Microsoft Buys GitHub Confirmed

cageymaru said:
Skype. Nokia. Etc.

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also HDCD now music industry trying to push mqa which kinda same philosophy (encode all the hi-res goodness in an inaudible signal) but (unlike hdcd) unless you have mqa decoder you get a lossy (see mp3) signal.

its almost as if they buy these ip's with the intent on burning them to the ground???
 
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Looks like the internet is speaking it's opinion on this...

upload_2018-6-5_8-54-5.png


https://monitor.gitlab.net/dashboard/db/github-importer?orgId=1&from=1526975431730&to=1528185031732
 
Biznatch said:
And here I thought most skilled devs were impressed/aware of MS's push to integrate open source products with windows and how they have been pushing their code to public git repos.... I can get the blind hate from basic (non-tech) users crying about win 10. But when people in the actual industry are jumping on the blind hate wagon, that is pretty pathetic.... I don't even need to run a separate linux VM anymore for devops tasks that can't be run on windows now that they brought over multiple varieties of linux shells. VS code is by far the best editor available, and most devs at our office have switched from atom. MS may have dropped the ball with win10 by following apple/googles insane mining for data, but they are making huge progress in the devops/development world.
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Blind hate? That is a leap. Historically, Microsoft has screwed up more than they have fixed as it applies to the execution of well established brands. Microsoft has brought this on themselves.

I have a responsibility to my customers and when they ask how this was going to impact them going forwward, there is nothing I can say because Microsoft has a history of doing what is good for Microsoft at the expense of its users. My risk assessment and judgement, based on over 30 years in this business is to get out of there while it is easy to do so. There are too many unknowns to risk a business on right now.

By the way, the Visual Studio editor is great, but do not forget how screwed up VS2015 was either. VS2017 finally fixed those issues. I still do not care for the flat look though.
 
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BSmith said:
Blind hate? That is a leap. Historically, Microsoft has screwed up more than they have fixed as it applies to the execution of well established brands. Microsoft has brought this on themselves.

I have a responsibility to my customers and when they ask how this was going to impact them going forwward, there is nothing I can say because Microsoft has a history of doing what is good for Microsoft at the expense of its users. My risk assessment and judgement, based on over 30 years in this business is to get out of there while it is easy to do so. There are too many unknowns to risk a business on right now.

By the way, the Visual Studio editor is great, but do not forget how screwed up VS2015 was either. VS2017 finally fixed those issues. I still do not care for the flat look though.
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Some of that is a stretch or is a double standard there. One bad release and everything in the VS line is a complete pile of shit. Apple has had bad releases of OS X, bad hardware releases hence the class action lawsuits against them for keyboards, has been found to purposely brick / degrade older phones with newer iOS releases. So they also have a track record of being anti customer. Google has a track record of making stuff that fails and goes away, while also being anti customer and tracking more than they should...

No company has a perfect track record with everything. So you better just tell your customers to stick to paper and pen.
 
Can only wonder how long until they move on to the gaming frontier and buy GOG. That strategy would fit the pattern so far. Got a branch that's not meeting a stellar performance tier, then buy out the nearest competitor that's have a weak moment. Granted, I don't think GOG is having a hard time but can't help to wonder how much of MS resources getting ready to pounce when they do. I think we all know what an amazing piece of something that MS store is.
 
My company uses Bitbucket, but I'm looking forward to the internet meltdown from Linux bros over this. :)
 
Exavior said:
Some of that is a stretch or is a double standard there. One bad release and everything in the VS line is a complete pile of shit. Apple has had bad releases of OS X, bad hardware releases hence the class action lawsuits against them for keyboards, has been found to purposely brick / degrade older phones with newer iOS releases. So they also have a track record of being anti customer. Google has a track record of making stuff that fails and goes away, while also being anti customer and tracking more than they should...

