Maingear X-Cube @ [H]

J

Jason_Wall

[H] Consumer Managing Editor
Joined
Jul 22, 2005
Messages
2,138
Maingear, one of our favorite integrators, is back with a SFF gaming box. We always enjoy getting a Maingear system in the office because we know we're in for a treat. This time around, there were some problems that we weren't expecting.

To be totally honest, this was a very difficult evaluation to write. We gave Maingear all the credit we could, but in the end, we had to put other integrator's labels on the situation and see how we felt. Maingear had essentially set the bar so high for itself that even minor transgressions seemed huge. All in all, I think we balanced out what happened vs. what they did vs. what they could have done as honestly as possible.

The most problematic issue by far was the fact that both the system and restore disc apparently shipped with malicious software present. Although we understand how this might happen, it is, frankly, inexcusable. Maingear helped us get back up on our feet, but the issue caused us much frustration and consumed a great deal of our time. Maingear is a relatively small shop – that’s one reason why we like it – but we can’t imagine this happening with a Tier I like Dell or Gateway, and we have to hold everyone to the same standards.
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Thanks for reading!
 
They send you a PC oozing with virus and are not getting punished at all? What if the test PC actually had infested all the other machines on your LAN before you found out about it, then would it still be "recommended"?
 
i wonder if they actually have an ETA for updating their site yet? that gallery has been a bit dead since they changed it several months ago, and i would simply love to see them finally revamp the cart with actual real full info on the different parts.

Not that i'm holding out for that stuff or anything (still have no where to really put a full computer at the moment since most of my furniture is still being built.....cept the floor...) but it would be cool to see something indicating that it's quite literally coming soon.
 
jon67 said:
They send you a PC oozing with virus and are not getting punished at all? What if the test PC actually had infested all the other machines on your LAN before you found out about it, then would it still be "recommended"?
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They got hit hard on Build Quality and also on Tech Support - two areas where they traditionally score very strongly.

If not for the virus, it would have been Highly Recommended. They were definitely punished.

Infecting the other machines on our office network would have been irrelevant.
 
The superb build quality of the X-Cube was hamstrung by the fact that the system shipped with a viral infection.
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Whoooa! I almost spit my coffee all over my desk reading this.... it almost came out my nose! This is kind of freaky. Quite unexpected from the likes of MAINGEAR.:eek:
 
Another great review as usual. About the only thing I can find to honestly nitpick about is this: it's funny you guys didn't B&M about the t-shirt. I believe someone did on a recent review where they got a t-shirt that was sized for a "big boy." Why no B&M'ing this time, did you guys get the right size t-shirt? ;)
 
Good stuff.
What about a failed media test tipped you off that there was a virus? That wouldn't have been my first conclusion....

Jason_Wall said:
Infecting the other machines on our office network would have been irrelevant.
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Except being SUPER pissed!
 
ir0nw0lf said:
Another great review as usual. About the only thing I can find to honestly nitpick about is this: it's funny you guys didn't B&M about the t-shirt. I believe someone did on a recent review where they got a t-shirt that was sized for a "big boy." Why no B&M'ing this time, did you guys get the right size t-shirt? ;)
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being 6'1" and 225#, i'd be complaining about any other size BUT XL :p
 
VikingBlade said:
What exactly was the virus?
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And did Maingear ever reply back to you as to why it would be on your restore disk in the first place?

/edit

And what is the risk of a similar virus being on a system John Q. Public buys after seeing a good recommendation from this article? Hopefully it was a one-time thing, but yikes, very scary.
 
Modred189 said:
Good stuff.
What about a failed media test tipped you off that there was a virus? That wouldn't have been my first conclusion....
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That's not what tipped us off to the presence of a virus. We became suspicious when our EXE files began disappearing with ever-increasing regularity.
 
OneMadPoptart said:
did Maingear ever reply back to you as to why it would be on your restore disk in the first place?
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Well, no, but we never really asked them, either. On an individually configured machine like the X-Cube, the restore disc is created from the image that's on the hard drive. Ergo, if it was on the hard drive when the tech created the restore disc, it'll be on the restore disc as well.
 
Tim_Roper said:
That's not what tipped us off to the presence of a virus. We became suspicious when our EXE files began disappearing with ever-increasing regularity.
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Ew, ew, ew with a side of extra ew. I do believe that would do it.

