It's that Time....New Server Build (or Upgrade)

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Dark_Falcon

Weaksauce
Joined
Dec 30, 2006
Messages
67
Well it's that time again. It's been a few years since I built my server. The OS has changed from WHS V1 to WHS 2011 and more recently to Windows Server Essentials 2016 (which has issues with backup/restores etc..). However, for the most part, the hardware has stayed pretty much the same for several years. I'm open to complete replacement of hardware and/or software with the exception of the case. The Norco case works well for me and provides me with the storage space I need/want.

What I want/like:
1) File Server - I primarily utilize this server to serve up files for media (movies, television, music) or to transfer large files from/to the server. My Plex server sits on a separate box (w/dedicated GPU, higher memory for transcoding etc...) and serves up media to 3-6 local/remote end users at any given time (max 8). File transfer rates have been very slow. I'm not certain if it's due to the cards I'm using or the CPU/Board/memory or some combination therein. The drives are all 7200RPM mechanical drives. While I know they will be a limiting factor at some point, as they are not SSD, it still seems overly slow to me (even on local transfers from one disk to another within the server box). Startups and other basic computing functions (i.e. unzipping files etc...) are a bit slow as well. All in all, while it was a decent setup several years ago, it's starting to feel a bit old and worn. I haven't really kept up on the latest and greatest hardware, so I would very much appreciate any input/thoughts on the best path for upgrading this server. Oh, one more thing, I REALLY like the SuperMicro IPMI functionality, so if there are recommendations to upgrade the motherboard, I would REALLY like something that either has the same or similar functionality.

2) Backups/Restores (OS related) - This is a big one for me. I must be able to serve up files quickly, take bare metal backups on a scheduled basis and be able to restore them easily. This is where the WHS*** Operating Systems shined. It was SOOOOO easy to setup/utilize (at least for Windows machines). If I could find some software that did this in a similar fashion, that would be ideal. As stated above, I'm having some issues/challenges with the WSE 2016 software and I'm not opposed to replacing it. Also, I have added several Linux servers to my farm and, if possible, would also like to be able to backup/restore those as well.

3) Duplication of Files - I MUST have duplication/replication of files (at folder level). I know it requires additional space on the drives, but I would prefer not to use Raid Arrays as I want to be able to pull a harddrive and have the files available without requiring rebuilding the array or worrying about replacing an array card. I don't want to start a debate about how great Arrays (or how they are not great). This is just my preference and what works for me. As such, I currently utilize Stablebit Drivepool to pool all the drives on the server. I don't know if this is still the best (or at least OK) method for pooling the drives or if I should be leveraging Windows Storage spaces or ???. Perhaps this is causing the slow speeds? I'm open to ideas/suggestions, but would really prefer to stay away from the Raid Array requirements/discussion if possible.

Any help/thoughts is very much appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Current Setup:
Case:Norco 4220, PSU:Corsair 650HX(CMPSU), MB:Super Micro X8SIL-F, CPU:Intel Core i3-530, RAM:Kingston KVR1333D3E9SK2/4G, CNTL Cards: LSI00301 SAS 9207-8i (2), Fans:Scythe 120mm, OS: WSE 2016, HD's:Hitachi/Seagate/WD 7200RPM drives, SysDrive: WD Blue 3D 500GB
 
I think you'll definitely appreciate an upgrade, as an i3-530 is super ancient.

For what you're doing, I would consider some second hand 1st gen Ryzen kit, if you can get your hands on it. Something like a 1600 or 1700. That won't include IPMI functionality, unless you pair it with one of the ASRock Rack boards that has IPMI, but it would likely be your best bang for buck in terms of performance. If you want to stick with something more "server-ish" and keep your BMC/IPMI functionality, then buying something equipped with an E5-26xx v2/3/4 series Xeon isn't out of the question. E5v2 chips are cheaper and can still use DDR3 which is super cheap, but obviously the v3 and v4 chips are faster and more power efficient. My server is based on an X10SRL-F with an engineering sample E5-2650v3. I bought the CPU on eBay for like $100, but I lucked into the motherboard (it's still a bit expensive) so aiming for an X9 series board (and a v2 series CPU) will be less expensive.

For backups and restores, honestly I would just run Veeam. It has no 'integration' into the OS like home server used to have, but it's dead simple to set up and use and includes the bare metal restore functionality you want. You can run nightly incremental backups easy as can be, and it's free to run on individual endpoints like desktops.

Since you're opposed to RAID (normally I would advocate RAID6 as a personal preference of mine) I would stick with DrivePool. Storage Spaces is a can of worms most people are best staying out of. Without use of a real array, you'll be without the benefit of combined spindles adding extra performance, but you should still be able to saturate a normal 1 GbE network connection reading data off DrivePool. If you're not getting close to 100MB/s copying data over a 1 GbE NIC, you might just check to make sure your drives are not fragmented to hell and back.

Lastly, given what you described, I can't really think of a reason your "server" needs to actually run a "server" OS. My "server" just runs Windows 10, which is handy because it means I can run Backblaze for $5/month and backup all my shit with it. Had I any edition of Windows that says "server" in the name, Backblaze won't run.
 
