I have a few WCing questions

V

videogamer323

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 31, 2003
Messages
384
About to start working on a new watercooling setup and I have a few questions since I have been out of the loop for awhile.

D-Tek Fuzion
GPU Block (maybe x2) (Probably some sort of EK one once I get my new videocard(s))
Chipset block (once I figure out if it is needed)
Thermochill PA120.3 Radiator
Laing DDC or Laing D5
2x Thermochill PA120.3 Fan Shroud
6x 120mm Yate Loon D12SL-12 Case Fan - Black (47 CFM, 28 dBA)

Going T line and trying to make this build pretty silent so all fans will be on controllers. Radiator will be mounted on top of the case.

Ok so the questions I have:
1) Which pump would better serve me? The Laing DDC w/ Petra'sTech DDCT-01s Top or Laing D5? I was looking at the GPH and Head pressure both have good and bads. Which would be better for the setup above?
2)Would 2x fan shrouds be overkill? Remember I want as little airflow to keep everything silent so the more efficient it is the better.
3) Is it ok to use elbows in the loop?
4) Anything you see just absolutely wrong with my setup?

Thanks for all the help!
 
videogamer323 said:
Ok so the questions I have:
1) Which pump would better serve me? The Laing DDC w/ Petra'sTech DDCT-01s Top or Laing D5? I was looking at the GPH and Head pressure both have good and bads. Which would be better for the setup above?
2)Would 2x fan shrouds be overkill? Remember I want as little airflow to keep everything silent so the more efficient it is the better.
3) Is it ok to use elbows in the loop?
4) Anything you see just absolutely wrong with my setup?

Thanks for all the help!
Click to expand...
1. Generally, a DDC with a top has more pressure than a D5, but the D5 has a higher peak flow rate. If you're going for quiet and want a DDC, make sure to go with the quieter DDC (they go by many names, just make sure it's a <30 dBA model). The D5 is cheaper, but I'd say the DDC with a top would perform better.

2. PAs are designed to work as well as possible with everything under 130cfm of air. With those Yates, it certainly won't hurt performance. The dBA level increases by 3 when you add another equal noise source, so 6 12v Yates would be around 34 dBA, or theoretically slightly below twice as loud as a single Yate (36 vs. 26 dBA). At that price for the PA120.3 and shroud(s), I'd highly recommend getting multiple radiators instead of (or in addition to) a single PA120.3. I'd say that push-pull is probably overkill for a low CFM designed radiator, but if you want to try it out, I'd recommend getting a single shroud first, then adding another if you think it's worthwhile.

3. Elbows can make routing tubing easier, at the cost of flow. In general, a single one won't make a major difference, unless it's in a bad place (mainly, right before a pump's intake). If you do think you'll need or want to use elbows, I'd highly recommend trying to use 45* elbows if at all possible, and for 45* and 90* elbows, getting sweep instead of mitre elbows (scroll down here for further explanation and pics).

4. Nothing really sticks out, they're all great, top (or best) performing parts. I'd recommend getting the FuZion accelerator nozzles as well (use the 4.5mm one for best performance), and a reservoir is (usually) easier to fill and bleed than a T-line, but adds another $20 or more. And if you want to save some cash, there are a few ways to cut costs without losing too much performance.

Good luck, and take pics!
 
ikellensbro said:
1

2. PAs are designed to work as well as possible with everything under 130cfm of air.
Click to expand...
I'd have to disagree with that. CFMs over 130make little difference in cooling for a PA120.3. Their cooling maxes out at 150 CFMs or so. But CFMs under 130 CFMs have tremendous differences, as much as 250% at low flow rates, and even more at higher flow rates....+300%

http://www.thermochill.com/PATesting/PA1203HeatdissVSFlowrateGPM.jpg
PA1203HeatdissVSFlowrateGPM.jpg
 
Lemme have a go with your questions:

1) Laing D5. The DDC+ with a top is more powerful, but has a horrible track record for reliability :)

2) Yes. I'd rather double up the fans, in a push pull config, then run with shrouds.

3) Yes!

4) Well, your component choices are good. What's the system you plan on cooling?
 
Add more radiators intead of a single 120.3? From what I was told a single 120.3 will perform better than 2 120.3's from other manufacturers. If he was to add more radiators he must have an insainly large case with tons of space to spare. 120.3 should perform awesome alone.

