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Linux casual use question?
- Thread starter Phantum
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poundofflour
Limp Gawd
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i vote for mandrake simply because thats what i started with. both distros do have their own gui config tools and are rpm based. so i suppose it wont matter too much whichever one you choose.
poundofflour
Limp Gawd
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well, i am assuming you have the rpms. so, just open a terminal and su to root, and then just type rpm -Uhv /path/to/rpm
also, you might want to look around linuxquestions.org.
also, you might want to look around linuxquestions.org.
you need to start reading docs first of all.
if it is an rpm, you can install it by double clicking the package in a graphical file explorer. If it is a source package (.tar.gz or .tar.bz2) you need to do the following commands:
tar -xv(z for .gz or j for .bz2)f filename.tar.(gz/bz2)
cd ./(new directory named after file)
./configure
make
(as root) make install
you can read the README file inside the source package if you need help
if it is an rpm, you can install it by double clicking the package in a graphical file explorer. If it is a source package (.tar.gz or .tar.bz2) you need to do the following commands:
tar -xv(z for .gz or j for .bz2)f filename.tar.(gz/bz2)
cd ./(new directory named after file)
./configure
make
(as root) make install
you can read the README file inside the source package if you need help
Ok, I can't install things, that'd be the first thing wrong. I have the .gz files, now what? I tried your method and it doesn't work. I tried reading the Install doc and it doesn't make sense. I'm stuck throwing commands at the terminal. No matter what I do it doesn't work. So I'm stuck, this is exactly Windows is main stream. Click-n-run is way easier.
poundofflour
Limp Gawd
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well of course, but linux is much sexier
since you are new to linux, you might want to stay away from source files, and stick with rpms. sometimes they are a pita because of the dependencies, but for the most part they are easier to work with.
MTB2Live Live4Comps
[H]ard|Gawd
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for a newbie learning linux? to me, redhat and mandrake are the worst ways of going about it. they try to be windows but fail off their asses at it. i'd rather dive right into debian or gentoo or slackware. are they hard? at first, yes. but so is starting out on redhat. the thing with debian or gentoo or slackware is they make you get close and dirty with the configuration files and the more internals of linux. they force you to learn commands and how things work. if you don't learn well by reading documents and then doing it, then slackware and gentoo are definitely NOT your choice. if you can read something, do it, and basically understand it, then i can't help but recommending gentoo.
as for not changing distros, aren't there programs which deal with rpm dependencies? i've heard of redcarpet, yum, apt-get-rpm (or something like that), but i've never used them (portage KICKS ASS). maybe somebody with more knowledge/experience with rpms can help out (all i say on rpms is they SUCK).
as for not changing distros, aren't there programs which deal with rpm dependencies? i've heard of redcarpet, yum, apt-get-rpm (or something like that), but i've never used them (portage KICKS ASS). maybe somebody with more knowledge/experience with rpms can help out (all i say on rpms is they SUCK).
Ok, wow, that was interesting. I had to do a complete re-install of RedHat 9 because I didn't have the correct packages installed. I also looked up some commands, I was just being stupid. I'm a newb at Linux, some reading and help from a friend really helped. Thanks anyways all.
This is exactly why Open Carpet is the best thing to happen to Linux in a while, as far as getting LotD is concerned.
MTB2Live Live4Comps
[H]ard|Gawd
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i don't really understand how this is better than portage, or especially the upcoming portage-ng, but hopefully it will end up helping cure the rpm hell many new comers seem to encounter and get scared away from linux.
yes, these rpms are detering for a noob. when i installed mandrake for the first time, and had to install something from source i had a couple of problems. the configure kept having errors finding binutils and glibc, which for some reason i didnt have or could not be found. at the time i was a total noob so i had no idea what any of these things were, and so i had a hard time fixing them.
luckily i didnt quit
luckily i didnt quit
Originally posted by cloaked
yes, these rpms are detering for a noob. when i installed mandrake for the first time, and had to install something from source i had a couple of problems. the configure kept having errors finding binutils and glibc, which for some reason i didnt have or could not be found. at the time i was a total noob so i had no idea what any of these things were, and so i had a hard time fixing them.
luckily i didnt quit
Hell, .rpms are deterring for everybody.
