherwise, I could literally have an endless list. The headphone world is a little smaller and easier to list.
 
Alai said:
Why would you like closed headphones for games? Open headphones are better for their bigger soundstage.

I suggest the AD2000 or W5000 from ATH. Awesome headphones, but expensive. For cheaper, I would say K701, K601, D2000, or DT770. Ultrasone Proline 750 is another pricey one that's amazing.

For headphone amps and DAC's, well, the simplest and best bang for the buck would probably be the Audio-gd Compass. Amazingly well-built, extremely transparent sound for the price. Get it at its current promo price!

For separate headphone amps, I would vote for the M^3, Heed Canamp, Headamp AE-2, pretty much any Eddie Current amp, or any Millet amp.

For 2ch DACs, I would shoot for an Adcom GDA-600 or 700, any Stello DAC, almost any KECES DAC, any Shanling, any Bada, or any Oritek.

If you prefer soundcards, let me know. Also, you have to tell us if you want a soundcard as a transport or as a DAC.

Or you could stick with a preamp/surround processor. Let me know if you want this.

Also, they aren't necessary, let me know if you're interested in a separate preamp.

As for speakers... you have to give a budget and if you want passive versus powered. Otherwise, I could literally have an endless list. The headphone world is a little smaller and easier to list.
Click to expand...

I thought closed would be better for games since I don't like to hear anything but the game. I don't really know what my conditions ae going to be like at college, so I just wasn't sure. If the HD600s or HD650s would be great for games, that simplifies things.

If I could use the soundcard for processing, then pass it to a 2 channel DAC for decoding, that'd be great. But, I want to be able to use positional audio for games.
I've looked at the Keces DACs before, and while they look good on paper (and in person), it seems like a bit much to spend on a dedicated DAC. Perhaps something more along the lines of a ZeroDAC would be a good stater unit for me, then I could upgrade later as my budget allows. I'm not sure what kind of power any of these phones need, though, so I may see better results with a dedicated headphone amp. I had wanted to build an MK3 for a while, but I never did. Maybe that should be a summer project.

I would like to use a surround processor/receiver someday, but it wouldn't make a lot of sense at the moment, since I prefer headphones for
playing games and don't intend to get a 5.1 system for the computer at this point in time.
For music, though, I'm looking to make no compromises (other than cost).
 
Depends on your setup. A receiver or surround processor might be just the thing for you. Still haven't answered anything about speakers.

For the HD 600 or 650, it is highly advised to get a dedicated headphone amp. Same with all the ones I listed except the D2000, but the D2000 will still do better with an amp.

The HD650 or 600 are ok for gaming, but the soundstage is definitely improved on other headphones (aka positional audio).

If you wanted an all-in-one, then the Compass is a much better component than the Zero. And the amp can maximize almost all headphones except the most demanding (ie K701 and HD650). But even with them, the amp section of the Compass will push the headphones well. And you also have a nice entry level DAC with the Compass.

If you will be using the soundcard with digital out, then you should look into the Auzentech offerings. There will be almost no weak point in the Auzentech soundcards, esp. with digital out.

Also, if you have a budget limit, please say so. You are wasting my time and yours when I list expensive components.
 
Alai said:
Depends on your setup. A receiver or surround processor might be just the thing for you. Still haven't answered anything about speakers.

For the HD 600 or 650, it is highly advised to get a dedicated headphone amp. Same with all the ones I listed except the D2000, but the D2000 will still do better with an amp.

The HD650 or 600 are ok for gaming, but the soundstage is definitely improved on other headphones (aka positional audio).

If you wanted an all-in-one, then the Compass is a much better component than the Zero. And the amp can maximize almost all headphones except the most demanding (ie K701 and HD650). But even with them, the amp section of the Compass will push the headphones well. And you also have a nice entry level DAC with the Compass.

If you will be using the soundcard with digital out, then you should look into the Auzentech offerings. There will be almost no weak point in the Auzentech soundcards, esp. with digital out.

Also, if you have a budget limit, please say so. You are wasting my time and yours when I list expensive components.
Click to expand...

As far as speakers are concerned, I don't really know what I'd get -- possibly some monitors from AV123. Eventually, I very well may move to a 5.1 speaker setup, but I would have to already have a setup in the living room before I bothered with one specifically for PC use. For probably at least the next five years, it'll be headphones and maybe 2.1/2.0.

I'll definitely look into the compass, as an all-in-one would probably be best for me right now -- I can always upgrade later.

If there aren't any problems that come with using the soundcard for processing duty only, then I would think that would be best. Auzentech's offerings look to be very good, is there a specific model you would recommend?

