Leaked Next-Gen Nehalem Road Map?

I used the google translator and dual channel DDR3 are for the value and mainstream deskto version of Nehalem. I don't get the 3MB L2 cache though for the E7400/7300. I guess those are still Penyrn?
 
Steve said:
I have no idea what this Chinese website is saying but these leaked Intel roadmap images are in English and pretty self explanatory. The slides show processor information from 3Q 2008 through 3Q of 2009.
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Expreview has an English version too y'know? ;) The article in English is here. They have several other good articles too now; browse on their English home page.

Bojamijams said:
Why is it saying 2ch DDR? Isn't it supposed to be 3ch?
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Only Bloomfield is triple-channel; Lynnfield and Havendale are dual-channel.
 
Are we ever going to pass the 3ghz speed or is it a physical limit right now?
 
bfellow said:
I used the Google translator and dual channel DDR3 are for the value and mainstream desktop version of Nehalem. I don't get the 3MB L2 cache though for the E7400/7300. I guess those are still Penryn?
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Yeah, I believe that any processor that's actually named yet is Penryn/Yorkfield. They still haven't come up with any marketing names yet for Nahalem-family processors. It would be logical if they called it "Core 3", but marketdroids aren't always logical, and the names of the individual processors are certainly not known yet.
 
farfromhome said:
It would be logical if they called it "Core 3", but marketdroids aren't always logical, and the names of the individual processors are certainly not known yet.
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Can't be any worse than Nvidia naming conventions...
 
IceDigger said:
Are we ever going to pass the 3ghz speed or is it a physical limit right now?
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I would assume so, you see a some "greater than or equal to" signs after Q2 '09, so you'd hope that would mean they're going to break into the 3ghz stock speeds, especially with the 2.93ghz procs.
 
Interesting. So by this chart, if I'm building my new system in late Aug, early Sept, I won't really be missing anything by not waiting (I give myself two months of due diligence when building/buying anything, which in computing can mean months of watching and researching as things change quickly lol).
 
sulfur_lad said:
Interesting. So by this chart, if I'm building my new system in late Aug, early Sept, I won't really be missing anything by not waiting.
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Kind of depends what price bracket you're aiming for. If you're talking about sub-$250 processors or dual-cores, then the answer is yes; it will be quite a while until there's substantial change in that segment. Basically nothing will change there until Q3 2009 when Lynnfield and Havendale come out.

Over $250 though, it's becoming more and more apparent that waiting for Nehalem might not be all that bad thing to do, as long as you're willing to pay a little more for the memory and possibly a lot more for the motherboard. Instead of the paying $316 for the 2.66 GHz Bloomfield, it looks like it will cost $284 instead. And the chipset roadmap shows the X58 occupying not only the enthusiast section, but also the top of the mainstream segment, where the P45 is today. So we might see some sub-$200 X58 motherboards after all. With all this recent news, I for one am going to wait and see what happens after Nehalem is released instead of upgrading to a Q9550 as soon as the price drops as I had previously mused.
 
At least I can take my time upgrading since it will be about a year before mainstream Nehalem processors come out.
 
Bojamijams said:
Why is it saying 2ch DDR? Isn't it supposed to be 3ch?
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Ah that would be the server varient of intels next gen chips yes folks the Bloomfield is a server processor thats means money ++++ i knew intel was not going to do bloodletting on core2 chips have to wait till q3 of 09 to get the desktop part.
 
maxius said:
Ah that would be the server varient of intels next gen chips yes folks the Bloomfield is a server processor thats means money ++++ i knew intel was not going to do bloodletting on core2 chips have to wait till q3 of 09 to get the desktop part.
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Actually, it's not. Bloomfield, triple-channel memory and all, is most definitively a desktop CPU, or "Workstation" if you prefer. It works with the X58 chipset, which follows X48 as the high-end desktop chipset. Sure, it can be used for single-processor servers, but then so can any desktop CPU. Gainestown and Beckton are the server chips, and Beckton even has a different socket.
 
