Microsoft Surface Prices Revealed?

Microsoft's partners had to be shitting in their pants when they heard the tablet rumor last week. Apparently none of the knew about Surface. But I bet some folks at Apple and Google wished they hadn't had that much fiber that day as well.

What if Microsoft had decided that had to win in the tablet space no matter what it took. What if they had priced at cost plus a normal large OEM cost per unit license fee? They could have literally taken over the tablet space. Imagine a device like the Surface Pro running in the price range and the RT significantly cheaper. Even Apple couldn't shrug that off.

But the whole computer industry would be in a whirlwind with lawsuits flying all over. The proposition of Microsoft being a major computer hardware maker has to scare everyone. In fact Acer's CEO said that he thought that Surface was just a onetime thing and that Microsoft wouldn't be in the game but for this one and only time. And the rest of Microsoft's partners have been really, really quiet.

If it were Microsoft's intentions to really compete in the tablet space alone as hardware maker with devices the quality of Surface at prices of at cost plus Windows license fee, yeah, that would be some serious shit.
 
wonderfield said:
The problem with that is that other OEMs won't be able to sufficiently compete. There's no way for them to subsidize costs on there,
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Apparently, OEMs cannot compete now anyway, thanks to Apple.
You think Microsoft wants to delay Windows 8, for OEM Tablets to be good enough?
 
jwcalla said:
Tablets are for leisure and entertainment, not work.
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I use tablets for work all of the time, because they run Windows. Breaking free is great and all but something that puts money in my pocket is pretty cool too.
 
Before the iPad. Portable computers like laptops and tablets were aimed at Professionals.
 
800 for the pro is actually a fair price (with the pen a keyboard). I really have to try one with a text editor to see if it is usable for any length of time, I'm not sure how happy my eyes will be using a screen over 4x the density of my desktop display.

I think you would be crazy to buy an Ultrabook(tm) now. Even if you don't buy one of these, they will push the price down and everyone will start offering touch screens.
 
I thought HardOCP members were supposed to be intelligent and informed? I'm seeing a lot of misinformation, speculation with no basis in facts, and strawman arguments on what amounts to two, almost, wild guesses about their price.

We're months away from their release and trusting every "industry insider" out there is sort of like trusting Walt Mossberg to be an unbiased reviewer of Apple products. Why is it so hard for people to wait for the official pricing?
 
If the Pro version is gonna be 800, I would be tempted to buy one at that price.The big what-if is if Windows 8 is going to get decent developer support for touchscreen applications.
 
Price is to high, these are too late, saw the keyboards already have flaws.

I'll stick with my iPad for a tablet and a PC for a computer.

And...if I wanted a notebook, I'd buy a notebook.
 
Oh well it was fun while it lasted...

In the UK that means £599 ($928) and £799 ($1238) for us most likely.

But then again MS isn't Adobe so it could mean £400 and £500. Still too pricey for me.
 
I had a feeling it would be overpriced (for the market). I'm sure being an i5 platform, it probably is expensive to make, and it may justify the price.

But in the world of sub $500 tablets, I don't see it doing well.

Apple has always been able to get away with a bit of a premium on their stuff, but Microsoft doesn't have that ability, nor does it have the vision or design to ever be able to pull it off.
 
I think Microsoft is targeting the wrong company to compete against. The Kindle Fire has sold nearly as well as the iPad 2 and I doubt that is going to change. Amazon's tablet has single handedly brought the Android OS to the same level of consumer penetration that Apple has. Microsoft's strength has never been stability and construction materials it has been the ability to get thier software into the hands of the masses at reasonable prices. I am excited to see how the pro version of thier tablet performs. I don't think the RT version will do very well though. Online Publishers Association has a good write up on the current state of tablets and expected future growth. http://onlinepubs.ehclients.com/ima...t_of_Tablet_User-Wave_2_--_Jun12_(Public).pdf
 
Darth Millennial said:
Why is $599 high when it comes with 32GB of memory and the iPad 32GB is $599?:confused:
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I don't think it's a high price, honestly, but I think they'll still have a problem selling them with the lead Apple already has with the iPad (same thing that happened with the zune).

They'd have to make it REALLY attractive to entice buyers away from the iPad and cheaper Android tablets (both of which have a much better software catalog to boot). The only people I can really see buying the ARM version are geeks like us that want a complete ecosystem (WP8, Win8, Win8 ARM).

The pro version on the other hand, I can see being useful in the design community depending on the specs of the stylus. I really wish Apple would get off their asses and develop a proper stylus for the iPad (w/ palm rejection)/API for iOS. It's a crime to have that sort of resolution with a great library of sketch/painting apps, only to be forced to use a stylus the size of your finger.
 
