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Help with Botique Configuration

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grooverider

Weaksauce
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Mar 16, 2008
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83
I want to order a new PC within the next 7-10 days. I will order from a Botique company. I'm looking for high end components and a quality build process. I'm not looking for a cut-corners company to make everything cheaper, I want a solid build with the company standing behding it. I have a monitor and brand new OS, so if it can be configured without an OS that would be a plus, if not, oh well. I want to be able to overclock it. I will be using it for gaming, graphic design, and programming. I do not have a perference really between ATI/Nvidia, but the new 9800GX2 looks real nice. I'm looking for performance. I have looked at alot of companies but figured I would ask everyones opinon on this before I made a decision.

My budget is $3500-4000, without a monitor. It can be less if it is a good configuration. Also any companies with specials going on would be nice too (more for the money).

Can anyone configure me something and help me pick a company? Thanks in advance.
 
Kevin5255 said:
i've heard nothing but good things about puget. and with that budget you might be able to go watercooling and cool stuff like that with these guys

www.pugetsystems.com
Click to expand...

Thanks for the mention, Kevin.

Groove, We'd be happy to help you with any questions you may have prior to making a purchasing decision. You can call me directly, if you like, at the number in my signature or at that email address.

I'm always thrilled to see enthusiasts supporting boutique builders, even if that boutique builder doesn't happen to be Puget. Thanks for supporting our little corner of the industry.
 
I can't decide if I want to go liquid cooling or not. I want to overclock, but I bet if I do it myself and its not factory overclocked the warranty is void.

I really think I want DDR3 as well, I know its expensive but I want to future proof a little and add more when it becomes cheaper.

What do you guys think about liquid cooling/ddr 3? I haven't decided on a manufacturer yet either, some are really expensive, but I can tell your paying for quality.
 
Water cooling will offer a better over clock in many system, both for the CPU and GPU. The other debate is how quiet the water cooling system is compared to a similar air cooled setup. You might lose a slight bit of over clocking (very minor), but some water cooling systems are a bit louder.

I would still think sticking with DDR2 would be the best bet as DDR3 is still new and expensive. Now the one thing you can talk to a rep (with the company you choose) is how well will the system you are looking at upgrade down the line if you so choose. Not everything can be predicted, but will you be able to go from DDR2 to DDR3 with your current motherboard, how well will I be able to upgrade the CPU or GPU, etc.?
 
maingear, puget and ava are good choices. you are right that overclocking yourself will likely void the warranties so i would leave it to the factory.

liquid cooled systems will be quieter and give a bit more headroom on the overclock but i really can't recommend ddr3 at this point unless you are buying a 790i board.

i would go for ddr2 with lower latency and maybe even 8gb if you want to "future proof" - ddr2 is pretty cheap now. by the end of 2008 or beginning of 2009 nehalem will be out and all LGA775 mobos will be on their way out anyway
 
Kaolinchemist said:
Avadirect.com That's where I would go!
Click to expand...

Bottom line Puget and Maingear are both great companies but we are significally cheaper after an apples/to/apples comparison.

If you want send us an RFQ and we'll get back to you right away.

Regards,
Misha Troshin
Sales Manager, CEO
888.363.1051 direct
 
Bottom line is MAINGEAR's proven time and again via [H] Consumer they are head and shoulders above the competition. There really is no apples-to-apples, Misha.
 
Omaura said:
Bottom line is MAINGEAR's proven time and again via [H] Consumer they are head and shoulders above the competition. There really is no apples-to-apples, Misha.
Click to expand...

Yea, I'm sorry but Maingear has come out of the [H] Process with absolutely no big problems. And received top honors in their boutique reviews for i think it was 2007? Yea, Apples to Apples doesn't apply really... Two completely different builders. AVADirect is cheap for a reason... And im not even going to talk about my "experience" with them...
 
Omaura said:
Bottom line is MAINGEAR's proven time and again via [H] Consumer they are head and shoulders above the competition. There really is no apples-to-apples, Misha.
Click to expand...

