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How necessary is push-pull w/ SB?

J

Jimmy the Greek

Gawd
Joined
Aug 20, 2002
Messages
657
I just upgraded to the Sandy Bridge platform, and am running my 2600k at 4.6 / 1.325v. I'm reusing the Thermalright Ultra-120 Extreme from my LGA775 setup, and with a single 120mm Nexus fan in push, I hit 85C after 30 minutes in Prime95.

I've been considering the Ultra-120 Black, as this would allow me to have a push-pull setup while reusing my TRUE mounting plate, so I wouldn't have to remove my motherboard from the case. My questions are two-fold:

1) Should I worry about the 85C temps in Prime95, if I only hit around 60-65C in real-world gaming?

2) Should a push-pull Ultra-120 Black yield significantly lower (e.g. 10C or more) temps? Alternatively, would a more modern cooler (e.g. Noctua NH-D14) provide tangible benefit over the Ultra-120 Black, and be worth the time and effort needed to switch mounting plates?
 
85C is pretty high, but if you're not hitting that high when gaming, then I don't see a problem.

A Push-Pull system usually only drops 1C at best.
Now when the CPU is under load, your max temps may drop 1-3C, which is not too bad.

If you're going to upgrade, I'd recommend the Noctua NH-D14.
By far, the best air heatsink. :)
 
85C does seem bit high. Is the thermal grease installed properly? Also Nexus fan (its Real Silent isnt it?) doesnt push a lot of air and TRUE120 works better with fans that do push a lot of air.
 
MaZa said:
85C does seem bit high. Is the thermal grease installed properly? Also Nexus fan (its Real Silent isnt it?) doesnt push a lot of air and TRUE120 works better with fans that do push a lot of air.
Click to expand...

Yes, Real Silent. FWIW, I used this same setup (case, cooling fans) with a 4GHz E8400, and would usually get 65C max in stress testing.

Would I see a big difference if I swapped it out with this? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185005
 
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Jimmy the Greek said:
Yes, Real Silent. FWIW, I used this same setup (case, cooling fans) with a 4GHz E8400, and would usually get 65C max in stress testing.

Would I see a big difference if I swapped it out with this? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185005
Click to expand...


I really cant say, but I believe there should be improvement. S-Flex is a good fan, pushes decent amount of air and is also silent, though I would opt for version that spins faster. Usually you can use some software, like Speedfan, to control fan speeds if you want silence, max speed is necessary for stress testing anyway.

Another good fan is Gentle Typhoon 1450rpm version, it downvolts really well and is surprisingly silent despite being a ballbearing.

Akasa also has PWM fans (makes temperature controlling easier as you should be able to set it up in BIOS) that move a lot of air. Not sure how silent they are. I use Akasa Apache 1200rpm and it is louder than 120mm Real Silent running in same speed, but it pushes more air.

Perhaps I should do a comparison out of curiosity. I do have couple of Real silent fans around so I could check how it compares to me my Akasa at same speed. I have TRUE120 too.
 
I hit 79C with the Thermalright Archcon after 2 hours of prime. This is with the single 140mm fan it comes with. My setup is very quiet. With Push/Pull I could have probably gotten 5ghz stable but figure why bother. I like silence. You might try the Thermalright 140mm on your setup or Lap and washer mod that TRUE.
 
I decided to go with the Scythe Kama Flex, because it seemed like the best bang for my buck, in terms of PWM fans. I'll try replacing the fan first, and see if that makes a difference. If not, I'll reseat the TRUE.

Thanks for the suggestions!
 
85C with a TRUE120? That seems very odd. At 4.5ghz and with a smaller hyper 212+ and single fan, I'm not even breaking 60C under load. Then again it was mid-late Jan when I upgraded to the 2500k and ambient room temps were pretty fricking low ;)
 
First thing anyone should try when questioning temps is a re-seat. I don't see OP mentioning trying that yet soo...
 
