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First time WCer, review this setup please.

B

Betatester

Weaksauce
Joined
Aug 2, 2006
Messages
72
ok to start off, my case sucks. it has 0 airflow whats so ever i actually just leave the door off for the time being untill i can get it cooler inside and on my parts, personally i think all of it is running warm for one reason or another. specs are in the sig. Heres a pic of my case with it set up. its a big, not so good picture. i know the cables are kind of a mess and usb cables flopping over in the case but it just got in my damn way to much :-p
first off id like a few recommendations on what kind of fans i should get...maybe some that i could control the fanspeed so it actually pushes air through the case. i believe the case uses 2x 120mm fans in the back and 1 in the front. (gigabyte 3d aurora with the window).
heres what i plan on getting from danger den....

Danger Den Single 5 1/4" Bay Reservoir
2X Koosah for Nvidia 7800/7900 (Prepped for SLI - 2 Fittings & 2 Plugs)
12V DD-D5 Pump
Copper TDX Block for AMD AM2 Processor ( Acrylic with Universal Top, +Accelerator Nozzles)
5X Tygon 3603 Tubing 1/2" ID 3/4" OD

and i dont know what kind of radiator to get, im gunna cool some pretty warm stuff but i have no experience with water cooling :) also about the Koosah, its pretty expensive @ 124 a pop... id like to cool the entire card but will i benefit from using it over a Maze4 with heat sinks? and i have no idea how much tubing 5x is...so i how its enough....
without the radiator the total is 442 with 88 dollar savings from the paglan06 code 20% off stuff......
thanks for looking, all comments appreciated, [h] rules.
 
Ok first off... the 4$ Yate Loons from jab-Tech.com. They're almost silent at 7v. Those white fans arn't really bad either... Get a bay controller... There are a few for about 12$ that do a wonderful job.

Next... The rad... I recommend the HWlabs GT Stealth 240 radiator. With 2 fans pulling (make sure to drill out the crappy Aurora pre-drilled fan holes :p) air through that Rad you'll get quite enough cooling for a SLI + CPU setup.

I'd stay away from Tygon. Simply because it's VERY expensive and quite thick. I'd get the 7/16" Masterkleer tubing for 2 reasons. It's a bit thinner, so IMO it looks better, It's also easier to route. Also, you need to boil the ends to get it to fit over most standard WB Barbs... This means, when it cools back down it LOCKS on the barb, and you dont even need Hose Clamps!

5' is NOT enough. Considering you can get about 20' of the Masterkleer for the same price as the tygon you currently have checked out... From MCmaster Carr online... Well, do yourself a favour.

Stay away from the accelerator nozzles. I can guarentee you you'll leave them in your drawer for a year before accidentally smashing one and throwing the set out (ahem :p Personal experience). There's also a 20% discount code for the DangerDen store, that I'm sure someone will post in this forum. Also, I do believe DD is selling a Combo of the D5 pump and the TDX waterblock to save some cash too (and you'll need it, those Koosah's, such a ripoff).

Oh yeah, about the Koosah's. No. There will be no benefit over using a maze 4 and some ramsinks... None at all, I can almost guarentee it! The only benefit is that they're easier to set up in SLI mode... I'd go the Maze4 route and pick up some coolsleeves (the wirey coily things) to get rid of kinks (and MAN those blocks are gonna kink that close).
 
Danger Den Single 5 1/4" Bay Reservoir
2x EK Waterblocks for your 78/7900[www.ekwaterblocks.com]
12V DD-D5 Pump
Copper TDX Block for AMD AM2 Processor ( Acrylic with Universal Top, +Accelerator Nozzles)
10x Masterkleer 7/16"

Arcygenical, the Accelerator nozzles are good. I like number 4 or 5, they're better than the stock, and just a few bucks.

The EK blocks are way cheaper, and work much better. Plus, you can get them in acrylic or delrin, and in the fittings of your choice.
 
alright thanks for the help and tips, i think im gunna use the EK stuff even though im not sure about using a brand i know nothing about....gunna have to research. with the masterkleer ive heard alot of people recommend it. i searched 7/16th and came up with 3 different results.....idk which one to get. and these will work with the 1/2 barbs right?

and the GT Stealth 240 radiator from dangerden is out of stock ATM :(
 
Yeah... the 4th plate is pretty good, in theory, but none of them actually decreased my temps at all...
 
