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Help to build a gaming PC

M

mathieumg

n00b
Joined
May 8, 2006
Messages
55
A friend of mine wants to build a new PC and has asked for help.

1) What will you be doing with this PC? Gaming? Photoshop? Web browsing? etc


As per the topic title, the main use of his PC will be gaming, although he will of course use it for some browsing etc.


2) What's your budget? Are tax and shipping included?


He has a maximum budget of $2,500 canadian. It has to include everything.


3) Where do you live?


He lives in Quebec, Canada.


4) What exact parts do you need for that budget? CPU, RAM, case, etc. Please be very specific.


  • Computer case
  • Case fans if not included with the case
  • Power supply
  • Motherboard
  • Processor
  • Heatsink
  • Heatsink fan
  • RAM
  • Hard drive
  • Video card
  • Bluray player
  • Floppy drive
  • Monitor
  • Keyboard
  • Mouse
  • Speakers
  • UPS


5) If reusing any parts, what parts will you be reusing? Please be especially specific about the power supply. List make and model.


Not reusing anything I think (except a non-usb microphone).


6) Will you be overclocking?


I don't think so.


7) What size monitor do you have and/or plan to have?


Plan to get him a 24".


8) When do you plan on building/buying the PC?


ASAP. Once I get advice in this thread.


9) What features do you need in a motherboard? RAID? Firewire? Crossfire or SLI support? etc.


Nothing fancy, the standard at the moment.


10) Do you already have a legit and reusable/transferable OS key/license?


Yes. He might buy Windows 7 when it comes out though. (But you don't have to include it in the budget)


-

My friend has specified he is going to use the onboard sound card, the only thing I'm not sure about is wether he'll need a wireless ethernet card, let's assume he won't for now, I'll post an update once I get the answer.

We plan on ordering entirely from ncix.com so the pieces suggested have to be available there. (Unless there is a superdeal on a big part at newegg.ca or something) We plan on doing pricematching with other canadian websites but don't take that into account for the budget (i.e. use the price shown on ncix's product page)

Given his not so bad budget and the fact that he wants his PC to last him a while, I suggested he go for an i7.

Here are the parts he "found". This thread is to get approvals and/or recommendations of better pieces:

Computer case

Coolermaster Cosmos S Black E-ATX Aluminum Case 7X5.25 4X3.5INT Front USB & Sound

I have a Cosmos 1000 and the thing is HUGE and HEAVY. At least this one is in aluminium, it still looks huge however. Has it gotten good reviews? He's open to the idea of a different case with similar features.

Power supply

PC Power & Cooling Silencer 750 Quad CrossFire 750W ATX V2.2 EPS12 24PIN Active PFC Power Supply Red

I have this (except it is the black, SLI edition) and it has been working really great for me. I don't know if someone has something better to recommend.

Motherboard

ASUS P6T SE X58 ATX LGA1366 DDR3 LGA1366 3PCI-E16 PCI-E1 2PCI CrossFire SATA2 Motherboard

I don't know much about i7 products (CPUs, Motherboards, RAM), so I need advice with this. The only thing I can say is that I had two ASUS motherboards so far and both served me well.

Processor

Intel Core i7 920 Quad Core Processor LGA1366 2.66GHZ Bloomfield 8MB LGA1366 4.8GT/S

I believe its the only i7 with an affordable price.

HSF

Thermalright Ultra 120 Extreme 1366RT Heatpipe Cooler LGA1366 120MM Fan FDB 1600RPM 28.0DBA 63.7CFM

I know -zip- about heat sink and heat sink fans, I have this HSF (but not that fan) and it is doing great but I'm sure there are many other options. Also, the fan provided looks a bit of low quality.

RAM

Corsair XMS3 TR3X6G1600C9 6GB DDR3 3X2GB DDR3-1600 CL 9-9-9-24 Core i7 Memory Kit

He wants to start with 6GB (3x2GB) but I don't know which product is the best bang for the buck.

