Microsoft to make Windows security more Mac like

paradoxical said:
I have no idea what you're talking about. In this scenario Barb was running payroll from her Macbook. Duke asked a very stupid question - "why would fortune 500 companies which run predominantly on Macs, like IBM, cease to function if Macs shut down?" He then intimated that there wouldn't actually be any issues, because people "just use macs to SSH into their linux servers."
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Well I run my business purely on Linux machines, so Barb better get with the times or Barb's out with the trash.

Lakados said:
Don’t bother, set up each needed profile as a separate mailbox then give the needed user the various send permissions on the other mailboxes and it adds itself, or at least it’s supposed to, it currently doesn’t and you have to manually add it but I’ve been told that’s a bug and will be resolved one day soon.
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Well that's called a workaround and is hardly a replacement for isolated profiles under Outlook. Essentially, Office under MacOS isn't as fully featured as it is under Windows.

philb2 said:
I hope even millennials are aware that IBM started the modern PC age with their PC introduction in 1981. Intel 8088 CPU and 2 floppy drives.
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In the end, I think the success of the PC had little to do with IBM - I don't think the IBM PC played out exactly as IBM imagined it would.
 
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paradoxical said:
The fact that you are advocating for a major corporation with average users to use Linux proves you have never supported and don't understand both average users and large corporations.
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The story behind Google’s in-house desktop Linux
"If you look around Google’s Mountain View, CA offices, you’ll see Windows machines, Chromebooks, Macs — and gLinux desktops. G what, you ask? Well, in addition to relying on Linux for its servers, Google has its very own Linux desktop distribution."

Switzerland federal government requires releasing its software as open source
"This new law requires all public bodies to disclose the source code of software developed by or for them unless third-party rights or security concerns prevent it. This "public money, public code" approach aims to enhance government operations' transparency, security, and efficiency."

French police move from Windows to Ubuntu Linux
"There are many reasons to switch to a Linux desktop from Windows. Better security; not having to worry over possible built-in privacy leaks; and, last but never least, Linux is cheaper... a lot cheaper."

German state ditches Microsoft for Linux and LibreOffice
"But that's not the case in the European Union (EU) and China, where computer users know all about Microsoft's dominance on the desktop -- and many don't like it. So, when Dirk Schrödter, digitalization minister for the German state of Schleswig-Holstein, announced the state government would switch from proprietary software "towards free, open-source systems and digitally sovereign IT workplaces for the state administration's approximately 30,000 employees," there was cause for rejoicing among Linux desktop fans."
Apple gives me one within the hour for the deductible on Applecare (I just go to the Apple store and get a new one). I press one button in Mosyle and the machine is back to the identical state it was before it failed.
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This is a software situation so you wouldn't go to your local Apple Store to resolve this. Unless you think the drive to your local Apple store is quicker than just inserting a USB stick or even just holding down some keyboard keys and restoring MacOS? Applecare doesn't solve these problems better and quicker.
Good luck with 70 year old Barb from HR running payroll from a linux server.
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Just gonna point to list above. Also, why a Linux server and not a desktop OS? It's not like Apple still makes MacOS server, and there's a reason for that.
Lakados said:
They are easily mitigated at a software level, Cloudstrike, Sentinel One, Coro, they all cover that it’s not a problem. Cisco, PaloAlto, and Fortinet can all detect it at a network level as well. It’s really not an issue or any worse than the current Intel and AMD exploits.
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The problem you don't see is that if Apple is not mitigating their hardware exploits then malware will be made to use it. Unlike AMD and Intel with Spectre and Meltdown where they did mitigate them with a bit of sacrifice to performance. The way to mitigate this flaw would require a massive drop in performance, so Apple's solution is for you to buy an M4. It's not like Apple has stopped selling M2's and M3's either. I'm not a fan of losing CPU performance for security against a flaw that nothing uses, but if there's no mitigation from Apple then it's just a matter of time before malware makes use of it. Just a reminder, Apple had a similar problem with their iPhone due to having undocumented hardware registers and that has resulted in Triangulation and Pegasus. Apple is not a company that anyone should aspire to be when it comes to security.
Google does too much snooping and Google Drive is not seamless. Furthermore, none of the Google suite holds a candle to O365, it’s not even remotely close. Google does do its own MDM solution which functions at the browser level so then you need to operate some form of LDAP server with its own user directory that you feed back to Google unless you want to have a system login and then a service login. Still, then you're going to have one hell of a time with SSO and certificate-based services you try to run. It is too much of a PITA having users need to use multiple logins, trust me, they struggle to remember one.
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Not talking about Google the company but Google's use of Linux. They're not alone. Also, didn't Google give Apple $20 Billion to spy on Apple users? If you're afraid of Google then why aren't you afraid of Apple who's actively giving Google your data freely? I shouldn't say free because Google paid for it. This is why Elon Musk is upset about Apple's use of OpenAI, for the same reasons.
 