The Masterkleer tubing (7/16") will work with 1/2" barbs. I'd get the middle thickness one, the thinest wall one is too thin.

As for the EK blocks, go for it, they're good pieces of equipment.
 
alright cool so im changing the rig too

Danger Den Single 5 1/4" Bay Reservoir
2 × EK-FC79 for SLI mode
12V DD-D5 Pump
Copper TDX Block for AMD AM2 Processor ( Acrylic with Universal Top, +Accelerator Nozzles)
15' of Masterkleer 7/16"
some artic silver

and it roughtly comes out to 400 something..without shipping included which will prolly be alot. since im ordering from 4 different sites...also i started looking at fan controllers none ive seen that i like or got decent reviews.
 
The swiftech MCR360 radiator would be better since you are going sli and using low speed fans (just for note if you want ultimate performance get the thermochill PA120.3 it is the best, but also more expensive). The hwlabs gts are better for high speed fans, but if you are looking to save money ordering from dangerden they are fine. A black ice pro would also be fine. I recommend a 120.3 type radiator for cpu+sli for better performance, and it isnt much more money.

For pump a ddc with the acrylic top is a better pump than the D5. Much higher head height, with 3 blocks it'll be nice to have, plus lower heat dump. Dangerden has the ddc i believe. They dont have the acrylic top though.

The EK water blocks are good.

TDX isnt terrible but the storm is better. TDX is fine if you want to save a few dollars ordering from dangerden.

Masterkleer is good.

Use whatever reservoir or t-line you want. Doesnt make a huge difference either way.
 
yea i was looking at the DDC pump but theres only 3/8 fittings and i was planning on going with 1/2 fittings so i went with the D5, also im unsure if the storm will work with the AM2 bracket.

EDIT: i might go and get the swiftech apogee extreme since its compatible with the AM2 bracket. what do you guys think? better then TDX?
 
It's probably about the same. In all honesty only the Storm really bests the TDX by anything noticable. Get whatever's cheaper.
 
Betatester said:
yea i was looking at the DDC pump but theres only 3/8 fittings and i was planning on going with 1/2 fittings so i went with the D5, also im unsure if the storm will work with the AM2 bracket.

EDIT: i might go and get the swiftech apogee extreme since its compatible with the AM2 bracket. what do you guys think? better then TDX?
Click to expand...

Did you already order? Thats why i said get the ddc with the plexi top (performance-pcs might have it), you can get it with 1/2" barbs. If you already ordered then nevermind.

also TDX>apogee
 
Arcygenical said:
Oh yeah, about the Koosah's. No. There will be no benefit over using a maze 4 and some ramsinks... None at all, I can almost guarentee it! The only benefit is that they're easier to set up in SLI mode... I'd go the Maze4 route and pick up some coolsleeves (the wirey coily things) to get rid of kinks (and MAN those blocks are gonna kink that close).
Click to expand...

He could also just use elbows. They won't be any more restrictive than the elbows that are built into the koosah anyways. That way he can put the elbows on one barb each (for the tubing run betweent the two cards), and use a less restrictive arrangement on the other barbs if he wants.
 
no i haven't ordered anything yet, this is something that i consider should be looked at carefully, reviewed carefully and planed ahead. if im gunna spend this much money on something i want it to work effectively while looking professional. i have no intention of buying some premade kit and slapping it in. im already considering modifications i can do to the case to get better airflow and possibly cram everything inside of it.

i looked at performance pc and i think i can cut costs by getting alot of my stuff there as so long they didnt hike the price to much. with the pump are you talking about Alphacool Laing DDC-Pump 12V Ultra ?
 
yea its the alphacool laing ultra with the clear top, (dont get the one with the water tank it actually hurts performance). With it you need to put one of the barbs on the top of the pump for the inlet, one barb on the side for an outlet, and plug the other hole on the side that is connected to the inlet with the included plug. Hope that is clear, im sure if you look around you can find some pictures of what i mean. That pump has 20 feet of head height and with the top inlet barb modification has much higher flow rate than the stock ddc. It is also quieter than a mcp655.