$799 is a lot less expensive than I would have thought. And again, it's not going to compete with the iPad, since it's a full desktop OS. With a few choice applications, like a good art and a good design program designed to work with the stylus, it could really sell in a business environment. Hell, in my company they're considering the iPad, but some people are pushing them to check out the Surface instead.
 
ballistic90 said:
$799 is a lot less expensive than I would have thought. And again, it's not going to compete with the iPad, since it's a full desktop OS.
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I don't know about that. With a few notable exceptions, theres not a whole lot that you can do on a fullscale OS that you can't do on a mobile OS these days (iOS or Android), especially in the workplace. If the OS can't do it nativly, there are countless 3rd party applications to take over where it falls short. It's not going to have an easy time selling (I still want one though)
 
ballistic90 said:
$799 is a lot less expensive than I would have thought. And again, it's not going to compete with the iPad, since it's a full desktop OS. With a few choice applications, like a good art and a good design program designed to work with the stylus, it could really sell in a business environment. Hell, in my company they're considering the iPad, but some people are pushing them to check out the Surface instead.
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The Surface Pro will be HUGE in the enterprise environment. The Execs will go batshit when they find out.

I agree on the price. I was expecting $999 for the 64GB Pro. Imma buy a Pro for sure!! :D
 
dr.stevil said:
I don't know about that. With a few notable exceptions, theres not a whole lot that you can do on a fullscale OS that you can't do on a mobile OS these days (iOS or Android), especially in the workplace. If the OS can't do it nativly, there are countless 3rd party applications to take over where it falls short. It's not going to have an easy time selling (I still want one though)
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One thing you can't do on mobile OS tablets that's pretty big these days in a lot of workplaces is multiple monitors and multiple programs. And iPads don't even work with mice officially.
 
Don't worry guys, I have the solution.

tumblr_lzfc7ie90U1qfm0bto1_500.jpg
 
So if the Pro has Windows 8, essentially a full-scale operating system, why does it only have 64GBs of hard drive? On my PC I think Office takes up about 7 gigs. I'm worried if you want to have all your work applications on the tablet, the hard drive might be too small. I'm only thinking out loud but if someone has a better understanding of tablets, I am interested to read their thoughts.
 
Kelby said:
So if the Pro has Windows 8, essentially a full-scale operating system, why does it only have 64GBs of hard drive? On my PC I think Office takes up about 7 gigs. I'm worried if you want to have all your work applications on the tablet, the hard drive might be too small. I'm only thinking out loud but if someone has a better understanding of tablets, I am interested to read their thoughts.
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At least in enterprise world, everyone has an ipad of some sort. They bring it to meetings, lunch, scrums, etc etc. They use their ultrabook/laptops for working @ home/vacation/remote offices. The Tablet, especially a windows 8 based will allow the enterprise to have even greater interoperability between the two. The Tab hasnt replaced the laptop by any means, its just allowed the laptop to become more of a workhorse when you are somewhere to work, not just bust out some notes/presentation/etc etc.


I see this potentially having a huge impact in the enterprise world.
 
Kelby said:
So if the Pro has Windows 8, essentially a full-scale operating system, why does it only have 64GBs of hard drive?
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It all comes down to cost. MS could easily put a TB in the Surface but no one would be willing to drop $4k on it. :rolleyes:
 
dr.stevil said:
I don't know about that. With a few notable exceptions, theres not a whole lot that you can do on a fullscale OS that you can't do on a mobile OS these days (iOS or Android), especially in the workplace. If the OS can't do it nativly, there are countless 3rd party applications to take over where it falls short. It's not going to have an easy time selling (I still want one though)
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The issue is that even on the iPad, 3rd party apps leave alot to be desired. I'm using FileExplorer (free one) to browse my WHS and while it works, I'm not a fan of the iOS UI when looking at photos, nor do my videos with their encoding work.

If I get a MS Surface Pro, it should take care of all those issues...

I think the Window RT version might be a bit overpriced depending on Specs, but if the Pro model is under 1K, I'll pre-order one.
 
Kelby said:
So if the Pro has Windows 8, essentially a full-scale operating system, why does it only have 64GBs of hard drive? On my PC I think Office takes up about 7 gigs. I'm worried if you want to have all your work applications on the tablet, the hard drive might be too small. I'm only thinking out loud but if someone has a better understanding of tablets, I am interested to read their thoughts.
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7GB for office? Try again. I have Office 2010 and it's 1.11GB. My workstation in the office has never gone over 30GB in usage. Everything is stored on servers. So for enterprise scenarios, the tablet will be fine.
 
