Large LAN Party Setup

[Oneos]

Ok well I had some time today and was doing some planning for if our little LAN party were to get bigger. So here's the diagram i put together (sorry about not having a thumbnail):

The 4Gb trunks on the servers are probably overkill unless I were to do some trunking with the 24 Port switches as well (2Gb trunks each).

So yeah, comments and suggestions?

 

[TopGun]

The gamers don't get any InterWebz?

 

[Oneos]

Well there isn't any fiber or anything available in the area, so any net that would be made available would die.

So I figure have it open to those running it, incase a patch was missed that needs to be put on the file server, and then the wireless for any basic browsing someone might do.

 

[TopGun]

Well there isn't any fiber or anything available in the area, so any net that would be made available would die.

So I figure have it open to those running it, incase a patch was missed that needs to be put on the file server, and then the wireless for any basic browsing someone might do.

Ah, thought that is what would be put on the servers. Too bad this isn't in my area

 

[goodcooper]

looks good... well thought out... simple...

what game? is one server for 72 clients enough?

 

[Nacho]

One server can run far beyond 72 clients..

I would recommend 2 1gbit uplinks aggregated from a table to core (24x100mbit = 2.4gigabit assuming max load)

And quad-gig to servers is far excessive for anything but a LARGE fileserver.

 

[Oneos]

what game? is one server for 72 clients enough?

BF2, CS, etc.

One server can run far beyond 72 clients..

I would recommend 2 1gbit uplinks aggregated from a table to core (24x100mbit = 2.4gigabit assuming max load)

And quad-gig to servers is far excessive for anything but a LARGE fileserver.

I was thinking about that for the tables since the idea is to try and give everyone full speeds for transferring files.

And you're probably right about the 4Gb links; though what happens when every PC starts transfering from it? Plus it'd just be some level of awesome.

 

[annaconda]

You can put the DHCP on the File Sever i don;t think so you need a seperate server for that.

 

[chooper]

Nacho is right. The PCI bus can only handle ~130 Mbytes/sec. 1000Gbit/s is 125Mbytes/sec, but it would not hurt to have 2 links bonded for redundancy purposes.

I also agree with having aggregated/bonded uplinks (2x1Gbit) from the smaller switches to the core switch. I don't know what kind of hardware you have in mind, but Cisco Catalyst 2950s (with recent firmware) handle link aggregation just great and handle both EtherChannel and LACP (and most models have 2x 1000BaseT ports available).

 

[Ockie]

- Dump the admins on the same network, dont make them exclusive.
- Setup your ALP server (asuming your running ALP) to a captive portal, so you can assign internet access to those who need it or banish it for everyone, this gives you control and also better management
- Dump the quad trunks to each server, thats excessive and your server will tank before the connection does. Unless if you had really high end hardware, you shouldn't need that.
- Dump the single links to each switch and setup aggregate trunks to each switch, giving each switch two pipes from the core, this would be one major improvement
- Setup your DHCP on your ALP box and run your files from there, it can be a crappy machine.
- Use the file server (assuming it's powerful enough) for a game server, you will tax a server with 72 players if you are playing high end games.


This setup will give you the most bandwith within reasonable change to each gamer, saves you two switches, gives you greater management, better overall experience.

 

[jpochedl]

BF2, CS, etc.

And you're probably right about the 4Gb links; though what happens when every PC starts transfering from it? Plus it'd just be some level of awesome.

If everybody started transferring files at once, the network connections wouldn't be the bottleneck... You'd probaly saturate the disks... As a general rule, assume a GB connection can support 80 megabytes of storage traffic and 10,000 IOPs per second.

Now, most disks can do a sustained throughput that could keep up with 80 MB / sec on a sequential read... But, once you start having multiple users access the disks, you've got a lot more seeking going on and your average throughput plummets... That's when IOPs become important.

So, you're average disk does maybe 100 IOPs per second (SATA lower, SCSI higher, etc)... For simplicity's sake, let's say you've got five disks in a RAID 0 in the server... You've got 500 IOPs to work with... When you've got a GigE connection that could put through 10,000 IOPs, your disks are the bottleneck...

