IPS and Black Levels

[Peat Moss]

I would like to get an IPS monitor (24" - 27") with good black levels and contrast, but every monitor I've researched and liked (for other reasons) has had average black levels i.e. 0.14 - 0.16 and contrast, i.e. ~ 700:1 - 800:1.

I've considered Eizos, and even considered forgetting IPS in favor of AMVA, but I don't think I could tolerate the fan noise of the Eizos, nor the off-axis shifting of AMVAs. I don't require 3000:1 kinds of contrast but something around 900:1 or 1000:1 would be nice.

I'm just looking for a decent IPS monitor with a nice high contrast ratio and good blacks (and no flickering). Uses: photo editing, watching movies.

So, I'm wondering : are there things I should look for in an IPS monitor that would tip me off to potentially having better than average black levels and contrast ?

- Panel model number?
- Matt, semi-gloss or glossy coating?
- Panel type: IPS or PLS or AH-IPS?
- Wide or standard gamut?
- etc.

 

[Morkai]

This article has a list of some "high" contrast IPS monitors.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6741/lg-29ea93-monitor-review-rev-125

I think some budget eizo later also had around 1200:1, but it was a smaller 1080p screen.

 

[Namelessme]

I think a lot of the newer IPS models can reach 1000:1 and even sometimes higher. But there will be some variability still. So some panels from the same model may be 800:1 ... some will be 1000:1.

The Eizo 2736 may be something to consider, PLS, and most people report less glow on it than typical for IPS panels. It is also flicker free at brightness levels over 20%.

And I think only some of the higher end Eizos (Coloredge line) has noisy fans? There are IPS panels that can go to 1200:1+, but some of those are the glossy 27" 1080p models, and NCX has commented that due to the bezel, blacks subjectively look worse on them.

The highest contrast IPS model I am aware of is the Eizo 2133, with a 1500:1 manufacturer listed static contrast. But it's an odd size for most people (4:3) and will be really expensive -- assuming you can find one even for sale somewhere.

 

[4ort]

The black level wouldn't actually be bad on most of the IPS monitors if it was at least uniform. But from a normal sitting position, the bottom right corner of the screen will have TN-like black levels and destroy shadow detail in that part of the screen. Unless you're willing to sit so far from the screen you can't read the smallest text.

 

[Peat Moss]

I think a lot of the newer IPS models can reach 1000:1 and even sometimes higher. But there will be some variability still. So some panels from the same model may be 800:1 ... some will be 1000:1.

Is there really that much sample variation in the same units?

The Eizo 2736 may be something to consider, PLS, and most people report less glow on it than typical for IPS panels. It is also flicker free at brightness levels over 20%.

Yes, that seems to be the only Eizo I've read about that meets all my main criteria. But then the Prad review mentioned, "An IPS Sparkles was also noticeable, but which subjectively not quite as much struck as with many competitive products", and someone on the forum here mentioned buzzing, which both kind of spooked me away from it. No LUTs, factory settings are not great, and it lacks HDMI.

It still may be worth another look though. Thanks for reminding me of it.

And I think only some of the higher end Eizos (Coloredge line) has noisy fans? There are IPS panels that can go to 1200:1+, but some of those are the glossy 27" 1080p models, and NCX has commented that due to the bezel, blacks subjectively look worse on them.

So, does a glossy screen affect black levels one way or the other? Or is it subjective.

The highest contrast IPS model I am aware of is the Eizo 2133, with a 1500:1 manufacturer listed static contrast. But it's an odd size for most people (4:3) and will be really expensive -- assuming you can find one even for sale somewhere.

Yeah, I'm looking for a at least 1920 x 1200. That must be an old model. Amazing specs for an IPS though.

 

[roma]

Eizos never impressed me. I've long thought they were overrated like Bose radios, Jaguars and Rolex watches. More sizzle than steak.