just to clarify some about water blocks. there was a lot of discussion about swiftechs claims when the apogee came out. Basically all you need to know is that with a cpu that has an IHS (if you leave it on) you probably wont see much difference between any blocks at all. However, with a bare die you do see differences and with a bare die the Storm is currently the best, with the MP-05 very slightly behind. If youre interested read this:

http://systemcooling.com/swiftech_apogee-01.html
 
i'd rather see you use a modded DDC or DDC+ plexi top w/ 1/2" barbs than the D5

just my $0.02
 
i skimmed through the site and it looks like all the higher perfroming ones dont support this damn AM2 proc :mad: so really it boils me down to the TDX vs Apogee extreme.
also im thinking about going with the tygon 1/2 since its only around 1.00 a foot. and use some black plastic cable ties for clamps, also getting some coolsleeves so i can make a tight tight turn on the sli waterblock. im really worried about the tubing not being very flexable to make it through my case, i mean if the only real disadvatadge to tygon is price then im alright with that.

also i dont understand the modded dc pump, am i gunna have to buy some barbs to screw in? looked on google images but i couldnt find any pics
 
stormshadow said:
i'd rather see you use a modded DDC or DDC+ plexi top w/ 1/2" barbs than the D5

just my $0.02
Click to expand...

Agreed. IMHO the only good reason to get the D5 is if money's tight and you're getting the D5/TDX combo. On a tight budget, it's a great way to set up a WC rig. But if he's contempating getting koosahs, then there's enough room in the budget to get a DDC with the alphacool top.

Swapping koosahs out for maze4s on the GPUs more than makes up for it without hurting performance. Especially if he gets the DDC at dangerden with 20% off. It's the 18W version they're selling, so you're not missing out on anything special by not getting the whole thing from performance-pcs. Even if you order the whole unit from performance-pcs, you've still got to put the top on yourself.
 
Betatester said:
Danger Den Single 5 1/4" Bay Reservoir
2X Koosah for Nvidia 7800/7900 (Prepped for SLI - 2 Fittings & 2 Plugs)
12V DD-D5 Pump
Copper TDX Block for AMD AM2 Processor ( Acrylic with Universal Top, +Accelerator Nozzles)
5X Tygon 3603 Tubing 1/2" ID 3/4" OD

and i dont know what kind of radiator to get, im gunna cool some pretty warm stuff but i have no experience with water cooling :) also about the Koosah, its pretty expensive @ 124 a pop... id like to cool the entire card but will i benefit from using it over a Maze4 with heat sinks? and i have no idea how much tubing 5x is...so i how its enough....
without the radiator the total is 442 with 88 dollar savings from the paglan06 code 20% off stuff......
thanks for looking, all comments appreciated, [h] rules.
Click to expand...

If you are looking to save some money, I have a practically brand new watercooling loop up for sale which was only used for about a month. PM me for details.
 
The TDX isnt a bad block, it has slightly lower performance than the RBX, which is in that review. Also, supposedly the newest MP-05's have AM2 mounting you could probably call to verify this before ordering.

Pics of what i meant with the top: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=111911

you dont really have to modify anything, its just that the top comes with the plug on the top hole rather than on the side, but its been shown that you get better performance with the inlet barb on the top of the plexi top rather than on the side. You should get what i mean when you look at that pic. Basically just make sure you put the barbs and plug in the way its set up in that pic.

everyone says modded i think due to this: http://systemcooling.com/mcp350_mod-01.html

I actually did that mod to my pumps because the plexi top wasnt available over here at the time. Also note that is with the older 10watt (12 feet head) pump rather than the 18watt (20 feet head) version. The 18w version also has higher flow rate. The top inlet barb modification lowers head height very slightly but greatly increases flow rate give you much better performance.
 
alright i understand about the pump now. and i looked around for the MP-05 being compatible with AM2 and all i found was this shop http://www.petrastechshop.com/aqmpspliedam.html selling the "AquaXtreme MP-05 SP Limited Edition" but all other sites that sell it dont even mention poor ol am2.
on a side note should i use artic silver 5 or the ceramique for the blocks?
 
yea petra is actually the person that mentioned AM2 compatibility over at xtremesystems.org. Other sites may or may not have it, the very newest ones are the AM2 compatible ones, if you call and ask they may be able to tell you if they have them. Petra's is a good site though if you feel inclined to order from them.
 
yea i think ill give em a call tommorow if you think the block is worth it. ive been thinking of ways to get all this in my case and heres my idea...