As I said earlier, I don't really have a budget, but for the sake of not going overboard, I will say that I'd prefer not to go over $500 for the hardware (soundcard, DAC, amp, etc.).
The headphones themselves shouldn't be an issue as far as cost is concerned, as you can find most of what I'm looking at for under $300.
 
Then I would say the K501, HD600 (should be ok with the Compass amp, though it's not the best, it's decent), D2000, and DT770 are going to be the headphones for you. And get the Compass. For soundcard, literally any Auzentech card will do. The Prelude and Forte are popular and well-built.

I would stay away from AV123 products. They are having money troubles and I wouldn't give them more than a year to go under. If so, then that means that, if your speakers break, there is pretty much no way to repair or replace parts. They had amazing bang for the buck products, but without product support, buying from them is a dice roll.

Energy, Polk Audio, Mirage, Outlaw Audio, Ascend Acoustics, Totem Acoustics, Paradigm... These are some of my favs, especially Outlaw, Ascend, and Polk.
 
Alai said:
Then I would say the K501, HD600 (should be ok with the Compass amp, though it's not the best, it's decent), D2000, and DT770 are going to be the headphones for you. And get the Compass. For soundcard, literally any Auzentech card will do. The Prelude and Forte are popular and well-built.

I would stay away from AV123 products. They are having money troubles and I wouldn't give them more than a year to go under. If so, then that means that, if your speakers break, there is pretty much no way to repair or replace parts. They had amazing bang for the buck products, but without product support, buying from them is a dice roll.

Energy, Polk Audio, Mirage, Outlaw Audio, Ascend Acoustics, Totem Acoustics, Paradigm... These are some of my favs, especially Outlaw, Ascend, and Polk.
Click to expand...

Are you saying that the Sennheiser HD600s are not the best, but decent, or that the HD600s paired with the Compass won't do as well as other combination because of the higher power requirements of the HD600s? I've head both the HD600s and the HD650s and thought they were great.

I like my Polks (I have two pairs of RTi8s as fronts and surrounds with a CSi3 for the center), but I thought Outlaw only made processors and receivers. I wasn't aware AV123 was having trouble, but then again, I haven't really been looking for speakers.
 
If I want to run a 2.0/2.1 setup as well, how would I integrate the two? I'd probably opt to run the speakes from a receiver, but then how would I connect the headphone amp?
 
HD600 with the Compass combination, not the components themselves. Each of these pieces are amazing audio components.

No, Outlaw makes everything now. I haven't heard their speakers, but a friend of mine, whom I trust when it comes to audio because he has a ton of experience working and playing with audio equipment, heard the Outlaw Audio subwoofers and he loves them. I am actually really tempted to get one, myself.

And, yes, AV123 is having trouble. That's why their forums were shut down, to stop customer complaint from flooding in. Started with a huge debacle with the LS and MFW series. You can Google it. I also have a friend who knows the inner workings of AV123 and he confirms that AV123 is in a very precarious situation. Doubtful they will last long. You will notice they also have nothing in development.

EDIT: Depends on the headphone amp and receiver. If the receiver has a headphone out, I would use that and connect the headphone amp to it. Otherwise, you can just use some sort of second pre-out on the back like a Zone 2 pre-out (if the Zone 2 is allowed audio from the main source).
 
Alai said:
HD600 with the Compass combination, not the components themselves. Each of these pieces are amazing audio components.

No, Outlaw makes everything now. I haven't heard their speakers, but a friend of mine, whom I trust when it comes to audio because he has a ton of experience working and playing with audio equipment, heard the Outlaw Audio subwoofers and he loves them. I am actually really tempted to get one, myself.

And, yes, AV123 is having trouble. That's why their forums were shut down, to stop customer complaint from flooding in. Started with a huge debacle with the LS and MFW series. You can Google it. I also have a friend who knows the inner workings of AV123 and he confirms that AV123 is in a very precarious situation. Doubtful they will last long. You will notice they also have nothing in development.

EDIT: Depends on the headphone amp and receiver. If the receiver has a headphone out, I would use that and connect the headphone amp to it. Otherwise, you can just use some sort of second pre-out on the back like a Zone 2 pre-out (if the Zone 2 is allowed audio from the main source).
Click to expand...

Is the Compass just not powerful enough for the HD600s, or are they just not a good match sonically?

That sucks. Glad I didn't splurge on a bedroom speaker set, as they were the front runners in my decision at the time. Hope it tuns out alright for them.

I'm not sure that running a headphone amp from the headphone out would sound that good. If I'm not mistaken, a receiver's headphone out is amplified. Is it not preferable to have a line-level signal for amplification?
 