On a side note, does [H] have a date that they expect to switch their reviews to systems with vista instead of XP?
I'd imagine it wouldn't be totally necessary until ATI's DX10 cards, but I was curious...
 
jon67 said:
They send you a PC oozing with virus and are not getting punished at all? What if the test PC actually had infested all the other machines on your LAN before you found out about it, then would it still be "recommended"?
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Man I'm with you. How a system shipped with a virus can be recommened is beyond me. Supposedly a "recommended" system has "minor" issues. If a virus is a minor issue, then I'd like to know what constitutes a major flaw in a build?
 
OK I think I follow your reasoning on not dinging them to hard for the Virus on your brand new PC they did after all provide some pretty great hardware. BUT I would definitely like to see a follow up from Maingear explaining how this happened and and the steps they are taking / will take to make sure this doesn't happen to systems in the future.

I am also interested in what virus was identified...

Personally I don't think I would be comfortable recommending ANY system from Maingear until they have responded to this very serious breach in their security.

I wouldn't think "Free Virus with every system sold" would be a very good ad line...

JRV
 
Great Review! That really sucks about the virus though.

On page 8, Gaming Summary, you say "...although consumers looking for a bit more future proofing might want to consider the 512MB version of the 8800GTS..." I think it should say 640MB version. Just an observation
 
I normally agree with 9 out of 10 of the conclusions you draw from your reviews. However in this case, having a virus on a shipping system, and the restore disc should be an INSTANT failure for a manufacturer. This should never happen.

I cannot understand how you would recommend a manufacturers system that shipped to you like this. I feel that your past positive experiences with Maingear have influenced your opinions on this system. I personally would be raising holy hell if I was the consumer that bought this system.
 
From the post I have seen here I take it you all advise everyone not to buy an iPod of any type correct? Some of them shipped with viruses thus everyone should never use one and should tell everyone they know to never buy one.

I'd guess they took the pc online to download the newest drivers and updates and happened to pick it up that way. Unless there is reason to believe otherwise this is probably just some random occurance and not something that happens to every machine they build.

I myself dont' see much wrong with their rating. They did ding them from Highly recomended to just recomended. I did a quick search for maingear and virus and found a page linking to this review but didnt' see any type of mass postings of others having the same issues. So unless there is some known issue about this happening I would assume it is a fluke, althought not a very good one.
 
I'm still reading through the article but I couldn't help but notice how the svideo/breakout connector on the video card was a bit cut off by the chassis of the case, did you guys have any trouble connecting the cord?
 
I've seen this a lot actually. Whoever burns the images has a specific box they use, and that's all they do. Someone hooks up to their little stand alone network that's infected, and wham it infects their imaging machine. Good thing the hardware was solid.
 
stellar review as always, im kind of shocked towards the virus... i may have missed it as i was at school, but did you get a new restore disc? you should see if that one is infected as well... i think the recommended is good as long as a new restore disc doesnt have virii with it... thats kinda crazy 0_0

Whats up wallace? any info you can share with us?

edit: wallace = maingear right? or is it wallace = oPC and Giovanni = Maingear?
 
Quite an exceptional review.
I have personally recieved systems from several different venders and most of them have had issues of some sort or another (including an infection).
I have to say, that I have been impressed with the hard work and effort that [H]ardOCP puts into its System reviews.
As far as I am concerned, Maingear is definately a must recommend in my book. The description of the efforts they put into supporting thier product appears to be Top Notch.
The virus incident albeit a serious one did raise some concern, but seeing how they handled it and how they provided an alternative means of bringing they system back up to speed without the use of a "cure all DVD" is impressive.
Also not sending you a copy of a new restore DVD is also a smart move on thier part. Without the ability to prove the restore DVD contains the ifection really does not put the total blame on MainGear IMHO. On top of that, I am positive from what I have gathered from this and other reviews of MainGear, they probably would have replaced the entire system at no cost.
So yeah, they got punished, but IMHO probably harsher then they deserve.
From now on though, I will be recommending MainGear over other gaming machine venders.
-D
 
ir0nw0lf said:
Another great review as usual. About the only thing I can find to honestly nitpick about is this: it's funny you guys didn't B&M about the t-shirt. I believe someone did on a recent review where they got a t-shirt that was sized for a "big boy." Why no B&M'ing this time, did you guys get the right size t-shirt? ;)
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Different writers have different pet peeves. We've mentioned it in previous articles - the H2C article comes to mind - but integrators are never actually punished for it. The fact that they actually include a shirt goes further than not providing a choice in what size. We're generally very clear on what the company is being punished for. Everything else is just gritching. :p

Some integrators ask you what size you wear, which is cool - but then it's not a surprise when you get it. That's part of the deal for some companies. Falcon actually started asking us to not reveal all of the extra things that they send to customers as "surprises" because other companies were ganking their ideas and the customer was expecting to receive all of the extras instead of saying, "Hmm, what's in this extra box? Oh WOW, look at this swag! What a cool company!"

