High-end Smartphones Killing Off High-end Smartphones

Dekoth-E- said:
I think the point is that smart phones have been able to easily do all of those tasks for many years now. What do the newest ones bring other than forced obsolescence through bad design? They certainly don't bring any new features that offer any actual merit.
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My wife had a Note 3, her friend a Note 5, her friends phone downloaded content much faster because it supported an available network type that my wife's phone did not. Network support is one of the biggest single major features that should be a consideration for new phones. It sure used to be, but people seem to have forgotten this recently by the replies here.

5G is coming if you believe President Trump's Executive Order to support a nationwide roll-out of that service.

Here is an article about the difference in current 4G and 5G networks but it's sort of misleading in one specific way that I will go into.
https://www.lifewire.com/5g-vs-4g-4156322
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From a peak speed perspective, 5G is 20 times faster than 4G. This means that during the time it took to download just one piece of data with 4G (like a movie), the same could have been downloaded 20 times over a 5G network. Looking at it another way: you could download close to 10 movies before 4G could deliver even the first half of one!

5G has a peak download speed of 20 Gb/s while 4G sits at just 1 Gb/s.
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Now here is the problem. Because 5G will be operating at much higher frequencies, the distance from antennas will be shorter, meaning our providers will have to roll out many more antennas. Now the article does cover other aspects like the fact that these higher frequencies won't penetrate into buildings as well, and 5G service will degrade in poor weather. But the end result is that 4G will have to remain active so that when you can't get decent 5G service your phone can drop to the 4G networks to stay connected.

And if you are into wearing a tin-foil hat, 5G and the extremely dense antenna saturation is going to make for some extremely accurate direction finding service.

So in short, although the Networks have not changed much, this should be something that is on everyone's RADAR when they are thinking about a new phone, or whether to invest this kind of money into a new phone.

My wife's and my last switch was driven by a change in carriers, we left Verizon for T-Mobile and so far are very happy for it. One hell of a discount for seniors
 
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lcpiper said:
There's this guy in class and his college professor says he doesn't understand why young people are so hung up with sex. He says sex is no more satisfying than a good shit.

So the student stands up and says to the professor, "I mean no disrespect sir, but either I don't know how to shit, or you don't know how to fuck".

I have replied to job recruiters who called me and was able to send my most recent resume in on the spot with my phone.

I have had to submit documents online and used my phone to photograph them instead of going home to use a scanner.

I have performed remote management tasks on computer networks from my phone.

Like the matrix, I didn't know how to replace a pump in my washing machine, a Youtube video did the trick.

And the new phones these days are getting pretty good at voice control if you put some effort into training it.

So which is it, don't know how to shit, or don't know how to fuck?

Look man, few people need such things. But some people can make very good use of them if there is enough practical use for the features available.

You may not, but why would you decide that just because you don't, that no one does?
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My Z3 can and has done all of these. It's still capable of all of them. Literally all.

If this is the best you can come up with to justify paying £1000 for a phone in 2018, then really you're making everyone else's argument for them - You can buy a Z3 or an equivalent current-model, midrange phone, for £200.

The only reason you'd ever pay 5 times as much for the same capability (in terms of shit you actually use, and don't just brag about but then ignore because it's not useful) is if you're a complete fucking idiot.
 
lcpiper said:
My wife had a Note 3, her friend a Note 5, her friends phone downloaded content much faster because it supported an available network type that my wife's phone did not. Network support is one of the biggest single major features that should be a consideration for new phones. It sure used to be, but people seem to have forgotten this recently by the replies here.

5G is coming if you believe President Trump's Executive Order to support a nationwide roll-out of that service.

Here is an article about the difference in current 4G and 5G networks but it's sort of misleading in one specific way that I will go into.




Now here is the problem. Because 5G will be operating at much higher frequencies, the distance from antennas will be shorter, meaning our providers will have to roll out many more antennas. Now the article does cover other aspects like the fact that these higher frequencies won't penetrate into buildings as well, and 5G service will degrade in poor weather. But the end result is that 4G will have to remain active so that when you can't get decent 5G service your phone can drop to the 4G networks to stay connected.

And if you are into wearing a tin-foil hat, 5G and the extremely dense antenna saturation is going to make for some extremely accurate direction finding service.

So in short, although the Networks have not changed much, this should be something that is on everyone's RADAR when they are thinking about a new phone, or whether to invest this kind of money into a new phone.