Obviously this does account for disk cache hits, any controller cache you may have (if this is a real, or 'nice' server) etc etc etc... But anyway, the point is that a GigE connection to the file server is probably sufficient.

 

[Oneos]

<snip>

Reading through Ockie's suggestions

 

[Ockie]

And you're probably right about the 4Gb links; though what happens when every PC starts transfering from it? Plus it'd just be some level of awesome.

You won't have that problem. Even in larger lans, I have yet to see saturation of single gig links for game servers.

For emergency files, you shouldn't see saturation of a gig either. Now if your file server contained a lot of other files, such as media and other garbage... then this may become an issue. However, I recomend that you keep the media and fun files seperate from those important files such as patches, maps, mods, etc..... these important files can go onto your ALP server.

 

[Oneos]

- Dump the admins on the same network, dont make them exclusive.

They would be on the same network, but have access to the second network with the net, but yes I see what you mean.

- Setup your ALP server (asuming your running ALP) to a captive portal, so you can assign internet access to those who need it or banish it for everyone, this gives you control and also better management

I'm not familiar with ALP. Care to Share?

- Dump the quad trunks to each server, thats excessive and your server will tank before the connection does. Unless if you had really high end hardware, you shouldn't need that.

Right, was more for shitz and gigglez. So just the single Gb link? or 2?

- Dump the single links to each switch and setup aggregate trunks to each switch, giving each switch two pipes from the core, this would be one major improvement

Yep

- Setup your DHCP on your ALP box and run your files from there, it can be a crappy machine.

I would be worried about hard disk usage if it's "just a crappy machine" serving the files. EDIT: (Though I suppose we would assume most people already have the patches right? So nvm )

- Use the file server (assuming it's powerful enough) for a game server, you will tax a server with 72 players if you are playing high end games.

So 2 game servers then?

This setup will give you the most bandwith within reasonable change to each gamer, saves you two switches, gives you greater management, better overall experience.

That's always good

 

[Oneos]

Alright, I think this is closer to the ideal setup, yes?

 

[goodcooper]

with mem prices the way they are i would suggest setting up a ramdisk on one of the servers you want to share a lot of patches on... give it a couple gigs for some patches and you won't have to worry about disk access issues any more...

talk about awesomeness... then you'll need those multiple trunks into your server

 

[Keiichi]

That infratrsucture setup is better than most businesses. Personally though I'd go with stackable managed switches. With that many people I would also suggest a seperate server to do fileserving for patches/webaching/proxy stuff.

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

Yup that's a good setup....I agree overkill as far as the NICs for the servers. Honestly you can do fine with a single NIC on each server, I've done LAN parties bigger than that...just have your server be true server grade hardware, especially the NIC....you want a good server grade NIC that can handle lots of concurrent connections...not some 19 dollar desktop NIC. SCSI or SAS hard drives if you can...better performance for a server serving to many concurrent clients.

DHCP for the LAN is good, just have everyone set their TCP to auto.

Lay down the rules...no P2P software running on the LAN, and enforce it.

Other rules ahead of time...tell people to have their PCs clean...no malware/virus ridden PCs on the network.

Administrator account on your servers....don't leave it with a blank password, don't share out the entire C drive on the server, or any other drives. Always some knuckleheads who think they'll be funny and try to dork with your server from across the network.

Tell people to have their games patched to whatever level you'll be running. If you feel like putting the work into it..have a single folder shared from your server with patches and any custom map packs available for download. Read only rights.

Lock down your server well, windows updates so it won't catch a worm or something from someones infested PC on the LAN.

Low system impact antivirus on the server.

Servers and your core switches on battery backup units...in case you push the power threshholds of wherever you're doing this LAN part. I've been to one big one we had...rented a conference center at a Marriot....kept blowing the circuit to that room until staff ran in some huge extension cables going out to some other circuits to spread the load for us.

 

[AMD_RULES]

Diagram looks good
I also second YeOldeStoneCat's comments.

