Fifth Undersea Cable Cut

Status
Not open for further replies.
Ok this is actually starting to get serious, we have passed the point of US bugging gone bad, into DELIBERATE sabotage here.
IF, and I say IF the US/Isreal/west etc. is doing this on purpose then all they have done is make those being affected EXTREMELY trigger happy, and upped the rate of patrols up and down their borders.
I have a feeling that ALL shipping in the area is going to be watched real carefully.
 
Lannister said:
It is not common knowledge but Iran was set to launch(Feb. 1-11) an internation pertroleum market based on non-US dollars(euro). Seeing as how this would destabalize the American economy 2+2=4 ...... Oil is currently traded in US dollars FYI.

All surrounding nations affected by this disturbance saw utilization of internet fall to anwhere from 10-40% where Iran had 100% loss. I haven't seen proof yet but I read unconfirmed reports of a 6th cut.....
Click to expand...

So this is intended to cut off the internet in Iran? Are we sure Iran didn't do this so they could blame the US? I mean they might want an "upgrade", but don't want to pay for it. I only say this because Iran's President is obviously wacked!
 
iran's president is obviously whacked??? doesnt hold a candle to bush.....

excuse me while i take a bat to my tower here so i can get an upgrade.....
 
gibber said:
Loses credibility why? Does he claim he has PROOF that it was an inside job? Then I could see why that would loose cred. but not just saying that he think's so, because there are plenty of reasons why to think it might be an inside job, means and motivation are both there.
Click to expand...
He makes plenty of wild assertions aside from that one. Some of his references are good, but it's an editorial piece... an opinion based upon pretty wild speculation.

I mean, how could he miss the most obvious? The Pope. The man in the point hat secretly hates the Muslims and Internet porn! He and his secret army of sexy, scantily clad battle angles will launch an attack on Muslim computer users the likes of which the world has never seen (well, not since 689 A.D. of course).
"Only the most myopic among us remain oblivious to that reality."
Click to expand...
(Heh, lets see how many fallacies we can use in one sentence!)

Really though... do a search on the author... I was mildly interested when I thought he was a sci-fi writer. When I stopped scanning and started reading and realized he was for real... well, I'm sure I'll look silly when the truth i revealed and we all find out that genetically engineered dolphin-men cloned by the CIA operating under orders from the reanimated corpse of JFK were responsible for the cuts... :rolleyes:

If you love tin foil hats, you'll love Richard Sauder.
...and if you believe all of it, I've got a great bridge for sale on ebay! I take cash, or gold, no credit. ;)


Blaming the US is all well and good, I mean, the US is the easiest scapegoat du jour. I just don't see what they really have little to gain from this (I'm sure someone has a plausible reason the US might want to do this). If it has to do with causing trouble with the Iran market, I'd imagine that they'd wait until it was up to disrupt it rather than preempt it and give them time to fix any holes in their system. Also... there are plenty of reports that Iran really wasn't affected by all this much. (I'd imagine that the US has more effective ways to disrupt internet communication in Iran)

Who has the most to gain from communication isolation of mid-eastern countries form the west?
1) Totalitarian regimes seeking to control all information locally.
2) Military forces with centralized command locally. (possibly, though most non local military forces in that arena have other communication options that certain countries in the area may or may not be working to undermine as well...)
3) Terrorist groups seeking to cause unrest/fear in the area.
4) ???

It's certainly something to keep an eye on though. Definitely odd and a litte too much to be a coincidence.
 
There are several stories about single cables being damaged in the past on CNN.com. But there is no mention at all when FIVE go down? I've got a seriously bad feeling about this.
 
"Who has the most to gain from communication isolation of mid-eastern countries form the west?" lets sub in "Iran" for "mid-eastern countries" since they are the only ones gettting 100% blacked out.


-- Who has the most to gain from communication isolation of Iran from the west?" --

lets reverse that and take a look at who has the most to LOSE.... if the Iranian market takes off(as it will since it is based on a more secure currency -Euro-). Answer? the U.S.

OPEC(of which Iran is a member) has already voiced concern at the instability of the dollar and have hinted at maybe taking a look at switching to a non-US dollar rating for its oil exports.... Should iran succeed, other oil bearing nations may follow and drop the dollar as a value rating for oil sending the US economy further into a recession.