I am not denying Maingear's achievements Chris, but I am sticking to the fact that while we may not send coffee mugs or wow you with "FREE SHIPPING" after jacking up the margins, we are more real than that and do provide best parts selection, solid support and customer service backed by LOWER pricing which is important to say the least. We aren't the lowest and do concentrate on quality vs. quantity unlike CyberPower but our focus does and will remain on building TRUE custom computers with the same "bells and whistles" minus the coffee mug.

Misha
 
avadirect said:
I am not denying Maingear's achievements Chris, but I am sticking to the fact that while we may not send coffee mugs or wow you with "FREE SHIPPING" after jacking up the margins, we are more real than that and do provide best parts selection, solid support and customer service backed by LOWER pricing which is important to say the least. We aren't the lowest and do concentrate on quality vs. quantity unlike CyberPower but our focus does and will remain on building TRUE custom computers with the same "bells and whistles" minus the coffee mug.

Misha
Click to expand...

Nice straw man fallacy.

First of all, I take issue with your statement that margins are artificially jacked up just to be lowered by gimme's like Free Shipping. That's disingenuous and baseless. "More real"? C'mon, Misha.

Special offers are just that - special. They cost money and move product at margins below a sustainable rate in order to increase brand awareness, customer base, and increase volume which makes your quarters look good to your partners like Intel, AMD, etc. It's simple Marketing 101.

Also, you know what I think about "best parts selection" - that just makes you a parts supplier with an integration fee. When you offer 30 motherboards and 5 different graphics cards vendors you simply cannot have experience with every combination of parts that you offer - perhaps you should re-read "Fear And Loating In Lost Business."

Your comment that the addition of a cheap coffee mug negates the ability for a company to offer a "TRUE custom" computer by somehow jacking up prices into the stratosphere is laughable.
 
Omaura said:
Nice straw man fallacy.

First of all, I take issue with your statement that margins are artificially jacked up just to be lowered by gimme's like Free Shipping. That's disingenuous and baseless. "More real"? C'mon, Misha.

Special offers are just that - special. They cost money and move product at margins below a sustainable rate in order to increase brand awareness, customer base, and increase volume which makes your quarters look good to your partners like Intel, AMD, etc. It's simple Marketing 101.

Also, you know what I think about "best parts selection" - that just makes you a parts supplier with an integration fee. When you offer 30 motherboards and 5 different graphics cards vendors you simply cannot have experience with every combination of parts that you offer - perhaps you should re-read "Fear And Loating In Lost Business."

Your comment that the addition of a cheap coffee mug negates the ability for a company to offer a "TRUE custom" computer by somehow jacking up prices into the stratosphere is laughable.
Click to expand...


Twist it all you want Chris but I would choose your words carefully as you don't know what future holds.

Misha
 
avadirect said:
Twist it all you want Chris but I would choose your words carefully as you don't know what future holds.

Misha
Click to expand...

I have chosen my words carefully and twist nothing, Misha, as I mean what I say and say what I mean. Your thinly veiled threat means nothing to me.
 
Twist it all you want Chris but I would choose your words carefully as you don't know what future holds.

Misha
Click to expand...

Sounds like a fortune cookie.

Who is this guy, Chuck Norris? Let's be realistic here, noone knows what the future holds, but I do know this: Our reputation precedes us. We have and always will put the customer first. Chris has a point, it's simple marketing, there's no need to 'attempt' to belittle our techniques. Now I say attempt because, it's literally stupid to think that one would take your accusations seriously. If there's room for a discount because we improve our relationship through our distribution channels and then we relay this discount to the customer, that makes us a bad bad company? Definitely not, and guess what? It seems to make people happier. An unfortunate side effect I guess. We're just going to have to bite the bullet on this one. In conclusion, you should come away with a lesson in mind. Take this experience as a positive one and try to apply the same ethics to your own business. Don't shoot accusations out there and try to blame other companies for their 'downfalls'. Mugs are bad!, who needs Free Shipping!? Don't be ridiculous. Just be good and let that speak for itself. We don't have to tell you or anyone else what we've done because everyone already knows that we don't mess around. It's a given. First, I'd work on your customer service though. Bluezilla ring a bell to anyone?!?! ZING!!!!!

