MSI N460GTX Hawk Edition Video Card Review @ [H]

FrgMstr

FrgMstr

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MSI N460GTX Hawk Edition Video Card Review - MSI's N460GTX Hawk Edition has landed in its place atop the totem pole of factory-overclocked GeForce GTX 460 video cards. It has some unique new features that should definitely pique the interest of many budget-minded hardware enthusia
 
why is the gddr5 on nvidia gpus so much slower then amds? that always bothered me. amd gddr5 was running that speed on their hd4xxx series cards.
 
tricky0502 said:
why is the gddr5 on nvidia gpus so much slower then amds? that always bothered me. amd gddr5 was running that speed on their hd4xxx series cards.
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in most cases they actually use the same 5000MHz rated ram that ATI now uses but its their memory controller that is the problem.
 
tricky0502 said:
why is the gddr5 on nvidia gpus so much slower then amds? that always bothered me. amd gddr5 was running that speed on their hd4xxx series cards.
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Why do the specs matter? What difference does it really make?

Those numbers are nearly meaningless. Actual performance is the only thing that is really important. Specifications are just bullet points.
 
Mark_Warner said:
Why do the specs matter? What difference does it really make?

Those numbers are nearly meaningless. Actual performance is the only thing that is really important. Specifications are just bullet points.
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the performance of the product has nothing to do with his question though. he simply wanted to know why they are using much slower speed gddr5 than ATI. obviously most people don't know its the memory controller not the actual memory that is the issue for Nvidia.
 
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Quick question. Did you guys try to go slightly down in voltage to hit that 1ghz overclock you were shooting for? Sometimes the voltage is a lil higher on these pre-overclocked cards than need be, and can be the issue. On my BFG GTX 280OC I actually dropped the voltage a hair and was able to achieve a more stable overclock over 700 on the core. If I took the voltage any higher I couldn't pass 685 no matter what. Shader and ram were limited too. Going lower (even by a hair) can make a difference. ;)
 
My palit sonic platinum has no problem hitting 850Mhz without voltage adjustment, not really impressed with the hawk edition.
 
The memory overclock does look slow, my gigabyte 460 1GB is currently doing 2020mhz (havent tried faster), are they using the same memory as gigabye?

I was expecting more too (given the price premium), I was hoping to see a GTX 460 @ 1000mhz:(
 
Mark_Warner said:
Why do the specs matter? What difference does it really make?

Those numbers are nearly meaningless. Actual performance is the only thing that is really important. Specifications are just bullet points.
Click to expand...

But your review shows that those numbers matter. The only thing you can't overclock on this card is the memory (five percent increase after a voltage increase).

This card's core is clocked 15% faster than stock, but shows the following scaling in your three games (using your apples-to-apples):

AvP: 26% faster
BFBC2: 14% faster
Metro: 10% faster

That's some pretty meaty scaling for a 15% core overclock!

Then you guys go to the extreme and overclock the card an additional 20%, and get the following scaling (versus HAWK stock speed of 780):

AvP: 14% faster
BFBC2: 6% faster
Metro: 25% faster

So, with the exception of Metro, your benchmarks seem a bit memory bandwidth limited. This means the GTX 460 may have less value as a high-end overclocking GPU, because there are signs that the bandwidth limitation kicks-in around ~800 MHz core speed.

Of course, you'd have to test many more games to get a clearer picture. But it is possible that the low GDDR5 controller speeds are holding this card back.
 
"If we go up to 2560x1600 (which we are not inclined to do with this video card, considering we don’t believe there are many gamers with 30" monitors driven by $250 video cards)"

And your test setup is...
 
zyzeast said:
My palit sonic platinum has no problem hitting 850Mhz without voltage adjustment, not really impressed with the hawk edition.
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I completely agree, factory overclocked cards are often a waste of money. I have the regular Palit card and it will hit 880Mhz with 4Ghz RAM clock without a voltage tweak. The best plan is to buy the cheapest card you can possibly find, then if it does overclock well you've got a great deal and even if it doesn't you're still getting more performance per dollar.
 