Looking for straw men to shift suspicion from the obvious isn't convincing anyone. We all know the US has a hardon to get Iran out of the picture. Surrounded on all sides (land and sea) looking for any excuse to jump into another war, antagonizing them whenever possible, fabricating stories, flase flag operations to destablize the region. You really think they will flinch at cutting a few com lines???? dude get real...
 
ssratt said:
Ok this is actually starting to get serious, we have passed the point of US bugging gone bad, into DELIBERATE sabotage here.
IF, and I say IF the US/Isreal/west etc. is doing this on purpose then all they have done is make those being affected EXTREMELY trigger happy, and upped the rate of patrols up and down their borders.
I have a feeling that ALL shipping in the area is going to be watched real carefully.
Click to expand...

I'd like to make an addendum to your post.

This is serious. Starting to get serious was about 3 cables ago.
 
Cannydog said:
So this is intended to cut off the internet in Iran? Are we sure Iran didn't do this so they could blame the US? I mean they might want an "upgrade", but don't want to pay for it. I only say this because Iran's President is obviously wacked!
Click to expand...

That's what I thought immediately, although I was speculating that their motivation would be to further turn world opinion against the U.S. - "Look, that bully America is picking on little ol' us again" - rather than some sort of financial or technological motivation. Hmmm.

But the more I think about it, based on the maps of where the cut cables actually are, I'm thinking Iran doesn't have the naval resources it would take to pull of something like this with plausible deniability, provided the cables are far below sea-level. I mean, maybe they could do it, but I kind of doubt it -- my mind keeps going back to a couple of weeks ago when they had those idiots trying to provoke a U.S. battleship in a fricken motorboat.

One other thing - Does anyone actually know if we are talking damaged cables 400 yards off-shore or 30 miles? To me, that would narrow the list of suspects somewhat...

'Course, I could be wrong and the conspiracy theorists might be right -- maybe we're the ones doing the cable-cutting. That's a scary thought to me though. Because if that were the case, I doubt the intent would be solely to disrupt internet communication in the area. Something bigger would be in the works, probably related to the Iranian move away from the dollar to the euro as was previously posted. And I just remembered reading that Iran recently test fired some sort of rocket under the pretense of starting up a space program? Hmmmm. <reaches for tinfoil hat>
 
Lannister said:
iran's president is obviously whacked??? doesnt hold a candle to bush.....

excuse me while i take a bat to my tower here so i can get an upgrade.....
Click to expand...

R.O.F.L. Learn some middle eastern history and stay up on current events. Either you're radical muslim extremist or you have some sort of reality interpretation divergence disorder. :p
 
Lannister said:
"Who has the most to gain from communication isolation of mid-eastern countries form the west?" lets sub in "Iran" for "mid-eastern countries" since they are the only ones gettting 100% blacked out.


-- Who has the most to gain from communication isolation of Iran from the west?" --

lets reverse that and take a look at who has the most to LOSE.... if the Iranian market takes off(as it will since it is based on a more secure currency -Euro-). Answer? the U.S.

OPEC(of which Iran is a member) has already voiced concern at the instability of the dollar and have hinted at maybe taking a look at switching to a non-US dollar rating for its oil exports.... Should iran succeed, other oil bearing nations may follow and drop the dollar as a value rating for oil sending the US economy further into a recession.

Looking for straw men to shift suspicion from the obvious isn't convincing anyone. We all know the US has a hardon to get Iran out of the picture. Surrounded on all sides (land and sea) looking for any excuse to jump into another war, antagonizing them whenever possible, fabricating stories, flase flag operations to destablize the region. You really think they will flinch at cutting a few com lines???? dude get real...
Click to expand...
OMGWTFBBQ! Iran is down! Iran is down! Iran is... of wait, I can still get to all the Iranian government sites...

The link provided here on the [H] says that Iran may not have suffered much at all due to these cable cuts and that the reports of 100% down were false. Now, I'm sure they had some slow down with internet communication, but this idea that Iran was suddenly blacked out... well, believe what you want. Keep the Faith man.

A quick search will tell you that about 70% of the oil traded in the world is done with the US dollar. Iran sells none of it's oil for US dollars anymore... yeah, they've already succeeded in doing that even though they can't get their mini market running. Iran has about a 5% share of the world oil market.