What kind of specs are we talking on these servers?

 

[Oneos]

Not really sure, it will be a while before we get to this size so I'm not too worried about scouting out hardware just yet.

The Catalyst 2950Ts would be great for the branch switches, a quick look at eBay and I see ~$350.... from China . I assume the replacement is the 2960-24TT-L, obviously that would work as well I believe (thought it costs a fair bit more).

What would you suggest for the core switch? In terms of current cisco products I think the 3560E-24TD is closest to fitting the needs of this setup, but is there a perhaps older model that would also work.

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

One thing you want to think about....keep your equipment simple. You want to set things up quickly...and have them very maintenance free. You want to spend your time gaming...not spend it troubleshooting high end equipment.

Yes Cisco is a good brand...but you need someone who knows Cisco equipment well. I've been to one LAN party where we built it around a Cisco Cat....the guy who brought it that knew Cisco well...it was one of the spares his IT group had (some big insurance company starting with a "T").....I remember one party the config file got hosed....spent over an hour troubleshooting that and replacing it. Seriously...if there was just a decent unmanaged switch doing the job....no gaming time would have been lost.

It's a LAN part of under a hundred computers...not a world wide wide area network of several thousand PCs. Don't get caught up in trying to have fancy names there so people will go "Ooooh...and Aaaaah". K.I.S.S. and it will work!

 

[Ockie]

with mem prices the way they are i would suggest setting up a ramdisk on one of the servers you want to share a lot of patches on... give it a couple gigs for some patches and you won't have to worry about disk access issues any more...

talk about awesomeness... then you'll need those multiple trunks into your server

I disagree, you do not need ramdisk on a file server for such a small setup. A regular cheapo box with a gig nic will be more than ever needed.

That infratrsucture setup is better than most businesses. Personally though I'd go with stackable managed switches. With that many people I would also suggest a seperate server to do fileserving for patches/webaching/proxy stuff.

Stackable managed switches are way overkill for a lanparty of this scale, unless if you can pick it up used, but stackable isn't required or needed. A managed switch is only as useful as the person who is using it.... I've seen most lan enviroments where people don't even use the management abilities of the switch. A managed core switch is important for various functions and setup such as trunking, etc.

I think he forgot to add in the seperate sever (ALP) for his files and other functions. This should be your gateway server to the internet.

just have your server be true server grade hardware, especially the NIC....you want a good server grade NIC that can handle lots of concurrent connections...not some 19 dollar desktop NIC. SCSI or SAS hard drives if you can...better performance for a server serving to many concurrent clients.

I disagree with this. A regular box with decent hardware and a gigabit nic and a SATA drive will suit you just fine. Game servers do not rely heavily upon disk access or disk speed, they do however like processing power. 2GB memory is also just fine, nothing more than that needed.

SCSI and SAS adds to the overhead and adds to the costs.

Lay down the rules...no P2P software running on the LAN, and enforce it.

Enforce this by only whitelisting certain ports.

Other rules ahead of time...tell people to have their PCs clean...no malware/virus ridden PCs on the network.

Administrator account on your servers....don't leave it with a blank password, don't share out the entire C drive on the server, or any other drives. Always some knuckleheads who think they'll be funny and try to dork with your server from across the network.

Tell people to have their games patched to whatever level you'll be running. If you feel like putting the work into it..have a single folder shared from your server with patches and any custom map packs available for download. Read only rights.

This I agree with. A good idea is to send out an email a week before the lan and tell everyone what patches they will need to be up to date and what they need to have configured.

Servers and your core switches on battery backup units...in case you push the power threshholds of wherever you're doing this LAN part.

I disagree with that. There shouldn't be any UPS's at a lanparty. None. They consume power when they are idling and they can immensley consume power when they are charging while providing power to the machine.

Leave the UPS's at home, it will not only draw more power, but they are a PITA to move and they leave the impression that you can't trust your own infrastructure.


A lot of large lans such as MML have a strict rule about UPS'es and if you are caught with one you will be thrown out for these exact reasons.