To be fair, it only reaches 85C in Prime95. After a couple of hours in Crysis 2, the highest core is around 65C. Also, I'm running a low-noise/silent setup, so high temps should be somewhat expected.
 
I just got the Kama Flex, and the temperatures were roughly the same (83C) afterwards. I haven't re-seated the TRUE yet, but tried running the CPU at stock, and only hit 63C in Prime95. With that in mind, are the high OC'ed temps an issue with the processor itself, and not the heatsink?
 
Does anyone have any good pointers for reseating the TRUE? Should it be screwed in completely, or should I leave some wiggle room?

Also, what's the best way to apply thermal paste to quad cores? With dual cores, I would apply a grain of rice-sized piece of goo to the center of the chip, then clamp down the heatsink. Should I still being doing this with a quad? I'm using MX-4, if that makes any difference.
 
push/pull at a minimum lets you spin your fans slower for any given cooler. That to me is worth it.
 
I reseated the TRUE, and tried applying paste with the "line" method instead of the "grain of rice" method. Unfortunately, temperatures are the same.

I'm using an Antec P182, and have the TRUE's fan pointing towards the rear exhaust. The rear exhaust is about 4.5" away from my wall, so the heat may not have much room to travel. Should I re-orient the TRUE fan, so it points towards the top exhaust fan?

Please advise.
 
I tried a couple of other setups last night:

1. Adding a Nexus fan to the TRUE in "pull" configuration
2. Adding a Nexus fan to the 5.25" bay, to add intake

But in both instances, temperatures were only 1-2C cooler, so I still ended up in the low 80s. Aside from this, my current fan configuration is as follows:

1. Nexus Real Silent 120mm on top (exhaust; runs 1000rpm at load)
2. Nexus Real Silent 120mm on rear (exhaust; runs 1000rpm at load)
3. Scythe Kama Flex 120mm on TRUE (push; runs 1600rpm at load)
4. Nexus Real Silent 120mm in HDD (pushing air towards PSU; always runs at 1000rpm)

My cable management is pristine, so I'm miffed at the temperatures. Is the P182 just that bad for keeping temps down?
 
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I'm using a p182 as well and my temps don't get that high with a less capable cooler.
 
Here is my setup, FWIW:

Cooler Master Hyper 212+ with Push/Pull CM Blademaster (PWM fans Y-cabled to board)
Arctic Silver 5
Antec 300
3 x Antec 120mm TriCool Intake (two front, one side, the two front plugged into the board control)
1 x Antec TriCool 140mm Exhaust (top)
1 x Antec TriCool 120mm Exhaust (rear)

My cable management is acceptable at best. All of the case fans have the Low, Medium, High switches. With all of them on high and the HSF fans controlled by PWM (and the two front intakes in the board, but I can't tell if they ramp up or down properly), at 4.7ghz I would see idle temps around high 20s/low 30s and IBT load temps in high 60s. Three hours of Starcraft 2 and Real Temp had the max at 55c. Of course, it sounds like an indoor hurricane with everything on high. I have yet to try the OC with the fans on medium, but on stock at medium idle temps still hover around same range.

I originally used the CM paste that came with the HSF, but I took it off, reseated, and used the AS5. The reseating certainly helped because one of my screws was stripped I learned, but temps did drop about 5c.

Are these temps with the front door of the P182 closed? Have you tried putting intakes down there? I know those front intakes lower my temps a lot.
 
Katalysis said:
Here is my setup, FWIW:

Cooler Master Hyper 212+ with Push/Pull CM Blademaster (PWM fans Y-cabled to board)
Arctic Silver 5
Antec 300
3 x Antec 120mm TriCool Intake (two front, one side, the two front plugged into the board control)
1 x Antec TriCool 140mm Exhaust (top)
1 x Antec TriCool 120mm Exhaust (rear)

My cable management is acceptable at best. All of the case fans have the Low, Medium, High switches. With all of them on high and the HSF fans controlled by PWM (and the two front intakes in the board, but I can't tell if they ramp up or down properly), at 4.7ghz I would see idle temps around high 20s/low 30s and IBT load temps in high 60s. Three hours of Starcraft 2 and Real Temp had the max at 55c. Of course, it sounds like an indoor hurricane with everything on high. I have yet to try the OC with the fans on medium, but on stock at medium idle temps still hover around same range.