 

[NCX]

The EV2736W uses the same coating as the other 1440p PLS panels. There are plenty of PWM Free options (most of the AH-IPS either have too many quality control issues and/or suffer from obvious overshoot ghosting) with 900-1100:1 contrast ratios

BenQ BL2710PT (User Mode=100% fine for non-color critical use)
Eizo EV2736W
HP ZR2740W (uses semi-glossy coating now, only supports 720p with consoles but HP is releasing the Z27i soon)
Qnix QX2710 (mine is PWM and glow free but =DEAD='s wasn't)
Viewsonic VP2770 (most reviewers measured 850-950:1)

The EV2736W has excellent color presets, works with consoles (use a dvi-hdmi adapter/cord) and is essentially glow free which is a huge advantage. The bezel issue is mainly a "frame-less," AH-IPS problem since the inner black bezel is so dark it makes the monitors blacks look grayish and the matte Qnix's glossy black bezel (can be painted) also has a similar effect (glossy bezel+matte coating=fail).

 

[Peat Moss]

The EV2736W uses the same coating as the other 1440p PLS panels. There are plenty of PWM Free options (most of the AH-IPS either have too many quality control issues and/or suffer from obvious overshoot ghosting) with 900-1100:1 contrast ratios

BenQ BL2710PT (User Mode=100% fine for non-color critical use)
Eizo EV2736W
HP ZR2740W (uses semi-glossy coating now, only supports 720p with consoles but HP is releasing the Z27i soon)
Qnix QX2710 (mine is PWM and glow free but =DEAD='s wasn't)
Viewsonic VP2770 (most reviewers measured 850-950:1)

The EV2736W has excellent color presets, works with consoles (use a dvi-hdmi adapter/cord) and is essentially glow free which is a huge advantage. The bezel issue is mainly a "frame-less," AH-IPS problem since the inner black bezel is so dark it makes the monitors blacks look grayish and the matte Qnix's glossy black bezel (can be painted) also has a similar effect (glossy bezel+matte coating=fail).

Extrahardware found the Eizo EV2736 to have a contrast ratio of around 800:1
http://www.extrahardware.com/articl...incing-27-inch-ips-four-megapixels/strana/0/7

TFT found the HPZR2740W to have a contrast ratio of 708:1
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/hp_zr2740w_v2.htm

You found a higher contrast ratio in the BenQ BL2710PT than TFT did.
http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?p=1040309047&highlight=benq+contrast+tft#post1040309047

Does a glossy coating affect contrast or black levels either way?

 

[NCX]

If you want to dismiss a monitor because one of the many units tested (TFT Central) had lower contrast then you should quit now while you are ahead. Calibrated contrast ratios only apply if you own a colorimeter.

Check other sites like PRAD, Extrahardware CZ, Svete Hardware, and Overclock.ru before dismissing a display. Glossy, matte, glass and plasma deposition coating comparison:

http://wecravegamestoo.com/forums/m...eview-glass-2560x1440-ah-ips.html#post1121396

PS Peat my BL2710PT is for sale if you want a calibrated, blb free unit with high contrast...

 

[seiyafan]

Check out my EV2736W calibration thread, I measured the contrast to be about 850:1 at 95cd

 

[Peat Moss]

If you want to dismiss a monitor because one of the many units tested (TFT Central) had lower contrast then you should quit now while you are ahead. Calibrated contrast ratios only apply if you own a colorimeter.

That's why I asked Namelessme "Is there really that much sample variation in the same units?"

If there's really that much sample variation, then you're right, I should quit now, because then there's no way to accurately determine contrast ratio even for the same panel. It becomes a meaningless spec and makes buying any monitor nothing more than a lottery.

Who said I was "dismissing" the Eizo. I am interested in it, but I have uncertainties based on conflicting reports of contrast ratios. When I do eventually decide on a monitor, I also do plan to get a colorimeter (or even a spectrophotometer). So calibrated contrast ratio results are still of interest to me.

Peat my BL2710PT is for sale if you want a calibrated, blb free unit with high contrast...

Thanks, (I figured you had sold it already) I may be interested.

 

[Peat Moss]

NCX, could you possibly elaborate on this passage about Plasma Deposition Coatings from your blog:

Despite being slightly more reflective glossy coatings offer superior black levels and are more suitable for watching movies and playing dark games. The main advantage of PDC is the unmatched clarity of whites and light colors and lower degree of reflectivity compared to tempered glass and glossy coatings.

Do glossy coatings actually have superior measurable black levels, or is this subjectively perceived?

Also, why would PDC have clearer whites but worse black levels?

Thanks.

 

[RadXge]

IPS monitors have all bad static contrast ratio.
The best one can barely achieve 1:1000 static ratio which is awful in my opinion.