Hard drive

Western Digital WD1001FALS Caviar Black 1TB SATA2 7200RPM 4.2MS 32MB 3.5IN Dual Proc Hard Drive OEM

Not sure about this or the Seagate (heard about the firmware hell). I have two 1TB Samsung spinpoint F1 series, but for some reason they disappeared at all sellers.

Video card

XFX Radeon HD 4890 XT 1GB 875MHZ 1GB 3.9GHZ GDDR5 PCI-E 2XDVI HDTV Video Card

What does this offer over the 4870? I have a Gigabyte 4870 and it has worked really great. Has nVidia released anything that matches the 4800 series in terms of price and quality?

Bluray player

LG CH08-LS10 Black BLU-RAY 8X Reader & 16X DVD Writer Combo Internal SATA Lightscribe

I don't know which one is the best at the moment, these tend to change quickly. I have always been satisfied with LG optical drives.

Floppy drive

Sony Black 1.44MB 3.5IN Floppy Drive ( OEM )

I guess.

Monitor

Samsung SyncMaster 2494HM 24IN Widescreen LCD 1920X1080 16:9 5ms 50000:1DC Vgta DVI-D HDMI HAS

I have a 245B, can the two be compared? Is there something better for a similar price?

Keyboard


Logitech G15 2ND Gen Gaming Keyboard USB Black Silver Amber LCD Panel Programmable Backlit Keys

He wanted a G11 but I think this is better since its the second generation, they removed the superfluous keys and integrated the LCD.

Mouse

Logitech G5 Laser Gaming Mouse 2000DPI USB Blue Black ENG/FR

I have a G5 (although the first model) and it works great.

Speakers

Logitech Z-4 Speakers 2.1 40W RMS SILVER-BLACK

I'm guessing he doesn't want anything too expensive, something that does the job.

UPS

OPTI-UPS GS1100B 1100VA 550W AVR Step Wave RJ11/RJ45 USB 6 Outlet

I have a TS1700B but I'm using it to power a monitor and two PCs so I thought it would be overkill for him. I don't know much about UPSes so help is welcome. He wants something that can handle his PC+monitor.

-

I hope I haven't forgot anything. Again, thank you very much in advance for providing me with approvals/recommendations regarding this build.
 
i7 920 CPU - $300 http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=34598&promoid=1042
Corsair TX750 - $122 http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=26415&promoid=1042
Samsung 23" 1080p Monitor - $200 http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=38255&promoid=1042
Sony BD drive - $100 http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=29966&promoid=1042
OCZ DDR3 6GB 1600 - $100 http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=35710&promoid=1042
EVGA X58 Mobo - $280 http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=39291&vpn=141-BL-E757-TR&manufacture=eVGA&promoid=1042
ATI 4870 1GB - $170 http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=35105&promoid=1042
WD 1TB Black - $100 http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=31000&promoid=1042
Prices valid until Tuesday midnight or until sold out.

Missing fans, case, floppy (seriously??), keyboard, mouse, ups, speakers.

Everything found on NCIX's weekly special deals, someone else can fill in the rest. Since it's only 3 days to the next sale, you can get the stuff that's on sale right now and wait til Wednesday for the next batch. You can wait on the video card since the 4890s from this round have all be sold, and there's bound to be a "top page" deal on the next one.

All Cosmos' are aluminum, so I dunno why you think yours is different. In any cases, they're terrible cases esp for the money. And cases are user preference so if he likes the CMS, go for it.
 
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Swans D1080MKII
M-Audio AV 40
Swans M12
Swans D1010MKII
or something other than Logitech.
These will probably cost a bit more but sound much better. I don't know how much they are in canada. Probably 1.5-2x the cost of the Logitechs? Really nice though.
Edit: Also, I'd personally get a sound card...
 
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You assume everyone is an "audiophile"...:rolleyes:

OP has already said onboard sound and speakers that "just get the job done". Dunno why every thread has to have someone who suggests otherwise (just stick w/ the criteria, makes everything so much less fussy).
 
lowteckh said:
You assume everyone is an "audiophile"...:rolleyes:

OP has already said onboard sound and speakers that "just get the job done". Dunno why every thread has to have someone who suggests otherwise (just stick w/ the criteria, makes everything so much less fussy).
Click to expand...

