MKV vs MP4

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XvMMvX

[H]ard|Gawd
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Jan 13, 2005
Messages
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I have chosen the MKV container for my current project of ripping my DVD collection. I am using AnyDVD to rip and then MakeMKV to just repacking the main video and audio files into an MKV (no transcoding). It seems that MKV has been chosen by the "HTPC Scene" as the go to container.

However I have noticed that the retail industry has been going forward with the "Mp4, m4v, etc" containers. I have come across this looking at all of the various "media extenders" on the market. Hardly any of the support the "MKV" container, if I wanted to use any of them I would have to convert and transcode to MP4 (I dont think I can just "repackage"). So I am left with having full windows systems as my extenders.

This is annoying as I can see the MKV container is far surprior.

Any thoughts on why the industry is moving this way?
 
For one, it's an open standard and subject to constant change. What works today may not work tomorrow, and that is expensive to do on hardware. MPEG is thought about by a bunch of brains, and then standards are set in stone. This means you can have a decoder in silicon that won't ever need to be changed or updated, rather than something that may need some flash memory for firmware updates. A lot of people are annoyed that their Blu-ray player even needs an internet connection to update once in a while. Then there is the fact that Matroska is mostly used for piracy rather than legitimate distribution.
 
So are you stating that Mp4 etc is becoming the industry standard, and maybe i should consider using that instead?

I chose MKV because of the ability to just repacking (taking all of 2 minutes) vs re-encoding which would talk about 30-40 minutes per movie.

Thoughts?
 
MP4 will store h.264 or MPEG4 and AAC, and nothing else from what I understand (standards.) Apple adopted MP4, and handheld devices have loved MP4 for a long time. There are plenty of devices with Matroska support, though. If it was me I would be recoding my DVDs to h.264, anyway, but still keep original audio, all in a Matroska container. It makes more sense to rely on a one-time software deinterlace to get a proper picture rather than tax hardware to do it on playback, unless you're in PAL land.
 
What is your endgame? Do you not care that it's fairly possible that the only thing that can play the file in the future is a computer, or a computer like device? Or do you want something that will likely be able to play on standard settop boxes in the future.

And even then, it's not that cut and dry. If you value subtitle support mkv would be a better choice, and chapters can sometimes be a pain in mp4, or multiple languages. I'm starting to see more and more devices but it's like Divx was 8-9 years ago, still fringe.
 
My endgame is simplicity, and I think i understand were you are going. I should be using MP4 (which has been adopted by apple and other large compies).

I like the idea of what Apple TV brings to the table (just dont know if I could stand itunes, I already hate it with our iPhones, but love the phone). A simple small device that streams your movies to your TV.

Not a loud noisy PC like my media center is now.

I might be making the switch to MP4.

More research to do.
 
Plenty more research to do. Not to start a flame war, but the Apple TV is crap. If you want narrow format support, then go for it. There are plenty of other small media players that will do much more than your Apple variant. I'm looking into the WD TV Live Plus.
 
Not to start a flame war, but the Apple TV is crap. If you want narrow format support, then go for it.
Click to expand...

No flame war started, from someone who likes to tinker it probably is crap...BUT I am a techie who likes to tinker with his own stuff. When you have something like a media delivery method to setup it takes a lot of time and effort. I want something that once my work is done the wife can use it with ease. It seems that the MP4 format has been adopted by these types of solutions.

If the format is limited for ATV that is fine, but I want to convert my collection and be done with it. Simple use afterwards. My current setup has been nothing but hassle after hassle (which seems to come with the territory).

Just my opinion.
 
XvMMvX said:
I have chosen the MKV container for my current project of ripping my DVD collection. I am using AnyDVD to rip and then MakeMKV to just repacking the main video and audio files into an MKV (no transcoding). It seems that MKV has been chosen by the "HTPC Scene" as the go to container.

However I have noticed that the retail industry has been going forward with the "Mp4, m4v, etc" containers. I have come across this looking at all of the various "media extenders" on the market. Hardly any of the support the "MKV" container, if I wanted to use any of them I would have to convert and transcode to MP4 (I dont think I can just "repackage"). So I am left with having full windows systems as my extenders.

This is annoying as I can see the MKV container is far surprior.

Any thoughts on why the industry is moving this way?
Click to expand...

There is plenty of MKV Players. WDTV is one and already mention.. There are many more. The AppleTV doesn't even do 1080p.. Stay away from it.
 
And there are some Samsung sets and bluray players that can play mkv for instance. I wasn't trying to steer you anywhere, just stating the negatives as I saw them. I personally use mkv as most of what I have is subtitled and that's personally has been a pain in the ass to get to work right with mp4 at least in my experience, but I also don't mind having a pc connected to my TV either.
 
Getting subtitles to work in MP4 isn't that hard, either. It's just the pain in the ass no matter what if you are starting from Blu-ray's SUP.
 
I'd say about 99% of my collection is in MKV's. I use XBMC and have never had a problem with the MKV's or any other format and my girlfriend uses it with ease.
 
ramicio said:
Getting subtitles to work in MP4 isn't that hard, either. It's just the pain in the ass no matter what if you are starting from Blu-ray's SUP.
Click to expand...

It's more that some of my players are finicky with it, or won't do things like word wrapping of text and such correctly. SUP is involving, but sometimes a SRT can be worse depending on who created it.
 
You're either not creating standard subtitles or the player doesn't meet specs. In the latter case I would be asking for my money back.
 
ramicio said:
You're either not creating standard subtitles or the player doesn't meet specs. In the latter case I would be asking for my money back.
Click to expand...
thats the trouble with media streamers though.. you can never be sure that your files will work on them until you have the device in your possession, and then once you have it you cant *make* the files work. At least on HTPC you can re-mux, re-encode, download/update something or whatever and probably end up with the final product you want. I'd rather be able to work it out myself (most likely for free) than be SOL with something i paid good money for
 
If something is to be branded as fitting in a standard, and that standard doesn't work, that is a BIG no-no. Places like MPEG-LA sue companies for stuff like that.
 
ramicio said:
If something is to be branded as fitting in a standard, and that standard doesn't work, that is a BIG no-no. Places like MPEG-LA sue companies for stuff like that.
Click to expand...
the problem is that the hardware might be compatible with the official standard, but that the files might be slightly out of whack. at least on an htpc you can mess with setting or alternate decoders
 
Running a lightweight HTPC these days doesn't have to mean anything big and noisy either. I recently deployed a couple of Zotac ZBox HTPCs, they're much smaller than a game console, and no noisier. Full 1080p in hardware, runs XBMC very well and looks pretty too. The flexibility of an HTPC is awesome compared to even the best standalone players, but alot of the players are getting pretty good, and very cheap. I think you can even run XBMC on an Apple TV.
 
I am a big fan of MKVs. If I were to record video utilizing my cell phone or my HD camcorder, the bitrate is usually VBR and has a variable frame rate as well. Appending the video stream is very much a PITA and usually the audio becomes unsynched. If I were to just “append” the video and audio stream without actually re-encoding the video and audio streams, it just takes minutes to output a single MKV file, without having to wait hours to encode all of your home movies to CBR, and then append each video to one long one and then do a re-encode and yadda, yadda, yadda…. To me the MKV container is a little more advanced than many other container formats out there.
 
Well, I think you should choose MP4 video, as MP4 is the most widespread used and compatible video format.
Personally, I always use iFunia AVCHD converter to convert HD videos shoot by my Panasonic HD camcorder, ;)
 
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