As far as hardware goes, I second the E5-26XX V2 series, cheap and fast enough for most use cases. Plus they use DDR3 which is super cheap, especially for ECC. Just get a decent LGA 2011 server board off ebay, maybe even a dual socket one :D
 
Thank you both for the feedback/input. I'll take a look at the options you presented. I should have mentioned that I'm willing to spend a $1000-$1500 to do this upgrade right. Once I'm done, I don't really want to revisit this for another 5+ years.

I'll go ahead and take a look at the possibility of fragmentation on the drives. However, I seem to recall that the Drivepool software does automatic defragmenting. With that said, are there any changes that you would recommend on the hard drive controller cards. I know I updated/replaced them about a year ago and got a little boost in drive speed (and resolved some issues with drives randomly dropping out). Without going into Raid cards etc..., are there any suggestions/thoughts on cards that might speed things up a bit for my relatively straightforward JBOD setup?

Also, I like that the SuperMicro boards still appear to be decent boards. It's been a rock solid board for me and as I mentioned, the IPMI functionality makes things VERY easy, as all my hardware is located in another room. With my budget in mind, are there any specific Boards/cpu/memory combos that would be recommended. I don't want to overspend, just to overspend, but I do want something decent (performance/reliability wise) to last a few years.

P.S. Appreciate the Veeam recommendation. I thought I was familiar with all forms of Backup software/companies, but somehow I missed this one.

Thanks again for the help.
 
With a budget of $1000 to $1500, you have more options and I would tend towards new hardware because it'll last longer and be quieter / more power efficient along the way .

How much memory do you need?

As for controllers, your LSI 9207-8i is more than capable as a HBA. I think you said you have two of them? That is pretty nuts. Most folks would run just one of them into a SAS expander to get more than 8 ports, but you've got 16 native ports thanks to your dual card setup. I cannot recommend you spend any more money here, you should be already set.

I've recently had the opportunity to look at the X470D4U line from ASRock Rack. I did a review of it, you can check it out over here if you want. It's an interesting part, because it allows you to combine a standard desktop processor with server-style IPMI management facilities. I've got a currently running FS/FT thread where I'm selling one of my review samples as well, though of course you can source the stuff from wherever you want.

I would combine that with either a Ryzen 5 1600, 1700, or 3600 CPU, and however much memory you need. 2x8GB DDR4 ECC 2666 would be more than plenty for most server tasks. Obviously get more RAM if you need more.

Alternatively, if you want to stick to Intel you could grab a Supermicro X11SCL-F + an E-2136 or E-2146G + 2x8GB DDR4 ECC memory.

The AMD based option would provide more opportunity for future upgradability, since you can drop the 12 and 16 core CPUs into those boards. But lots of folks bleed blue, so Intel.
 
Thanks a lot for the help/guidance. I think it set me well on the path to my once a semi-decade server upgrade. Here is what I've chosen for this go around. Please let me know if you see anything horribly out of whack.

MBD-X11SCL-F-O Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard = $199
Intel Xeon E-2146G 3.5 GHz 6-Core Processor = $328
Kingston KSM26ED8/16ME Server Premier - DDR4 - 2666 MHz (x2) = $200 ($100 x 2)
Samsung 860 Evo 1 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive = $149 (existing drive is very old and I want to setup a separate cache drive anyways)
Overall Price (roughly) = 876.00
Unless I'm missing something, it looks like this gets me out well within the budget I set aside for this endeavor. Now I may need to upgrade my HTPC while I'm at it :cool:

Oh ya....I guess I do bleed blue (and whatever supermicro devotees bleed), so Intel was the choice for me. Maybe the HTPC upgrade will be a good foray into the AMD landscape :)

Thanks again...
 
I would think that would be fine and would absolutely spank your existing system.

The only other thing I might mention is the possibility of integrating your main server with your transcoding box; this oughta have enough horsepower to juggle both jobs, especially if you bring over the GPU.

With that said, this board and that CPU on their own would have a level of hardware acceleration, thanks to the QSV capability on the CPU of the G series Xeon chip. Local users likely don't use much transcoding bandwidth.

My server - which admittedly has more cores than yours at 10 of them - handles being a file server and PLEX all in one, while also handling virtualization for my work. I max out at 3-4 concurrent PLEX users, but my system is not stressed at all.

As for team red vs team blue... it's a good day to be an AMD fan. They are peerless on the 'value' spectrum. I like Supermicro too, but mostly I just like the BMC/IPMI which is actually powered by a company called ASPEED and is used on more vendors than just them - ASRock Rack uses them, Dell, Tyan, probably more.

Either way though, your'e leapfrogging like... six generations of chips. Going from 2C to 6C... it'll be very nice!
 
I agree with your thoughts on combining the 2 systems. I actually considered combining the boxes....again. They were actually combined at one time, but I just found it more convenient to have them separate. For instance, if I'm working on the server, I don't have to worry about irritating the wife or anyone else that may be streaming something from the HTPC. Also, as you can imagine, it didn't take much in the way of multiple streams to bog down the server with the older hardware. I'm going to keep an open mind and will definitely give it a shot. It might be nice to make a little room in my server rack for another toy.

Thanks again for the sage advice. I utilized this board/members when I built this monstrosity several years ago. As always, it's always been a great help when it comes to obtaining that 'fuzzy warm' feeling when it comes to spending your hard earned cash.
 
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