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First Intel Build

Z

zero_vertical

Gawd
Joined
Jun 6, 2006
Messages
1,001
I'm building a PC for my old man, who is replacing a 10 year old Dell (that's been bandaided 100 times.) Goals are longevity, reliability, small/convenient size and under $1,000.

I've built a few AMD systems, but it's clear that the price / performance is with conroe right now. Here's the planned build. All you Intellers out there, please comment on my choices.

Intel E6400 Core 2 Duo
http://www.newegg.com/product/Product.asp?item=N82E16819115004

Intel Socket T G965 Express mATX Mobo
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?item=N82E16813121050

CoolerMaster Centurion Mini Tower
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?item=N82E16811119088

WD Caviar 250G 16mb Cache
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?item=N82E16822144701

3D Fuzion 7600gs
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?item=N82E16814143054

Enermax Liberty 400w
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?item=N82E16817194002

512m x 2 Wintec Ampo 240 pin DDR2 800 Memory
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?item=N82E16820161067

19" BenQ LCD
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?item=N82E16824014111

i'm at $929 + shipping right now, so i'm on target. The video card is probably a bit overkill for his needs, but i don't want to run the on board graphics.

Thoughts? Thanks in advance!

zv

[updated based on suggestions and bargain hunting]
 
looks good to me.
What is this going to be used for?
Just office work or some gaming or video editing.

Looks good, Go ahead and order everything :D
 
Since you won't be overclocking, go for some cheaper ram (same speed and 1.8v for better compatibility):
$100 - Wintec AMPO 1GB (2x512MB) DDR2-800 (1.8V) 3AMD2800-1G1K-R

Looks like a solid build.
 
enginurd said:
Since you won't be overclocking, go for some cheaper ram (same speed and 1.8v for better compatibility):
$100 - Wintec AMPO 1GB (2x512MB) DDR2-800 (1.8V) 3AMD2800-1G1K-R

Looks like a solid build.
Click to expand...

nice tip. thanks!
 
AMD RULES said:
looks good to me.
What is this going to be used for?
Just office work or some gaming or video editing.

Looks good, Go ahead and order everything :D
Click to expand...

web, music, work (spreadsheets, databases, word)

tiny amount of gaming (step sisters might play the sims or whatever) no video editing or anything major.
 
one last bump.

i'm most concerned with the intel board. there aren't a ton of options for ddr2 800 compatability. anyone have any experience with it?

zv
 
As long as the memory you get runs at 1.8v, you'll be fine. The RAM will be running at 266Mhz anyhow (DDR2-533), so it doesnt really matter. The reason I suggested that particular kit is because it actually costs less than your previous choice, its the same speed, its spec'd at 1.8v, and if he decides to upgrade his board to a more OC friendly one, he'll already have the ram :D Its a win-win situation.
 
why won't the memory run at 800? the mobo supports the standard, and the wintec ampo sticks are ddr2 800. this will never be OC'd. i want DDR2 800 out of the box.

i'm confused...
 
upon further review, the wintec ampo timings are not listed, and the intel 965 boards require 555 timing and 1.8v. the wintec site doesn't list this ram (and the timing specs) and neither does newegg...

i think i'm going with the geil. a newegg review using the same mobo had success with it at 5-5-5-15, 1.8v, DDR2 800.

zv
 
enginurd said:
As long as the memory you get runs at 1.8v, you'll be fine. The RAM will be running at 266Mhz anyhow (DDR2-533), so it doesnt really matter. The reason I suggested that particular kit is because it actually costs less than your previous choice, its the same speed, its spec'd at 1.8v, and if he decides to upgrade his board to a more OC friendly one, he'll already have the ram :D Its a win-win situation.
Click to expand...

"The RAM will be running at 266Mhz anyhow (DDR2-533)"....Can you follow up on this? The original poster didn't seem to catch this, or maybe it's just me. With no OC, Somthing to do with 1:1 with the somthing?

enginurd(and all), your 1st build suggestions are super, but we need a full-on noob speedround or somthing. And you've pimped the G.Skill right out of newegg stock.
 
skig8r said:
"The RAM will be running at 266Mhz anyhow (DDR2-533)"....Can you follow up on this? The original poster didn't seem to catch this, or maybe it's just me. With no OC, Somthing to do with 1:1 with the somthing?

enginurd(and all), your 1st build suggestions are super, but we need a full-on noob speedround or somthing. And you've pimped the G.Skill right out of newegg stock.
Click to expand...
I know, it sux... I wanted to buy some, too! haha!