My wife's and my last switch was driven by a change in carriers, we left Verizon for T-Mobile and so far are very happy for it. One hell of a discount for seniors
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Network support? So..what new rollout has carrier done that any 4g LTE class phone doesn't have? Because last I checked my 6 year old GNex is fully capable of maxing out Verizons network. What I do notice however is it slows down randomly for no reason until I call Verizon and bitch about it then suddenly it maxes out again. Seems to me you are describing network throttling as a means to "encourage" you to upgrade not some unknown network upgrade.
 
I had a Nexus 6P that I was perfectly happy with. It only got upgraded to a Mate 9 as it was replaced under warranty due to a defective battery. Aside from that I would have happily kept using it for another year or two as it had everythign I wanted - great screen and camera, and it was nice and zippy. Especially given the stupid pricing of flagships now, there's no way I'm paying 50% more for an equivalent tier phone. Not gonna happen.
 
lcpiper said:
My wife had a Note 3, her friend a Note 5, her friends phone downloaded content much faster because it supported an available network type that my wife's phone did not. Network support is one of the biggest single major features that should be a consideration for new phones. It sure used to be, but people seem to have forgotten this recently by the replies here.

5G is coming if you believe President Trump's Executive Order to support a nationwide roll-out of that service.

Here is an article about the difference in current 4G and 5G networks but it's sort of misleading in one specific way that I will go into.




Now here is the problem. Because 5G will be operating at much higher frequencies, the distance from antennas will be shorter, meaning our providers will have to roll out many more antennas. Now the article does cover other aspects like the fact that these higher frequencies won't penetrate into buildings as well, and 5G service will degrade in poor weather. But the end result is that 4G will have to remain active so that when you can't get decent 5G service your phone can drop to the 4G networks to stay connected.

And if you are into wearing a tin-foil hat, 5G and the extremely dense antenna saturation is going to make for some extremely accurate direction finding service.

So in short, although the Networks have not changed much, this should be something that is on everyone's RADAR when they are thinking about a new phone, or whether to invest this kind of money into a new phone.

My wife's and my last switch was driven by a change in carriers, we left Verizon for T-Mobile and so far are very happy for it. One hell of a discount for seniors
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Again, not everyone streams 4k movies on their phone. I literally have no use for a network faster than 3G for what I use my phone for. I also usually use between 200-300 MB a month in cellular data. Although my LG G2 is starting to show its age but I can still get 2-3 day's normal use out of it on one charge as my phone is at idle with the screen off literally 99% of the time. I admit that I am an atypical user of smart phones as I almost always have access to a laptop, desktop, or tablet that can do everything that my phone can do (except make calls and texts) better. When I get a new phone in the next year or so, I am looking to spend $200-300 and plan on keeping it for 3-5 years.
 
$1,000 for a celestial jukebox, a compendium of all human knowledge, the best screen in my apartment, some of the best satnav money can buy, and a camera that's probably better than the last point and shoot you bought; a swift web browser, communicator, and credential manager; a thin, easily pocket-able case with decent ergonomics.

Doesn't sound unreasonable to me. If there's one device I value more than anything else in my home, regardless of monetary value, it's my phone.

Now hurry up and develop that effortless HUD. Beam 4K directly into my eyeball. Looking forward to having this conversation again at $10,000.
 
IRSmurf said:
$1,000 for a celestial jukebox, a compendium of all human knowledge, the best screen in my apartment, some of the best satnav money can buy, and a camera that's probably better than the last point and shoot you bought; a swift web browser, communicator, and credential manager; a thin, easily pocket-able case with decent ergonomics.

Doesn't sound unreasonable to me. If there's one device I value more than anything else in my home, regardless of monetary value, it's my phone.

Now hurry up and develop that effortless HUD. Beam 4K directly into my eyeball. Looking forward to having this conversation again at $10,000.
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Again, my £200 Z3 fits this description perfectly. Why do you WANT to spend 800 extra to obtain the same capability?
 
For me too now it's just -

1. Does it have a decent enough camera? (to be honest a good quality 8MP would still do fine for me)
2. Is it fairly cheap?
3. Of course it will run Gmail, Calendar, Drive, Here Maps, Keep, BBC, IMDB, News360....it has 6 cores or more.

Done.

I don't game, I enjoy the real social company of other humans and I don't consider a phone as my BFF. I use maybe 150MB of data a month and sometimes I go two days without charging. I don't even care about what version of Android it uses or if it gets updates anymore cos that's all bullshit anyway. As long as it still runs the apps I need...done!

My ideal phone would be a Nexus 4 with some minor hardware tweaks and an upgrade to the camera.
 
daglesj said:
For me too now it's just -

1. Does it have a decent enough camera? (to be honest a good quality 8MP would still do fine for me)
2. Is it fairly cheap?
3. Of course it will run Gmail, Calendar, Drive, Here Maps, Keep, BBC, IMDB, News360....it has 6 cores or more.