No company has a perfect track record with everything. So you better just tell your customers to stick to paper and pen.
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You kind of went off the deep end there and took my comment out of context. I never said VS was a "complete pile of shit". Overall it is a good program and has been the benefactor of many years of development.
 
I wish Google or Facebook bought GitHub instead. This would ensure GitHub stayed a high quality platform, at least in the medium term.

I have a good deal of code currently on GitHub. I'm not so pessimistic that I'm going to move immediately, but I'll be sure to be ready to do so at any moment's notice.
 
AVT said:
I wish Google or Facebook bought GitHub instead. This would ensure GitHub stayed a high quality platform, at least in the medium term.

I have a good deal of code currently on GitHub. I'm not so pessimistic that I'm going to move immediately, but I'll be sure to be ready to do so at any moment's notice.
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Wut?..... What do you mean stayed high quality platform? What have you heard that makes you think otherwise, other than OMG it's MS, I hate teh MS!!!!?.... If MS were going to steal any code, it would be all the .net code they already store on VSTS. Which is a fantastic CI/CD tool for anyone in the .net world. So I'm still trying to understand all the panic from open source people stuck on impressions of MS from almost 20 years ago, when there has been no news that should induce any panic.
 
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Biznatch said:
And here I thought most skilled devs were impressed/aware of MS's push to integrate open source products with windows and how they have been pushing their code to public git repos.... I can get the blind hate from basic (non-tech) users crying about win 10. But when people in the actual industry are jumping on the blind hate wagon, that is pretty pathetic.... I don't even need to run a separate linux VM anymore for devops tasks that can't be run on windows now that they brought over multiple varieties of linux shells. VS code is by far the best editor available, and most devs at our office have switched from atom. MS may have dropped the ball with win10 by following apple/googles insane mining for data, but they are making huge progress in the devops/development world.
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What in the world made you think criticism of Microsoft's behaviour, based on their factual history of destroying things, is blind, or from non-tech users? I'm pretty sure the criticisms of that history come from tech users. So, you must be outside of tech circles yourself to have come to that conclusion. Otherwise, you're just shilling nonsense to try to intimidate people into not criticizing Microsoft - which is pathetic.

MS may have dropped the ball with win10 by following apple/googles insane mining for data
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Microsoft is leading both Apple and Google in the amount of data they are harvesting. Every little step you take in Windows 10 is recorded and sent to Microsoft's servers.

But the vast amounts of data harvesting is far from the only issue with Satya Nadella's Microsoft What about a lack of system owner control, the forced updates, the terrible quality control with each major update, all the bogus marketing propaganda and lies, the deliberate disregard for customers by resetting configurations with updates to MS defaults and the probably-intentional repeated breaking of 3rd-party UI replacements, the in-OS ads (which can return with updates), the programs that auto-reinstall with updates, the dumb psychological tricks MS likes to play like calling Win32 programs "Classic" to try to suggest that UWP is somehow more modern (despite instead being more limited) to try to coax people into using Microsoft Store which Microsoft is trying to turn into a walled-garden... and so many other things?
 
Just a bit of a history to remind or inform people of why Microsoft might not be well trusted by the tech community:


Microsoft has a history of employing the tactic of Embrace, Extend, Exterminate to kill competition, or to make open standards Microsoft's own. Standards that have been affected by Microsoft doing EEE at some point or another include:

SMB
Active Directory/LDAP/Kerberos
exFAT
ODF/docx
HTML and CSS
C++/C#


Microsoft has a history of seeking to undermine open source software:

http://www.catb.org/esr/halloween/
http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2007/05/28/100033867/
https://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-profits-from-linux-patent-fud/
http://techrights.org/2010/10/14/msft-scorpion-and-the-tortoise/
http://techrights.org/2016/03/10/charm-offensives-distract/
http://techrights.org/2018/01/16/microsoft-uses-patent-trolls/


Microsoft likes personal customer data - even when the people it comes from aren't Microsoft customers:



Microsoft has a habit of arbitrarily dumping services and screwing over those who used them, such as was the case with the GFWL fiasco. There was also the shuttering of Ensemble Studios, of FASA Studio, of Lionhead Studios...