And yes, the shirt fits me perfect :D .
 
Modred189 said:
On a side note, does [H] have a date that they expect to switch their reviews to systems with vista instead of XP?
I'd imagine it wouldn't be totally necessary until ATI's DX10 cards, but I was curious...
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There won't be an official date. We've got a couple of Vista machines coming up, though. Vista is a pain at the moment because it won't run some of our stability and benchmarking software.
 
Hurdler said:
Great Review! That really sucks about the virus though.

On page 8, Gaming Summary, you say "...although consumers looking for a bit more future proofing might want to consider the 512MB version of the 8800GTS..." I think it should say 640MB version. Just an observation
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Yep, you're right - fixed.
 
0mega said:
stellar review as always, im kind of shocked towards the virus... i may have missed it as i was at school, but did you get a new restore disc? you should see if that one is infected as well... i think the recommended is good as long as a new restore disc doesnt have virii with it... thats kinda crazy 0_0

Whats up wallace? any info you can share with us?

edit: wallace = maingear right? or is it wallace = oPC and Giovanni = Maingear?
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No, we did not receive a new restore disc. We were aided in creating a new one after our tech walked us through a Windows and driver installation. After the fresh install, no virus problems. Our original restore disc was definitely infected.

Yes, Wallace and Giovanni = Maingear.
 
Jason_Wall said:
No, we did not receive a new restore disc. We were aided in creating a new one after our tech walked us through a Windows and driver installation. After the fresh install, no virus problems. Our original restore disc was definitely infected.

Yes, Wallace and Giovanni = Maingear.
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well there we go :p

so many CEO's peruse the [H] :D i wonder how many other forums have that luxury :D
 
Great review guys.

I had considered a XCube, but went with the F131. No, my machine did not have virus.
My guess was as one poster said, got drivers online, got infected!

However, that kinda blows holes in the hole burn-in, full testing claim then, because I just can't see a infected machine testing out too well, even if there were AV app on it to tell them it was there.

Really, there is no excuse for shipping an infected box, not from a small boutique builder that is supposed to be doing more than slapping parts on a box, imaging it, and shipping. Solid testing is supposed to be a part of the boutique deal.

I can say that my experience remains top notch. I firmly believe my system was solidly tested, as it was very stable out of the box, and remains so, with one caveat: a few weeks ago, it started blue screening, got worse, and became un usable for gaming. I tried drivers, etc, only got worse. DL'd Memtest, and ram was failing. I finally called Maingear support, they over nighted the ram to me. fixed. Perfect, like new since.

So, even Rolls Royce can put out a lemon; this should just serve a call to MG to specifically scan any machine they have, and every build before ship.
 
Your experience was quite similar to mine. I ordered an F131 just after windows vista came out and it too came with a virus. But my virus checker caught it and cleaned it. I did not think to report it to maingear however.

But, a week later 2 gigs of my memory burnt out (I ordered 4 gigs), as is common with the 680i evga motherboard. Maingear replaced it no questions asked, but when I reinstalled vista from the recovery disks the virus was back.

I have since had to replace the power supply. I have now run stable for a week, but without any overclocking, only 2 gigs of memory and no sound card. I am a bit disappointed to have 2 gig of very expensive memory sitting on my shelf. But, I am hoping for the best and may try to put the memory back in. Maingear support has been good, but the virus was the least of my troubles.

Also, next review, order a second hard drive. My second drive came unformatted, which took me a bit to discover and straighten out. They should have a page in their manual that explains how to format the second hard drive they install.

Also, it would have been nice to have been told before I ordered that overclocking with 4 gigs of memory is not a good idea. I think it would have influenced what I ordered.

The machine is great, and it is very fast, but my experience has not been hassle free.
 