IceDigger said:
Are we ever going to pass the 3ghz speed or is it a physical limit right now?
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I'm sure we'll see faster chips out of Intel just as soon as AMD becomes more competitive. Why make faster chips when you're sole competition cant even bang with you at your current level, video games are gpu limited, and MS office opens up just as fast on a 6ghz c2d as it does on a 100mhz pentium 1?
 
farfromhome said:
Actually, it's not. Bloomfield, triple-channel memory and all, is most definitively a desktop CPU, or "Workstation" if you prefer. It works with the X58 chipset, which follows X48 as the high-end desktop chipset. Sure, it can be used for single-processor servers, but then so can any desktop CPU. Gainestown and Beckton are the server chips, and Beckton even has a different socket.
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from what it looks like trichannel is more for the server side of things than the desktop. please note intel is dropping a lot of sockets with its next gen; and i am correct intel will not do bloodletting on the core2 till q3 of 09 that's when the next gen chips will be less expensive than core2 processes. till then i wound not expect to touch Bloomfield chip for anything less $999 due to the current crop of intel extreme chips also note the current extreme lineup is just a rebranding of a server chip...
 
just to add even more clarity http://www.pcstats.com/NewsView.cfm?NewsID=68718

this will not be cheep folks
Bloomfield: Socket 1366, Quad-Core, Ultra-High-End.
Socket 1366: 3xDDR3, External PCI Express, 1-2xQuickPath (Optional 2S?), Q408.

this will but you have to wait for it
Lynnfield: Socket 1160, Quad-Core, High-End.
Socket 1160: 2xDDR3, 16xPCI Express Gen2, DMI (to southbridge, slower than FSB), 2H09.
 
maxius said:
from what it looks like trichannel is more for the server side of things than the desktop. please note intel is dropping a lot of sockets with its next gen; and i am correct intel will not do bloodletting on the core2 till q3 of 09 that's when the next gen chips will be less expensive than core2 processes. till then i wound not expect to touch Bloomfield chip for anything less $999 due to the current crop of intel extreme chips also note the current extreme lineup is just a rebranding of a server chip...
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maxius said:
just to add even more clarity http://www.pcstats.com/NewsView.cfm?NewsID=68718...
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Did you even look at the links I posted? :rolleyes: The lowest-end Bloomfield, still no slouch at 2.66 GHz, will be only $284. DDR3 prices are already going down pretty quickly. That will not be a price barrier by release date. The only possible expensive item will be the motherboard...but according to Intel's own chipset roadmap the X58, in stark contrast to the X38 and X48, will be aimed not only at the "Extreme and High-End" segment, but also at the top of the "Premium and Mainstream" segment, where the P45 is right now. That strongly implies that there will be affordable (<$200) X58 motherboards. Perhaps not at launch, but within a couple months afterwards likely, assuming no drastic changes to their roadmap.
 
doubtful intel will not destroy core2 sales intel is all about one thing and that bleeding as much cash out of its cpus as they can get you have to take a look at the manufacturing schedule to gain complete clarity on this issue intels next gen does not take over in manufacturing till next year q2/q3 and just to clarify "This rumoured pricing is yet to be confirmed by Intel, but if a 2.66GHz Bloomfield arrived in Q4 with a retail price of say $299 or around £199, it would make for a mighty tempting upgrade. Though, you'll have to factor in the cost of a required motherboard upgrade for socket 1366" NOTE THE WORD RUMORED IN THAT STATEMENT TILL IT IS CONFIRMED I WOULD NOT BET THE FARM ON IT.

Intel is not stupid the mainstream parts are Lynnfield and those are next year they would kill core2 sales cpu's that intel has made and is not going to make money off of they are still releasing core2 chips come on its business sense here
 
Are any of these native quad-core, or are they all still doubling up dual-cores?
 
farfromhome said:
Kind of depends what price bracket you're aiming for. If you're talking about sub-$250 processors or dual-cores, then the answer is yes; it will be quite a while until there's substantial change in that segment. Basically nothing will change there until Q3 2009 when Lynnfield and Havendale come out.

Over $250 though, it's becoming more and more apparent that waiting for Nehalem might not be all that bad thing to do, as long as you're willing to pay a little more for the memory and possibly a lot more for the motherboard. Instead of the paying $316 for the 2.66 GHz Bloomfield, it looks like it will cost $284 instead. And the chipset roadmap shows the X58 occupying not only the enthusiast section, but also the top of the mainstream segment, where the P45 is today. So we might see some sub-$200 X58 motherboards after all. With all this recent news, I for one am going to wait and see what happens after Nehalem is released instead of upgrading to a Q9550 as soon as the price drops as I had previously mused.
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Yeah, I'm a bit of a cheapskate traditionally, and price/power is pretty good with p45 and something like a Q6600 right now. Looking at the next arch is a bit of a risk but maybe also not a bad idea: I don't want to buy right on the end of a platform and pooch myself for upgrades down the road. I've pushed my S939 platform about as far as it'll go, and there's nowhere else I can go to upgrade that now. If I wait for Bloomfield, I'd guess I'll end up likely spending about twice what I would on what's available now, but with a longer life potentially it could be worth it.