Anything below 1:10,000 static contrast ratio is not good enough.
Only a good plasma (or a ridiculously priced OLED) can achieve a satisfying contrast ratio.

 

[DVerde]

NCX, could you possibly elaborate on this passage about Plasma Deposition Coatings from your blog:



Do glossy coatings actually have superior measurable black levels, or is this subjectively perceived?

Also, why would PDC have clearer whites but worse black levels?

Thanks.

It's subjective, just like gloss in general.

 

[CrabJuice]

From all the reviews I've seen its mainly the 27" 1440p and 30" IPS panels that seems to have lower contrast ratios like you described. Look at lower DPI panels and you have at least over 1000:1. Even with oldies like U2412M. Some 27" 1080p AH-IPS panels measures up to 1300:1 even. So you should be able to do fine with any 24" 1200p monitor. Like one of those NCX suggested.

 

[Namelessme]

Is there really that much sample variation in the same units?

So, does a glossy screen affect black levels one way or the other? Or is it subjective.

Yeah, I'm looking for a at least 1920 x 1200. That must be an old model. Amazing specs for an IPS though.

I recall numbers being thrown around that panel variability as to contrast was around 30% or so. But that was from a couple of years ago. Anyway, it wouldn't surprise me in the least to see various panels from the same model to come in anywhere between 800:1 to 1000:1.

As for a glossy screen, I think that is more subjective. And that Eizo 2133 is a new model, surprisingly enough. I expect they may have sourced a panel outside of the normal companies we are used to (LG, AUO). On the plus side, if it can be done at 21.3", it should be feasible to get that same contrast on 24" models, or close to it -- same exact vertical size as 24" 16:10s. So hopefully one day someone makes a higher contrast IPS.

Your requirements don't differ from my 'wish list' for monitors a whole lot. Although I greatly prefer 4:3 or 16:10 over 16:9, and prefer < 27". If you are okay with the price of an Eizo 2736, I suggest just trying one from a place with no hassle (and no stocking fee) returns.

If you want okay black levels, good angles, and no flicker, it narrows down your search. And if you throw in low IPS glow (which sort of relates to black levels), it really, really narrows down your search. You are looking at the Eizo 2736 or one of the higher end 24" pro Eizo models. Although fans may be an issue with the pro model stuff.

Either that, or live with somewhat worse angles and go for A-MVA. Another option which you may have not considered, look for a used S-PVA instead. It should have somewhat better angles than A-MVA, contrast similar or better than most IPS panels (stlll nowhere as good as A-MVA), and no glow. Downsides are somewhat slower panels (only matters if for gaming), text may not be as crisp w/cleartype (but still fine for most), angles won't be as good as IPS, and they tended to use a medium type of coating, rather than super light (but not as bad as heavy IPS).

There probably won't be a perfect solution, so just pick which faults you can live with. As for what you want, I'd think the Eizo 2736 may make the most sense ... or just try an A-MVA and see if angles bother you.

 

[NCX]

That's why I asked Namelessme "Is there really that much sample variation in the same units?"

S-PVA, PLS & TN typically only vary by 10% between the units tested (small sample size of units tested: 3-6) compared to the massive variations (25%+) measured from IPS (e & S-IPS) and A-MVA panels

Thanks, (I figured you had sold it already) I may be interested.

Haven't sold it.

Do glossy coatings actually have superior measurable black levels, or is this subjectively perceived?

It is subjectively perceived, look at my picture (used the same camera settings) of the three displays (all displays were calibrated to the same settings and placed in the same spot). All three displays have 900-1000:1 contrast ratios but the glossy Qnix's blacks appear to be the deepest. Notice how the 2755AMG's blacks look light compared to the glass cover black bezel, as do the Qnix's compared to the glossy bezel while the BenQ's blacks look darker than the light gray bezel. Bezels play an extremely important role in the subjectively perceived black depth.

Plasma Deposition Coating and edge-to-edge/tempered glass are not anti-reflective like glossy and matte coatings. Normal glass displays have a gap between the LCD panel and glass while PDC'd displays do not. PDC offers the "truest," image an LCD can produce due to the lack of an image altering coating and gap between the LCD and glass.

 

[Peat Moss]

Can't find an Eizo EV2736 anywhere in Canada right now.