(Ports and family unite
)MTB2Live Live4Comps
[H]ard|Gawd
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a good bit off topic, but how is that radeon with FreeBSD? i've got an nvidia card now, the 9000 pro had to go, but i'm still curious.
Works just fine, but I have to use XFree86-4-Server-snap (which is 4.3.99.something) instead of plain Xfree86-4-Server.
(X 4.3 only supports radeons up to 9700)
It's not ati-made drivers, but it works perfectly in 2d (including dual-monitor).
There's currently no hardware 3d for anything higher than ... 9200 or something, though. No matter, I use windows for 3d-gaming (but little else).
The 9000 would have had full support in the standard X-server, and probably hardware openGL.
Okay, think of the command-line utilities like apt and yum. This program finds different packages along the same lines, but does it with a nice, neat GUI instead of command line. In fact, you can search through the libraries for certain versions, meaning you don't just have to get the latest build. In addition, the program will tell you if you can handle the dependencies, and gives you the option to get everything you need for the program to workall through a GUI. If there's anything that will compete with WindowsUpdate (especially once MS integrates all MS products under WU), this is it. However, you don't just have to use it for updating, because it can grab new programs as well. What's more, it uses the known good apt and yum sites for its searches, and is easy to add new locations to search for stuff. It takes the versatility of already top-notch package managers and makes it easy, error-free, and totally configurable.
Not to mention it's available now, not RSN, like portage-ng.
I honestly think a nice easy portinstall/portupgrade (packagename) sounds easier, but that's just me
(Partly because I tend to do these things per ssh, and inside screen. GUI tools are only usable as supplements, IMO)
And I know it'll handle dependencies. I won't use a package system that isn't self-contained.
(Partly because I tend to do these things per ssh, and inside screen. GUI tools are only usable as supplements, IMO)
And I know it'll handle dependencies. I won't use a package system that isn't self-contained.
You know, just having to start the app first, or clicking the search-field, makes it slower than typing the appropriate command. I'll agree that graphical interfaces are an easier way to present lots of information, but for getting anything done when you already know what to do, they're an unneccesary slowdown (and another possible point of failure).
"Graphical" doesn't neccesarily mean "easy".
Besides, that would mean that I'd need X, the toolkits it uses (probably gtk or qt. *bleh*.) and who-knows what other madness just to mess around with packages. No, thank you.
Assuming you've set it up in a reasonable way, set you proxysettings to localhost: (portnumber) on the computer running squid, and itsIpAdress: (portnumber) on the other computers, if any.
As for portnumber, I think it defaults to 8080. Look at the man page and the config file.
When you post on this very forum, what OS do you use? Are you seriously telling us that you're using a CLI browser?
Just because you can type commands fast does not make it less clunky, and more difficult to learn properly. The graphic interface make OpenCarpet able to show a person not only different versions and builds, but which ones need what dependencies, and allows you to easily get them, all through a "click and let it work" interface. If you want ease-of-use and versatility of install features, graphic is the best way to allow a total n00b to install something he or she may have been looking for but didn't know all the CLI commands to make sure dependency problems don't occur.
If you don't run X to begin with, then you're not talking about a desktop, which is what OpenCarpet is made for.
I've got a story for you...
So, back in the day, I was trying to set up a linux server at school, with some minimal Linux machines connecting to it over XDMCP as dumb x-terms. It should've been easy, but it turns out that the version of GDM I was using didn't support a feature I needed. I found the RPM for an updated GDM, but it was packed using a newer version of RPM. I got the RPM for the new RPM and _it_ was packed using a newer version of RPM.
Consider now, doing all of this when the Linux machine has no internet connectivity & I'm stuck copying files to it via floppy AFTER downloading them on dialup.