I say cheapskate, but with the graphics card decision I think I'm making, maybe that's changing in my old age anyways. :)

I've only been reading up on all this stuff recently, as I only recently decided it was time for a new machine. :)
 
sulfur_lad said:
Yeah, I'm a bit of a cheapskate traditionally, and price/power is pretty good with p45 and something like a Q6600 right now. Looking at the next arch is a bit of a risk but maybe also not a bad idea: I don't want to buy right on the end of a platform and pooch myself for upgrades down the road. I've pushed my S939 platform about as far as it'll go, and there's nowhere else I can go to upgrade that now. If I wait for Bloomfield, I'd guess I'll end up likely spending about twice what I would on what's available now, but with a longer life potentially it could be worth it.

I say cheapskate, but with the graphics card decision I think I'm making, maybe that's changing in my old age anyways. :)

I've only been reading up on all this stuff recently, as I only recently decided it was time for a new machine. :)
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Your looking at 200-300 more approx waiting for nehalem vs vuilding now and thats about it. Hardly not worth waiting imo since were getting close falls around the corner dude.
 
I'll I have to say is thank god the Chinese slave drivers are buying our Engineered cpu's. Lord knows they sell us enough garbage to fill up the Atlantic.
 
maxius said:
doubtful intel will not destroy core2 sales intel is all about one thing and that bleeding as much cash out of its cpus as they can get you have to take a look at the manufacturing schedule to gain complete clarity on this issue intels next gen does not take over in manufacturing till next year q2/q3 and just to clarify "This rumoured pricing is yet to be confirmed by Intel, but if a 2.66GHz Bloomfield arrived in Q4 with a retail price of say $299 or around £199, it would make for a mighty tempting upgrade. Though, you'll have to factor in the cost of a required motherboard upgrade for socket 1366" NOTE THE WORD RUMORED IN THAT STATEMENT TILL IT IS CONFIRMED I WOULD NOT BET THE FARM ON IT.

Intel is not stupid the mainstream parts are Lynnfield and those are next year they would kill core2 sales cpu's that intel has made and is not going to make money off of they are still releasing core2 chips come on its business sense here
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Don't you remember the Core 2 Mobile introduction?

Core 2 Duos (Merom) were the exact same cost as Core Duo (Yonah) at the same clock speed. And that's with the newer SSE, 64-bit, and double the L2 cache. It was many months before the older Yonahs were finally price-cut.

Not because Intel wanted to bleed anyone. They wanted to push the new chip so much that they sacrificed the older one. And it wasn't a "C2D is cheaper to manufacture", either. They were on the same process, and C2D had more transistors; therefore a bigger die, therefore fewer dice per wafer, therefore more expensive per die.
 
CharonPDX said:
Don't you remember the Core 2 Mobile introduction?

Core 2 Duos (Merom) were the exact same cost as Core Duo (Yonah) at the same clock speed. And that's with the newer SSE, 64-bit, and double the L2 cache. It was many months before the older Yonahs were finally price-cut.

Not because Intel wanted to bleed anyone. They wanted to push the new chip so much that they sacrificed the older one. And it wasn't a "C2D is cheaper to manufacture", either. They were on the same process, and C2D had more transistors; therefore a bigger die, therefore fewer dice per wafer, therefore more expensive per die.
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same socket same infrastructure this is a new socket and new chip completely different as well as the main stream parts are hitting till next year on socket 1160 all Bloomfield is is a rebaggged xeon that would mean a price premium that would be more than current chips again look at intels leaked manufactureing schedule they are making more core2 chips than Bloomfield's till next year.
 
English translation i just woke up "same socket same infrastructure, this is a new socket and new chip it is a completely different ballgame as the main stream parts are hitting till next year on socket 1160

all Bloomfield is is a rebagged xeon that would mean a price premium that would be more than current chips again look at intels leaked manufactureing schedule they are making more core2 chips than Bloomfield's till next year.thats when the core2 chips start falling off the cliff
 
gaspah said:
yeah cas AMD's 'native' quad-core design kicked intels dead ass.. oh wait was it the other way around??
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Well... considering that they have different advantages and tradeoffs, your statement is apt.
 
sulfur_lad said:
Yeah, I'm a bit of a cheapskate traditionally, and price/power is pretty good with p45 and something like a Q6600 right now. Looking at the next arch is a bit of a risk but maybe also not a bad idea: I don't want to buy right on the end of a platform and pooch myself for upgrades down the road. I've pushed my S939 platform about as far as it'll go, and there's nowhere else I can go to upgrade that now. If I wait for Bloomfield, I'd guess I'll end up likely spending about twice what I would on what's available now, but with a longer life potentially it could be worth it.