I've been to one big one we had...rented a conference center at a Marriot....kept blowing the circuit to that room until staff ran in some huge extension cables going out to some other circuits to spread the load for us.

The problem with this lan was that circuit layouts probably wasn't well mapped. One of the most important things of a lan is power limitations and knowing what you can plug in and what you can't. If you are blowing circuits, you most likley are overloading it due to a miscalculation, imporper mapping, or some other violation.

Not really sure, it will be a while before we get to this size so I'm not too worried about scouting out hardware just yet.

The Catalyst 2950Ts would be great for the branch switches, a quick look at eBay and I see ~$350.... from China . I assume the replacement is the 2960-24TT-L, obviously that would work as well I believe (thought it costs a fair bit more).

What would you suggest for the core switch? In terms of current cisco products I think the 3560E-24TD is closest to fitting the needs of this setup, but is there a perhaps older model that would also work.

To be quite honest, you do not need Cisco equipment for a lan such as this size. It will blow your budget which will translate into less value for the gamers.

Something like a Dell 3024 would suit your needs well for the gamer switches. Something like a dell 5224 should suffice as a good backbone switch.


Keep in mind, you are only dealing with 72 people, you don't need to overkill or anything. Everything you spent money on, is going to translate to added costs to your attendees or to yourself.

 

[Ockie]

One thing you want to think about....keep your equipment simple. You want to set things up quickly...and have them very maintenance free. You want to spend your time gaming...not spend it troubleshooting high end equipment.

Yes Cisco is a good brand...but you need someone who knows Cisco equipment well. I've been to one LAN party where we built it around a Cisco Cat....the guy who brought it that knew Cisco well...it was one of the spares his IT group had (some big insurance company starting with a "T").....I remember one party the config file got hosed....spent over an hour troubleshooting that and replacing it. Seriously...if there was just a decent unmanaged switch doing the job....no gaming time would have been lost.

It's a LAN part of under a hundred computers...not a world wide wide area network of several thousand PCs. Don't get caught up in trying to have fancy names there so people will go "Ooooh...and Aaaaah". K.I.S.S. and it will work!

This is one of the biggest things that I would say read again to.

Keep it simple. Any downtime due to fancy equipment or fancy things will not only upset other gamers, but it will make you look dumb when you can't get it solved. Stick to the tried true and working platforms. The more complex your system is can sometimes translate into the more problems you are going to have, especially when somone looking for trouble knows a little/lot more than you do about the equipment.

 

[Oneos]

I agree I don't need Cisco, nor am I set on buying them; I would just want something that works and will stay solid; thanks for the mentions of the 3024 and 5224, both are much cheaper and serve the same purpose.

I can see how you mean just a cheap server for files would work, as the sincere hope is that everyone wasn't too lazy to patch up.

I did some googling and I assume you mean "Autonomous LAN Party" when referring to ALP. I'll look at this more.

Either way, whatever route we may go, I'll spend quite a bit of time making sure I know the ins and outs of it.

Thanks again for the continued input.

 

[Ockie]

I agree I don't need Cisco, nor am I set on buying them; I would just want something that works and will stay solid; thanks for the mentions of the 3024 and 5224, both are much cheaper and serve the same purpose.

I can see how you mean just a cheap server for files would work, as the sincere hope is that everyone wasn't too lazy to patch up.

I did some googling and I assume you mean "Autonomous LAN Party" when referring to ALP. I'll look at this more.

Either way, whatever route we may go, I'll spend quite a bit of time making sure I know the ins and outs of it.

Thanks again for the continued input.

Yep, thats the program.

 

[goodcooper]

I disagree, you do not need ramdisk on a file server for such a small setup. A regular cheapo box with a gig nic will be more than ever needed.

well of course it's not needed.... but is this going to be a [H]ard lan party or not?



cheapo box may be good, but i got 5GB DDR2 for 15 dollars.... put 4 in a cheapo box, leave 512 for OS and 3 and a half giggles for patches... couple gig nics, and give your network equipment a real workout


you'd be suprised how many people don't have trackmania, and iirc its like over a gig

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

I disagree, you do not need ramdisk on a file server for such a small setup. A regular cheapo box with a gig nic will be more than ever needed.

