GDHardware.com are Canday... Cry Babies!

Status
Not open for further replies.
P

provoko

Gawd
Joined
Aug 6, 2004
Messages
656
Their recent article on FPS cry babies shows how much they're cry babies. They publish an online RANT for all to see trying to prove that unbalanced and overpowered concepts in old school games are OK.

Sorry to tell you that your skills are shit. It's too easy to pick up a railgun in Quake and get a kill and far too easy to pick up an AWP in CS and get kills. I would know, I'm the one pulling the trigger and getting those kills.

Sure you have to practice at it, BUT then you realize you're just preying on the imbalances of the game. Awp is a broken weapon in CS, you know why, cause it's too easy to use and extremely devestating, how do I know, cause I'm the one pulling the trigger. In America’s army, bunny hoping guaranteed you winning every single close-quarters-combat, why, cause it was too easy and exploitive of the game.

When you take an AK47 in CS and start SHOOTING THE FLOOR TO GET A KILL, THATS NOT CALLED SKILLS, IT'S BLATANT IMBALANCE.

Nothing wrong with an oldschool concept as aim, shoot, kill, but when you're shooting the floor to get a kill or your killing everyone in one hit (no matter what part of the body) then theres a problem. Games are supposed to be balanced.
 
/join #cry

YOu shoot the AK at the floor in CS to hit them in the face...... its calling pulling down your spray, lemme guess you are the nub the shoots 8 feet above somones head while running backwards and then crying when you get killed.

The Awp isnt imbalanced you either A. Suck with the awp and cry about people awp whoring or B dont know hwo to beat someone with an awp. the awp is balanced becasue it has the big ole chambering the next round thing going on.

/part #cry
 
If people knew general weapons tactics in the first place, FPS games wouldn't be as unbalanced and "unfair" as they are. Far too many people do not understand the real-life mannerisms of these weapons and just spray all over and get lucky with kills. Then again, when you DO practice these techniques and get taken out by "lucky" shots, failing to kill your enemy it can be very frustrating. I see this happen all the time and it has happened to me quite a few times. I guess we try to focus too much on realism and forget that it's a game, it's not perfect and it's not true-to-life all of the time.
 
CS is a garbage game with garbage balance. Garbage everything. If AWP wasn't such a noob cannon then servers wouldn't be banning/punishing for it and people wouldn't be bitching.

I can't believe people still defend CS in this day and age.
 
Sizer said:
CS is a garbage game with garbage balance. Garbage everything. If AWP wasn't such a noob cannon then servers wouldn't be banning/punishing for it and people wouldn't be bitching.

I can't believe people still defend CS in this day and age.
Click to expand...

Yeah, but now you're a crybaby, I guess.
 
Shakezilla said:
/join #cry

YOu shoot the AK at the floor in CS to hit them in the face...... its calling pulling down your spray, lemme guess you are the nub the shoots 8 feet above somones head while running backwards and then crying when you get killed.

The Awp isnt imbalanced you either A. Suck with the awp and cry about people awp whoring or B dont know hwo to beat someone with an awp. the awp is balanced becasue it has the big ole chambering the next round thing going on.

/part #cry
Click to expand...

The AWP is overpowered compared to other guns. It's a little too easy to get a one-shot kill with the AWP compared to the near impossibility of doing the same with a glock.

A 9 mm round to the chest will stop someone cold, if not kill them. Yet we experimented with it, and couldn't find a way to make a glock kill an unarmored person without a headshot. And even a headshot is not guaranteed, it seems.
 
Who cares if the balance is true to life or not? It isn't supposed 'crybaby' gamers that are ruining gaming, it is the hardcore gamers.

The people who have nothing better to do than sit around and play CS of Q3A for eight hours a day, who figure out every little trick in the book, and who obliterate anyone not close to their skill level. It is virtually impossible for a casual gamer (IMO someone who plays maybe an hour or two a week) to log onto an online game like this and find friendly competition of equally skilled players without some whacko running around gunning down everybody within 5 secs of spawning.