Darth Millennial said:
Why is $599 high when it comes with 32GB of memory and the iPad 32GB is $599?:confused:
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Simply because "Hi, I'm Mr. New Tablet! I am the same price as the iPad...please buy me!" has never worked. ANd I do mean N.E.V.E.R.

The tablets / devices that HAVE worked (most recently, the Kindle Fire) blasted out of the gate with solid features and WAY cheaper than anything Apple offered.
 
$599 is high because you get an ARM chip and miss the point of a Windows operating system in the first place. Who the hell buys a Microsoft tablet, pays the $85 fee for win8 and gets no legacy support to run desktop applications? That WinRT tablet is an absolutely horrendous buy, regardless of the price.

The Pro otoh at least makes a bit of sense (to some of you. The idea still confuses the shit out of me) because you can replace your laptop with some of the functionality -- not all. you're still using win8 and a crappy keyboard ;P
 
4saken said:
At least in enterprise world, everyone has an ipad of some sort. They bring it to meetings, lunch, scrums, etc etc.
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Only have 3 iPads connected to the office exchange servers.
2 of them are older managers who have trouble reading emails on thier phones, so they bought an ipad for the bigger screen. 3rd person is a marketing manger - enough said :)
 
Steve said:
Simply because "Hi, I'm Mr. New Tablet! I am the same price as the iPad...please buy me!" has never worked. ANd I do mean N.E.V.E.R.

The tablets / devices that HAVE worked (most recently, the Kindle Fire) blasted out of the gate with solid features and WAY cheaper than anything Apple offered.
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But you have to consider that Microsoft isn't trying to compete with it's partners. Considering that Microsoft isn't even going to sell these in general retail, Surface will only be available through Microsoft Stores and online store, at least for now it's not Microsoft's intent to push this device.

However, there is a warning shot being fired here. If OEMs drop the ball on this, Microsoft looks to be preparing itself to take on its partners. Just think if Microsoft sold Surface at cost plus whatever an OEM gets charged. The term iPad killer is way overused but at that price point, you got a couple.

The all of the business and legal implications of doing that are beyond comprehension. It would the the most fundamental change in the PC business ever. I don't think Microsoft nor any computer hardware maker would ever want to see Microsoft pursue an aggressive PC hardware business.
 
heatlesssun said:
One thing you can't do on mobile OS tablets that's pretty big these days in a lot of workplaces is multiple monitors and multiple programs. And iPads don't even work with mice officially.
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While true, I'm wondering why you'd want a tablet to support it at all.

The only benefit of having a tablet over a dedicated workstation or laptop is mobility/battery life. It might work with it, but it seems like it would be a pretty cumbersome experience.

The issue is that even on the iPad, 3rd party apps leave alot to be desired. I'm using FileExplorer (free one) to browse my WHS and while it works, I'm not a fan of the iOS UI when looking at photos, nor do my videos with their encoding work.

If I get a MS Surface Pro, it should take care of all those issues...
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Try some other apps. There are tons of solutions avalible for streaming photos/music/video to the iPad
 
face2palm said:
The Surface Pro will be HUGE in the enterprise environment. The Execs will go batshit when they find out.
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This. Our execs, sales, and marketing people will have us ordering these up like hotcakes.
 
heatlesssun said:
But you have to consider that Microsoft isn't trying to compete with it's partners.
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Yes they are. They're charging their partners an OEM license for win8 and winRT and have their own tablet up for sale, therefore they're directly competing with their partners.

It's a different story with google who doesn't charge anything for Android. The Google service (Android) isn't factored into the equation whereas with MS it means an MS equivalent from an OEM will be more expensive because MS has to charge a licensing fee.
 
pelo said:
Yes they are. They're charging their partners an OEM license for win8 and winRT and have their own tablet up for sale, therefore they're directly competing with their partners.
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If Microsoft were really trying to compete with its partners why is Surface only going to be available from Microsoft's retail channels?
 
heatlesssun said:
If Microsoft were really trying to compete with its partners why is Surface only going to be available from Microsoft's retail channels?
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You're aware this works both ways...

If Microsoft weren't competing with their partners then why would they sell the tablet via retailers in the first place?
 
DOA. You're not going to compete with the ipad by being the same price. This will end up where blackberry is now, limited to a few corporate types who think they're too good for a real smartphone.
 
dr.stevil said:
The only benefit of having a tablet over a dedicated workstation or laptop is mobility/battery life. It might work with it, but it seems like it would be a pretty cumbersome experience.
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Surface may not be the best solution but there will be x86 Windows 8 devices with folding keyboard and workstation docks. I have a stationary dock with for my Samsung Series 7 Slate and I be using it in the dock with an external monitor, keyboard and mouse, pull it out the dock, pick up the pen and take what it was working on and never miss a beat.

