Going from a 780 to either a 970 or 390x need advice.

Discussion in 'Video Cards' started by Godmachine, Mar 14, 2016.

  1. Godmachine

    Godmachine [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Wow awesome. Its nice that AMD tackled this issue and it seems it FULLY supports 4k as well with UHD. Downside however is that it adds input latency to the connection (being an active adapter) and OLED TV's already have some hefty input latency to deal with. Do you by chance know how much input latency it introduces? If its small (say 5ms) then that's still doable. But if its like 15+ ms then that's a no go.

    I don't tend to upgrade my video cards often , its an expensive hobby and I prefer to spend my time in games and not benchmarking them for personal pleasure. There just aren't enough Direct X 12 games to really be worried about that right now. It takes years for a new Direct X standard to actually get a healthy pool of games and even the most recent Direct X 12 enabled game (Hitman) doesn't really show any fantastic gains from the benchmark I've seen. Of course this could change with further driver and game updates.

    I'll be honest I have some bias towards Nvidia. I've never really had a bad experience with them. I buy them. I plug them in and they work. With AMD I had a rough time with drivers , weird BSOD (or GSOD) errors. Clocking issues with the GPU's even under load (I read the recent patch notes on a driver update and this problem still is being addressed). Without question however AMD offers a great bang for the buck but it seems like as usual AMD can be a bit more picky where as the recent 900 series Nvidia cards pretty much outside of 2 driver updates are rock solid. I'm not saying I'm not willing to try AMD again but there is another thing holding me back. I have a G-sync monitor and I love it. If I go with AMD I'll have to re-buy a new monitor with Freesync and it will cost a ton (at least $600 from what I've seen for a nice 1440p Freesync monitor) so that's $400 for a card and possibly up to $600 for a monitor. That alone makes it hard for me to switch. I've seen Freesync in action and it seems just as amazing as G-sync but the monitors can be limiting , some of them don't have a 144Hz refresh rate with Freesync enabled (some are between 40Hz and 75Hz which is way to narrow) and it'll probably be awhile before the offerings are more fleshed out. Plus all of the new IPS based G-sync and Freesync monitors seems to have terrible QC issues. I hate playing the lottery on panels , its misery. I can't even imagine buying an Acer Predator 34X and having all the big QC problems it has and feeling like dumping $1300-1400 down the drain just to MAYBE get one that isn't riddled with issues.
     
  2. techobrien

    techobrien Limp Gawd

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    Anecdotally I can say that I don't notice the lag at all when gaming. My 2015 Vizio M series TV has an input lag of 18.5 ms with interpolation disabled and 43.9 ms with interpolation enabled. The extra 25 ms is very noticeable to me, so I would have to say the Club3D adapter falls somewhere in the 5-15 ms range because I don't notice it at all. If someone can tell me how to actually measure the added lag, I would be more than happy to do so and report back.
     
  3. precariousgray

    precariousgray Limp Gawd

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    As someone still running an i5 750 who previously owned a 290X and now owns a GTX 970, just hang in there. The 780 will still run what you're looking at playing, and you'll get much more performance out of the new generation of cards when they're released. If you absolutely have to though, or find a killer deal, I'd definitely go with the 390X.
     
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  4. KazeoHin

    KazeoHin [H]ardness Supreme

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    I think you made the best decision. a 980 at stock is not that impressive, but once you get it to 1400+ it starts to show performance beyond its price.

    The BEST solution would be to wait, but if you NEED to upgrade now, the 980 is a good choice.
     
  5. RaZoRbLaDeD

    RaZoRbLaDeD Gawd

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    I agree with most in here, OC and hold out until the new cards come...you wont really gain anything over the cards you listed
     
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  6. Frank Burns

    Frank Burns n00b

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    OC and hold out bro, the hard gods have spoken!
     
  7. Godmachine

    Godmachine [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Well my friend actually just bought a Sapphire 390X and we are both going to switch cards on and off for the next week and make up our minds. That way we both get to try them out (he is also using a GTX 780). So now I can see how the grass is on both side of the fence.

    Also my 780 was overclocked already to 1230Mhz Core and like an extra 100Mhz for the memory. That was as stable and as high as I could get it. Which if you consider its reference clock speeds is pretty good. I'll report back my results with both cards for any interested.
     
  8. Godmachine

    Godmachine [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I don't think there is a really good way that's DIY without proper equipment. The AVSforum guys generally are all over stuff like this so I'm going to pose my question there since there are tons of OLED owners and maybe a few who have had to purchase a DP to HDMI 2.0 adapter.