-Giovanni

2277imagezj9.jpg
 
grooverider said:
I want to order a new PC within the next 7-10 days. I will order from a Botique company. I'm looking for high end components and a quality build process. I'm not looking for a cut-corners company to make everything cheaper, I want a solid build with the company standing behding it. I have a monitor and brand new OS, so if it can be configured without an OS that would be a plus, if not, oh well. I want to be able to overclock it. I will be using it for gaming, graphic design, and programming. I do not have a perference really between ATI/Nvidia, but the new 9800GX2 looks real nice. I'm looking for performance. I have looked at alot of companies but figured I would ask everyones opinon on this before I made a decision.

My budget is $3500-4000, without a monitor. It can be less if it is a good configuration. Also any companies with specials going on would be nice too (more for the money).

Can anyone configure me something and help me pick a company? Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...

Back to the subject... I'm here to help. I would go with two GT's in SLI instead of a single GX2. Ping me; wallace at maingear.com if you need some assistance.

-Wallace
 
Well it seems I have stirred up some drama here with my thread..sorry about that. But as of now..

I have extensively looked at:

1. Avadirect
2. Maingear
3. Puget
4. Velocity Micro
5. Digital Storm
6. Alienware
7. HP-Blackbird

I will comment a little on each:

1. Avadirect's order process is plain. Their options are awesome for someone who loves to have alot of different options. However some options that should be on other systems (have no bearing whether or not its SLI, etc), are not. Such as the Core 2 Duo DD2 system does not offer a swifttech CPU liquid cooled system, just a CPU+GPU liquid cooled system which adds $400 more, yet the DDR3 Core 2 duo system has both options..wierd. Prices are good. Shipping price seems good. 3 year warranty is a plus, big time.

2. Maingear is pretty nice. I don't care for the Ephex case much, I beleive its a Silverstone TJ09. Prices are above average, quite high actually. They require you to get an OS, which sucks when you have a brand new copy of vista ultimate already. System quality seems top notch. Very dissapointed in just Western Digital Hard Drives being offered. Very little customization options compared to Ava. 4.0 ghz overclocked from the factory is great though. 3 year warranty again, nice.

3. I like Puget but they seem even more expensive then Maingear. Not too many customization options..and the 1 year warranty thing really bugs me. If I'm spending $4k on a computer I would atleast like to have a 3 year warranty. Good specs though, and nice looking website, very clean.

4. I have bad experiences with VM in the past, but I like their systems. Seem to be higher priced as well, nice options on the processors (some of the newest processors including the Q9450 in stock already), but very little customization options again.

5. Digital Storm has good prices, once again, the Silverstone TJ09 case. Overclocking options, and a 3 year warranty. Pretty decent all in all if you ask me..but no 9800 GX2 graphics option!

6. Alienware is so overpriced. I do not know how they get away with it..I just like their case..but other then that not too many options and a 1 year warranty on a 5k ALX system..YUCK. Without paying $300 more for 3 years. Then they charge you shipping and tax on top of it all..lol..yeah right.

7. I seriously like the Blackbird alot but its dated now. None of the new graphics card options 1 year warranty, and really expensive. Think I'll pass.

Is liquid cooling really loud? I'm pretty sure I want a liquid cooled CPU...and you guys think DDR3 is a waste right now?
 
MaingearDude said:
Back to the subject... I'm here to help. I would go with two GT's in SLI instead of a single GX2. Ping me; wallace at maingear.com if you need some assistance.

-Wallace
Click to expand...

Thanks for extending some help, I will send you a mail. I will also send you one too Heather, and Misha.
 
Omaura said:
Bottom line is MAINGEAR's proven time and again via [H] Consumer they are head and shoulders above the competition. There really is no apples-to-apples, Misha.
Click to expand...


maybe it's because AVADirect doesn't have a website forum, but just reading at the customer reviews on maingear's forums scares me. There are numerous incidents where people are experiencing BSOD and stability issues, and haven't really seen any posts about their problems resolved. I thought people buy from boutiques instead of DIY to avoid those issues.
 
aX3SS said:
Sounds like a fortune cookie.

