Is RAID worth it?

[Brahmzy]

"Is it worth it" is the title of the thread. If you want to ignore that, find another thread. To paraphrase, get off your friggin' dead horse

The OP isn't building the fastest array EVAR OMG, he's looking to spend his money in a reasonable manner. Most people who consider raid would be better served by a single drive and an upgrade in another area.

Why is the raptor raid 0 setup so appealing to you? Scsi will give higher benchmarks, and probably have a higher cool factor too. To draw a bad analogy, "The fastest sata setup" is like "the most expensive Honda".

You're right - "Is it worth it" is the thread title - I should have saved a few of my comments for a "what is the fastest SATA setup you can have."

I AM seriously considering SCSI except for the noise they bring.

And as soon as iRAM can get more than 4GB per device, and a little more redundacy/reliability, I'm there. They are RAID0ing the iRAM's and getting exactly double the speed out of them-very impressive, but not practical - Vista will not even fit on them right now.

 

[feigned]

Striping is simply not worth the risk, nor cost. I'd like to add that mirroring is the way to go if you give a shit about your data.

And the 36GB Raptor's are general malaise to the people that own them. Why someone would want to own one or more of hot, noisy, and generally not-much-faster-than-7200rpm-SATA-disks is beyond me.

And for the ones "against" djnes and unhappy_mage, we tangoed a few years ago over this same subject and guess who won out? Eventually you will learn...

Where's DougLite at? He was good at blasting it too...

 

[tuskenraider]

And the 36GB Raptor's are general malaise to the people that own them. Why someone would want to own one or more of hot, noisy, and generally not-much-faster-than-7200rpm-SATA-disks is beyond me.

As the owner of multiple crappy 36Gb Raptors I'll respond. Hot? Mine ran(old)/run(new) at 27 C. 1 C cooler than the 200GB Seagate I have. Noiser? Sure, but I can hear the Seagate too. Not much faster? Well I can't think of one hard drive evolution for desktops that I've experienced that has presented a better improvement. Of course with the newer drives, 36GB, or any size for that matter, you data is outdated and irrelevant.

And for the ones "against" djnes and unhappy_mage, we tangoed a few years ago over this same subject and guess who won out? Eventually you will learn...

As noted, your analysis is outdated and only relevant to whatever your use and testing concluded on YOUR PC. Should I believe my PC isn't noticeably quicker with Raptors because someone here tells me, or do I measure improvements for myself and see you're full of shit?

 

[Brahmzy]

Striping is simply not worth the risk, nor cost. I'd like to add that mirroring is the way to go if you give a shit about your data.

And the 36GB Raptor's are general malaise to the people that own them. Why someone would want to own one or more of hot, noisy, and generally not-much-faster-than-7200rpm-SATA-disks is beyond me.

And for the ones "against" djnes and unhappy_mage, we tangoed a few years ago over this same subject and guess who won out? Eventually you will learn...

Where's DougLite at? He was good at blasting it too...

OK, who's the dumbass that would put any critical data on a RAID0 array...you? I don't know anybody here that would do it. Maybe you did once and learned your lesson?

"Where's DougLite at? He was good at blasting it too..." Wow, that justs sounds like you're lookin' for some help on this.

You telling me my personal experience with RAID0 not showing any gains is simply idiotic. The only experience you know and can speak of is your own. I feel very sorry for you that you've had such a poor RAID0 experience (if you've ever even tried it or owned a Raptor for that matter. My MANY experiences have been great as with thousands of others.

 

[djnes]

OK, who's the dumbass that would put any critical data on a RAID0 array...you? I don't know anybody here that would do it.

I would venture to say almost 90% of the people on here running RAID0 don't keep good backups, if any at all. Do a simple search for RAID0, and check out people's sigs. That was a topic in a thread not too long ago, and it was quite funny how many people had only the RAID array, and no other drives. At one time, there were tons of threads of people asking how to recover data from their corrupted arrays. That spurned the major debate, the all out testing by about 30 people, and in the end, led just about everyone of us involved to break our arrays.

see you're full of shit?