    Again appreciate all the level headed advice. I tried asking on Reddit and wow it turned into a flame war and was basically useless. The current fanboy levels between red and green are at fever pitch. I really hope these new generation cards balance the scales a bit more.
     
  9. AK0tA

    AK0tA Gawd

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    Still running my evga 660 Ti with pretty good performance in most games that I play Rise of Flight, MechWarrior Online and AA:pG. Really wanted to upgrade last year but never saw a significant price drop after the new cards came out. After observing several friends 980ti's I thought it a good decision to hold off spending $450+ for just a bit flashier and a few FPS. With DX12 games in the making I guess I'll start looking again but do not want to spend more than $325 /$350.
     
  10. PontiacGTX

    PontiacGTX Gawd

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    if thats the case holding ia better idea and you cna find refurbished freesync monitors 1440 144hz for below 470usd

    either way a 390x outperforms the 980 or does similar job and you wont have a 4GB limit
     
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  11. techobrien

    techobrien Limp Gawd

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    Yeah I didn't think there was a good way to do it myself. I might ask on the Club3D forums too but that place is a disaster right now. Heh...see you over at AVS :p That's actually where I first learned about the Club3D adapter (on the 2015 Vizio M series owners thread). I haven't found a lot of information because the adapter is fairly new (<2 months old) and so far most peoples answers to "I need HDMI 2.0" is "buy a GTX 9XX." A link to your post would be great so I can stay in the loop.
     
  12. rezerekted

    rezerekted 2[H]4U

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    GTX780>GTX970 is almost a sidegrade, don't do it. Wait for next gen.
     
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  13. Godmachine

    Godmachine [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Alright so my GTX 980 won't arrive until Monday but my friend lent me his 390x (its a Sapphire Nitro edition) and I've some interesting and disappointing experiences with it. First off the drivers seem MUCH better than AMD drivers were years ago. More frequent updates and it shows they've really stepped up their game. So that's a relief. Downside however is that finding simple things like changing the refresh rate of your monitors is a motherfucking pain in the ass. With Nvidia its right in the same menu and takes 2 clicks to get to. With AMD its buried in the native Windows display adapter settings. They need to change this. It should be easier to get to.

    My Qnix monitor REFUSES to be set at 115Hz without tons of visual distortion (and I had to use CRU and ToastyX's patch to even be able to get the card to force it , the custom refresh rate option just won't accept even trying to run that) so after a bunch of tweaking I am only able to run my Qnix at 75hz without visual distortion. This is pretty unacceptable when on my GTX 780 it takes literally 15 seconds to create a custom refresh rate and it works flawlessly. I don't know what AMD's deal is but its a big disappointment. I have three Qnix monitors and I'm only running a high refresh rate on one of them and only using one of them and it flat out refuses to work right.

    A lot of the settings like Global Overdrive a bit buried in the options menu as well. It use to be pretty simple and on the Catalyst display menu. Thankfully my clock speeds are proper it seems so I don't have that bug to deal with.

    The 390x also sucks in quite a bit more power than the GTX 780. Its really obvious that this series is at its limitations in terms of a power envelope. Another thing I've noticed is that AMD spikes core usage in really dramatic ways while Nvidia is really stable and consistent (based on my MSI Afterburner observations). I don't really understand why AMD needs such aggressive throttling at times but I've noticed some slight stutter now and again and really that's pretty unacceptable on a higher end Skylake rig.

    I can run games in 1440p with a smoother frame rate then the 780 that's for sure but I'm positive that the 390x would chug at 4k. So a Crossfire would be the only real solution.

    Overall I'm impressed with AMD's driver update frequency but not very impressed with the layout or the crappy DVI-D overclocking problems that are non-existent on Nvidia cards. Also I doubt I'll be able to get any real overclocking done. Seems like the 390x is already maxed in terms of what to expect and I doubt I'l get more than 30+Mhz on the core and probably nothing extra on the memory stable but I'll give it a try and see. I know the 980 overclocks like a beast with the right cooling and power stage configuration. I wish I had more Direct X 12 games to test but even the free included Hitman game can't be redeemed because of AMD's shitty redeem process that's bugged for me so I had to put in a support ticket to get it resolved , hopefully.

    Trying not to be biased but overall I feel like Nvidia is a smoother experience and like I said not being able to overclock my Qnix properly is a major bummer. Wish I could afford a high end Freesync monitor.
     
  14. Dayaks

    Dayaks [H]ardness Supreme

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    390x isn't enough of a jump for me from a 780.

    I'd just wait a few months like these guys said.
     
  15. Stoly

    Stoly [H]ardness Supreme

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    +1 on waiting.
     
