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From LCD back to CRT.

I LUV IBM's P275 21" for dark/gaseous astro images and noiseless DVD. Till SED arrives I cannot ditch the P275.
 
NEC, Samsung, Sony, will have the best picture.

Good luck, CRT's are becoming harder to find as they force mediocre LCD technology on the masses. :(
 
My key gripe with LCD's is that its lacks the resposniveness of CRT.
1. Color and Black level. The colors on the LCD doesn't seem so good. especially red, just google "blood" on google images it looks orange when compared to CRT.
2. The details on a moving target is are blurred.
3. I seem to be able to rack up higher scores in BF2142 on my old 15" CRT than on any of my LCDs.
4. I suspect screen of a CRT is updated quicker than a LCD by about a 1 - 2 frames. (thats about to 16 to 30 ms at 60fps).


LCD Models i have used.
Sony CDP L133 13" << Early generation LCD, not very good.
Eizo L-375 15" 1024 x 768 << Okay, buy not really big nuff. (keeping it for typing up documents.)
Sharp LL-T1620 16" 1280 x 1024 << Miserable colors. Got rid of it quickly.
Dell 2005FPW 20" 1050 x 1050 << Decent colors, still lacks responsiveness of CRT.

CRT used before:
Dell UltraScan HT825 1024 x 768 << 10 years old. still works. Use it for BF2.
Mitsubishi Diamond Pro 730 << Loved it , but had to sell it.

Video cards used. X1800XT and 8800GTX.
 
Well, if you are interested in a used CRT I have a LaCie Electron22Blue IV that I'm looking at getting rid of. It's what I used before going to LCD. As far as CRTs go it's one of the tops, though like most high end CRTs it's no longer made.

Shipping would be expensive as hell though, thing weighs like 100 pounds.
 
1. True, most lower end LCD's blacks arent black, but newer panels fix this, unless you want to spend $2k on a pro level lcd :)

2. Then you have a slow response time LCD - also not an issue on newer models

3. likely related to #2.

4. LCD's dont update the entire screen, they update on a per pixel basis, they dont use a refresh rate like a CRT, again related to #2.
 
You can get a brand-new NEC FP2141SB-BK at NewEgg for $844 shipped. That would your best bet, since it is brand-new, comes in a retail box, and is protected by a three-year warranty from NEC. NewEgg also has an open NEC FE211SB-BK for $370 shipped.

You could also look into AccurateIT. They have "New-Overstock" SGI versions of the NEC FP2141SB and Sony G520 available for $399 shipped and $499 shipped, respectively. "New-Overstock" means that someone (let's say the government) bought these monitors, performed some basic tests on them, and put them in storage. They are techically used and may have some superficial cabinet damage, but the tubes and glass themselves, for all intents and purposes, should be like new. AccurateIT provides a one-year warranty if the monitor should fail or develop a serious problem, and if such a thing were to happen in the first thirty days, they will supposedly pay shipping both ways. Buying from them is somewhat more of a crap shoot; you may end up with a perfect specimen, or you may not. Please note that I said should be like new. You may just end up with one that has a screen flaw, even though they claim no such flaws on New-Overstock models. So, like I said, you are taking more of a chance. I suppose the same would apply with the open-box FE2111SB from NewEgg.

And lastly, stay away from used or refurbished units. They are extremely iffy, and you are very likely to get a bad one. I bought a Sony FW900 off eBay some time ago, and, to make a long story short, I was very sorry. Again, for your own good and your own sanity, stay far, far away.


I hope this helps. :)
 
I bought a new old stock NEC FE2111SB-BK. It's a great monitor, designed for professional use - I use it in a dual monitor setup with my LCD. I use the CRT for gaming. For reaction time nothing can compare, but I still use the LCD for browsing, text / programming etc - it never hurts to have two monitors unless desk space is at a premium. The CRT is also better at movies, although the display real estate is smaller - I don't really watch whole movies at the computer.

If you are interested in CRTs make sure you get a Diamondtron / Trinitron type monitor as opposed to cheaper Invar Shadow Mask tubes which are not as good.

You can look into "Grade A" refurbs for CRTs - they are very inexpensive but you do take a chance, luckily these companies have a decent return policy.
 
MrGuvernment said:
1. True, most lower end LCD's blacks arent black, but newer panels fix this, unless you want to spend $2k on a pro level lcd :)

2. Then you have a slow response time LCD - also not an issue on newer models

3. likely related to #2.

4. LCD's dont update the entire screen, they update on a per pixel basis, they dont use a refresh rate like a CRT, again related to #2.
Click to expand...

I recently purchased a LCD rated at 5ms GTG after playing games on a CRT for many years. The blur is definitely noticeable, but I'm getting used to it.

I've read that #4 is the bigger contributer to the perception of motion blur than #2. I believe the LCD industry is looking into strobing backlights that introduces an artificial refresh rate that actually reduces the perception of motion blur.
 
I dont understand why my dad and all my friends hate LCD monitors/tv's because "The blacks are not black". My Viewsonic vx2025 Displays black perfectly once i adjusted with nvidia color and monitor color. I never see any ghosting unless i move my mouse at lightspeed and even then its only minimal. The colors are perfect (again after playing with the colors). I can see alittle black light bleed but only when there is nothing on screen to display, and really. when are you going to be starring a a completely blank screen?. I would say go with a vx2025 but if your realling wanting to go the crt then fine.

Granted my previous monitor was like the first dell LCD monitor ever made which now when i play on it ghosts like a mother.