By the way, what's with the "agree with me or your an ass" attitudes? Considering your asking people to ignore well respected sites and believe in one person....while that person flames anyone who disagrees ruins any and all credibility. Fact of the matter is, RAID0 doesn't offer anything compelling when you add up all the factors. Let people use what they want, and deal with it. Needless flaming only hurts your case....and it's childish.

 

[oozish]

As the owner of multiple crappy 36Gb Raptors I'll respond. Hot? Mine ran(old)/run(new) at 27 C. 1 C cooler than the 200GB Seagate I have. Noiser? Sure, but I can hear the Seagate too. Not much faster? Well I can't think of one hard drive evolution for desktops that I've experienced that has presented a better improvement. Of course with the newer drives, 36GB, or any size for that matter, you data is outdated and irrelevant. As noted, your analysis is outdated and only relevant to whatever your use and testing concluded on YOUR PC. Should I believe my PC isn't noticeably quicker with Raptors because someone here tells me, or do I measure improvements for myself and see you're full of shit?

Listen, seriously...these drives are VERY NOISY...Come on man, admit it. Sure you can hear other drives but they aren't as loud. Now I'm referring to the old 8MB kind, I also have the newer 16mb cache (as a replacement for one that died) and it's alot better...so maybe that's what you're referring to. The new 74 I have is only slightly louder than the seagate I have and to me (now) noise between the drives shouldn't be an issue. But that clacking of my old drive in the computer across from me drives me crazy.

 

[tuskenraider]

By the way, what's with the "agree with me or your an ass" attitudes?

Well it goes both ways. I have no problem apologizing for the tone of my post, but if someone posts their experience as "fact" in a condescending tone and I have different "facts", then the reply will be equally as harsh. Like already meantioned this thread is dead so I'll just finish saying my experience with RAID0, and Raptors, is very positive and measured to be so. Others, sorry it didn't work out for you.

Listen, seriously...these drives are VERY NOISY...Come on man, admit it.

I did admit it. But if you're the type of person that gets annoyed over hard drive noise, the difference between most drives and the Raptor isn't that signifigant to blame the drive, it's more the users sensitivity. And between ambient room noise, fans, any audio playing, the sound of a hard drive when seeking is easily ignored for most.

 

[djnes]

Well it goes both ways. I have no problem apologizing for the tone of my post, but if someone posts their experience as "fact" in a condescending tone and I have different "facts", then the reply will be equally as harsh. Like already meantioned this thread is dead so I'll just finish saying my experience with RAID0, and Raptors, is very positive and measured to be so. Others, sorry it didn't work out for you.

But you have to realize situations are different. If I tested myself and found no benefit...and you did the same and found benefit, does that mean you are right and I am wrong? Absolutely not. That's what the problem was. Others have done legitimate testing and found no real benefit...even respectable industry leading sites. That all being said, you have to accept that to some (most) people, RAID0 is worthless. If you love it and want to run it, go right ahead. It's your computer. You have to accept it's not the end-all-be-all of technologies. And the fact that some people have tried it and switched back is perfectly fine. You don't use my computer, for example, so if one single larger drive is better for me, that's what I'm going to use.

 

[tuskenraider]

You don't use my computer, for example, so if one single larger drive is better for me, that's what I'm going to use.

Noone would disagree with this statement. As usual, things went awry when the two groups with different results try to dismiss the others experience. Then the throwing in of errant posts talking about the drives specifically used(Raptors in this case) didn't help the situation and I was part of that. The OP has to decide if he wants to take the gamble on what his results will be. Hopefully he makes the right decision. I told him not to bother at the beginning of this thread.

 

[Brahmzy]

Well, one thing's for sure...this topic really gets the emotions going...every time, hehe. Kind of strange that way.


As far as Raptors being noisy? They are a little louder than your typical SATA HDD but nowhere near SCSI volume levels.

That's why you buy a P180B or Solo case with silicon HDD grommets and you'll hardly know they're there.

 

[Slartibartfast]

A friend of mine's raptor 74 r0 recently bombed-out on him. I think that the time he gained by reduced load times was more or less cancelled out by having to rebuild the array and reinstall everything.

I'm with u_m on this one - the money is most likely better spent elsewhere. But, if your ram, cpu and gpu are all good, it might be a good option.