And, of course, there are the ongoing very many Windows 10 fiascos, which I mentioned some of in my previous post.

Microsoft also has a habit of arbitrarily and retroactively taking away things people depended upon: Free One Drive space, Group Policy editor features in editions of Windows 10...

There is also the fact that Microsoft lie through their teeth constantly, and only ever say what they calculate would be good-sounding for their business, regardless of whether it is true or not.


So, there are just some of the reasons why Microsoft isn't that trusted by the informed tech community.
 
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Biznatch said:
And here I thought most skilled devs were impressed/aware of MS's push to integrate open source products with windows and how they have been pushing their code to public git repos.... I can get the blind hate from basic (non-tech) users crying about win 10. But when people in the actual industry are jumping on the blind hate wagon, that is pretty pathetic.... I don't even need to run a separate linux VM anymore for devops tasks that can't be run on windows now that they brought over multiple varieties of linux shells. VS code is by far the best editor available, and most devs at our office have switched from atom. MS may have dropped the ball with win10 by following apple/googles insane mining for data, but they are making huge progress in the devops/development world.
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For one, Apple isn't in the business of data collection -- Apple sells devices and services. Try watching their latest WWDC and pay attention to the bit about OS-level Facebook "features".
Apple is afaik one of the only FAANG (or whatever the acronym is nowadays) tech giants NOT to monetize customer data.

Second, any "skilled" dev stopped trusting Microsoft and their shithouse of tools when this news broke: https://www.infoq.com/news/2016/06/visual-cpp-telemetry
When this was revealed, Microsoft first claimed ignorance, then made it an optional setting; however the default was still for telemetry insertion to be 'on' by default for a while.
"Skilled" devs love when IDEs insert hidden phone-home/telemetry features!

Microsoft isn't "integrating", Microsoft is consolidating and trying to recapture and ensnare developers who have rightfully abandoned their products.

"VS code is by far the best editor available and most devs at our office have switched from atom" ... said no "skilled" dev ever.
 
heatlesssun said:
Jesus didn't have 7.5 billion, not to slam Jesus, ways of the world and all. So for those who don't like this transaction, assuming GitHub was going to be bought and not remain an independent concern, who with the cash would you rather have seen bought them? Google, Facebook, Amazon, Apple? There aren't tons of players out there with that kind of cash were this acquisition would make sense for billions.
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Amazon wouldn’t have been a bad fit.
 
schoolslave said:
For one, Apple isn't in the business of data collection -- Apple sells devices and services. Try watching their latest WWDC and pay attention to the bit about OS-level Facebook "features".
Apple is afaik one of the only FAANG (or whatever the acronym is nowadays) tech giants NOT to monetize customer data.

Second, any "skilled" dev stopped trusting Microsoft and their shithouse of tools when this news broke: https://www.infoq.com/news/2016/06/visual-cpp-telemetry
When this was revealed, Microsoft first claimed ignorance, then made it an optional setting; however the default was still for telemetry insertion to be 'on' by default for a while.
"Skilled" devs love when IDEs insert hidden phone-home/telemetry features!

Microsoft isn't "integrating", Microsoft is consolidating and trying to recapture and ensnare developers who have rightfully abandoned their products.

"VS code is by far the best editor available and most devs at our office have switched from atom" ... said no "skilled" dev ever.
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From the article your posted about MS stealing our Megahertz:
…what the code does is trigger an ETW event which, when it’s turned on, will emit timestamps and module loads events. The event data can only be interpreted if a customer gives us symbol information (i.e. PDBs) so this data is only applicable to customers that are actively seeking help from us and are willing to share these PDBs as part of their investigation.

That is some pretty blatant invasion of privacy. It keeps time stamps AND module load events?..... I didn't see any more detailed info in any of the links on that page either.