  16. polydiol

    polydiol [H]ard|Gawd

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    have we considered that upon release the new batch of cards will be out of stock and difficult to obtain as well as potentially introducing additional concerns regarding a higher cost? The wait will likely be longer than anticipated so there is always a tradeoff.
     
  17. Godmachine

    Godmachine [H]ardForum Junkie

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    A solid point. Especially considering both Nvidia and AMD will be offering GDDR5X cards and that will strain production big time. People have been waiting almost two years to upgrade so the influx will be huge as well. Its probably going to be a pretty solid sell through for a long time. Plus new cards me new driver issues to sort out as well.
     
  18. extide

    extide 2[H]4U

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    That didn't take long, heh
     
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  19. Godmachine

    Godmachine [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Well I meant no interest in a 4k gaming monitor. A 4k TV is a different matter really. I'm going to use the TV for desktop stuff but mostly for 4k Blu Ray's and really just going hardcore for picture quality. The thought of having to spend absurd amounts of money on video cards just to hit 4k 60fps consistently is not something I'm interested in for PC gaming until 4k 60 fps is more price reasonable. Also OLED is going to have input latency to deal with. Making it less ideal for gaming for 2016 at least. Not only the cost of the GPU's to consider but also the cost of a half decent 4k gaming computer monitor. Right now most of the better gaming monitors have horrible QC issues , I see people constantly playing the panel lottery with the X34. Not interested.
     
  20. extide

    extide 2[H]4U

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    So you are not going to be gaming on it then, I see.
     
  21. rinaldo00

    rinaldo00 [H]ard|Gawd

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    Wow, you went from this
    to this
    In just 2 days ;)
    BTW, OLED TVs are not great for gaming yet, suffer from burn in and lag time.
     
  22. Godmachine

    Godmachine [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Read up a few posts for my response.
     
  23. Ieldra

    Ieldra I Promise to RTFM

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    May I steal this from you? Hilarious
     
  24. LigTasm

    LigTasm [H]ardness Supreme

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    Go for it.
     
  25. Guille_arg

    Guille_arg n00b

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    I have the same question, 780ti or 970, amd need too much power and performs like the 970 or under both GPU. Don't worth it.
     
  26. harmattan

    harmattan [H]ardness Supreme

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    Succinct and correct. In short, 390x is going to pull ahead in most games at any resolution, but at 1440p you're going to want more than 3.5GB VRAM.

    Also, if you're considering holding out for Pascal or Polaris, you're going to be waiting a while. All indications point to new card not arriving in the channel until late Q3 earliest. Don't believe that "it's coming in June" nonsense: that's the overly-optimistic, websites looking for hits, and nv/amd marketing machine talking.
     
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  27. PontiacGTX

    PontiacGTX Gawd

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    indeed it can be on july or june
    AMD Confirms, Polaris GPUs Will Be Released Before The Back To School Season For Desktops And Laptops
     
  28. filo

    filo n00b

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    and here i am trying to get 250fps in quake live with my e8400 and 7700. Anyways i also am in the i5 6600 and 390 bandwagon, but i expect substancial price drop of 390 after new tech release. So waiting for that is somewhat rational, no?
     
  29. chaikovski2002

    chaikovski2002 2[H]4U

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    Just wait! New cards come out next month hopefully with the ATI rumored to be in May. The thing is you can always buy at any time! If the new cards are too expensive or too few, or you dont like them being midrange, you can snag a 390x/970/980 at a lower price, either way is many much more logical yes?
     
  30. PontiacGTX

    PontiacGTX Gawd

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    I
    If you wait do it for getting a new card otherwise grt a cheap 290/x and oc it
     
  31. Zeblade

    Zeblade n00b

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    Well got 970,980,980TI. Now that long ago had a Amd 390. It was a tad faster then the 970. But MAN does it run HOT! The 390x should be better then the 970 but not by much. Unless you can get a GREAT deal on the 390X.. NV970 $319.. AMD 390x $414. .. for me the 390x is not worth a extra $100

    BUT like others said.. might want to wait.. NV AMD coming out with something new.. I would wait
     
  32. Darakian

    Darakian [H]ardness Supreme

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    I disagree. The performance might be a little better, but having your display server die every time you do a kernel update is terrible.
     
  33. Vellinious

    Vellinious n00b

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    +1

    A whole bunch o' this.....
     
  34. Jeffredo

    Jeffredo [H]ard|Gawd

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    The way you shouldn't wait if you have a GTX 780 is if you're terminally ill and only have three months to live. Might as well have fun while you can.