These are games, they are supposed to be fun, not something to obsess and rotate your life around.
 
Shakezilla said:
YOu shoot the AK at the floor in CS to hit them in the face...... its calling pulling down your spray, lemme guess you are the nub the shoots 8 feet above somones head while running backwards and then crying when you get killed.

The Awp isnt imbalanced you either A. Suck with the awp and cry about people awp whoring or B dont know hwo to beat someone with an awp.
Click to expand...

Haha, you totally didn't read my post. I'm the one shooting others with the awp and ak listening to people cry about it. I'm saying those cries are valid, they make sense becasue the awp IS an unfair weapon.

I'm A the person shooting you with the awp and getting the kill AND B killing awpers to steal it from them.

the awp is balanced becasue it has the big ole chambering the next round thing going on.
Click to expand...

If you were any expert on the awp you would know that nerf didn't do sh*t.

The awp is a long distance one shot kill, no matter what part of the body it hits. You could hit someone several times with an M4/AK47 and they can survive/runaway to counter and kill you. With an awp you zoom in and can shoot the head, chest, or leg to get the kill, easy.... thats not balanced.

Infact someone with less experience with an awp can kill an expert with an m4. When I used to teach people how to play CS I would tell them to learn with the AWP first because it's such an easy and devestating weapon. After they got good with it they were killing people with years of experience...

....skills are sh*t when it comes to broken unbalanced weapons in any game... getting a head shot with a deagle is skills, killing someone with an awp/railgun ISN'T.
 
Thanks for the comments guys.... we really tried to speak the hearts of most die-hard gamers we know of in that article...

It's just sad that - I feel - most of us who've been gaming for awhile are a dying breed - a new generation of newbie candy-asses is taking over as the game publishers want to have the widest possible appeal...
 
I agree with realism is bad.

But one shot kills in any game, without proper balance, is even worse.


To many games are ruined by the fact that it is possible to get one shot kills. This is in no way a show of skill. Skill is being able to fight your way from being completely blind sided when you should have little to no chance. There is no fighting back when a single shot is all that is required.

Modern FPS games lack Dog Fighting. That is my complaint with realism. And my complaint with things like gib styled matches in the non realistic games. When the game becomes about the kill, and NOT the fight, there is a problem. That however is not something addressed in this article. They seem more interested in the kill.

Balance is needed in ANY mutliplayer FPS.

This does NOT mean that everyone can do the same things. To me there is no better game than a non realistic, class based, FPS. They are the only games that tend to offer enough balance to the instant killing that the game is still about the fight.
 
Modern FPS games lack Dog Fighting. That is my complaint with realism. And my complaint with things like gib styled matches. When the game becomes about the kill, and NOT the fight, there is a problem. That however is not something addressed in this article. They seem more interested in the kill.
Click to expand...

QFT
 
provoko said:
...It's too easy to pick up a railgun in Quake and get a kill and far too easy to pick up an AWP in CS and get kills. I would know, I'm the one pulling the trigger and getting those kills.

Sure you have to practice at it...
Click to expand...

Might I refer you to the mighty dictionary:

Skill n.
1. Proficiency, facility, or dexterity that is acquired or developed through training or experience.
2. A developed talent or ability.

Not only did you present conflicting arguments, but they were within a paragraph of each other. Skill is practice... simple as that.

You state that you are the one getting the kills with these weapons, and I'm assuming you have practiced doing so... this leads the readers to believe you are an experienced player. But then you attack players for using 'skill' to combat the recoil of the automatic weapons by aiming lower the longer the trigger is pressed. This is one of the most basic techniques in the game and almost every player learns this within the first month of playing.

I would put this topic squarely in the trolling category and should be locked.
 
Keep this thread on topic. Any posting outside of the rules from this point forward will earn you a permaban.
 
Learning the different quirks of the game (ie shooting through walls) is definately part of it. If you don't like it, theres always someone like you that has a server and can enforce those rules. Find it and play there.

"Games are supposed to be balanced" Not true.