One criticism of these cards is that they're not as quiet as one might think. Nonetheless, the heatsink on this card is excellent for modding into a near-silent card without having to spend more on a third party hs/fan. While I do not have the subject card, the heatsink on the MSI Twin Frozr GTX260 is effectively identical (the fans are not similar as the Twin Frozr came with 60mm fans - notably, the noise description in this review is certainly applicable to the Twin Frozr GTX260).

The mod is relatively simply and provides substantial benefit for those looking for a silent card when not gaming and a very quiet card during load. The mod is summarized as follows:
(1) Replace the 80mm fans with two fans that can operate independently. I used 2 x 92mm fans.
(2) Run the inside fan at a constant, but low, rpm with the goal to maintain adequate temps during basic usage (idle, word, browsing, etc). I connected this fan to a fan controller since I do not have sufficient motherboard headers for this fan. On the GTX260 (which from all indications produces more heat than the 460), this fan can run low enough that it is inaudible.
(3) Connect the outside fan (nearest the video outputs) to a motherboard fan header that can be controlled via Speedfan. Speedfan should be configured to start this fan once it has clearly hit a non-idle state.

With this mod, the video card will be silent while idle as only one low rpm fan will be running. At load, it will still be substantially quieter than other cards with stock coolers.

You'll note that the 92mm fans overhang the heatsink. The second picture shows the airflow inhibitors (aka cut and curved cardboard) that directs the overhang air flow back onto the sink.

modun.jpg

mod2k.jpg


Notwithstanding the mod, those looking for a moddable GTX460 may also want to check out the Gigabyte GV-N460OC-1GI GeForce GTX460 which uses a somewhat similar style that would also be subject of a similar mod. The Gigabyte card also retails for less than the MSI Hawk.
 
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Mark_Warner said:
Why do the specs matter? What difference does it really make?

Those numbers are nearly meaningless. Actual performance is the only thing that is really important. Specifications are just bullet points.
Click to expand...

i was just wondering why nvidias memory runs slower then amds. as someone already pointed out it is because of their memory controller.

also at higher rez wouldnt memory bandwidth matter? im not they expert you are, so you tell me.
 
But for another $20, one could have a Galaxy 470. I am a little concerned about my 610 psu holding up to overclocked i7 930/470 combo. :-(
 
Nice review. MSI stuck that same HSF on a 768MB board:

http://us.msi.com/index.php?func=proddesc&maincat_no=130&cat2_no=136&cat3_no=&prod_no=2031

I just grabbed one from Mwave.com this afternoon for $169.99. Nice factory OC, good build quality and nice cooler. For that price (and considering my 1680x1050 monitor) it seemed like a good deal. Up until stumbling across it at Mwave's site I didn't even know it existed - brand new model I guess.

http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearc...X Twin Frozr II SOC 768MB GDDR5 DUAL DVI Min
 
i wondered why so many reviews didn't OC the memory. my galaxy GC runs at 2150 memory. hardocp review shows reference board hitting 2200 memory. it is not as drastic as core clocking but it does indeed help. the base is like 1600-1800 and you can OC to 2100 -2200 on some cards.
 
Jeffredo said:
Nice review. MSI stuck that same HSF on a 768MB board:

http://us.msi.com/index.php?func=proddesc&maincat_no=130&cat2_no=136&cat3_no=&prod_no=2031

I just grabbed one from Mwave.com this afternoon for $169.99. Nice factory OC, good build quality and nice cooler. For that price (and considering my 1680x1050 monitor) it seemed like a good deal. Up until stumbling across it at Mwave's site I didn't even know it existed - brand new model I guess.

http://www.mwave.com/mwave/skusearc...X Twin Frozr II SOC 768MB GDDR5 DUAL DVI Min
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The same style HSF even applied on GTX 480, I've seen it listed on newegg.
 
I can easily get the same speeds on core out of my 768mb Cyclone version. My memory though will max out the afterburner slider @ 1170mhz.
With just the slight voltage bump allowed and the stock cooler.
 
The GPU cleaned up very nicely, but there was a very small amount of gray paste stuck in the tool marks on the heat-sink that just would not come out, even with isopropyl or acetone.
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Try charcoal lighter fluid, have yet to find a thermal paste it wont take off. :cool:
 
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