 

[feigned]

As the owner of multiple crappy 36Gb Raptors I'll respond. Hot? Mine ran(old)/run(new) at 27 C. 1 C cooler than the 200GB Seagate I have. Noiser? Sure, but I can hear the Seagate too. Not much faster? Well I can't think of one hard drive evolution for desktops that I've experienced that has presented a better improvement. Of course with the newer drives, 36GB, or any size for that matter, you data is outdated and irrelevant. As noted, your analysis is outdated and only relevant to whatever your use and testing concluded on YOUR PC. Should I believe my PC isn't noticeably quicker with Raptors because someone here tells me, or do I measure improvements for myself and see you're full of shit?

Wow, you sure showed me with your amassed empirical data that is well documented and published across the internet.

Your word versus someone elses, just like you said. Is every situation the same? No. Is my data correct? Yes. Is your data correct? Sure. I've done the benchmarks, I've done the stopwatch timing, I've done it all and it simply is not worth the risk...and yet you flew off the handle when I presented my stance like a typical !!!!!!/elitist/know-it-all like the douchebag below.

OK, who's the dumbass that would put any critical data on a RAID0 array...you? I don't know anybody here that would do it. Maybe you did once and learned your lesson?

"Where's DougLite at? He was good at blasting it too..." Wow, that justs sounds like you're lookin' for some help on this.

You telling me my personal experience with RAID0 not showing any gains is simply idiotic. The only experience you know and can speak of is your own. I feel very sorry for you that you've had such a poor RAID0 experience (if you've ever even tried it or owned a Raptor for that matter. My MANY experiences have been great as with thousands of others.

You're a self-aggrandizing fool.

It was a side-statement, vaguely related to this thread. You were making an ass out of yourself by assuming that I had lost data in one of my stripe sets. My 75GXP failed before that array was dismantled.

And like I said above, your "many" experiences and...thousands of others. I've had a few and they've been positive but simply not worth the risk in any configuration. I've been on the fence and on both sides, so please do not assume what I do and what I do not know.

DougLite entered every single one of these pissing contests with grace and tact, two things that you two mewling fucking cabbages lack.

 

[unhappy_mage]

DougLite entered every single one of these pissing contests with grace and tact, two things that you two mewling fucking cabbages lack.

Well that just *screams* grace and tact on your part. Why bring up DL if you're not trying to follow his example?

Can someone lock this thread? I don't like:
a) people arguing that raid 0 is good and useful, without presenting data to back it up
b) people arguing that raid 0 is bad and awful, without presenting data to back it up
c) people flaming others over their viewpoints, without presenting data to back it up
d) me wasting my time reading this crap in the hope that someone will ask a question that needs answering.

 

[tuskenraider]

DougLite entered every single one of these pissing contests with grace and tact, two things that you two mewling fucking cabbages lack.

Pot meet kettle.

 

[Brahmzy]

...like the douchebag below.


You're a self-aggrandizing fool.

It was a side-statement, vaguely related to this thread. You were making an ass out of yourself by assuming that I had lost data in one of my stripe sets. My 75GXP failed before that array was dismantled.

And like I said above, your "many" experiences and...thousands of others. I've had a few and they've been positive but simply not worth the risk in any configuration. I've been on the fence and on both sides, so please do not assume what I do and what I do not know.

DougLite entered every single one of these pissing contests with grace and tact, two things that you two mewling fucking cabbages lack.

Well, one thing's for sure...this topic really gets the emotions going...every time, hehe. Kind of strange that way.

See?

 

[djnes]

That's why you buy a P180B or Solo case with silicon HDD grommets and you'll hardly know they're there.

It would be nice if more cases came with them, wouldn't it?

 

[feigned]

Well that just *screams* grace and tact on your part. Why bring up DL if you're not trying to follow his example?

I know what it looks like. I'm not DL but, I see your point.

Pot meet kettle.

See?

And now you're both undeniably calm, cool, and collected once somebody calls you out on your responses.

 

[Slartibartfast]

It would be nice if more cases came with them, wouldn't it?

I have a Chenbro SR107, and on the HD racks there's like little rubber grommets between the actual rack and the HD, presumably to reduce noise vibration.

The kicker is that it comes with three delta fans that run at 46dba each