Iran has changed the currency in which it operates. As of late 2007 I don't think it sells a drop of oil for US dollars. Draw whatever conclusions you like, I just want to make sure people are starting with sound information.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/oilRpt/idUKDAH83366720071208
http://www.worldpress.org/Mideast/2314.cfm

If the world wants to start buying oil with Euro, Iran won't be the ones making them. And attacking Iran won't stop it... that doesn't mean US policy makers don't see Iran as a threat. But cutting lines to cause a slight slowdown in internet service to fail to even come close to stopping the Iranian market that doesn't exist or to stop Iran from trading in Euro which it already is... even though it won't change a thing, and even if it did wouldn't have any large impact on the oil trade as a whole...

The support lines on this theory start to break under their own weight. I think there's a good argument to be made here, this just isn't it.
 
Pertaining to all the cables snapping/cutting/breaking/whatever. Now it does seem a little suspicious, especially after the fourth and fifth. They all look to be in different areas, pretty far apart, if that map is correct with the cheezy mspaint overlays. :p

There could be all sorts of motives now that I can see. It could be...
- industrial sabotage by an extremist group
- a lower tech government carrying out some sort of effort to undermine another unknown motive of someone else
- iran trying to sabotage land line communications hoping they will cause more unrest to get blamed on them or someone else, triggering conflict
- the first two or three could have failed due to natural or man induced accidents, then the next two were sabotaged as a joke

And I really have no clue otherwise. Of course everyone would rush forward to blame America first, and that might be the goal of whoever is actually doing the sabotage.. to stir more conflict. In reality, we know the US wouldn't even need to carry out a mediocre weak operation like that, because it accomplishes nothing and they already have their hands full. The US generals on the ground aren't stupid, and they're the ones controlling all the operations in the middle east right now. There's an outside force here at work in the form of some other country or entity. With the oddity of the situation, I'm sure we'll hear some details in the next few days. If the cables were cut, the forensics tasked in the vicinity can be very telling.
 
G0lluM said:
That's what I thought immediately, although I was speculating that their motivation would be to further turn world opinion against the U.S. - "Look, that bully America is picking on little ol' us again" - rather than some sort of financial or technological motivation. Hmmm.

But the more I think about it, based on the maps of where the cut cables actually are, I'm thinking Iran doesn't have the naval resources it would take to pull of something like this with plausible deniability, provided the cables are far below sea-level. I mean, maybe they could do it, but I kind of doubt it -- my mind keeps going back to a couple of weeks ago when they had those idiots trying to provoke a U.S. battleship in a fricken motorboat.

One other thing - Does anyone actually know if we are talking damaged cables 400 yards off-shore or 30 miles? To me, that would narrow the list of suspects somewhat...

'Course, I could be wrong and the conspiracy theorists might be right -- maybe we're the ones doing the cable-cutting. That's a scary thought to me though. Because if that were the case, I doubt the intent would be solely to disrupt internet communication in the area. Something bigger would be in the works, probably related to the Iranian move away from the dollar to the euro as was previously posted. And I just remembered reading that Iran recently test fired some sort of rocket under the pretense of starting up a space program? Hmmmm. <reaches for tinfoil hat>
Click to expand...

I was only trying to introduce that as a "possibility", however remote, considering how it might have several advantages. Now I also recognize, as do you, that "where" the cables are cut is an important indicator given Iran's Naval capabilities. (I mean considering much of their "Navy" utilizes out-board motors...) Nor is it beyond reasonable doubt that this could be a move by some "black ops" organization, for the US government. I think it's safe to conclude only one thing. We don't know!

Oh and to > Lannister - While I do agree that GW is "way out in left field"..... or maybe "from another planet" .... or is currently residing "in another space/time continuum". I just wish he'd "go home". I don't however think he's responsible for 9/11. If you really must blame someone in the White House. I think you'll find Dick Chenny to be more plausibly culpable. "Bush bin Lyin" just doesn't seem smart enough.
 
The US government can't even keep their own CIA agent's names secret, or their own military servers secure. They wouldn't even be capable of pulling off a conspiracy theory as large as 9/11 when hundreds of people would be involved. Anyone would speak out on that subject, especially since it was an attack on US soil. If you think they could pull it off, you need your head checked. Seriously. ROFL.
 