Because the difference in performance compared to price is huge? You don't need to be an audiophile to notice a difference in sound quality? Logitechs are bad for the price and there is stuff better than them in the price range. He's already spending 100$ on 2.1 speakers so from what I can tell, he wants something decent.
The logitechs can be found for ~70$ US in some places and the speakers I suggested are around 99-125$?US or so. The price difference isn't that big. Again, I don't know what the price difference will be in Canada though.
 
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mathieumg, I have some additional questions for you and your friend...

11) Which games is your friend going to play?
12) Which level of visual quality does your friend use for gaming? Does he/she use AA/AF as well?
13) Why do you need a BD-ROM drive? Do you have any Blu-ray playback software?
14) What features is your friend looking for in a case?
15) Are you even considering overclocking at any point in the future? (If not, why are you pursuing an aftermarket CPU cooler and DDR3 1600 memory?)

Check out the GenHard FAQ for some building guides and a few links to some additional Canadian-based retailers.

I'm not getting into that fight over the speakers; get what you want.
 
lowteckh, is it possible to have a mini explanation as to why these products are the way to go? (Or is it just because they are the deal of the week like you said) Also, I would like to stick with the 24" screen :) Thanks a lot!

Joseph, my friend is ready to up the price of the speakers to get a little more quality (he will stick to the onboard soundcard though) They don't seem to be selling Swans products on ncix.com, and they sell only a few M-audio products. The only one they have in stock that is not 50$ or 400+ $ is this one: http://ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=26044&vpn=9900-52266-00&manufacture=M-Audio and I don't think thats good enough since there isn't a SW. According to ncix.com most popular products, the most sold non-logitech 2.1 system is http://ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=27404&vpn=S330D&manufacture=EDIFIER . Is that any good?

tiraides, here are the answers:

11) Which games is your friend going to play?

For now, nothing too requiring (Warcraft III, The Orange Box, Call of Duty 4/5/6, Bioshock, Starcraft 2) but he wants it to be future proof so lets say he wants it to be able to run Crysis 2 (or something I don't know what the next game of "reference" for graphics will be) with decent settings once it gets released (not necessarily maxed out, but something good and in 1920x1200).

12) Which level of visual quality does your friend use for gaming? Does he/she use AA/AF as well?

I guess that he should be able to run most games with high settings (not necessarily highest) in 1920x1200. I told him about AA and AF and he didn't know what that meant. I then explained to him what it is and he said that's it handy. Basically, if he can get a few levels of it in most games (say 4x) he would be a happy man, no need for the 16x extravaganza.

13) Why do you need a BD-ROM drive? Do you have any Blu-ray playback software?

Didn't think about that one. I see now on Cyberlink that PDVD9 is only US 49.99$ so it shouldn't be too hard to fit into the budget. I don't know much about other solutions (I think there is a WinDVD BD player too).

14) What features is your friend looking for in a case?

He wants the case to be well cooled and good-looking (I know, that's very relative) since it will be in plain sight. He wants at least 2 front-panel USB connections as well. (I believe most cases have this anyway) If you have suggestions I can show him and ask him if he likes it.

15) Are you even considering overclocking at any point in the future? (If not, why are you pursuing an aftermarket CPU cooler and DDR3 1600 memory?)

I don't think so, I don't live close to that friend and he doesn't know much about OC (and neither do I, actually) so it makes it harder to help him on that matter. (Tweak his latencies, test stability with Prime95 etc.) To give you a clear answer, I don't think there will be any OC done. To answer your question, he chose this HSF only because it is the one that I have (I showed him my build sheet from a year ago) and we don't know much about HSFs. He is very welcome to change it if something better suits his build. As for the memory, like I said I don't know much about the DDR3 memory and what's best for his build. He picked that memory from the site and I believe it was because it was a featured product or something. Suggestions for something more suitable are welcome.