I originally used the CM paste that came with the HSF, but I took it off, reseated, and used the AS5. The reseating certainly helped because one of my screws was stripped I learned, but temps did drop about 5c.

Are these temps with the front door of the P182 closed? Have you tried putting intakes down there? I know those front intakes lower my temps a lot.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the detailed info!

The case's front door is closed. Before I got my GTX 570, I was able to fit the middle drive bay in my case, and had attached a 120mm Yate Loon low-speed fan using the Antec clips. The GTX 570 gets in the way of the bay, but I will try placing an intake fan in the very front of the case.

My other thought is that the GTX dumps hot air onto the CPU, and that I should try moving the video card to my 2nd PCI-Ex16 slot. My video card takes up three slots, so I probably won't have enough room, but I will try to shimmy it in later today.
 
I just use the bottom hd tray in my p182, the 'middle' one has been removed. Haven't installed a fan to suck in air tho.
 
There wasn't enough room to mount my GPU in the 2nd PCIe x16 slot, so I ended up making the top fan an intake. Temps are down about 5-6C, which is pretty neat.

I still think the CPU's proximity to the GPU is causing issues, and I was considering putting this between them: http://www.frozencpu.com/products/9...FTER_25_Quad_Drive_HDDSSD_Cooler_Adapter.html

1. Would this fit in a PCI-e x1 slot?
2. If I were to use two 80mm fans, would it be best to have both blowing towards the CPU, both at the GPU, or one blowing at each device?
 
Hmmm, I have a P182 also. My temps with my stock 2500k are ~33-34 C. Not "high" but I would like them a bit lower before i delve into overclocking. So, you just flipped your top fan around to make it an intake? So what all is set up for exhaust? Just the one rear fan and of course bottom mounted PS?

I still have the three antec tri-cool fans and one (can't recall the brand) as an intake in the front where the top drive cage was.
 
2004raptor said:
Hmmm, I have a P182 also. My temps with my stock 2500k are ~33-34 C. Not "high" but I would like them a bit lower before i delve into overclocking. So, you just flipped your top fan around to make it an intake? So what all is set up for exhaust? Just the one rear fan and of course bottom mounted PS?

I still have the three antec tri-cool fans and one (can't recall the brand) as an intake in the front where the top drive cage was.
Click to expand...

I have one Nexus Real Silent as the rear exhaust fan, and then the PSU fan. There's a Nexus in the lower drive bay, between the HDDs and PSU...would that be considered exhaust, as well?

I should've also mentioned that I added a Nexus to the very front of the middle drive bay, but I'm skeptical as to how much air that's adding to the intake.
 
Just got home and tried switching my top fan from exhaust to intake. Temps went up ~2 C. So, back to exhaust it goes. I still get and average of 33 - 34 C so I'm not too bad but really want to get a few degrees lower.
 
DarthV said:
At 4.5ghz and with a smaller hyper 212+ and single fan, I'm not even breaking 60C under load.
Click to expand...

I'm in the same boat, 2500k @ 1.36v and haven't seen it past 56 C with the hyper 212+.
But I did the push-pull because i have extra fans lying around. my ambient is 65-67 F.
 
I just tried push/pull with my setup and the temps went up?? I guess it may have been the fan I used for the "pull". All I had was a yate loon d12sl-12. It's only ~1350 rpm. I guess it was restricting the "push" fan maybe?
 
So I upgraded to the NH-D14, and using ULNA on both fans, I get about 76-80C on the warmest core in Prime95. I guess these temps are normal!
 
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