I disagree with this. A regular box with decent hardware and a gigabit nic and a SATA drive will suit you just fine. Game servers do not rely heavily upon disk access or disk speed, they do however like processing power. 2GB memory is also just fine, nothing more than that needed.

SCSI and SAS adds to the overhead and adds to the costs.

I disagree with that. There shouldn't be any UPS's at a lanparty. None. They consume power when they are idling and they can immensley consume power when they are charging while providing power to the machine.

Leave the UPS's at home, it will not only draw more power, but they are a PITA to move and they leave the impression that you can't trust your own infrastructure.

I've built a lot of game servers. For more than 20 or so concurrent connections.....there is a noticable difference in desktop grade hardware, versus server grade hardware. Desktop grade NICs, similar to desktop OS's, are designed for desktop duties..not more than 10x concurrent connections. Take 2x servers with identicle software, CPU, RAM, chipset, hard drives...put a server NIC in one of them...put an el cheapo desktop NIC in the other. Put the same load on them...20x clients...30x clients...40x clients....50x clients. As the amount of clients grows..the one with the cheapo desktop NIC won't keep up with the performance of a good server NIC...the server NIC will keep gameplayers pings nice and low as the load grows...it won't break a sweat. The desktop NIC ..as the load grows....clients will start getting higher and higher pings, packet loss, little drops, etc.

This includes building it on Windows Server....not XP or Vista or some other desktop OS..they are not designed to handle many concurrent connections well.

Disk throughput is also important, I've clearly easily seen the difference when you build a server with IDE/SATA drives..versus SCSI. Especially when you run several games on the same physical server (which is no problem if you build a real server). I've built boxes that have run a half dozen games at the same time...including several different Battlefield games...bd42, BFV, DC....build a good server right..and it does the job well. Build it on deskgrade components...and you'll just have to deal with the compliants at the LAN of "Lag, why taking so long to change levels, I'm getting kicked...waa waa..boohoo".

You don't need to spend a lot of money building the server...you can gather server grade components at affordable prices...we always did back when I was involved with clanning. I built the servers that we co-lo'd at big data centers...and for the big LAN parties.

As for the APC....well, you can't attest to the power abilities of whatever place you're renting to have the LAN party at. You can only tell them what you're renting the place for....tell them what you'll have there..the amount of PCs...load expected, etc. They say "Yup..no problem"...what ya gonna do? I spend a lot of time building my servers and tweaking them....and I insisted on having a battery backup unit for my server. Why? I'm not going to take the chance of having the power pulled from the server if a breaker pops...or some dipsh|t steps on the button of the surge strip it's plugged into..and the server starts having a disk error when we attempt to boot it up again. Yes keep cables and surge strips off the floor where people can't step on them...but experience has shown no matter what you do..always gonna be some 'tard who manages to step on something or bump it or knock it or whatever. Or..because the AC system of some convention hall can be thrown out of whack...a slight surge...or a little dip in the power for a millisecond..and the server locks up....nope..not for me. Don't need some APC 2200 or 3000 unit....just a little 750 or a 1000 unit. Anyone capable of lifting and carrying a large desktop can certainly carry in an APC.

Doing LANs for a long time taught me what to expect, and what precautions to take..to ensure a smooth....top notch performing setup where I spend the maximum time doing what I came there for...to game..and to let others game. I'll gladly take the path that lets me game...and hear people say "Nice...ran great!"