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I hope they wait start this new security stuff with Windows 12. I just got Windows 11 deployment and issues resolved at work I don't need something new. Let me finish getting everyone on 11 first :ROFLMAO:
 
DukenukemX said:
The problem you don't see is that if Apple is not mitigating their hardware exploits then malware will be made to use it. Unlike AMD and Intel with Spectre and Meltdown where they did mitigate them with a bit of sacrifice to performance. The way to mitigate this flaw would require a massive drop in performance, so Apple's solution is for you to buy an M4. It's not like Apple has stopped selling M2's and M3's either. I'm not a fan of losing CPU performance for security against a flaw that nothing uses, but if there's no mitigation from Apple then it's just a matter of time before malware makes use of it. Just a reminder, Apple had a similar problem with their iPhone due to having undocumented hardware registers and that has resulted in Triangulation and Pegasus. Apple is not a company that anyone should aspire to be when it comes to security.
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This one can’t be not in M2 or M1, M3 has a flag that disables the one aspect of the prefetch rendering the attack useless. But it is a fundamental hardware flaw that can’t be fixed with microcode.

To exploit it though you need to install malicious software that has root access. At that stage this flaw is a minor thing. Because you’ve given malicious software root access and they can get just about anything at that point.

https://www.zetter-zeroday.com/apple-chips/

At some point someone may find a way to make it a drive by, but that hasn’t happened yet. But people are undoubtedly working on it.

Pegasus works as well on Android as it does Apple, that’s an ever evolving threat developed by a government sponsored spy agency. That’s not the same thing. Pegasus is not a single attack, how it works and what it exploits to gain access changes constantly. The current implementation most likely requires access to a compromised cell tower it’s not something that some random group is taking advantage of.

All Apple did for Google was take their $20B and make them the default search engine, that’s it.
Apple also blocks the cookies, scripts, and telemetry that Google uses to track users by default choosing for an opt-in approach to tracking instead of the more common opt-out used on Android and Microsoft.
 
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DukenukemX said:
Not talking about Google the company but Google's use of Linux. They're not alone. Also, didn't Google give Apple $20 Billion to spy on Apple users? If you're afraid of Google then why aren't you afraid of Apple who's actively giving Google your data freely? I shouldn't say free because Google paid for it. This is why Elon Musk is upset about Apple's use of OpenAI, for the same reasons.
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The way people phrase things... they pay apple to be the default search on their device. How you using the free google search engine can possibly be called your data and not Google data ? No one expect directly asking google a search something google would not know about when they use their phone.

And they news make it sound like the discovery of Google paying 20 billions apple was some news when it was 18 billion for the year before: https://www.businessinsider.com/goo...3-10?utm_medium=referral&utm_source=yahoo.com

And it was know for a long time that google paid to be the default search on device:
https://www.businessinsider.com/apple-bargaining-power-over-google-search-mobile-safari-ios-2016-2
 
Lakados said:
This one can’t be not in M2 or M1, M3 has a flag that disables the one aspect of the prefetch rendering the attack useless. But it is a fundamental hardware flaw that can’t be fixed with microcode.
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Who's controlling the flag that switches on it on or off on M3's? Seems pointless if any application can do it. As a reminder, Apple still sells Vision Pro's with M2's and just started to sell iPad's with M2's.
To exploit it though you need to install malicious software that has root access. At that stage this flaw is a minor thing. Because you’ve given malicious software root access and they can get just about anything at that point.

https://www.zetter-zeroday.com/apple-chips/
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The article you linked disagrees.
"How does an attacker trick the processor? They can do this by slipping malicious code into an application that a user downloads to their computer. The GoFetch attack code they created doesn’t require root access on a machine to work; it can trick the processor into doing this with just the same level of access that any third-party application has on a machine."
"It’s also theoretically possible for an attacker to pull this off by embedding malicious code into Javascript on a web site so that when a computer with an M-series chip visits the site, the attacker’s malicious code can conduct the attack to grab data from the cache. The researchers didn’t test a web site attack, but Green says the scenario is plausible. It would also be a more concerning attack, he notes, because attackers could scale it to attack thousands of computers quickly."
At some point someone may find a way to make it a drive by, but that hasn’t happened yet. But people are undoubtedly working on it.
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It's the same situation as Spectre and Meltdown and everyone had a panic attack over it. Within a week mitigations were created and distributed because thousands of businesses depend on their data being kept secure.
Pegasus works as well on Android as it does Apple, that’s an ever evolving threat developed by a government sponsored spy agency. That’s not the same thing. Pegasus is not a single attack, how it works and what it exploits to gain access changes constantly. The current implementation most likely requires access to a compromised cell tower it’s not something that some random group is taking advantage of.
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Pegasus didn't infect Android devices as universally as it did with iPhones.
All Apple did for Google was take their $20B and make them the default search engine, that’s it.
Apple also blocks the cookies, scripts, and telemetry that Google uses to track users by default choosing for an opt-in approach to tracking instead of the more common opt-out used on Android and Microsoft.
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"Google was paying 36 percent of the total revenue that it earns from searches conducted on Safari". How you think Google was making money off Apple devices? Google had to be collecting data off Apple users. Again, this is the same concern with Apple's use of OpenAI as they also collect data. Of course Apple says they don't but what's stopping OpenAI?
 