basicly ill have the resevoir dump the water into the pump intake which should have just enough clearence to fit in a floppy drive, then ill have the pump push the water out and into the radiator with 2 120mm fans (the fans should be pushing air through them vs sucking right?) then the radiator will dump the water through the cpu and then through the sli and back into the resevoir. the only thing i dont like about this is that the heat isnt immeadiatly kicked out of the system but put in the resevoir to sit untill the pump pushes it into the radiator, but i was told the pump makes heat so it should come before the radiator, and the best way to get water to the pump is with the resevoir dumping the coolant into the pump so you dont run it dry
 
dont worry about trying to have your things in any specific order, just route it which ever way is easiest. The water really doesnt heat up much in the loop from hottest to coldest, maybe only a degree or two tops, its constantly mixing so no matter what itll always be close to equilibrium.

what fans you planning on using? Again if you are going with yate loons then you are better off getting the mcr220 than the GTS. GTS is better with higher cfm fans (guessin ~70cfm or so is crossover)

Testing of common rads:

ADDENDUM - JULY 2006 - Further independant comparative results vs other rads - Testing Performed by Radical_53 on behalf of HardwareLuxx Magazine - Germany

120.3 radiator formats tested. Results scale down perfectly for all other formats (120.2, 120.1) from same radiator family (as originally proven in BillA's testing of the HE Series MANY years ago)

1 - Pressure Drop - flow set at 4lpm at pump, pressure measured after radiator. % loss shown - smaller the loss, better the head pressure... listed best to worst.

Least Pressure Drop...
ThermoChill PA120.3 - 6%
Watercool HTFX3-x - 14%
HWLabs BlackIce GT360 - 17%
HWLabs BlackIce GT360 XFlow - 17%
HWLabs BlackIce Xtreme - 17%
HWLabs BlackIce Xtreme XFlow - 17%
Watercool HTSF - 17%
Cooltek MCR320 - 18%
NexXxos Xtreme - 23%
NexXxos Pro - 27%
...highest Pressure Drop

As you can see, you could theoretically run TWO Thermochill rads, and still have better head pressure than if you were using a SINGLE rad of any other brand.

2 - Performance order (best to worst) based on final coolant temp, cooled with YateLoon 120mm fan - lower the "k" figure (difference between coolant temp and air temp), cooler the coolant, therefore better the performance...

At 600rpm:
Thermochill PA120.3 - 7k
Watercool HTSF - 8k
Watercool HTSF3-x - 8.4k
Cooltek Maxistream / Swiftech MCR - 8.4k
Black Ice GT - 9.2k
Black Ice Extreme - 11k
Alphacool NexXxos Pro - 11.2k
Black Ice GT X-Flow - 12.1k
Black Ice Extreme X-Flow - 12.3k
Alphacool NexXxos Extreme - 14k


At 900rpm:
ThermoChill - 6.2k
Cooltek - 6.9k
BIGT - 7.2k
WC HTSF - 7.3k
BIGT-XFlow - 7.3k
WC HTSF3-x - 7.4k
NexXxos Pro - 7.5k
BIX - 8.5k
NexXxos Extreme - 8.5k
BIX-XFlow - 9.5k


At 1200rpm:
ThermoChill - 4.2k
Cooltek - 5.6k
BIGT - 5.7k
BIGT-XFlow - 5.9k
BIX - 5.9k
NexXxos Pro - 6.1k
NexXxos Extreme - 6.1k
HTF3-x - 6.3k
HTSF - 6.3k
BIX-XFlow - 6.6k
 
i guess ill get some yate loon fans since you seem to know more about it then me, and ill get the mcr220.
man it seems like im changing everything i started out with :-p is there any advatage of having such a big resevoir? or can i get a more compacted one? (not that ive seen any smaller except in that other thread of the guy who did wcing with 3d aurora)
also how much tubing is enough? 12 feet seems almost like to much! i mean it only costs like 4 bucks, but i want to account for the coil springs so i dont get any kink-age
 
is there any advatage of having such a big resevoir?
Click to expand...

The only advantage of any resevoir is initial setup/bleeding. After you're up and running, all it does is decrease pressure/flow, and make noise.
 
well its not like you can remove the resevoir after bleeding, and personally i think the t-lines look like crap. i havent seen a good one yet :S
 
Haha, you dont have to get the yate loons, they are very popular though because they have a very high CFM/noise ratio, so you can get pretty good performance and still have it be quiet.