The exploits are available to everyone, so it is balanced. By some simple observation you can learn a LOT. Whether it be spray points through walls, or even simple burst patterns that are effective on different guns.

We're not talking about hacking here, where players are given an edge by using exploits that arent available to everyone. We're simply talking about learning how the game works, and using it to your advantage. Which is something that everyone has the ability to do.
 
SwanBeeCh said:
Learning the different quirks of the game (ie shooting through walls) is definately part of it. If you don't like it, theres always someone like you that has a server and can enforce those rules. Find it and play there.

"Games are supposed to be balanced" Not true.

The exploits are available to everyone, so it is balanced. By some simple observation you can learn a LOT. Whether it be spray points through walls, or even simple burst patterns that are effective on different guns.

We're not talking about hacking here, where players are given an edge by using exploits that arent available to everyone. We're simply talking about learning how the game works, and using it to your advantage. Which is something that everyone has the ability to do.
Click to expand...

For the most part, I agree with you. However, in the case of CS and CS:S, the AWP is and always has been seriously overpowered in relation to the other weapons. a 5.56 round will almost certainly incapacitate anyone shot in the chest with it just as effectively as an AWM (on which the AWP is based)...yet the 5.56 rounds in the game aren't nearly as effective.

What makes it so bad is that the AWP is such an expensive weapon. I've literally seen a team dominate for hours simply because the opposing team could never afford to buy AWPs to counter them. AWPs can ruin the fun of a game fast, which in my book makes them bad and unbalanced.

Scouts and autosnipers are where it's at. Their damage modeling is more consistent with the rest of the game and they are very effective weapons.
 
The way I see it... saving for 3 rounds, without killing anything, gets you enough money for an awp. Then its back to skill.

If you cant convince your teammates to save, and they just keep running and dying you have two choices.

1. Get clutch
2. Take up leage-play, and stop pubbing. Teamwork is more effective.

And no, switching teams is NOT an option. Team-stackers deserve painful death.

And with cs these days, so many people hate the awp, that there are nearly as many servers that allow it as those that dont, so I can't really see it being a problem in a pub.


edit: And we can't forget the scout. Its definately the anti-awp. Being able to move quickly and still shoot accurately has its advantages.
 
Scouts (aka Squeeker) have always been the answer to AWP whores. Become skilled with the 'Squeeker' and you can save a losing team.
 
chiablo said:
Might I refer you to the mighty dictionary: Skill n.

Not only did you present conflicting arguments, but they were within a paragraph of each other. Skill is practice... simple as that.

You state that you are the one getting the kills with these weapons, and I'm assuming you have practiced doing so... this leads the readers to believe you are an experienced player. But then you attack players for using 'skill' to combat the recoil of the automatic weapons by aiming lower the longer the trigger is pressed. This is one of the most basic techniques in the game and almost every player learns this within the first month of playing.

I would put this topic squarely in the trolling category and should be locked.
Click to expand...

The 'skill' GDHardware refers to is based off of imbalance. It's only contradicting because the people at GDHardware are hypocrites. Skill based on imbalance is not skill, thats my point.

I use the word EASY because theres almost no disadvantage in using these guns. I can shoot you from long distances and shoot any part of your body to kill you in one hit. THATS EASY. Don't make me define the word easy for you.

I used the word PRACTICE because you can't just pick it up and start killing people, but you don't need tremendous amounts of hours learning the INTRICACIES of the AWP or Railgun because... theres nothing to it. Just put up your sight, you have a giant target (opposed to a small target like the head), shoot, and you got your kill in one hit. Same goes for the plasma rifle in unreal tournament.

Lowering your weapon to combat recoil is fine, but... when you're shooting the floor.. the floor, I seriously mean the floor, and you get a kill out of it is just dumb. CS has an outdated engine with outdated concepts. If you recoil, your gun moves up and so does your view, in CS it doesn't, which can be exploited, for example the AK47 that I've mentioned. Plus you're not even being oldschool or being skillful if you're not aiming at someone, you're just exploiting the system.

Next time don't be a smart ***.
 