Ok, so unless your motherboard has some nice memory dividers and you set them up, everything will be running 1:1 out of the box. An E6300 runs at 7 * 266 = 1.86Ghz (multiplier is 7, and the FSB is 266Mhz), with an effective bus speed of 4 * 266 = 1067Mhz (Intel CPUs are quad pumped). Meaning your ram will be running at twice that, 2 * 266 = DDR2-533 speed.

Sorry if I messed up somewhere. Someone else can correct me if I'm wrong, I'm in a hurry, lol.
 
enginurd said:
I know, it sux... I wanted to buy some, too! haha!

Ok, so unless your motherboard has some nice memory dividers and you set them up, everything will be running 1:1 out of the box. An E6300 runs at 7 * 266 = 1.86Ghz (multiplier is 7, and the FSB is 266Mhz), with an effective bus speed of 4 * 266 = 1067Mhz (Intel CPUs are quad pumped). Meaning your ram will be running at twice that, 2 * 266 = DDR2-533 speed.

Sorry if I messed up somewhere. Someone else can correct me if I'm wrong, I'm in a hurry, lol.
Click to expand...


Bwahaha. I'm glad you caught this, but I'm not done with you. With Zero's permission..
I'll skip the links because you have all this memorized anyway.

Light OC, stock cooling, and won't touch for 1-2 years if I can get this thing working.

E6300
P5B-E

Memory? OK, Mr. Smartypants, now what?
I was looking at the black Patriot 667.
PDC22G5300LLK
http://www.newegg.com/product/product.asp?item=N82E16820220095

x1950xt...delivered today, yeah!

The FSP AX-450, case, disk drive, etc, etc.

I just want the thing to be stable, boot out of the box, and a enough OC so you guys don't point and laugh.
 
Those PDP sticks are nice. They can reach 400Mhz with some extra voltage. The G.Skillz are back in stock :D So... 7*400=2.8Ghz... you'll most likely need an aftermarket HSF to reach this speed and keep nice temps.
 
i understand most of that, but i don't understand why my ddr2 800 memory is only 266*2.

i got your whole post up to the "your ram will be running twice that 266*2." why? if the bandwidth of the FSB = 1066, why can't i get up to 800?

this is important, because a lot of the products i chose were to allow for ddr2 800 speeds (mobo + ram).
 
Because your RAM speed is based on the FSB. If the FSB is 266, your ram will be running at twice that unless you use a memory divider. Out of the box, everything is set to 1:1, where your ram will be running at the same speed as your FSB. Since the board you chose supports DDR2-800, you'll have to choose that setting in the BIOS.

[EDIT]
Also, there really isnt much performance gain going from DDR2-533 to DDR2-800 speeds:
http://www.anandtech.com/memory/showdoc.aspx?i=2800&p=6

The main reason for going with DDR2-800 would be for OC'ing the CPU. Though, as mentioned earlier, since prices are about the same for both speeds, the better buy would be the higher speed.
 
enginurd said:
Because your RAM speed is based on the FSB. If the FSB is 266, your ram will be running at twice that unless you use a memory divider. Out of the box, everything is set to 1:1, where your ram will be running at the same speed as your FSB. Since the board you chose supports DDR2-800, you'll have to choose that setting in the BIOS.
Click to expand...

it says the FSB is 1066/800MHz. i'm sure there's a bios setting, but once it's enabled, what's stopping that build above from running at full DDR2 800 speed?
 
zero_vertical said:
it says the FSB is 1066/800MHz. i'm sure there's a bios setting, but once it's enabled, what's stopping that build above from running at full DDR2 800 speed?
Click to expand...
DDR2-800 speed is 400Mhz. If you're CPU is running at stock speeds, I think you'll need a 4:3 (CPU:RAM) ram divider if your base FSB is 266Mhz (4*266:3*266).
 
enginurd said:
DDR2-800 speed is 400Mhz. If you're CPU is running at stock speeds, I think you'll need a 4:3 (CPU:RAM) ram divider if your base FSB is 266Mhz (4*266:3*266).
Click to expand...

you lost me. as i said in the post before, hte FSB is 1066/800mhz, which i assume is 266*4 (because it's quad pumped.)

you're saying because the timing doesn't match (cpu266 - mem400) i'll need something to correct for the ratio?

what is a memory divider? i've never heard of it.
 