 

[goodcooper]

+1 on the changing levels... if you have a uber slow disk drive you're going to have problems... and modern FPS do rely very much on cpu cycles, but also on memory... when i was running CS:S servers, a good rule of thumb was 1GB per 20 guys... and at 100tic somewhere around 2.4ghz p4... to run smoothly...

and if you've got a bit more memory, run your srcds from ramdisk (lol, i'm stuck on that ramdisk thing)

 

[Ockie]

well of course it's not needed.... but is this going to be a [H]ard lan party or not?



cheapo box may be good, but i got 5GB DDR2 for 15 dollars.... put 4 in a cheapo box, leave 512 for OS and 3 and a half giggles for patches... couple gig nics, and give your network equipment a real workout


you'd be suprised how many people don't have trackmania, and iirc its like over a gig

Yes, not a lot of the people has the game, but chances are that 72 people want the game at the same time with no one having it would be a bit pushing it. With just a decent machine you can serve hundreds of gamers without a problem.

It may not be so "hard", but it does the job.

I've built a lot of game servers. For more than 20 or so concurrent connections.....there is a noticable difference in desktop grade hardware, versus server grade hardware. Desktop grade NICs, similar to desktop OS's, are designed for desktop duties..not more than 10x concurrent connections. Take 2x servers with identicle software, CPU, RAM, chipset, hard drives...put a server NIC in one of them...put an el cheapo desktop NIC in the other. Put the same load on them...20x clients...30x clients...40x clients....50x clients. As the amount of clients grows..the one with the cheapo desktop NIC won't keep up with the performance of a good server NIC...the server NIC will keep gameplayers pings nice and low as the load grows...it won't break a sweat. The desktop NIC ..as the load grows....clients will start getting higher and higher pings, packet loss, little drops, etc.

No offense, but you are starting to talk a little out of the sky here. Game servers especially for lanparties do not follow the same logic as high horsepower computing enviroments.

This includes building it on Windows Server....not XP or Vista or some other desktop OS..they are not designed to handle many concurrent connections well.

Another missconception. This is a game server. You can run a desktop OS just fine as a game server without having to worry about your loading issues. Adding server licenses into this area will add dramatic costs and give you no real value in return.

Disk throughput is also important, I've clearly easily seen the difference when you build a server with IDE/SATA drives..versus SCSI. Especially when you run several games on the same physical server (which is no problem if you build a real server). I've built boxes that have run a half dozen games at the same time...including several different Battlefield games...bd42, BFV, DC....build a good server right..and it does the job well. Build it on deskgrade components...and you'll just have to deal with the compliants at the LAN of "Lag, why taking so long to change levels, I'm getting kicked...waa waa..boohoo".

Another missconception.

You don't need to spend a lot of money building the server...you can gather server grade components at affordable prices...we always did back when I was involved with clanning. I built the servers that we co-lo'd at big data centers...and for the big LAN parties.

Affordable prices?? Have you seen the cost of SAS drives, Server licensing fees, and high performance nics? SCSI is cheap, but now all of a sudden you need controllers, cables, terminators, etc... racking costs up... you might just as well have bought yourself a raptor instead and deal with less problems.

When you start buying up old technology to save money, you are not going to be much further than using current technology that would do the job.

As for the APC....well, you can't attest to the power abilities of whatever place you're renting to have the LAN party at.

This is another missconception. Chuck this one up to bad planning.

You can only tell them what you're renting the place for....tell them what you'll have there..the amount of PCs...load expected, etc. They say "Yup..no problem"...what ya gonna do?

You think this is the logic MML, Quakecon, and Dreamhack works with? No. It's called doing your homework. If you know enough about electrical (don't need to know much), you can do your own walkthrough and map the building.

Only a fool would rely on what a sales person tells you.

I spend a lot of time building my servers and tweaking them....and I insisted on having a battery backup unit for my server. Why? I'm not going to take the chance of having the power pulled from the server if a breaker pops...or some dipsh|t steps on the button of the surge strip it's plugged into..and the server starts having a disk error when we attempt to boot it up again. Yes keep cables and surge strips off the floor where people can't step on them...but experience has shown no matter what you do..always gonna be some 'tard who manages to step on something or bump it or knock it or whatever.

Breaker would pop due to bad planning and design. Power can be pulled from a server with a UPS too, it's not magically going to keep your computer running with power regardless of what happens.