RedRocket said:
Your experience was quite similar to mine. I ordered an F131 just after windows vista came out and it too came with a virus. But my virus checker caught it and cleaned it. I did not think to report it to maingear however.

But, a week later 2 gigs of my memory burnt out (I ordered 4 gigs), as is common with the 680i evga motherboard. Maingear replaced it no questions asked, but when I reinstalled vista from the recovery disks the virus was back.

I have since had to replace the power supply. I have now run stable for a week, but without any overclocking, only 2 gigs of memory and no sound card. I am a bit disappointed to have 2 gig of very expensive memory sitting on my shelf. But, I am hoping for the best and may try to put the memory back in. Maingear support has been good, but the virus was the least of my troubles.

Also, next review, order a second hard drive. My second drive came unformatted, which took me a bit to discover and straighten out. They should have a page in their manual that explains how to format the second hard drive they install.

Also, it would have been nice to have been told before I ordered that overclocking with 4 gigs of memory is not a good idea. I think it would have influenced what I ordered.

The machine is great, and it is very fast, but my experience has not been hassle free.
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so you didnt do the research and burned your memory? hardly maingear's fault... they arent marketing the systems to be overclocked, because that voids many warranties instantly...

that virus thing is getting disconcerting now with 2 reports on our forums, out of a known 2 recent purchases here :p

Wallace, Giovanni, whats up? :p we be needin info :p
 
Spazilton said:
I normally agree with 9 out of 10 of the conclusions you draw from your reviews. However in this case, having a virus on a shipping system, and the restore disc should be an INSTANT failure for a manufacturer. This should never happen.

I cannot understand how you would recommend a manufacturers system that shipped to you like this. I feel that your past positive experiences with Maingear have influenced your opinions on this system. I personally would be raising holy hell if I was the consumer that bought this system.
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I ageee this is not acceptable for any manufacturer let a lone a boutique. This should have been an instant falure for maingear. You have them a 10/10 value what the hell. I know you guys like maingear but when you get a virus on your hand built computer and you have no failure safe in the restore disk that is unthinkable. I seen you guys hit integrates harder for small things and you guys barely nudge them down for a virus. I mean come on what if the was a person who had very pesonal documents that they loaded on there new computer that person may have just lost everything. I know the computer is good overall but stil.
 
RedRocket said:
Your experience was quite similar to mine. I ordered an F131 just after windows vista came out and it too came with a virus. But my virus checker caught it and cleaned it. I did not think to report it to maingear however.
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Haha, glad to see only one virus left the ultra high quality, HardOCP-beloved Maingear.

If I had just spent 1900 on a 8800GTS equipped toaster, I'd be DAMN pissed if it came with a virus. Me thinks the sunshine and roses of earlier Maingear reviews have infected HardOCP a bit. Come now folks, if this was a Dell with a virus, you guys would have eaten them alive (not to say their adware/bloatware stuff is much better...)
 
Anyone find it ironic that when the review was good, Wallace Santos (CEO of Maingear) was all over the thread and with this new review thread where there is a virus, instead of explaing how a "hand-built and tested" machine could leave the office (especially one with this price tag) he is no where to be found? :confused: What I (and everyone here) wants to know is, how did the virus escape the testing before it shipped off. Either Maingear lied and is no longer testing its computers or the anti-virus was inept. According to a previous poster, this is not an isolated incident. Please step forward and explain in detail just exactly what happened before Maingear's stellar reputation becomes tarnished. Don't be like Bush and his cronies, hiding behind a veil of silence!
 
0mega said:
so you didnt do the research and burned your memory? hardly maingear's fault... they arent marketing the systems to be overclocked, because that voids many warranties instantly...

that virus thing is getting disconcerting now with 2 reports on our forums, out of a known 2 recent purchases here :p

Wallace, Giovanni, whats up? :p we be needin info :p
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I think you misunderstood me. The machine came overclocked by Maingear. True, I should have done more research and turned down the overclock once I saw what they had done, but I trusted them to do it right. It also happened a week after I got the rig, and I did not think to read the evga boards before I bought the rig--my bad. Also, I was not blaming maingear. Rather, I said that maingear support was great. The problem is with the egva 680i board and setting the memory voltage at the factory setting of 2.2v. I did turn down the voltage after my research. My point is, I think it is a bit much to have to reset the overclock settings that the rig came with in order to preserve parts. But, let me repeat, maingear replaced the parts no questions asked, and were very quick to do so.
 