As for retailers, I like the fact that ncix is only 5% tax and that I can get really good pricematches on it. I've bought several times there and have always been satisfied. I bought two times on newegg since it launched in .ca and I've been satisfied as well. I've been disappointed by tigerdirect and do not intend to do business with them again.

I believe I have answered all questions. Thanks a lot guys for investing your time to help me help my friend! :)
 
They're quality parts and on sale.

Zzzz... the futureproof crap again. There is no futureproofing, there are no "Crysis 2" requirements out, we don't know what they are, and there is no *&#(! futureproofing. Buy for the present not the future - this isn't the stock market.
 
Simply put, go with lowteckh's build. They're quality parts and on sale for a limited time. If you're really concerned about the gaming quality, bump the video card up to an HD4890. But as lowteckh mentioned earlier, "futureproofing" a computer for unreleased games is impossible to do.
 
mathieumg said:
Joseph, my friend is ready to up the price of the speakers to get a little more quality (he will stick to the onboard soundcard though) They don't seem to be selling Swans products on ncix.com, and they sell only a few M-audio products. The only one they have in stock that is not 50$ or 400+ $ is this one: http://ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=26044&vpn=9900-52266-00&manufacture=M-Audio and I don't think thats good enough since there isn't a SW. According to ncix.com most popular products, the most sold non-logitech 2.1 system is http://ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=27404&vpn=S330D&manufacture=EDIFIER . Is that any good?
Click to expand...

M-Audio stuff is pretty good. They have built in subs so they can output good lows without the need for a subwoofer. AV20 has a 2 inch sub AV30 has a 3 inch sub AV40 has a 4inch sub. Probably I would get the AV30 or AV40(I'd wait for them to get back in stock or buy from somewhere else). If you want you can buy an inexpensive sub separately but I don't know where this stuff sells. Ncix doesn't have anything cheap and I tried looking around but I didn't really find anything (maybe the audio forum knows where this stuff sells in Canada). I think just the AV30 or AV40 speakers should be enough though.
 
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OP your parts are not bad actually. However, you can save money yet not sacrifice performance by making some adjustments in your build. You total cost is too close to $2500 amount and this does not include the tax and shipping yet.

If you're willing to up your budget on the speakers, get the M-Audio AV30 or AV40 speakers. The AV20 is just too small and weak. Don't buy it from NCIX as they are overpriced. Canadacomputers sells it at a more decent price but, they are also out of stock. Look at purchasing the M-Audio AV30 or AV40 from Qweego.com

M-Audio AV30 for $106.36

M-Audio AV40 for $175.66
 
hehe... ditch the FDD. :p

At quick glance, the parts lowtekh listed are better bang for buck, but your parts aren't bad either.

Don't spend more than $30 for 2.1 logitech speakers. :p Their higher end products don't sound much better than their lower end products.
 
Consider this setup for your budget. Well below your budget without sacrificing performance. The $200 lcd monitors that lowtech suggested earlier is out of stock. The Asus VH242H 23.6" for $219.99 is a overall good monitor. Let's do a combination purchase for this build from these 4 vendors

NCIX.com
bestdirect.ca
newegg.ca
compu2000.com

CASE – Coolermaster Storm Scout for $99.99
http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Produc...+Cases+-+ATX+Form)-_-Cooler+Master-_-11119196

PSU – Antec EA650 for $84.79
http://www.bestdirect.ca/products/177363/ANTEC/EA650/

CPU – Intel Core i7 920 for $299.99
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=34598&promoid=1042

MOBO – ASUS P6T SE for $239.99 ($15 MIR)
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?affiliateid=4352418&sku=38342&promoid=1042

RAM - G. Skill 6GB DDR3 1600 for $114.44
http://www.bestdirect.ca/products/196506/F3-12800CL9T-6GBNQ/G.SKILL/

VIDEO CARD – XFX Radeon HD 4890 1GB for $234.99
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=37430&promoid=1042

HDD - Western Digital WD1001FALS Caviar Black 1TB for $98.85
http://www.bestdirect.ca/products/177741/Western_Digital/WD1001FALS/