Lannister said:
"Who has the most to gain from communication isolation of mid-eastern countries form the west?" lets sub in "Iran" for "mid-eastern countries" since they are the only ones gettting 100% blacked out.


-- Who has the most to gain from communication isolation of Iran from the west?" --

lets reverse that and take a look at who has the most to LOSE.... if the Iranian market takes off(as it will since it is based on a more secure currency -Euro-). Answer? the U.S.

OPEC(of which Iran is a member) has already voiced concern at the instability of the dollar and have hinted at maybe taking a look at switching to a non-US dollar rating for its oil exports.... Should iran succeed, other oil bearing nations may follow and drop the dollar as a value rating for oil sending the US economy further into a recession.

Looking for straw men to shift suspicion from the obvious isn't convincing anyone. We all know the US has a hardon to get Iran out of the picture. Surrounded on all sides (land and sea) looking for any excuse to jump into another war, antagonizing them whenever possible, fabricating stories, flase flag operations to destablize the region. You really think they will flinch at cutting a few com lines???? dude get real...
Click to expand...

What does the US have to gain from this incident?

Very little, sure they fear the new exchange but you can't just keep cutting cables. At best you buy yourself a few more months then the cables will have to come back on line and with it the oil exchange. Invasion? The US army is stretched thin as it is and IMO even with out Iraq and Afghanistan the US still doesn't have what it take to take down Iran all things considered as they have much better army then Iraq etc.

But someone is getting something out of this, I just don't know who and what.
 
all i can say is thank god i fully covered my house inside and out with tin foil...of course the microwave sucks now but you gotta do what it takes to keep tom cruise from saving you... now if you will excuse me.. i have to send a message to my trained killer dolphins with lasers on thiers heads via gps controlled pigeons and ps2's left over from those used by third world countries in thier nuclear control centers....
 
Tim Wardlaw said:
This article could open up some other opinions...
http://news.zdnet.com/2100-9595_22-529826.html

This is from 2001. The technology could be here now to handle the volume of data.

Bloody NSA
Click to expand...

Oh they have the capability for sure! Have a look - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narus

NarusInsight focuses on two layers: number four, the transport layer, built on standards like TCP and UDP, the physical building blocks of Internet data traffic, and number seven, the application layer, built on standards like HTTP and FTP, which are dependent on the application using them, i.e. Internet Explorer, Kazaa, Skype, etc. NarusInsight monitors 10 billion bits per second at level four and 2500 million bits per second at level seven. For reference, a 256K DSL line equals 0.25 million bits per second (Mbit/s), and a normal modem around 0.05 Mbit/s. So a single NarusInsight machine can monitor traffic equal to the maximum capacity of around 39,000 DSL lines or 195,000 modems. In practical terms 10 Gbit/s equals the combined traffic of millions of broadband users, so the number of subscribers monitored by one installation is several millions. It can also perform semantic analysis of the same traffic as it is happening, in other words analyze the content, meaning, structure and significance of this entire traffic, as it is happening.
Click to expand...

Here's a story from the PBS show Frontline discussing it in detail in relation to the domestic NSA wiretaping program - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHDVNWf6lFA&feature=related

Couple the Narus device with the fact that the NSA has a good chance of knowing the numbers your favorite OS's random number generator creates, (all it takes is one TLS session initiation - such as logging into your online bank account), there are no secrets anymore.

Now I'm not saying that the US is involved in cutting undersea cables, but they certainly do have the ability to process the information. Fact is, if said data touches the US or any of it's allies, it already is being processed - so in that sense cutting cables is not necessary.

Not to sound like a conspiracy theorist or anything...but this crap is hard to deny. It really makes me feel ashamed as an American.
 
maybe somebody in iran keeps trying to download a really really big file and it keeps getting caught in the undersea cables and bursts them... not that I really know how these IT thingimabobs work ;)
 
1) Why no major media attention?
2) Why aren't more questions being asked?
3) Why aren't any really vague, bullshit, made up reasons being given as an excuse for the cuts?

I believe that the lines are being cut as a diversion while splices are added further down the line. If you tried to splice a line while service was running, you would most certainly draw attention. Cut the lines and blame something else to cover your tracks, well that may just work.

I smell one of two things happening. Something really bad. Or nothing at all.
 
Maybe its China?