So they are 'consolidating' linux by adding support for linux docker containers and multiple varieties of bash shells (Ubuntu, Suse, Kali etc)? Uh oh, better go warn the open source people that MS is about to kill it.....

And I haven't heard any complaints from devs about code. Anyone that's made the switch from atom has not come back, myself included. I guess none of the devs here working on multiple products for a company with 100's of millions in revenue each year are skilled. We should probably fire them all and hire people who don't use code, because you said they aren't skilled.
 
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The amount of vitriol butthurt over this is amazing. I also like how many people want to speak for the "skilled" devs out there...

I am going to be very clear about this, "skilled" devs don't give a shit. "Skilled" devs will use whatever they need to get the job done. They will generally use the tools they like the most or develop their own.

As for Microsoft killing brands, that is on a small scale. Like most other large tech companies they buy up various companies and either utilize their products as a whole, or take the parts they need to incorporate into their other ventures. Google, Apple, Amazon, etc all do this. As for the standards, MS has generally been a part of many standards groups, so to say they are stealing them and claiming them as their own is disingenuous.

Also the hate over MS "stealing" people's code is also ridiculous, mostly because this claim is being made by people who are upset over open source freedom. So how is MS going to steal open source material? And for code that is not open source, it should be protected by copyright, which would make it illegal for Microsoft to steal and use. So I am not sure where people are getting this notion from.

As for if it is a good thing MS is buying GH, that is debatable. GH was up for sale, which means the owners were pretty much done with it. So if MS had not bought it, someone else would have, and it would be pretty much the same situation with another big company in control.
 
NoOther said:
GH was up for sale, which means the owners were pretty much done with it.
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No kidding. In the end - a large portion of devs/devs-ish decided to trust some random startup with all their code. Folk who were venture capital backed, no one knew much about, had a closed backed end system, was ten years into not making close to profit, etc.. Folks who could just fold overnight and leave everyone in a lurch.

In comes Microsoft - the people who support shit for YEARS.. comes in to buy what GITHUB was selling, and outside of some interesting integration points in MSDN.. nothing has changed with no reason to explain it being changed... since, well, their own developers have a ton of things on there - including the entire .NET Framework.

Whackadoodles I tell ya.
 
This likely isn't like Microsoft buying other brands and killing it. At least I this purchase kind of falls in line with things Microsoft should be involved with. At least it's not like the Nokia purchase that was way too late in the game and led to nothing.
 
Biznatch said:
From the article your posted about MS stealing our Megahertz:
…what the code does is trigger an ETW event which, when it’s turned on, will emit timestamps and module loads events. The event data can only be interpreted if a customer gives us symbol information (i.e. PDBs) so this data is only applicable to customers that are actively seeking help from us and are willing to share these PDBs as part of their investigation.

That is some pretty blatant invasion of privacy. It keeps time stamps AND module load events?..... I didn't see any more detailed info in any of the links on that page either.


So they are 'consolidating' linux by adding support for linux docker containers and multiple varieties of bash shells (Ubuntu, Suse, Kali etc)? Uh oh, better go warn the open source people that MS is about to kill it.....

And I haven't heard any complaints from devs about code. Anyone that's made the switch from atom has not come back, myself included. I guess none of the devs here working on multiple products for a company with 100's of millions in revenue each year are skilled. We should probably fire them all and hire people who don't use code, because you said they aren't skilled.
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If all your devs are so blasé with random, hidden code insertions by their chosen tools then yes, they are not skilled. A skilled developer is aware of what goes on in their codebase. Otherwise it’s no different than fumbling around in the dark and trying shit until it works.

Of course, if you’re only doing fisher-price level development work where nobody understands how the underlying code is actually structured/works then it’s no surprise. Good luck.
 
schoolslave said:
If all your devs are so blasé with random, hidden code insertions by their chosen tools then yes, they are not skilled. A skilled developer is aware of what goes on in their codebase. Otherwise it’s no different than fumbling around in the dark and trying shit until it works.