OPTICAL - LG CH08-LS10 Black BLU-RAY 8X Reader & 16X DVD Writer for $147.40
http://www.bestdirect.ca/products/214182/LG_Electronics/CH08LS10_AVBR00B/

KEYBOARD - Saitek Eclipse Keyboard Black USB for $64.99
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=14355&vpn=PZ30AU&manufacture=Saitek

MOUSE - Logitech G5 Laser Gaming Mouse 2000DPI USB for $49.99 w/free shipping
http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Produc...c3canadaCA-_-Mouse-_-Logitech+Inc.-_-26104076

FLOPPY – Why? Hehe

UPS - APC BACK-UPS 540W 4 Port UPS 900VA for $161.72
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=39309&vpn=BR900&manufacture=APC

MONITOR – ASUS VH242H 23.6” for $219.99
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=36970&promoid=1042

SPEAKERS – M-Audio AV30 for $101.99
http://www.compu2000.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=884


$1,919.12 before shipping & taxes
 
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Don't forget to check what the shipped/taxed prices would be if you limited the vendors to 2 instead of 4.
 
Sorry for the delay, I'm in the process of moving :p

Here are the parts he will be ordering for sure:

CPU: Intel Core i7 920 Quad Core Processor LGA1366 2.66GHZ Bloomfield 8MB LGA1366 4.8GT/S (original intent, plus two suggestions)

HDD: Western Digital WD1001FALS Caviar Black 1TB SATA2 7200RPM 4.2MS 32MB 3.5IN Dual Proc Hard Drive OEM (original intent, plus two suggestions)

GPU: XFX Radeon HD 4890 XT 1GB 875MHZ 1GB 3.9GHZ GDDR5 PCI-E 2XDVI HDTV Video Card (original intent, plus one suggestion)

BD player: LG CH08-LS10 Black BLU-RAY 8X Reader & 16X DVD Writer Combo Internal SATA Lightscribe (original intent, plus one suggestion)

Keyboard: Logitech G15 2ND Gen Gaming Keyboard USB Black Silver Amber LCD Panel Programmable Backlit Keys (he wants to stick with this option)

Mouse: Logitech G5 Laser Gaming Mouse 2000DPI USB Blue Black ENG/FR (original intent, plus one suggestion)

Speakers: M-AUDIO Studiophile AV30 Desktop 2.0 Speaker System 30W RMS Black

Here are the parts we will be ordering most likely:

HSF: Thermalright Ultra 120 Extreme 1366RT Heatpipe Cooler LGA1366 120MM Fan FDB 1600RPM 28.0DBA 63.7CFM (nobody suggested something else)

PSU: Corsair TX750W 750W ATX 12V 60A 24PIN ATX Power Supply Active PFC 140MM Fan (don't know what is better than the original Power & Cooling I suggested, but I figure there must be a reason it sells so well)

Monitor: Samsung SyncMaster 2494HM 24IN Widescreen LCD 1920X1080 16:9 5ms 50000:1DC Vgta DVI-D HDMI HAS (He wants to stick with 24"+, is this a good product regardless?)

Here are the parts I would like some input on:

Case:

Coolermaster Cosmos S Black E-ATX Aluminum Case 7X5.25 4X3.5INT Front USB & Sound

vs.

Coolermaster Storm Scout Black ATX Tower Case 5X5.25 5X3.5INT 120MM & 140MM Red LED Fan No PSU

He likes the look of both, is there a good reason to choose one over another?


Motherboard:

ASUS P6T SE X58 ATX LGA1366 DDR3 LGA1366 3PCI-E16 PCI-E1 2PCI CrossFire SATA2 Motherboard

vs.

EVGA X58 SLI LE ATX LGA1366 DDR3 4PCIE-16 PCI-E1 1PCI SATA2 Sound Dual GBLAN 1394 Motherboard

Which one and why?


RAM:

G.SKILL F3-12800CL9T-6GBNQ 6GB DDR3 3X2GB DDR3-1600 CL 9-9-9-24 Triple Channel Memory Kit

vs.

OCZ Gold OCZ3G1600LV6GK 6GB DDR3 3X2GB DDR3-1600 PC3-12800 CL 8-8-8-24 Triple Channel Memory Kit

Which one and why?