Who is this guy, Chuck Norris? Let's be realistic here, noone knows what the future holds, but I do know this: Our reputation precedes us. We have and always will put the customer first. Chris has a point, it's simple marketing, there's no need to 'attempt' to belittle our techniques. Now I say attempt because, it's literally stupid to think that one would take your accusations seriously. If there's room for a discount because we improve our relationship through our distribution channels and then we relay this discount to the customer, that makes us a bad bad company? Definitely not, and guess what? It seems to make people happier. An unfortunate side effect I guess. We're just going to have to bite the bullet on this one. In conclusion, you should come away with a lesson in mind. Take this experience as a positive one and try to apply the same ethics to your own business. Don't shoot accusations out there and try to blame other companies for their 'downfalls'. Mugs are bad!, who needs Free Shipping!? Don't be ridiculous. Just be good and let that speak for itself. We don't have to tell you or anyone else what we've done because everyone already knows that we don't mess around. It's a given. First, I'd work on your customer service though. Bluezilla ring a bell to anyone?!?! ZING!!!!!

-Giovanni
Click to expand...

Finally I can tie a nickname to the name :eek: Was wondering when I would actually see you around Giovanni :p Now I can actually use you as an example to recommend Maingear :p

Yea, Bluezilla, had it been a big thing, would have been a PR nightmare for AVA. If it had been [H] than im 100% sure they would NOT be welcome on these forums... (Take that as you will Misha, I already don't consider AVA. )

Basically this thread has determined two things for me: When I get sick of building my own computers and can afford boutiques, It WILL come down to Puget and Maingear, despite AVA's part selection.
 
i think the maingear ephex case is a TJ-10 - basically a TJ-09 with a door and a few other additions. i used to love the TJ-09 but have recently been moving towards cooler master and lian li

i have a feeling that if you call maingear up they can build a pc without an OS as a custom order - but i might be mistaken

puget has limited options on their web configs but call them up and they can literally get you anything you want as a custom order - heather can probably clarify that but i do recall that being said

ava has the best web configurator with its tons of options and are a no-frills builder meaning lower prices - but I have to admit there have been a few mixed reviews (both great and horrible) on them at [H]. i think my only draw to them is the customization they can offer through the web

HP-blackbird looks great with the case and allow for user overclocking without voiding the warranty but like you said, are expensive and dated

and definitely steer clear of ddr3 unless you buy a 790i board - then you'll have no choice

hope this helps - good luck!
 
WhiteGuardian said:
maybe it's because AVADirect doesn't have a website forum, but just reading at the customer reviews on maingear's forums scares me. There are numerous incidents where people are experiencing BSOD and stability issues, and haven't really seen any posts about their problems resolved. I thought people buy from boutiques instead of DIY to avoid those issues.
Click to expand...

It's a Hardware Troubleshooting Forum. People go there to get their problems fixed. ;)
 
Omaura said:
It's a Hardware Troubleshooting Forum. People go there to get their problems fixed. ;)
Click to expand...


Sorry, but I see it as a customer reviews section, cause that's what it's named. Im not saying there aren't positive reviews, most of are positive about the overall build, but the number of BSOD errors unresolved tells me they're not being fixed.
 
0mega said:
Now, here is a question for you Misha: You know Omauras name, I would REALLY like to know how. History between the two of you perhaps?
Click to expand...

i think omaura is Chris Morley formally Managing Editor [H] Consumer and now with Maingear - if so we have 3 Maingear employees who post on [H] - pretty good representation if you ask me.
 
WhiteGuardian said:
Sorry, but I see it as a customer reviews section, cause that's what it's named. Im not saying there aren't positive reviews, most of are positive about the overall build, but the number of BSOD errors unresolved tells me they're not being fixed.
Click to expand...

The happy people generally don't give enough of a damn to post about their experiences ;) Trust me on that one. ;)
 
Usquabach said:
i think omaura is Chris Morley formally Managing Editor [H] Consumer and now with Maingear - if so we have 3 Maingear employees who post on [H] - pretty good representation if you ask me.
Click to expand...