Yeah, it is preferable. Currently, I use my headphone out and my headphone amp together because the headphone out on my preamp/pro is the only one capable of Dolby Headphone. And I am pretty sure the headphone amp on the preamp/pro won't be able to push my K701 to its limits.
 
Alai said:
Yeah, it is preferable. Currently, I use my headphone out and my headphone amp together because the headphone out on my preamp/pro is the only one capable of Dolby Headphone. And I am pretty sure the headphone amp on the preamp/pro won't be able to push my K701 to its limits.
Click to expand...

Exactly right. It will do a good job but not an all the way to the hilt job.

Best idea I have had so far is to get as good a surround receiver with an audio output as you can afford. This gives you dolby headphone for movies (pretty important), music and games(although stereo is better than dolby for these two with headphones imo).

With a receiver like this, you can add a headphone amp and speakers. It will do fine for headphones without a separate amp. You can try different headphones until you find ones that you love. The 600s are great for music but not for games. The 595s are actually better for games than the 600s.

Honestly, if you want to use headphones and want bass plus detail, it will cost you as much as a decent speaker setup. If you want just really good directional sound and detail, an AKG 601 or 701 will do very well.
 
Been looking at different possibilities. I think I like the flexibility that a receiver offers, but I don't really know what to get. What would you recommend in the ~$500 range?

Are there any receivers that allow you to apply dolby headphone processing over any outputs other than the headphone output?

As far as headphone amps are concerned, I've been out of the loop for a while, so I don't really know what's out there.

I'm thinking my best bet would be to find the headphones I'm interested in first, since they'll have the biggest impact on sound, then look at receivers, then possibly a headphone amp, and later on a DAC, since the DAC in a good receiver is probably pretty good to begin with.
 
currently i'm using x-fi titanium + audio gd-compass + dt770/80, multiple eargasms i tell ya :D so yea get compass while you can it's gonna be more expensive on 1st of june (but still worth it imo), i was thinking of buying akg 601 along with it but that was biased because my previous amp was not cutting it ( PA2V2 ), i still got the itch for trying out an open of headphones for a change, i've gone through everglide s-500 -> auditechnica A700 -> beyerdynamic DT770/80 if that's saying something

But first i want to use my beyers for atleast another 100hrs, i was never been so pleased with the way my music and games are sounding right now :D
 
I think I'm going to go ahead and order a Compass DAC/amp.

Advice regarding receivers to use for speakers and soundcards to pair the compass with?
 
a popular gaming/headphone solution is the forte soundcard. uses an x-fi chip and has a built in headphone amp. for a dorm situation u probably want closed headphones. some of my faves (i only speak of headphones i have owned). all of these are large closed headphones

jvc harx700 40$
jvc hadx1 75$
audio technica ath-a900 175$
denon ahd2000 225$
 
I ordered a Compass a while ago and it will hopefully be shipped on Thursday (Audio-Gd need 2 weeks to build/test/burn-in the unit). I can't wait to hear the performance with my ATH-AD700. Starting today, it is sold for 330$, which is a great price, even if the shipping is quite expensive (the package weight 5Kg ... )
I was lucky enough to buy it at the introduction price of 285$ in May.

I just discovered the joys of wasapi (Vista) And I'm looking for some higher-end cans in July.

I really believe the Compass is a great piece of gear for serious audio enthusiasts on a budget.
 
Failed to take the time difference into consideration and missed the promotional period. I think for now I'll go with a receiver-based setup. As for a soundcard: If I'll only be using the digital out as a transport, does the brand really matter?

What receivers should I look at?
 
Monkeypillow said:
As for a soundcard: If I'll only be using the digital out as a transport, does the brand really matter?
Click to expand...

Only in a few specific cases in terms of specific features. But any card providing those features is basically equal.

I just run mine off the motherboard.
 
ashmedai said:
Only in a few specific cases in terms of specific features. But any card providing those features is basically equal.

I just run mine off the motherboard.
Click to expand...

I thought about doing that, and am currently doing that, however: I would like sound processing since this is also for games. Don't I need a soundcard to achieve this?
 
Eh, throw CPU at it. Sound cards are becoming obsolete except for analog functions - which you won't be using.
 
ashmedai said:
Eh, throw CPU at it. Sound cards are becoming obsolete except for analog functions - which you won't be using.
Click to expand...

How would I go about doing this? It seems I don't have any option to choose what kind of sound setup I'm using to tailor the sound processing. Where would I find this?
 
I was also wondering about this.

How do you get your EAX and use a receiver at the sametime? For instance, if you want the soundcard to send out an EAX signal and have the receiver act as the amp to speakers and headphones?

I'm thinking just an optical out from the soundcard to optical in on the receiver. Its too bad the computer's soundcard will "taint" the decoding, or is there a way around this?
 
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