And also you have to consider what type of panel is used in the monitor. the new dells, Viewsonics and benq's all use the same panels last time i checked.
 
johnnyc said:
I recently purchased a LCD rated at 5ms GTG after playing games on a CRT for many years. The blur is definitely noticeable, but I'm getting used to it.

I've read that #4 is the bigger contributer to the perception of motion blur than #2. I believe the LCD industry is looking into strobing backlights that introduces an artificial refresh rate that actually reduces the perception of motion blur.
Click to expand...


That is some interesting info and an interesting concept as well, would be neat to see how that is implemented.

For sure LCD's do fall short when we get to consumre level ones, but they have come a long wayyy

and yes my 2025 viewsonic looks great as well after i calibrated it, somethign most people are too lazy to bother doing, they would rather complain.
 
blazingrig: I feel similar. I was real worried, being a longtime CRT guy. I valued the good colour and response of my CRT. It was a good CRT too, a pro LaCie 22" tube that was damn near as expensive as the LCD that I got. However I love this LCD and I'm not going back. While there are areas the CRT is better at (low level colour detail being the biggest) overall it can't compare to the LCD. The sharpness and perfect geometry alone make it worth it. While the CRT was fine for games it was fatiguing for text work.

So while the LCD isn't better in every area than the CRT, I'd say it's better in at least 90% of things, and the areas it is worse in, it's not really a big deal.
 
This thread has gone on without mention of the beloved 24" widescreen Sony GDM-FW900? For shame! :eek:

The OP must visit the stickied FW900 thread! :cool:

It's a beautiful monitor for those of us that want widescreen but are unwilling to put up with the poor black detail, grayish blacks, flawed colors and possible ghosting/lag of LCDs.
 
Sycraft said:
blazingrig: I feel similar. I was real worried, being a longtime CRT guy. I valued the good colour and response of my CRT. It was a good CRT too, a pro LaCie 22" tube that was damn near as expensive as the LCD that I got. However I love this LCD and I'm not going back. While there are areas the CRT is better at (low level colour detail being the biggest) overall it can't compare to the LCD. The sharpness and perfect geometry alone make it worth it. While the CRT was fine for games it was fatiguing for text work.

So while the LCD isn't better in every area than the CRT, I'd say it's better in at least 90% of things, and the areas it is worse in, it's not really a big deal.
Click to expand...

Same for me, plus, since I go to LAN parties every month an LCD is MUCH better! :cool:
 
i'd have to say crts have a much better response than lcds. i have a l90d+ with 8ms response time, but i can still see ghosting at times. i had the most issue when playing id games and strafe jumping...it made me a little dizzy with the lag.

but i will say the vivid colours and image quality on the lcd are outstanding. i love using it for bf2. and you can't beat the look on the desk as compared to a 21" clunking hulk.
 
blazingrig said:
Then again my LCD is a HDTV and uses a PVA panel with a very high contrast ratio, It was around $600 to so I guess thats why it was so much better to any CRT I used.
Click to expand...
So what you're saying is since it was $600 its automatically better than a CRT?

The blind leading the blind...... :(

That contrast ratio is not very high, its very low, when compared to a CRT.
1000:1 isnt crap compared to 10000:1 on a CRT. 1000:1 for an LCD isn't bad for an LCD but until they get it right, i'll pass

ThatsAgood1jay said:
I dont understand why my dad and all my friends hate LCD monitors/tv's because "The blacks are not black". My Viewsonic vx2025 Displays black perfectly once i adjusted with nvidia color and monitor color.
Click to expand...
Maybe for YOUR eyes but keep in mind Photoshop designers have color/black needs that other people dont care about. What you think is black is really dark grey. Turn all the lights out, you'll see.

NO LCD can display "perfectly good blacks". (NEC has one fit for PS designers @$6300) Blacks on an LCD only go so far deep to a certain point, then just stay grey. Remember LCD watches with the silver lining on the back? What do you think is in ALL LCD's? you can't turn apples to oranges, and you can't turn silver to black.

BTW, those INSANE brightness levels that LCD's boast about all the time is just another ploy to make the blacks seem blacker, not because they really are. Turn the blinding brightness down and calibrate then with the light off, and see how black those blacks are.
 
Dunan said:
BTW, those INSANE brightness levels that LCD's boast about all the time is just another ploy to make the blacks look blacker, not because they really are. Turn the blinding brightness down and calibrate then with the light off, and see how black those blacks are.
Click to expand...

yeah, i tried the nvidia calibrator and one of the first steps was to turn the brightness down until the two top bars are black or close to black. the top bar could work for black, but i turned the brightness down all the way and the second bar didn't look anywhere near black :\
 
Yes, P991s are pretty kick ass monitors. All the compys here at work have P991s as the monitor (some have smaller Sony mons, but basically everything is a Trinitron).

I'm loving my CRTs more now really...I have 2 P991s, 1 P990 and am looking into getting a FW900. CRTs by their nature. I just love them for video/graphics work. Big, yes, power hogging, yes, but that's the nature of the beast.

I honestly don't understand how anything smaller than 19" at 1600x1200 (or 1680x1050) is usable. ;)
 
pRS317 said:
yeah, i tried the nvidia calibrator and one of the first steps was to turn the brightness down until the two top bars are black or close to black. the top bar could work for black, but i turned the brightness down all the way and the second bar didn't look anywhere near black :\
Click to expand...

One thing I DID notice and this is a BIG plus *possibly* for LCD owners is that i found if you put a privacy screen in and LCD it *dramatically* helps the black levels, to the point where I was quite impressed! But, that's also sinking $40 into the monitor.
I'm actually contemplating getting an LCD + a black privacy screen all over again, i thought it looked that good. And i'm EXTREMELY critical when it comes to blacks/colors :D
 
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