I would run higher CFM fans rather than doubling them up you will likely gain more performance and optimize your noise/airflow ratio using higher power fans, you will gain more noise than performance trying to double up. Plus it may be much cheaper to buy 3 appropriate fans for the job since you will need less of them. Also you can use 120x38m fans to help with the airflow because they typicaly can generate more static pressure (not really an issue with the thermochill, but probably better than doubling up on fans as well)

I like my D5, reliability is important. I don't bother using the adjustment screw on mine, but I DO wish my older D5 had an RPM sensing wire. It would be nice to connect it up and tell the BIOS to shut the PC down should the RPM drasticaly drop.
 
I would run higher CFM fans rather than doubling them up you will likely gain more performance and optimize your noise/airflow ratio using higher power fans, you will gain more noise than performance trying to double up.
Click to expand...

I disagree full heatedly. Moving from dual Panaflow M1A's at 10v, to quad Yate loons at around 7v decreased my noise levels by around 5dba (from 1 foot, case closed).

From what I was told a single 120.3 will perform better than 2 120.3's from other manufacturers.
Click to expand...

Are you saying that you were told a single PA120.3 is as good as dual 120.3's from other manufacturers? I don't quite get what you're getting at.
 
Arcygenical said:
I disagree full heatedly. Moving from dual Panaflow M1A's at 10v, to quad Yate loons at around 7v decreased my noise levels by around 5dba (from 1 foot, case closed).
Click to expand...
Try L1A's instead...M1A's are loud, but there are other fans that will push more air as well, and when I say push more air, I mean more air through the radiator not just looking at theoretical fan CFM ratings...As far as Panaflos I hear they are somewhat hit and miss now depends on where the batch came from that the resellers are selling....

Point is your not going to blow twice as much air through the radiator br doubling up on fans, in fact you likely will never even reach the maximum CFM of a single yate. My recommendation is not to buy the fans I purchased (I'll leave that for the OP to decide) but that you will likely flow more air using 3 fans of higher CFM than 6 fans of lower on each side of the radiator, if the fans are designed properly for the application.

Since the OP mentioned silence I would recomend 3 yates over 6 period. if you want more performance than that then use a different 3 fans. Also from my understanding (reading some time back), with push pull you would want the parallel fans to spin in opposite directions but push air in the same direction for maximum gains. Hard to find fans that do this...

Are you saying that you were told a single PA120.3 is as good as dual 120.3's from other manufacturers? I don't quite get what you're getting at.
Click to expand...

yep,
 
Justintoxicated said:
yep,
Click to expand...

That's just plain wrong then...

As for the six vs three yate loon fans... I've also noticed the reverse too. Due to a space issue, I had to return back to three yates at 10-11v, rather than 6 yates at 6v.

The three were substantially louder.
 
Arcygenical said:
That's just plain wrong then...

As for the six vs three yate loon fans... I've also noticed the reverse too. Due to a space issue, I had to return back to three yates at 10-11v, rather than 6 yates at 6v.

The three were substantially louder.
Click to expand...

Then can you link me to a radiator that performs anywhere close to the thermochill with low CFM fans?

So you had to double the voltage on the yates to get the cooling back to where it was with 6 @ 6v? I guess thats just another reason why I don't use them, sounds like they do not have enough static pressure. You were running these on the thermochill though?
 
Justintoxicated said:
Then can you link me to a radiator that performs anywhere close to the thermochill with low CFM fans?

So you had to double the voltage on the yates to get the cooling back to where it was with 6 @ 6v? I guess thats just another reason why I don't use them, sounds like they do not have enough static pressure. You were running these on the thermochill though?
Click to expand...

No question about it, the Thermochill IS the best radiator on the market. This margin of improvement, is in the area of 20-50% (depending on the rads in comparison, and the fans blowing through it). Nowhere near a full 100% boost. Over a regular MCR of the same size, with a yate loon slow fan, the margin is about 25%.

Yes, I had to double the voltage on my yate loon fans, The radiator is a Black Ice Pro Xflow 360. The noise level increased, as I said, but the cooling stayed about the same. I don't see how the static pressure conclusion was formed though... The best of fans of a comparable RPM figure (1200) wouldn't be enough to cool my radiator at 6v. At 12v, the Yates have a static pressure of 2.4mmH2O... Which is about the same as the panaflow L1A's at 10v.
 
Yea I dunno, I could never really hear my L1A's when I run them at around 8 volts and they are pleny enough to cool my thermochill...Then again my setup was inside the PC so I guess that reduces the noise drastacly, as well as having an easier flowing radiator.

I have a fishtank in the same room with a small airstone, so maybe thats why I never noticed.

BTW I got my info on the thermochill from this forum when I asked abotu the Black Ice Extreme 120.4 and I was told that my thermochill PA 120.2 would work better than the 120.4.....

If the margin of improvement shoudl not be linear then though so maybe thats what they ment...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top