Yup - and I also run Omaura North America, hence the name.
 
Usquabach said:
i think omaura is Chris Morley formally Managing Editor [H] Consumer and now with Maingear - if so we have 3 Maingear employees who post on [H] - pretty good representation if you ask me.
Click to expand...

Yea, I figured it out and edited my post. It made sense. The name Omaura was familiar but I forgot from where ;)
 
WhiteGuardian said:
Sorry, but I see it as a customer reviews section, cause that's what it's named. Im not saying there aren't positive reviews, most of are positive about the overall build, but the number of BSOD errors unresolved tells me they're not being fixed.
Click to expand...

OK, I see what you mean - you are right, the majority are very glowing. But do not assume that just because issues aren't played out 100% in a public forum does not mean they are not resolved offline.
 
Omaura said:
OK, I see what you mean - you are right, the majority are very glowing. But do not assume that just because issues aren't played out 100% in a public forum does not mean they are not resolved offline.
Click to expand...

On your other post you said steer clear of DDR3. Well I plan on getting an Ephex if I get a Maingear PC, and 790SLI is the new motherboard you guys are offering with Kingston ram..are you saying to avoid DDR3 because of cost or because some other reason?
 
grooverider said:
On your other post you said steer clear of DDR3. Well I plan on getting an Ephex if I get a Maingear PC, and 790SLI is the new motherboard you guys are offering with Kingston ram..are you saying to avoid DDR3 because of cost or because some other reason?
Click to expand...

T'wasn't me. DDR3 has a price premium, and that's why people say to stay away. But a properly tuned setup with overclocked FSB and FAST DDR3 (not just DDR3-1333, which holds no performance gain over DDR2-1066) does have performance improvements.
 
it was actually myself who said steer clear of ddr3 UNLESS you buy the 790i board

and from the looks of it, the 790i is really nice - probably the only nvidia chipset i would buy right now but you will pay a premium for the RAM if you go 790i
 
aX3SS said:
Sounds like a fortune cookie.

Who is this guy, Chuck Norris? Let's be realistic here, noone knows what the future holds, but I do know this: Our reputation precedes us. We have and always will put the customer first. Chris has a point, it's simple marketing, there's no need to 'attempt' to belittle our techniques. Now I say attempt because, it's literally stupid to think that one would take your accusations seriously. If there's room for a discount because we improve our relationship through our distribution channels and then we relay this discount to the customer, that makes us a bad bad company? Definitely not, and guess what? It seems to make people happier. An unfortunate side effect I guess. We're just going to have to bite the bullet on this one. In conclusion, you should come away with a lesson in mind. Take this experience as a positive one and try to apply the same ethics to your own business. Don't shoot accusations out there and try to blame other companies for their 'downfalls'. Mugs are bad!, who needs Free Shipping!? Don't be ridiculous. Just be good and let that speak for itself. We don't have to tell you or anyone else what we've done because everyone already knows that we don't mess around. It's a given. First, I'd work on your customer service though. Bluezilla ring a bell to anyone?!?! ZING!!!!!

-Giovanni
.
Click to expand...




Listen, I am bigger than you and will not waste time responding to your silly attemts to look good, if anything, you are that small kitty as gaming is only a part of what we do.

To give you an idea, we buy direct from all the major RAM manufactures: Corsair, OCZ, Kingston and Crucial. We will be posted on Asus, Zalman and Thermaltake's site as authorized system builders. Our reviews will only keep coming so I'll let my actions speak for themselves.

Misha
 
Usquabach said:
it was actually myself who said steer clear of ddr3 UNLESS you buy the 790i board

and from the looks of it, the 790i is really nice - probably the only nvidia chipset i would buy right now but you will pay a premium for the RAM if you go 790i
Click to expand...

Sorry about that ;)

Now the real question on the Maingear end would be.. E8400 Overclocked to 4.0 or the QX9650 overclocked to 4.0 :p
 
the 790i is really nice - probably the only nvidia chipset i would buy right now but you will pay a premium for the RAM if you go 790i
Click to expand...

true true...
 
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