I've never touched a Redhat box since.
yes grenme, sometimes people do use console computers, i am not sure how this makes it not a desktop, as thats how computers were until about 10 years ago
not having the overhead of x can be very useful sometimes
and have fun scripting or sshing to a gui app
not having the overhead of x can be very useful sometimes
and have fun scripting or sshing to a gui app
Odd... ten years ago I was working with Win 3.1.1. But the operative term in your sentence would be ten years ago. Welcome to the 21st Century.
Yeah... on ten-year-old equipment (or a server, which is not a desktop, like I already pointed out)
Gee, I can remote in through a VPN and have a GUI. Have fun living in last century.and have fun scripting or sshing to a gui app
Seriously, how is Linux going to come to the desktop with people constantly living on the crutch of command-line?
Would you say you are representative of more than 1% of the computing populace? Just an opinion, but that doesn't sound representative of 0.5% of the computing populace.
Besides, I was pointing out cloaked's faulty logic arguing against a GUI package manager made specifically for end-user desktops. NewBlackDak
[H]ard|Gawd
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I'll come here once in awhile with a "links -g -driver fb -mode 1280x1024x16M32" Works GREAT, and you don't have to deal with the annoying flash animations.
A command line is NOT a crutch. Learning a few commands is no different than learning to click a few buttons. I predict that linux will catch on more once the current crop of brainless, clueless, ignorant windows users dies out. Kids are very good with computers and they learn easily. Start them on it young and they will have no problem with it. It is people like you who say that nobody can use linux and scare people away from it. You do not know what is best for every computer user.
MTB2Live Live4Comps
[H]ard|Gawd
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I use linux because i find it vastly more productive than windows. I can type a LOT faster than i can move my hand between the mouse and the keyboard, and once i've learned something once i know what i'm doing with it. Therefore, typing it is much faster than needing to be slowed down by bloated graphical interfaces (this applies to more than just windows ).
The problem is NOT in linux, the problem is the habbit's of people who have used Windows. Remember the HUGE complaints people had over a tiny ass change of the start menu in XP? And then people used it for longer time periods, changed their habbits, and found (almost always) increased productivity. There is a better way to do almost anything, and given a chance instead of saying "Oh, they need to imitate windows," Linux is that better way.
). The problem is NOT in linux, the problem is the habbit's of people who have used Windows. Remember the HUGE complaints people had over a tiny ass change of the start menu in XP? And then people used it for longer time periods, changed their habbits, and found (almost always) increased productivity. There is a better way to do almost anything, and given a chance instead of saying "Oh, they need to imitate windows," Linux is that better way.
MTB2Live Live4Comps
[H]ard|Gawd
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hey don't get me wrong. graphical interfaces are often very powerful tools. I just find that for many tasks, using command line is faster and easier. But there are other things which i couldn't stand not having graphical interfaces (xmms, samba, gaim all come to mind immediatly).Originally posted by GreNME
Wow... graphic interface is not better than command-line. Amazing. I guess all the advances in visual interface is a total crock of crap. Xerox was wrong.
IMO providing graphical interfaces is great for most users, they can generally descipher (sp
) and do what they want more quickly. But for a learned user, or when a very specific goal is at hand, command line can be vastly quicker. To me, the ultimate is when both are provided and you can use either depending on the task at hand. With this view, linux can often times be lacking. But I shiver at the thought of going fully graphical or command line.This is the important part:
Command line has its uses... I use it regularly. The thing is, when it comes to the end user on the desktop, it's all about working smoothly on a visual interface. I don't see how supporting the best of the GUI tools for the desktop user is a bad thing.
Most users are not (and should not be) required to be "learned" at using it, as the computer is a tool. Since almost all modern tools for end-user use are through a GUI anyway, intrinsic learning of the OS is not necessary. Once again, this is the 21st Centurytools need to advance with the times.
Command line has its uses... I use it regularly. The thing is, when it comes to the end user on the desktop, it's all about working smoothly on a visual interface. I don't see how supporting the best of the GUI tools for the desktop user is a bad thing.