UPS:

OPTI-UPS GS1100B 1100VA 550W AVR Step Wave RJ11/RJ45 USB 6 Outlet

vs.

APC BACK-UPS 540W 4 Port UPS 900VA 120V W/ 3 Surge Protecion Ports

Which one and why?



Again, thank you all in advance for all your help.
 
Cases are personal preference, but personally, I'd go with the Scout because of its black interior and huge ass handle on the top. Though, the Cosmos looks nice, too, lol... hard choice.

Mobo... Asus if you don't need SLI... eVGA if you want support for Tri-SLI.
RAM... whichever has lower voltage, which is the G.Skill. Timings don't matter much between CL8 and 9.
UPS... APC, just because I use that same unit. I have no idea about the other option, sorry.
 
Thank you enginurd. For the UPS, I'm a bit in the same situation since I own an OPTI and have no idea about the APC option :p
 
Just read the updated list...glad to see a Corsair PSU on there. Was just trollin thru egg.ca for the prices. Good call.
 
The PC P&C 750 QUAD is built by Seasonic. The TX 750 is built by CWT. Both are equally good units. Go for whichever one is cheaper. Though, you really don't need 750W... even if you Crossfired a 2nd HD4890, you'd still be under 550W.
 
He's not planning to do many upgrades to his machine in the future, except perhaps change the video card in a couple of years, and these tend to always require more and more power.I just want him to be on the safe side and make sure he doesn't have to worry about changing his PSU. Also, isn't the 750W only an indication of the peak the PSU can reach?
 
Most of today's components draw most of their power from the 12V rail, which is another indication that we use to determine a good PSU. While the TX750 is a good PSU, again, you don't need that much power. You could save yourself some money by going with a 600-700 watt power supply like the Antec Earthwatts EA650.

Speaking of which, you can save some money by going with the Xigmatek Dark Knight instead of the TRUE 120 1366RT.

As for the parts that you're considering, I agree with enginurd.
 
Thanks. Can the level of silence be compared for all these PSUs? Also, I assume most PSUs nowadays are designed to be placed at the bottom of the case (I believe both Coolmaster cases are designed for a PSU at the bottom as well). I just want to make sure the build is compatible, meaning all pieces will go well together.

As for the HSF, I guess he will go with that one, since it is the only HSF suggestion I have received :p Thanks.
 
Check the reviews on frostytech.com. Though the TRUE is the better HSF of the two, the Xigmatek isn't that far behind. (However, in the US, there's a significant price difference between the Xigmatek Dark Knight and the TRUE 120 1366RT, making the Dark Knight the better bang for the buck.)

The best place to measure the noise level for all of the PSUs would be silentpcreview.com. However, noise is highly subjective -- the Corsair, for example, has been considered pretty quiet by some users and very loud by others.
 
The CM cases have vents on the bottom, IIRC, allowing you to mount a PSU with the fan on the bottom. Yes, PSUs only draw as much power as needed by the system, but some people don't want to pay for capabilities they'll never use. The 750W isn't just more than he needs, its overkill for his needs, especially if he's not adding a 2nd vidcard. Now, if adding a 2nd vidcard is a possibility, then the 750W is not really overkill. :p
 
My friend just ordered it:

Total price, with pricematches, taxes and the NCIX free ground shipping deal: $2,293.86
Total weight: 146.75 lbs (NCIX free shipping deal covers up to 150 lbs, haha)

So I wanted to thank you all for all the help you gave me, my friendly greatly appreciates it. A big thank you on his behalf also.
 
Hm... looks like he needs a desk upgrade next, lol! Thanks for the pics!! :D
 
Haha yes, he said that was a temporary crappy desk :p That is at his parents', but he's moving in less than two weeks :p
 
One thing to consider is that the PC Power and Cooling PSU at 750 watts is almost dead silent while the Corsair 750 units sometimes have some coil whine.
 
A bit late though, if you read the last posts of the thread you'll understand :) Thanks anyway!
 
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