Or..because the AC system of some convention hall can be thrown out of whack...a slight surge...or a little dip in the power for a millisecond..and the server locks up....nope..not for me. Don't need some APC 2200 or 3000 unit....just a little 750 or a 1000 unit. Anyone capable of lifting and carrying a large desktop can certainly carry in an APC.

Yet again, this would result in bad planning.

Doing LANs for a long time taught me what to expect, and what precautions to take..to ensure a smooth....top notch performing setup where I spend the maximum time doing what I came there for...to game..and to let others game. I'll gladly take the path that lets me game...and hear people say "Nice...ran great!"

That's good for you. But the same results can be acchieved with proper handling, proper setup, and proper planning... all while saving costs to the gamer. And if you are hosting a lan and gaming for that duration, you aren't hosting the event.

 

[Ockie]

+1 on the changing levels... if you have a uber slow disk drive you're going to have problems... and modern FPS do rely very much on cpu cycles, but also on memory... when i was running CS:S servers, a good rule of thumb was 1GB per 20 guys... and at 100tic somewhere around 2.4ghz p4... to run smoothly...

and if you've got a bit more memory, run your srcds from ramdisk (lol, i'm stuck on that ramdisk thing)

Trust me, you wont have slow map changes on a more modern SATA drive or even a raptor for that matter.

1GB per 20 guys 100tic sounds about correct. I would however go a little higher on the processor for 100tic


Keep in mind, this lan is 72 people.

 

[Toytown]

This I agree with. A good idea is to send out an email a week before the lan and tell everyone what patches they will need to be up to date and what they need to have configured

But assume that some still wont and have the facilities there to provide them with said patch. If you dont then people will end up being upset.......even though its totally there fault.

Another suggestion is to have spares for ethernet cables/power cables and switches if at all possible. cables should be easy and are one of the things i have seen fail multiple times, so for a little extra cost you can have a few more leads.

Switches depending on what type you purchase could end up expensive, however there is nothing worse at a lan party if you have 72 clients and the switch connecting 1/3rd of them has just died and no replacement is available.

 

[Ockie]

But assume that some still wont and have the facilities there to provide them with said patch. If you dont then people will end up being upset.......even though its totally there fault.

Yeah, thats what the cheapo file server is for for the folks who forget People will always forget something, you are right about that.

Another suggestion is to have spares for ethernet cables/power cables and switches if at all possible. cables should be easy and are one of the things i have seen fail multiple times, so for a little extra cost you can have a few more leads.

Extra cables to sell can help offset costs too.

Switches depending on what type you purchase could end up expensive, however there is nothing worse at a lan party if you have 72 clients and the switch connecting 1/3rd of them has just died and no replacement is available.

Yes, this sucks. A good idea is to always have a spare or at least some backup plan

 

[Oneos]

I'm comfortable with going into this assuming I'm not going to get much gaming done if at all. If i can sit at my computer and get some work done, that's great; though with one this size I'd expect to be running around solving problems most of the time.

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

No offense, but you are starting to talk a little out of the sky here. Game servers especially for lanparties do not follow the same logic as high horsepower computing enviroments.



Another missconception. This is a game server. You can run a desktop OS just fine as a game server without having to worry about your loading issues. Adding server licenses into this area will add dramatic costs and give you no real value in return.

No "talking out of the sky"....it's based on a history of helping out with LAN parties (some big ones too)...and building quite a few game servers that have been running at data centers. One of them held into the top 20 of UGStats list of Unreal Tournament servers worldwide...staying in the top 20 for a long time. I've seen the differences in a personal PC playing the role of the game server at a LAN, versus a good server.

Electrical abilities of the host you're planning it...you're as the "client"..when you rent a convention center...you don't get to build/implement the electrical system. You can only give them what requirements you'll need. Experience will show you that places often "lie"...and tell you they'll handle what you have, just to get you to rent the place and collect your money.

And..uhm...misconception/misunderstanding on your end..you don't need ..LOL..server CALs for a game server...this isn't user accounts we're creating..ROFL. That was funny!