I say cheapskate, but with the graphics card decision I think I'm making, maybe that's changing in my old age anyways. :)

I've only been reading up on all this stuff recently, as I only recently decided it was time for a new machine. :)
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Nahalem is going to be expensive for awhile.
Q6600, $180 at microcenter
$35/-45 boards can be had for < $100
4GB DDR2 for $75ish

2.66GHz Nahalem, mainstream one later this year. $284,thats in 1,000 volume. I figure MSRP $320ish, probably $350ish considering popularity and limited quantity at first.
X58 chipset extreme motherboard is all that is on the roadmap for support of Nahalem. X48's now are $200-$350. I would expect X58 to be no cheaper, most likely more.
DDR3 1600, 3 modules for triple channel. Dual channel kit, 2x2GB, hcepaets looks like $250ish now. So figure $325 for a triple stick set. DDR3 will drop in cost before nahalem launches, but with the triple channel kits... and demand spike, hard to say.

Not going to be cheap for the forseable future. I don't think I've seen P55(???) on any roadmaps. Probably won't be launched until well into 2009.
 
maximus said:
all Bloomfield is is a rebagged xeon that would mean a price premium that would be more than current chips again look at intels leaked manufactureing schedule they are making more core2 chips than Bloomfield's till next year.thats when the core2 chips start falling off the cliff
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They were selling many times more Netbursts than Conroes for nearly a year after introduction, yet the E6600 was released for $308. There is no law stating that new tech must be uber-high-end-only. Just because NVIDIA does it doesn't mean that everybody else does. ;)

Menelmarar said:
2.66GHz Nahalem, mainstream one later this year. $284,thats in 1,000 volume. I figure MSRP $320ish, probably $350ish considering popularity and limited quantity at first.
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I do not doubt that the prices will be high on the day of release; I would probably wait a couple months after release regardless to get past retailer price gouging on new tech. Not sure about $284 becoming $320 MSRP though; Q9450 is $316 per 1,000, and NewEgg is carrying it for $330, only $14 over the batch price. $300 is the most likely MSRP for the 2.66 GHz Nehalem after the first wave of early adopters gets theirs, unless Intel has trouble ramping up or holds back intentionally (both of which are doubtful).

Menelmarar said:
X58 chipset extreme motherboard is all that is on the roadmap for support of Nahalem. X48's now are $200-$350. I would expect X58 to be no cheaper, most likely more.
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Given Intel's own roadmap and where they're positioning it (both Enthusiast and upper-Mainstream, not just Enthusiast, and overlapping with the P45), I would indeed expect it to be cheaper, if not Intel's own DX58SO, then boards from partners. It's possible their roadmap is misleading, but it is not a fake. We are close enough to launch that we're well past the "rumor" stage.

Menelmarar said:
DDR3 1600, 3 modules for triple channel. Dual channel kit, 2x2GB, hcepaets looks like $250ish now. So figure $325 for a triple stick set. DDR3 will drop in cost before nahalem launches, but with the triple channel kits... and demand spike, hard to say.
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Why would you need DDR3 1600? Just get good DDR3 1333 and, if you're overclocking, overclock the RAM as well or use a divider. DDR3 right now is $184 for 2x2GB DDR3 1333 sticks, which would imply $276 for 3x2GB, which is still expensive. I'd go for 3x1GB instead though: 2x1GB is around $80, so 3x1GB would be a very reasonable $120. Now, increased demand could send the prices skyrocketing, or increased supply (as finally not just those with too much money would be buying) could send prices plummeting. No way to know until December/January (again waiting until after the early adopters get their fill).

Now does this mean it definitely, assuredly will be cheap then? Of course not. But the naysayers are wrong that it is assured to be uber-expensive too. All the signs are pointing to it being not just uber-high-end this time, if you take the time to actually look at the evidence and not just assume what's going to happen based on pure conjecture and guesswork. If you're buying now and upgrading again in a year or a year-and-a-half or so, yeah, buy Yorksfield, but if you're buying for the long haul, it is now close enough to the Bloomfield launch that it's warranted to take a more wait-and-see approach.
 
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