Done.

I don't game, I enjoy the real social company of other humans and I don't consider a phone as my BFF. I use maybe 150MB of data a month and sometimes I go two days without charging. I don't even care about what version of Android it uses or if it gets updates anymore cos that's all bullshit anyway. As long as it still runs the apps I need...done!

My ideal phone would be a Nexus 4 with some minor hardware tweaks and an upgrade to the camera.
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I've long since given up on phone cameras. They pretty much all suck. None of the old ones and none of the new ones that will probably come out in the next 1-2 years will compare to my 3 year old Sony Cybershot RX100 IV. All a phone camera is good for is taking a picture of some shitty lunch you had at some random restaurant.
 
krotch said:
I've long since given up on phone cameras. They pretty much all suck. None of the old ones and none of the new ones that will probably come out in the next 1-2 years will compare to my 3 year old Sony Cybershot RX100 IV. All a phone camera is good for is taking a picture of some shitty lunch you had at some random restaurant.
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I have come to the point in my life when I realise that no one wants to look at my photos and I no longer care or want to look at other people's photos either. So as long as they look fine to me that's all that really matters. Plus I prefer to live the moment through my own eyes rather than through a CCD.

This is a point that most camera obsessives forget. It doesn't matter how good your camera is. You ain't that good and yes your 7000 40MP vacation shots ARE boring!
 
The main things I want in a phone is a fast and good camera and the phone itself to be snappy
Its real easy for you guys to say "you wanna take pictures get a real camera"
I take pics of my kids and random shit all the time, do you think I'm gonna carry a camera around as well as the phone...no.

yet here I use mainly my work S8 which does indeed have a great camera, and th OS sucks balls because of Samesungs add on shite
i should have gotten an Xperia XZ premium. that was miles faster then the S8
 
krotch said:
I've long since given up on phone cameras. They pretty much all suck. None of the old ones and none of the new ones that will probably come out in the next 1-2 years will compare to my 3 year old Sony Cybershot RX100 IV. All a phone camera is good for is taking a picture of some shitty lunch you had at some random restaurant.
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The camera on my XA isn't terrible, but it does poorly in low light, and the built-in camera app is terrible. open camera is much better, and my hand cannon (a powershot s110) is better still (though the flash is somewhat inadequate, that's generally expected in a point and shoot camera).
 
GlacierNine said:
My Z3 can and has done all of these. It's still capable of all of them. Literally all.

If this is the best you can come up with to justify paying £1000 for a phone in 2018, then really you're making everyone else's argument for them - You can buy a Z3 or an equivalent current-model, midrange phone, for £200.

The only reason you'd ever pay 5 times as much for the same capability (in terms of shit you actually use, and don't just brag about but then ignore because it's not useful) is if you're a complete fucking idiot.
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Then I'm an idiot, completely.

BTW, you see me calling anyone an idiot for NOT paying $1000 for new phone?

Fucking toon
 
daglesj said:
I have come to the point in my life when I realise that no one wants to look at my photos and I no longer care or want to look at other people's photos either. So as long as they look fine to me that's all that really matters. Plus I prefer to live the moment through my own eyes rather than through a CCD.

This is a point that most camera obsessives forget. It doesn't matter how good your camera is. You ain't that good and yes your 7000 40MP vacation shots ARE boring!
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I don't take pictures for someone else. I take pictures for myself. My smartphone can take crappy pictures for someone else. Also my shots are usually,"Hey, that looks really cool. Let me grab my camera and take a picture of it."

If your trips are boring that you don't want to take a picture of it, that's fine. I enjoy my trips and like remembering them.

TheOne&OnlyZeke said:
The main things I want in a phone is a fast and good camera and the phone itself to be snappy
Its real easy for you guys to say "you wanna take pictures get a real camera"
I take pics of my kids and random shit all the time, do you think I'm gonna carry a camera around as well as the phone...no.

yet here I use mainly my work S8 which does indeed have a great camera, and th OS sucks balls because of Samesungs add on shite
i should have gotten an Xperia XZ premium. that was miles faster then the S8
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None of us said for you to carry around a camera. At least, I didn't. I'm just saying that I do, cause I like having good quality photos, when I want to take good quality photos. So, when I leave my apt, I grab my bag. Which has my passport, camera, smokes, and I'll toss in my keys, wallet, and phone.
 
krotch said:
I don't take pictures for someone else. I take pictures for myself. My smartphone can take crappy pictures for someone else. Also my shots are usually,"Hey, that looks really cool. Let me grab my camera and take a picture of it."