On of this biggest challenges that devices like Surface has is that few have seen anything like them and can't readily identify what's cool and useful about them. A number of analysts are saying that they expect Windows 8 to start out slow and I do to. But as more of devices like Surface cone into the marketplace at lower price points and as people see them and use them and talk about them, it's going to raise interest.

[/QUOTE]
Try some other apps. There are tons of solutions avalible for streaming photos/music/video to the iPad[/QUOTE]

One thing that's very cool about Windows x86 tablets, You have the same file system that you do on the desktop and even servers and it connects seamlessly to a network.
 
pelo said:
You're aware this works both ways...

If Microsoft weren't competing with their partners then why would they sell the tablet via retailers in the first place?
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Lots of reasons beyond Microsoft trying to sell lots of tablets. The biggest one just bringing attention to Windows 8. Still months away and Surface is already the best known Windows devices ever. And it is a nudge to Microsoft's partners to step up their game. Windows has languished in a see of cheap crap hardware.
 
Ryan711 said:
DOA. You're not going to compete with the ipad by being the same price. This will end up where blackberry is now, limited to a few corporate types who think they're too good for a real smartphone.
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Agreed. The Surface with Win RT has absolutely no chance, much to the eventual ultimate dismay of the delusional. The Pro has a decent shot, though. Not great, but at least decent.
 
But then why put it out for sale? Why not make the RT license cheaper if you know the consumer is getting the short end of the stick? (and that's beyond doubt. As far as App support for ARM you're better by a long shot opting to go with iOS and Android). Why make the RT tablet that expensive considering the better and cheaper alternatives? x768 resolution at 16:9 and a crappy cloth-like simulation keyboard? Hell, why release an ARM-based tablet at all if you're only getting basic Student Office from x86 and left to fend for yourself on a closeted OS?

Not to mention the OEMs didn't find out until the announcement Monday along with the rest of the world. That doesn't exactly inspire confidence as far as the relationship of trust between MS and OEMs. It's something Apple does.

Suddenly, a wild product appears.

Except you're saying that MS isn't competing with the OEMs but rather it just serves for inspiration? So you can't buy one? The OEMs are paying outrageous prices for licensing that will make the MS tablet always the better deal? Get real. A software company can't make a hardware product then turn around and charge for the required software and claim it's not competing directly. They are absolutely competing directly.
 
I don't see the point. A tablet screen is too small for x86 desktop applications to be viable, especially with bad DPI scaling in windows and with an inprecise pen tool (using menus and stuff with a very high-res graphics tablet is still difficult, let alone a cheap touch screen). Touch screens just aren't sensative enough to peck at tiny buttons. They are barely adequate for giant buttons that you see in Android and iOS.

What this means is you will be stuck with metro for productivity and I don't see windows metro apps taking off. The small amount of hard drive space is going to hurt productivity as well.

I do see three advantages:

1. Compatibility with windows networks and sys admins
2. Docking could be powerful
3. Can easily hook up with a windows media server

But I see problems too, despite these advatages. Tablets are low-powered devices, so you can't dock it and run photoshop, maya, or games (well, at least at any capacity acceptable to enthusiasts/professionals). Docking and hooking up to a real keyboard, mouse, and monitor is messy and adds expense (no, a flat-mat keyboard isn't usable for productivity, you will want a real one).

At that point, why not just get a laptop with more power that remains portable?

Honestly, I don't see how this can compete with Apple or even Amazon. The problem remains that the windows desktop sucks on mobile and that metro sucks on desktops. It looks awesome on paper, but when I think of how I would use it, the reality is that it would function as either a watered-down iPad or watered-down laptop. The high price doesn't help.

I don't understand Microsoft's approach here. I don't understand it from the perspective of a professional (rather have a business laptop with docking station), mass market consumer (Apple is far more known and stylish), or an enthusiast (rather have a laptop and a smart phone). I have used watered-down hardware before and it is not fun for gaming or for productivity. A high-end business laptop is even barely adequate compared to a desktop.
 
A tablet was a product that filled a large gap between the laptop and the smartphone. With this, MS is looking to fill a tight gap between notebooks and tablets. I say tight because you can get Ultrabooks with better specs, equal quality displays and natural full keyboards at roughly the same price and they're not much heavier. A "productivity tablet" is just a fancy way of saying "light laptop."
 
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