I think it shows inexperience to blame total game imbalance solely on weapon power and aim... The power behind all the good players is your ability to become as " unpredictable " as you can.. This could mean in your movements, strafe movements, changing cover spots, using different routes to try flank, confuse, and get behind your enemy. Your over-powered AWP won't matter, you'll be dead before you knew what happened.. prolly from a pistol too..

When I watch a team thats dominating, it because the other team is doing the exact same thing... its like watching a repeat of the same round every round.. everyone moves, camps, grenades, and snipes at almost the same times, and in the same spots...

Same with Quake 2-3-4.. You watch the guy dominating everyone... He moves different, sometimes faster, but always smarter. If you think rails can't be dodged, you haven't learned to strafe yet. The good players win off the predictibility of his opponents. They giggle to themselves as they hear your uh uh uh uh jumping rythmically coming around the map counting down their rail shot.. You were in their xhairs before they actually saw you... Good sound is like an accepted wallhack... he knew where you were, before you even knew when you could shoot.

but whatever you play... be cool, stay in school, use drugs and don't fuckin cheat.. k?
 
CS isn't meant to be realistic, so don't talk garbage calibur bullets should do this or that, because that doesn't mean jack shit in CS.

CS is an arcade game, pretty much. The awp isn't overpowered, perhaps in public servers, however in competition(where CS really shines), it's fine.
 
SwanBeeCh said:
"Games are supposed to be balanced" Not true.

The exploits are available to everyone, so it is balanced. By some simple observation you can learn a LOT. Whether it be spray points through walls, or even simple burst patterns that are effective on different guns.
Click to expand...

Then why would game makers bother to include lesser weapons in a multiplayer game? Every weapon should have its nitch of use. Any weapon that can do it all, simply devalues other weapons.

I love shotguns in most any game I play. Blame it on wolfienstien and doom.

In many games shotguns are completely useless because other weapons can manage quick, single shot, high damage, precise, hits that do not depend on distance. Sure I might manage to inflict some damage on more than one target, but people should know not to bunch together in most any game with nades.


So why not carry the same weapon as everyone else since they have the perfect weapon? It makes things dull. There is more challenge when you know what to expect but you are not sure how it will be done. No longer is it a contest of who can perform a cookie cutter strat the best. It brings back the mental aspect of skill to go along with reflexes and instinct.
 
Games are getting too difficult as it is. Hardcore gamers are a very small portion of the gaming population, maybe 5-10% if that, and games which are designed primarily for them are no fun for someone else.

If having an AWP means that someone who has a life and job and etc and can't afford to spend 8 hours a day playing Counterstrike can still get online and make a kill on a 'pro' (and I use that term laughably, professional gaming is IMO of the most ridiculous things out there, but that is only marginally related to this, so I will bring it back...) then it is all the better. Weapons/skills/rules in the game that allow the normal gamer to get a victory time and again from the opressive 'l337' players are what make those games even worth playing online for most people.
 
So is it just me or does this guys entire article basically comes down to:

"I am a whiny candy-ass crybaby and I don't like it that developers are making games that are different in any real way, other than graphics, from the games I grew up on and am really super good at like Doom and Quake. It's all those darn candy-ass crybabys fault! They're the reason I get owned at CS:S and F.E.A.R., and other modern games with "realism" in them. They should all just shut up and allow this genre to stagnate until nobody new wants to play. That way I will always be playing against people my age, who grew up with these games, and I will never have to take on younger players who have faster reflexes!"

I mean honestly, WTF is wrong with this guy. His entire article makes no sense.... Half the stuff he complains about as happening "because people wanted games to be fairer" actually make games HARDER and less fair. It takes only a few hours to become decent at Quake style play where whatever you aim at you hit, and where it takes a few hits from most weapons to die. I actually rarely play that kind of game, but even so I can jump on any public server and be in the top 3 almost every time once I learn enough of the map, which usually takes about 3 or 4 rounds. Meanwhile, it takes real time and serious effort put into skill development to become even medicore at some more current games. The worst/best example is CS.... It took me 3 months of playing for a few hours every night to learn to deal with increased inaccuracy while moving, with being killed with only a few hits, and most importantly to learn the maps. Even now, if I take more than a few weeks off from the game it takes a few days just to get back to half-way decent shape (finishing with more kills than deaths every time, and it can take 3 or 4 weeks of practice to get pretty good (top 3 on a public server regularly) at the game.