If your trips are boring that you don't want to take a picture of it, that's fine. I enjoy my trips and like remembering them.



None of us said for you to carry around a camera. At least, I didn't. I'm just saying that I do, cause I like having good quality photos, when I want to take good quality photos. So, when I leave my apt, I grab my bag. Which has my passport, camera, smokes, and I'll toss in my keys, wallet, and phone.
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The implication is always "carry a camera if you want good photos" Every time a thread like this appears

I carry a wallet, keys and phone...so the phone better be damn good at taking photos
 
Dekoth-E- said:
Network support? So..what new rollout has carrier done that any 4g LTE class phone doesn't have? Because last I checked my 6 year old GNex is fully capable of maxing out Verizons network. What I do notice however is it slows down randomly for no reason until I call Verizon and bitch about it then suddenly it maxes out again. Seems to me you are describing network throttling as a means to "encourage" you to upgrade not some unknown network upgrade.
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No, I'm not talking about throttling. Others listed all kinds of features and reasons for upgrading. I said that the phone network types matter every bit as much or more and are a very valid reason to upgrade.

No one remembers when the Moto Razer V3 first came out, the best phone available when 3G networks first came online? A lot of people bought new phones then if 3G was available, hell even if it wasn't.

Now we have a pretty solid idea that 5G will be coming, not right away, but it looks like it's happen and when it does, many people will be trying to decide if it's time for a new phone, and when that time comes, 5G might be a solid reason if it's available to the buyer.

This is what I am, I guess, having a hard time communicating.

Oh and the camera debate, when I have worked in server rooms that weren't classified, I sometimes use my camera to take pictures of the equipment I manage. I grab images of the rear of the equipment and try to get clear shots of the ports and their designations, and serial numbers cause those come in handy too. It's not easy getting good shots, bad light and bad angles make it challenging but a good camera makes a real difference. My old Note 2 did a good job, but when I upgraded to Moto Droid Turbo I chose it over a Note 3 because of price, and the Moto had a higher pixel density camera. What I didn't realize at the time was that the camera had a lot of pxels, but it was slow and hard to get clear focused shots with. This was another reason that I wanted to upgrade sooner and get a better camera.
 
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I just don't see the point of these crazy priced phones. I used a Zenfone 2 for the longest time (bought for 100) until I finally got tired of replacing the extremely fragile screens. I then used a cheep ass 30 smart phone I got directly from att. That phone was noticably slow so I bought a cat s60 to replace it and honestly couldn't be happier. It doesn't need a case, its water proof, no bloatware, ect. Not the best spec wise but realistically no one needs most of that power in a phone
 
lcpiper said:
Then I'm an idiot, completely.

BTW, you see me calling anyone an idiot for NOT paying $1000 for new phone?

Fucking toon
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I mean, why are you even mad that you don't have a better way to waste £800, than to buy a phone five times more expensive than is required to do any of the things you do?

Do you genuinely not have any better reason to own the thing than this?
 
GlacierNine said:
I mean, why are you even mad that you don't have a better way to waste £800, than to buy a phone five times more expensive than is required to do any of the things you do?

Do you genuinely not have any better reason to own the thing than this?
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Why do you feel it's an issue for you to resolve, how I spend my money?

Why do you think it's even a cause for comment in a public forum knowing that others will feel put upon by your challenge.

I mean look at the nads on you that you think it's your place to question my choices that I made based on my situation, needs, and desires.

I'd spend a $1,000 just to tell a self-righteous prick like yourself to go fuck himself.

But thanks to the wonders of the internet age, it's not costing me nearly so much.
 
lcpiper said:
Why do you feel it's an issue for you to resolve, how I spend my money?

Why do you think it's even a cause for comment in a public forum knowing that others will feel put upon by your challenge.

I mean look at the nads on you that you think it's your place to question my choices that I made based on my situation, needs, and desires.

I'd spend a $1,000 just to tell a self-righteous prick like yourself to go fuck himself.

But thanks to the wonders of the internet age, it's not costing me nearly so much.
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So what you're saying is that you have absolutely no good reason to spend that money on something that gives you absolutely no tangible benefit but you're also so invested in continuing to do so and tell other people about it that you'll have extended arguments about it on the internet.