What reservoir are you looking at?
 
chris.c said:
The only advantage of any resevoir is initial setup/bleeding. After you're up and running, all it does is decrease pressure/flow, and make noise.
Click to expand...
not necessarily. my MCRES 1000 is silent. I"ve heard the Micro res and that thing is silent. but having said that, i'm about to change to a repack res and i don't know if they slosh or not.
 
i was looking at getting the single bay resevoir from danger den, but it seems quite big when i can get the floppy driver version? and slap the pump right up there in it too cutting down on some stuff.. i think ><
i looked at the Swiftech MCRES-1000 Reservoir and it looks cool, something i want to do but it uses that D5 it looks like.
 
stormshadow said:
not necessarily. my MCRES 1000 is silent. I"ve heard the Micro res and that thing is silent. but having said that, i'm about to change to a repack res and i don't know if they slosh or not.
Click to expand...

All reses I've had experience with made noise unless they were always topped off. If you let the water level get down to a few mm over the inlet, or even below it, you are going to hear about it.
 
chris.c said:
All reses I've had experience with made noise unless they were always topped off. If you let the water level get down to a few mm over the inlet, or even below it, you are going to hear about it.
Click to expand...
speaking of that, does the water get zapped out quickly? i mean id be happy if i only had to fill it like 5-7 months.
 
mcres 1000 uses the ddc but you cannot use the modded ddc with it. where are you planning on putting the res? Dead set on 5.25 or 3.5 inch bay?
 
kemist1117 said:
mcres 1000 uses the ddc but you cannot use the modded ddc with it. where are you planning on putting the res? Dead set on 5.25 or 3.5 inch bay?
Click to expand...
i wouldnt really say im dead set on anything, my goal is to try and get good components while keeping it in the case if possible.
 
Betatester said:
i wouldnt really say im dead set on anything, my goal is to try and get good components while keeping it in the case if possible.
Click to expand...

Well i have res systems and a t-line system and a res definitely is easier to bleed and fill but its not a huge deal to bleed and fill a t-line either. If you want to keep it in the case i would recommend an mcres micro or a t-line/fill port/hose plug. mcres micro is probably your better bet for easy maintenance and ease of fill/bleed.
 
i hate double posts >.> but.

pump: Alphacool Laing DDC-Pump 12V Ultra 119.95
Tubing: 20ft of Masterkleer General Purpose Clear PVC Tubing 7/16" 5.60
Resevoir: Swiftech MCRES-MICRO™ Reservoir 19.99
Radiator: Swiftech MCR220 Quiet Power Series Dual 120 mm 42.95
CPU Block: AquaXtreme MP-05 SP Limited Edition 75
GPU Blocks: 2 × EK-FC79 for SLI mode 171
Fans: 6x Yate Loon 120mm 28.24 (shipped)

---Misc---
80" of Swiftech 500 Coolsleeves™ - Blue 7.90
------------------------------------------------------
total: 470.66 shipping not included

with a fluid should i just make my own mix of antifreeze / distilled water or use something like fluidXP ? im kinda interested about the UV lol. if theres no difference ill get it and get those 10 buck uv lamp, and just replace my current fans with yate loons (i dont think leds will look good with UV light). oh and artic silver. should i get the regular stuff or the creamique stuff so i dont make my crap explode?

you think thats a well tuned set up?
 
Looks good, the only thing is, those style GPU blocks that cover the ram (EK-FC79, DD Koosah, ect) never perform as well as a maze4/mcw60/mp-1 and they cost a lot more.

with a fluid should i just make my own mix of antifreeze / distilled water or use something like fluidXP
Click to expand...

I use distilled water + pentosin. General rule of thumb is, stay away from all pre-mixed coolant.

im kinda interested about the UV lol.
Click to expand...

UV dye has a tendency to seperate and leave solid deposits in your loop. Not recommended.

oh and artic silver. should i get the regular stuff or the creamique stuff so i dont make my crap explode?
Click to expand...

I use arctic silver 5, and my crap has never exploded.
 
yea you can save some money with maze 4's and ram heat sinks if you want, and it wont change performance really. Also you probably dont need that much coolsleeves. What color water are you looking for? Artic silver 5 is fine for thermal paste. If you are going to get a fanbus you might want to look at the medium speed yate loons (~70cfm rather than ~50cfm) that way its still quiet when turned down but you also have a little more options cooling wise, i think D12SM12 fan rather than D12SL12, i think petra's may be the only place that carries them though.
 
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