Usually with a LAN party....much of the peeps who organize it are often built around a clan...someone in the group usually works IT somewhere..and will have a TechNet or MSDN subscription...there's your Server OS license. And amongst the group forming it...the server hardware can be gathered. It's not hard, it's not expensive, have done it many times. Plus..collecting fees at the door to help out with the room rental costs...pizza delivery for lunch, other costs...it's usually offset quite easily.

 

[Dew]

The setup I have for my LAN (Monthly LAN, 50-60 people each time) is this:
Backbone: Netgear 24-port Unmanaged Gigabit Switch (Managed was out of our price range)
On tables: 10x 8-port unmanaged gigabit switches.

Fileservers (One 4TB, One 6.3TB[Mine], One 2TB[Mine]) plugged directly into the 24-port
Game servers (Various admins' spare computers) plugged directly into the 24-port
Admins plug directly into the 24 port.

Router/DHCP is a Linksys RV016. (Comcast 8/1 connection)
-I setup IP zones for BW. No single, non-admin, gets more than 256Kbit down, 96Kbit up.
-UDP Traffic has unlimited BW.
-TCP traffic is limited to 500Kbit up, total
-TCP traffic is limited to 5000Kbit down, total
-Separate cable modem serves the Admin IP block, 6Mbit limit on TCP (4 of us)

With this setup we have few issues with Bittorrent, people playing online, or web browsing(Gets a little slow, but no real complaints).

Fileserver has(In addition to all the normal stuff):
-CTupdate (All Windows 2k/XP/2k3/XP64/Vista updates)
-Current AV definition files.
-Current drivers for NV/ATI cards, as well as driverpack
-Current Patches and ISOs for the games we play (You just supply your own CD key)

We tell all players to patch their games, update AV, update Windows, and update Steam the night before. Most do, but this helps those who don't.


BTW, you wont get much of any gaming done, at least not till the afternoon.

 

[Ockie]

Count me out of this thread. It's being plauged by bad advice from YeOldeStonecat (he's turning this into an ego pissing match)


OP, if you are serious about a lanparty, let me know. I have all the equipment that you require all the way up to camlock MCM-350 feeder wire and Power Distribution Units. I also have poweredge servers and a full gig multi trunked network that I rent out. I am not too far from you to make this possible. Just let me know on your needs.

 

[Oneos]

Haha, yeah - what ever happened to michigangamers? I went looking for it a little while ago.

 

[Ockie]

Haha, yeah - what ever happened to michigangamers? I went looking for it a little while ago.

Too much work went into it, don't have the time to maintain it... the domain is still there, but the rest of the site isn't

 

[moetop]

Count me out of this thread. It's being plauged by bad advice from YeOldeStonecat (he's turning this into an ego pissing match)


OP, if you are serious about a lanparty, let me know. I have all the equipment that you require all the way up to camlock MCM-350 feeder wire and Power Distribution Units. I also have poweredge servers and a full gig multi trunked network that I rent out. I am not too far from you to make this possible. Just let me know on your needs.

He has presented some sound advice. Some of it you agree with. Blatantly calling them misconceptions with out hard evidence supporting your or his point is not really constructive. I don't see anywhere in your or Stonecats posts, benchmarks or performance studies to support one side or another (in a gaming server situation). Quite frankly i don’t see any really "bad" advice, just attitudes.

The UPS for the servers is NOT a bad idea. Figuring out power before hand is critical, but even if you get all the calculations and loads correct that won't account for a weak breaker tripping, or a power surge/outage even if you have tested live. And yes I have seen that at a few events.

 

[BobSutan]

I didn't read the whole thread, but what happened to the wireless in the revised diagram?

Also, I'd put the servers behind a firewall and only limit access based on the ports/services absolutely required. If someone's system is acting up or has something it shouldn't it'll help keep the servers up and running without any issues.

What purpose will the admin machines serve? (no pun intended) You may want them firewalled off as well. At a minimum the servers and admin systems should be on their own VLAN away from the user systems. Do NOT make the file server your DHCP server. I've had nothing but problems with that in the past. People come in, start grabbing files, and then those that show up later can't get to it to pull an IP. It's just not a good idea.