Mem dividers are ratios that you can set to run RAM and FSB asynchroniously.

Since in this case the Conroe runs at 1066 FSB and your DDR2 is at 800, you'd set the divider at 4:3 because 1066/4 = 266 and 800/3 = 266.

I think that conroes prefer 1:1 so getting the FSB to run at 400 will attain the best results.
 
AntiSocialMunky said:
Mem dividers are ratios that you can set to run RAM and FSB asynchroniously.

Since in this case the Conroe runs at 1066 FSB and your DDR2 is at 800, you'd set the divider at 4:3 because 1066/4 = 266 and 800/3 = 266.

I think that conroes prefer 1:1 so getting the FSB to run at 400 will attain the best results.
Click to expand...

so it's just a bios setting? doesn't sound like a big deal... are there drawbacks to this?
 
Yes, its a BIOS setting. It should be available, since the spec says it supports DDR2-800. My point was, out of the box, you wouldn't get DDR2-800... you'd need the memory divider.

FYI, the board supports effective FSB speeds 1066/800... those are for CPUs (1066 for c2ds, 800 for pentiums). When looking for supported ram speeds, you have to look at the ram info, not the FSB. Everything is based off of the base FSB value, which can't be changed on that particular intel board.

The best efficiency is gained from 1:1 ratios. There are no drawbacks, that I know of, to using the 4:3 divider.
 
enginurd said:
Yes, its a BIOS setting. It should be available, since the spec says it supports DDR2-800. My point was, out of the box, you wouldn't get DDR2-800... you'd need the memory divider.

FYI, the board supports effective FSB speeds 1066/800... those are for CPUs (1066 for c2ds, 800 for pentiums). When looking for supported ram speeds, you have to look at the ram info, not the FSB. Everything is based off of the base FSB value, which can't be changed on that particular intel board.

The best efficiency is gained from 1:1 ratios. There are no drawbacks, that I know of, to using the 4:3 divider.
Click to expand...

enginurd, thanks for bearing with me. you and antisocialmunkey have been a huge help.

zv
 
Weird. Are you fixated on that case? There's a lot more to choose from if you go with a case that supports ATX. That case is almost as big as a lot of cases that do support ATX. I'd recommend one of those, and then a regular ATX board. Lots more to choose from, and you won't be limited to the G965.

Nice choice on cpu and gpu for sure for what it's going to be doing. The ram looks like it's getting addressed already anyway. If you're going for longevity, maybe you would want to look into one that offers lifetime warranty. And for futureproofing, maybe a big hdd would be in order. I know you're real close to your price limit already. But if you do the ATX route, you could probably save a few bucks on the motherboard. Good choice on the enermax. That would probably last the 10 years no problem. But if you're willing to go a little lower to maybe one of the standard antec's, that'd save a bit more money for a bigger hard drive. I know you said he wouldn't be doing any video editing, but you never know what's going to happen I guess. Overall, you've got something pretty solid going on there

edit: I've been a long supporter of enermax, but I came across another thread and found out apparently the liberty series aren't that stellar in longevity. Maybe it's only applying for that specific wattage psu, but nonetheless, thought you might want to look into that if you're interested. Hell, I saw a thermaltake 430w or something like that for 40 bucks. Sounds like a decent deal to me
 
i'm going mATX because small size is one of hte goals. it's for my father, who is fairly proficient on a PC, but nothing beyond MS Office apps, web, etc. i want small, quiet, and cheap, so staying away from a big tower that will basically be empty anyways makes sense.

250gig is probably bigger than he needs as is, but the price per pound for HDD space makes it a no brainer to go from 150 to 250.

i've had great luck with the libertys. i'm running the 400w in my htpc, and my brother is running the 500w. a close friend of mine is also running the 500w with good success. they're quiet, very stable voltages, and cool. not the cheapest, but for those attributes, i'm willing to pay a bit more.

thanks again for all the help folks. i'll post back up after the build.

zv
 
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