And the hypocrisy.... OMG... This article is RANK with hypocrisy. They guy spends tons of time complaining that other people complained to much (hypocrisy). So what does he say they should be doing? He says they should be practicing at HIS style of game instead of complaining about it, but then then he complains about THEIR style of game instead of practicing at it himself! Hypocrisy!!!!

Besides, if this guy would just STFU for a minute he might realize that developers never made these changes because people complained about Quake style gameplay. What happened was the developers saw that the single most popular game in the entire world was based on increased realism.... People played CS in mind-boggling, record-setting, numbers. So that was how the gaming public asked for more realism, through super-support of a more "realistic" game than any other around. It wasn't through complaints about less realistic games! This guy honestly sounds like my grandpa... "Back in my day kid we had to rocket jump five miles uphill in the snow to kill another player."..... Whatever old man...

Anyway, this guy needs to grow up, learn to write, learn to make a cohesive argument, and learn how to play a new freaking style of game!
 
It seems to me that the awp and railgun have become the main points here.
In my opinion... having the weapon available to ALL players(which they both are) makes it as balanced as can be. If you choose to use a less powerful weapon, thats your CHOICE.

"but, I dont have enough money to buy the awp, and the other team has five of them !!! :'("

If you have troubles rushing an awp with a glock or usp...wait it out a couple rounds and buy one for yourself.

I could see it as being a compromise of balance if it was one team with all high powered, accurate weapons, against the other team, left with only innacurate weak weapons. However, this is not the case.

As far as cs is concered, I can't count the number of players I know that will take a usp or glock, and destroy your awp... which you have conveniently spent no hours practicing with, because it's so simple to use... and stuff.

I believe the only balance issues at hand in the gaming world are skill levels. Which is hardly something you can blame on the game.
 
The very premise of that article is supported not by their examples but by their very publishing of said article.

They are, in effect, crying about today's games. Now how that differs from the 13 year old screaming obscenities on XBOX Live in Halo is beyond me...perhaps because it's more eloquent and lacks curse words?

I don't think so. I remember the first time I played Operation: Flashpoint. Look down the barrel of the gun for a change? Get tired from running? Kick back from the gun and spread from the fire? Holy crap I found what I'd been looking for! Fast forward a few years and now BF2 satisfies my urges for realism, and slower paced tactical play.

If I want run and gun there's always UT2004 or Quake4, but my personal preference is slower, more realistic games. I'm not out there looking to prove that I'm the number one player on the server, and in fact a concerted team effort that leads to map domination is a lot more satisfying to me...
 
Morley said:
The very premise of that article is supported not by their examples but by their very publishing of said article.

They are, in effect, crying about today's games. Now how that differs from the 13 year old screaming obscenities on XBOX Live in Halo is beyond me...perhaps because it's more eloquent and lacks curse words?

I don't think so. I remember the first time I played Operation: Flashpoint. Look down the barrel of the gun for a change? Get tired from running? Kick back from the gun and spread from the fire? Holy crap I found what I'd been looking for! Fast forward a few years and now BF2 satisfies my urges for realism, and slower paced tactical play.

If I want run and gun there's always UT2004 or Quake4, but my personal preference is slower, more realistic games. I'm not out there looking to prove that I'm the number one player on the server, and in fact a concerted team effort that leads to map domination is a lot more satisfying to me...
Click to expand...

Very well said. Im one for the fast paced games trying to prove I can get number 1, but I still consider myself a team oriented player. I sometimes get first, but thats in free for alls or deathmatches... Im a veteran player of qwf, tfc, and q3f, all fortress style mods that need strong teamwork to even attempt to win.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top