DukenukemX said:
"Google was paying 36 percent of the total revenue that it earns from searches conducted on Safari". How you think Google was making money off Apple devices? Google had to be collecting data off Apple users. Again, this is the same concern with Apple's use of OpenAI as they also collect data. Of course Apple says they don't but what's stopping OpenAI?
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By exposing Apple user to google ads and paid links, google monetize traffic on its platform, being the default search engine on the apple device make their traffic jump a lot (from the best rich users)

Has for collecting data off apple users, having all those users google action (search, what they looked like, time spend, link pressed, etc...) would already by enough they do not need access to the user data outside their own google data.
 
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DukenukemX said:
Who's controlling the flag that switches on it on or off on M3's? Seems pointless if any application can do it. As a reminder, Apple still sells Vision Pro's with M2's and just started to sell iPad's with M2's.
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You need to install something with root access, users don’t get that on iOS and what ever the OS on the Vision Pro is. So it’s not really a concern there. The attacker would need to get their corrupted Trojan uploaded to the Apple Store get past the security checks there and then convince somebody to install it, and even then I’m pretty sure in iOS, applications only get user access so I’m not sure it could even work on the platform.

It’s an issue that AI bots blew up for clicks because it has Apple in the title and it’s unfixable so it’s a great headline. But any means of exploiting the issue requires so many security clearances that by the time you can exploit it, you’ve already done all it does and more so it would simply be icing on the evil cake.

From what I understand of the flag on the M3 is in the OS as they just patched it to be off or on or which ever the way they needed it to be was. Then removed the toggle switch from the UI so you would need to find the file that UI toggled and change it manually. Which would require you to enter usernames and passwords to do, just so you could install the program which would again require usernames and passwords to be entered.

It would be the logical equivalent of disabling MMU which in Linux you would need to go to grub boot find the iommu flag and change it from on to off, then run your grub_update command, so you could reboot and then install some sketchy program from some unknown repository giving it your root or sudo passwords as you go. If your going to those lengths to install a program your getting what you asked for.

But to install a program in MacOS you need to give it credentials that have access to install. Most single user Mac’s that will be the local administrator, but that still requires somebody to manually input the username and password. So you can’t drive by on it, you need to give the program admin access to install in the first place. MacOS will prompt for credentials on any install or update tasks. Once installed it can run in any user context but you need to provide admin access to get it on there in the first place.
 
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The better Article headline and thread title, would have been
"Microsoft to limit kernel access"

Which is the exact right thing to do, and who gives a f^$k about all this Mac vs Windows vs Linux vs Android bullshit...

But, you gotta drive them clicks....
 
DukenukemX said:
Pegasus didn't infect Android devices as universally as it did with iPhones.
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You keep speaking as if Pegasus is a past event. The NSO group actively maintains the package and claims it is currently 100% effective on all iOS, Android, and BlackBerry versions.

There was the 3 CVE combo discovered on iOS that Pegasus was actively exploiting back in 2021, that Apple patched out but that was one attack vector they use in the platform, not the while thing.

It was recently revealed that the NSO group has been exploiting an unknown flaw in MMS going as far back as 2019. They call it MMS Fingerprinting.
https://www.darkreading.com/applica...gerprinting-zero-click-attack-spyware-arsenal

“Because the developers of MMS introduced it at a time when not all mobile devices were compatible with the service, they decided to use a special type of SMS (called "WSP Push") as a way to notify recipient devices of pending MMS messages in the recipient's MMSC. The subsequent retrieval request is not really an MMS but a HHTP GET request sent to a content URL listed in a content location field in the notification, the researcher wrote.

"The interesting thing here, is that within this HTTP GET, user device information is included," he wrote. McDaid concluded that this likely was how the NSO Group obtained the targeted device information.”

Based on the device information obtained the NSO group tailor fits the attack to get through. It is not a one size fits all, it is a targeted attack, that often makes use of a Stingray type device to function as a man in the middle when the group paying for their services can’t get access to the cellular infrastructure itself.
 
Mazzspeed said:
Tell me 70yo Barb shouldn't have retired 10 years ago.
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Thanks for reinforcing my point. BTW, there is nothing wrong with being a small mom and pop style operation - it's just that the realities you face aren't the same as ones from companies that employ many more people and have more diversity (in terms of age, skill set, etc) in the workplace.
 
DukenukemX said:
And what do they use the Macs for? iOS app development? SSH into Linux servers? They wouldn't be able to do presentations for a day? All the DJ's wouldn't be able to work? :ROFLMAO:
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i run serato on Windows. always have been.

all audio programs that run on both windows and Mac run better on Windows, with the right hardware of course. and it's cheaper. and judging by the forums don't think Macs don't have their bugs. they aren't perfect by any means
 
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