You're right, it's not an issue for me how you spend your money. In fact, your decisions on what to do with your money are clearly so ill-thought out that I look forward to you doing so, because, well, if you'll swallow an £800 upcharge for no benefit, clearly you'll swallow anything and I have some snake oil for you and anyone like you just around the corner.
 
lcpiper said:
There's this guy in class and his college professor says he doesn't understand why young people are so hung up with sex. He says sex is no more satisfying than a good shit.

So the student stands up and says to the professor, "I mean no disrespect sir, but either I don't know how to shit, or you don't know how to fuck".

I have replied to job recruiters who called me and was able to send my most recent resume in on the spot with my phone.

I have had to submit documents online and used my phone to photograph them instead of going home to use a scanner.

I have performed remote management tasks on computer networks from my phone.

Like the matrix, I didn't know how to replace a pump in my washing machine, a Youtube video did the trick.

And the new phones these days are getting pretty good at voice control if you put some effort into training it.

So which is it, don't know how to shit, or don't know how to fuck?

Look man, few people need such things. But some people can make very good use of them if there is enough practical use for the features available.

You may not, but why would you decide that just because you don't, that no one does?
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How much of that requires a $1000 phone, though? I bet very little.
 
GlacierNine said:
So what you're saying is that you have absolutely no good reason to spend that money on something that gives you absolutely no tangible benefit but you're also so invested in continuing to do so and tell other people about it that you'll have extended arguments about it on the internet.

You're right, it's not an issue for me how you spend your money. In fact, your decisions on what to do with your money are clearly so ill-thought out that I look forward to you doing so, because, well, if you'll swallow an £800 upcharge for no benefit, clearly you'll swallow anything and I have some snake oil for you and anyone like you just around the corner.
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That's not what I am saying at all. I'm saying I made my own choices for my own reasons and they may have nothing at all to do with your reasons and it's not your damned business to whine about it, it's mine.

And furthermore, I don't have to explain anything at all to you nor must I defend my reasons to you.
 
1_rick said:
How much of that requires a $1000 phone, though? I bet very little.
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First off, I have never bought a $1,000 phone. My Phone is a Moto Z2 Force. It replaced a Samsung S8 which I was very unhappy with when I discovered it's fragility and the cost of repairing mishaps. The previous phone was a $100 Moto Droid Trubo which I liked very much except the camera wasn't that great for what I wanted it to do, it focused slowly in poor lighting and taking pics in the server room was a pain to get a clear shot, (at my old job, not my current one, can't have a phone here).

My wife on the other hand had a Note 3 but she had had problems in this area downloading content that her friend with a Note 5 downloaded much faster. The Note 5 supported a network type the Note 3 doesn't. So there we were, I had just replaced my Turbo with an S8, the wife still had her Note 3 but it was time for her to replace that older phone because she likes to stream alot.

Then, when the Note 8s came out, my wife had been waiting on them, and after she saw them and the cost, she decided to take my S8 and let me get the Moto Z2 Force so I did at a little under $700.

Now we were on Verizon but as we both qualify as Seniors, (the other part of the equation, your plan, you know, the other thing you pay for that goes hand in hand with your phone), so we were paying like $96 bucks for 6GB shared data with Verizon, T-Mobile offered to switch us at $70 a month unlimited data plan, but since T-Mobile also said they would pay-off my wife's phone and .... shit, explanation running on too long, work

Longer story getting shorter, our unlimited plan runs $55 a month, they gave us $966 bucks paying off my current phone essentially buying it for me, and my wife's got her Note 8 and it'll run her around $650

And these are some of the recent phones and the choices I made which I take full responsibility for :sneaky:
 
lcpiper said:
That's not what I am saying at all. I'm saying I made my own choices for my own reasons and they may have nothing at all to do with your reasons and it's not your damned business to whine about it, it's mine.

And furthermore, I don't have to explain anything at all to you nor must I defend my reasons to you.
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Yeah, see, you chose to argue the utility of a $1000 device.

I saw flaws in your arguments and stated so.

Now you are relying on this asinine argument that because you made (or attempted to defend) a stupid decision, I am somehow obligated not to judge you for it.

The world doesn't work that way. If you conduct yourself in a way that I can only believe is idiotic, then I am not obliged to indulge your delusion or poor decisions. I am fully entitled to have a judgement of them. My judgement is that anyone who buys a $1000 device, solely for the purpose of being able to do the things you listed in your post, has wasted $800 and been a damn fool.

If you buy a $1000 device because you need utility that only a $1000 device offers, then fine. If you try to claim that you need a $1000 device in order to do things a $200-300 device does perfectly, then you are doing something idiotic and I am absolutely going to say so.

Sorry that you're too much of a snowflake to handle anyone else having an opinion on what you do.
 
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