amoeba1126 said:
Anyone find it ironic that when the review was good, Wallace Santos (CEO of Maingear) was all over the thread and with this new review thread where there is a virus, instead of explaing how a "hand-built and tested" machine could leave the office (especially one with this price tag) he is no where to be found? :confused: What I (and everyone here) wants to know is, how did the virus escape the testing before it shipped off. Either Maingear lied and is no longer testing its computers or the anti-virus was inept. According to a previous poster, this is not an isolated incident. Please step forward and explain in detail just exactly what happened before Maingear's stellar reputation becomes tarnished. Don't be like Bush and his cronies, hiding behind a veil of silence!
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Hopefully, when Maingear does post, it will be to say what they've been doing about this, and what they've done to ensure this will never happen again, instead of giving excuses and some cookie-cutter response saying how this situation isn't acceptable and they will be getting to the bottom of it.

Actions speak louder than words.
 
Well i dunno about that virus stuff, but my maingear comp's HDD failed last night and when i called this morning told em such and they overnighting me a new one, no extra charge third degree, or anything, and i've had this comp for over a year. Now just gota get everything back and running and see if my software can snag my data back from the HDD =/.
 
thyshallsmite said:
Well i dunno about that virus stuff, but my maingear comp's HDD failed last night and when i called this morning told em such and they overnighting me a new one, no extra charge third degree, or anything, and i've had this comp for over a year. Now just gota get everything back and running and see if my software can snag my data back from the HDD =/.
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Whew, replacing a hard drive, a component with a typical 3-5 year warranty, without any questions? Color me impressed!

Dell has done that for years, ever since I've worked in IT. If a hard drive in Billy Sue's laptop goes bad, I give them a call, and voila, new hard drive. That isn't rocket science, it's an RMA. Hell, it's almost as easy to simply go through Western Digital/Seagate/Maxtor/whoever and get an RMA on a drive.

But if we're grasping for straws on what to be grateful for, did they at least send you a smiley face sticker on the hard drive? Cause that's what I'd pay extra for.
 
Hotdog453 said:
Whew, replacing a hard drive, a component with a typical 3-5 year warranty, without any questions? Color me impressed!

Dell has done that for years, ever since I've worked in IT. If a hard drive in Billy Sue's laptop goes bad, I give them a call, and voila, new hard drive. That isn't rocket science, it's an RMA. Hell, it's almost as easy to simply go through Western Digital/Seagate/Maxtor/whoever and get an RMA on a drive.

But if we're grasping for straws on what to be grateful for, did they at least send you a smiley face sticker on the hard drive? Cause that's what I'd pay extra for.
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Done RMA with the actual companies, takes 2 weeks sometimes more, friend's dell laptop HDD went bad, they wanna charge him 200 for a new one (40GB) along with shipping to and from, been through alot of companies and RMAs have always been a huge pain, and if i wasn't in such a hurry, i'm sure they'd install the OS on there as well. Had my maingear comp for over a year and anytime i've had remote trouble (even when it totally not their fault) with it they always went the extra mile to fix it.
 
RedRocket said:
I think you misunderstood me. The machine came overclocked by Maingear. True, I should have done more research and turned down the overclock once I saw what they had done, but I trusted them to do it right. It also happened a week after I got the rig, and I did not think to read the evga boards before I bought the rig--my bad. Also, I was not blaming maingear. Rather, I said that maingear support was great. The problem is with the egva 680i board and setting the memory voltage at the factory setting of 2.2v. I did turn down the voltage after my research. My point is, I think it is a bit much to have to reset the overclock settings that the rig came with in order to preserve parts. But, let me repeat, maingear replaced the parts no questions asked, and were very quick to do so.
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ahhh i get it now :p it all makes sense... :p

did you get 2gb sticks? :S or 4 1gb?

Notorius said:
Hopefully, when Maingear does post, it will be to say what they've been doing about this, and what they've done to ensure this will never happen again, instead of giving excuses and some cookie-cutter response saying how this situation isn't acceptable and they will be getting to the bottom of it.

Actions speak louder than words.
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have you ever read the reviews here before? generally anything posted by Velocity Micro, Maingear, and overdrivePC can be taken in at face value. :p
 
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