Of course, if you’re only doing fisher-price level development work where nobody understands how the underlying code is actually structured/works then it’s no surprise. Good luck.
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And what does any of that have to do with VS code? Where is there any info on hidden code insertion on anything but VS (true visual studio, not code) 2015 sp2 that was linked above? Code is an editor like atom but better.... A LOT better. It's also open source and posted on git, so feel free to show me where it's doing any hidden code insertions:
https://github.com/Microsoft/vscode
 
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Biznatch said:
And what does any of that have to do with VS code? Where is there any info on hidden code insertion on anything but VS (true visual studio, not code) 2015 sp2 that was linked above? Code is an editor like atom but better.... A LOT better. It's also open source and posted on git, so feel free to show me where it's doing any hidden code insertions:
https://github.com/Microsoft/vscode
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I wasn’t referring to Atom or VS Code.
I (and many developers who work on highly efficient, performant, and usually low-level code) choose not to use bloated editors, but it sounds like you mostly deal with either business logic or the morass of “framework stitching”.

If needed, I’ll use a language specific IDE like pycharm or the like.

In any case, your original post reeks of condescending asshat so my responses are in kind.
 
schoolslave said:
I wasn’t referring to Atom or VS Code.
I (and many developers who work on highly efficient, performant, and usually low-level code) choose not to use bloated editors, but it sounds like you mostly deal with either business logic or the morass of “framework stitching”.

If needed, I’ll use a language specific IDE like pycharm or the like.

In any case, your original post reeks of condescending asshat so my responses are in kind.
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Exactly, and those are what I was referring to in the thread you quoted, hence my 'condescending asshat' reply.... Feel free to use whatever editor you choose, I didn't come here to argue other peoples programming preferences. My whole point in even posting in this thread was that MS is not the big scary boogey man that bought github to steal everyones code, and quickly / un-elegantly gave some examples of how they aren't the anit-open source company people are remembering from 10+ years back. I'm the only windows guy on our devops team based around *nix, and they have been impressed with changes MS has been making recently.
 
Biznatch said:
Exactly, and those are what I was referring to in the thread you quoted, hence my 'condescending asshat' reply.... Feel free to use whatever editor you choose, I didn't come here to argue other peoples programming preferences. My whole point in even posting in this thread was that MS is not the big scary boogey man that bought github to steal everyones code, and quickly / un-elegantly gave some examples of how they aren't the anit-open source company people are remembering from 10+ years back. I'm the only windows guy on our devops team based around *nix, and they have been impressed with changes MS has been making recently.
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This whole argument of ours feels incredibly pointless.
You like Microsoft's products, I don't. I honestly could care less what others use -- more power to you if you can look past what I perceive to be significant issues with Microsoft and their ecosystem.
Personally, I will be migrating all of my GitHub repos to GitLab or self-host.
 
Reddit just had an AMA from Nat Friedman at MS who is taking over github. Seems like good info that might ease the fears of some. Look at his work history as well, he's not some MS shill:
 
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...es-will-own-more-microsoft-stock-than-its-ceo

Each of the three could receive about 12.3 million Microsoft shares, assuming they control equal stakes in GitHub. A 0.16 percent holding would give each of them about 10 times more shares than Chief Executive Officer Satya Nadella, and roughly 14 times more than President Brad Smith. Among insiders, only co-founder Bill Gates’s 1.34 percent holding would exceed theirs, according to data compiled by Bloomberg.
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schoolslave said:
Microsoft "joined" the Linux Foundation for $500,000.
While I respect the Linux Foundation in and of itself, in this instance I just can't take their comments seriously.
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So you respect the linux foundation, but ignore all of the details they listed on how MS has been contributing to the open source community in the past years, because they 'joined for 500$' (I'm betting their contribution of development hours exceed that by JUST a little bit)...... When people you claim to respect give you facts and you just ignore them for your argument, maybe it's time to stop burying your head in the sand and rethink your position.....
 
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