Honestly this would not be in the US's best interest. As others pointed out the US Goverment is unable to keep anything secret whats makes you think they could keep this secret? It would spark a war that we are not ready for and lose all our allies in one stroke. it is really strange but I doubt the US is really behind it.
 
Tim Wardlaw said:
1) Why no major media attention?
2) Why aren't more questions being asked?
3) Why aren't any really vague, bullshit, made up reasons being given as an excuse for the cuts?

I believe that the lines are being cut as a diversion while splices are added further down the line. If you tried to splice a line while service was running, you would most certainly draw attention. Cut the lines and blame something else to cover your tracks, well that may just work.

I smell one of two things happening. Something really bad. Or nothing at all.
Click to expand...
Because frankly, nobody cares what happens in terms of the internet and middle eastern politics. It doesn't have enough shock value. It also would be a mere blip on the news. You'd probably miss it or not even care with all the storm damage and presidential delegate voting hullabaloo.
 
Rabid Badger said:
There are several stories about single cables being damaged in the past on CNN.com. But there is no mention at all when FIVE go down? I've got a seriously bad feeling about this.
Click to expand...

yes there is if you search internet cables on there site but it only says 3 not 5.
 
lolz teh internets are imploding!??! The matrix bots are cutting our cables and all our base are belong to them!
 
w1retap said:
<snip>You'd probably miss it or not even care with all the storm damage and presidential delegate voting hullabaloo.
Click to expand...

Not that I believe it, but the argument could be made that said hullabaloo would certainly ensure the (U.S.) media's attention was focused elsewhere, therefore making it the perfect time for such an operation to take place no matter who was behind it, right?

The storm was obviously a coincidence, but everyone in the world knew what was happening here yesterday.
 
Extremely weird. As much as I'm against the Bush administration, I don't think they'd be the ones to do it. I do hope there is at least some sanity left in his brain some where. It is his last year a good "f**k it" to end things? :D

Seriously, there is no way these have all been accidents. There is no way it's "pirates" (jokes aside, they still exist) doing this either. It could be used as a tactic there to build hate among the people as well. But if it was that then I think it would have been pretty clear and we'd have some news coverage of meaningful amounts.
 
Lol, some people here have tin foil for brains.

Let's see, we kick out the Taliban that was murdering people left and right for silly things like looking at someone wrong and we kick out a leader that was committing genocide against his own people and had two sons that were murdering and raping young female children and using really bad torture on people and we get called war criminals. LMAO, you people need to just stfu and go shoot yourself or something. It's this kind of stupidity that is causing the problems. Radical extremist nutjobs spewing BS.

Let them find the real people that did this and you conspiracy idiots just go home or something.
 
and the idiotic radical extremist that wants to blame a president for everything that happens in the world, you need to just shoot yourself too. Do the world a favor. It would be better off without you.
 
Cinge said:
Let them find the real people that did this and you conspiracy idiots just go home or something.
Click to expand...

Yeah, you just keep on watching your theatric Fox News Channel.

I bet you believe Lee Harvey Oswald killed JFK all by himself.
Just keep watching your brainwashing TV while the rest of us look for truth.

Idiot.

America would be better without people like you.
 
w1retap said:
Move out. ;)
Click to expand...

What's even more funny is it's coming from a guy named w1retap! :D:D

Seriously though, no I'm not moving - unless Hillary is elected! :p

I don't buy into conspiracies about cutting cables for the most part, especially with so much debate on the authenticity of the sources. But I am astonished at the willingness of the public to give up their privacy.
 
LeviathanZERO said:
Yeah, you just keep on watching your theatric Fox News Channel.

I bet you believe Lee Harvey Oswald killed JFK all by himself.
Just keep watching your brainwashing TV while the rest of us look for truth.

Idiot.

America would be better without people like you.
Click to expand...




What are you talking about? What he said about the Taliban and Saddam and his sons is completely true.

Unless, of course, you have an alternative theory as to how members of my family were killed in both Afghanistan and Iraq.
 
rayman2k2 said:
What are you talking about? What he said about the Taliban and Saddam and his sons is completely true.

Unless, of course, you have an alternative theory as to how members of my family were killed in both Afghanistan and Iraq.
Click to expand...

And what are YOU talking about?
I called him out on his unrelenting hate against "Conspiracy Theorists". I have no clue how you came up with that conclusion.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top