Fiber Network Questions

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HisShatness

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Oct 24, 2005
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I am setting up a new network with a hotel and I am exploring the idea of setting up a fiber backbone in a hotel.

My general idea is this:
Total of 600 data runs split between 4 floors.
On each floor have 3 48 port patch panels.
Terminate each port to a 48 port switch.
connect all 3 switches to a fiber hub that connects with a fiber hub on the floor below and replicate.
So I have fiber connecting floors and then rj45 to each drop.

I am not sure what kind of fiber hub/switch to get. The hotel doesnt need a lot of security on the customer level. Seperate network from management.

I also dont even know what the fiber port/cable are called.

Anyone offer a little help?
 
The issue you have there is that one floor's fiber fails the floors above have no connection.
 
I am not sure if the customer wants to pay for redundancy. Besides, if it fails they will have extras. Is there a similar way to do this that also has redundancy?

I am trying to get a name of a good product to buy that will give me a fiber connection on each floor. the fiber also has to integrate normal ethernet.
 
I would run each floor to the server room if possible. I always do two runs of fiber (as its quite easy for some idiot to over bend it and smash the stuff) The cost of re-running and the down time is not worth the mesing around.
 
Or daisy chain them (1st floor -> 2nd floor ->, 2nd -> 3rd, 3rd -> 4th) but also include a return run (last floor -> first). you'd have to have switches which run STP, or a similar loop-avoidance protocol, but it would give you some redundancy without the cost of running one fiber pull to each floor.
 
Jay_oasis said:
I would run each floor to the server room if possible. I always do two runs of fiber (as its quite easy for some idiot to over bend it and smash the stuff) The cost of re-running and the down time is not worth the mesing around.
Click to expand...

From the sounds of it, it looks like the OP is doing it that way already.
Although for each floor I'd recommend using stackable switches for easier management. Then connect to a fiber patch and have two sets of runs (second would be a backup) go straight to the server room.
 
I must have read it wrong... lol

i'll read it again.

If he is doing it as I said that I would say go with it. I have work on a 9 floor 250 room hotel and thats how we did it.
 
I was going to daisy chain, but the the problem was brought out that if one fiber hub goes bad, top floor goes out. Maybe run 2 fiber runs per floor to main server room. so 4>1, 3>1, 2>1, 1>1.

What is a stp?
Also, what piece of equiopment would you recommend for the fiber hub. It does not need to be managed. Im just installing infrastructure so the hotel can bring in their inhouse IT team to install their servers and POS

What kind of fiber cable?
what kind of corresponding switch?
 
If there is a seperate IT group you shuold be able to consult with them as to what kind of switches to get. as for patch paneling you can check out blackbox.com hubbell.com
 
if it were me i would want to run everything back to a central location, rather than daisy chaining it. perhaps this is just my personal preference, who knows! i'm also a fan of the hp procurve equipment. most of their switches either have the option of installing fibre modules or fibre gbics. when running the fibre have at least two runs installed.

then when it comes to the actual connectivity, you have a couple of options. either run multiple interfaces using some form of link aggregation which will give you twice the capacity when everythings fine and simply a reduced capacity should an interface fail, or run spanning tree so you have multiple links with a single path around the network utilising one of the active paths, but a redundant path should an interface fail.

the problem is, however, that as soon as you want to start looking into redundancy...it's not just the links you need to have redundant but the switching too... effectively creating a mesh of active/passive connectivity if you want to do things at layer-2 utilising spanning tree, or creating a mesh of active/active connectivity if you want to to do things at layer-3 utilising a dynamic routing protocol.

here your starting to introduce an amount of complexity and also a significant amount of expense too... so, i would be asking questions along the lines of whats the network actually going to be used for? and what sort of uptime/availability do you need?
 
You will want to run each swtich directly back to the main (core) switch. You will want 3 48 port switches on each floor in thier own (IDF), then you would want to run from each floor 3 fiber patch cable to the main (MDF) room where the core switch resides at.

Now the main question is, do you have the fiber, what is your budget like? Any reasoning of going wired in a facility where wireless can be accepted? Also, do you have the conduit room or even conduit between your floors to even think of fiber?
 
Ockie said:
You will want to run each swtich directly back to the main (core) switch. You will want 3 48 port switches on each floor in thier own (IDF), then you would want to run from each floor 3 fiber patch cable to the main (MDF) room where the core switch resides at.

Now the main question is, do you have the fiber, what is your budget like? Any reasoning of going wired in a facility where wireless can be accepted? Also, do you have the conduit room or even conduit between your floors to even think of fiber?
Click to expand...

I am also the elctrcian and this is a ground up project. All conduit needed will be installed. We have no communication with hotel IT team if any.

I was going to buy premade fiber in 100ft lengths. I just dont know what connector to buy since i have never installed fiber ( i just know what it looks like ).
What should I use for the core fiber switch?
Will the switch allow for an ethernet interface like the brand mentioned a few posts up?
 
i mean this with respect, but this has bad news written all over it...

you seriously need to get the i.t. guys involved asap...

i've worked in an environment where there was very poor communication between people doing buildings work (incl cabling) and then the i.t. guys who have to come along and put the active kit in... through no fault of the buildings guys and the i.t. guys i might add - it was the estates people doing the co-ordination who couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery! it was never pretty...and still isn't unfourtunately!

the hp procurve switches that i mentioned have the capability to have both ports for the local copper runs on each floor, and also ports for the interconnect fibre runs between each floor.

i hope i dont sound too negative, but i just find it really strange that if your the cabling guy they are also expecting you to put some of the active kit in too...

each to their own i suppose!
 
HisShatness said:
I am also the elctrcian and this is a ground up project. All conduit needed will be installed. We have no communication with hotel IT team if any.

I was going to buy premade fiber in 100ft lengths. I just dont know what connector to buy since i have never installed fiber ( i just know what it looks like ).
What should I use for the core fiber switch?
Will the switch allow for an ethernet interface like the brand mentioned a few posts up?
Click to expand...


You got a PM incoming.
 
HisShatness said:
I was going to buy premade fiber in 100ft lengths. I just dont know what connector to buy since i have never installed fiber ( i just know what it looks like ).
Click to expand...
Personally I wouldn't go with fiber if the distance is that short. Cat6 will work the same and will be cheaper and easier to deal with.
 
I know cat6 will be easy....I am trying to give them options which they will never use.

I dont know what will bottleneck first....the gb switch or the gb cable.

I am trying to hunt down the IT guys. We are bidding on this job and I was giving an add alternate to provide the distribution panels, patch panels and a fiber backbone in addition to the cable.
 
The fiber connectors will depend on what switches you use. there's LC (smaller connector, usually connects to SFP's [small form-factor gbics]) and there's SC (larger connector than LC, and a much wider gbic is required, usually on larger switches such as 4500's and such). At least those are the only two connectors i've ever worked with and seem to be the most common.

also, STP is Spanning Tree Protocol. it is used to prevent switching loops by designating a root bridge for each VLAN. each switch basically figures out where to block from learning MAC addresses so packets aren't constantly forwarded in a loop. these loops will literally bring your network to its knees.

as for what will bottleneck first, the cable itself won't really bottleneck afaik. the switch is what throttles how much goes through the cable. if you try to shove everything through a single link, it's still the switch/router on each end that determines if everything gets backed up or not.
 
great thanks. Let me put all this together. I will post with items I find. Thanks for eveyones help.
 
I'd lean towards a copper GigE solution myself....Easier to run the cables, easier to deploy and support due and cheaper due to the lack of the fiber modules. I'd guess that most of the switches are only going to support fiber or copper GigE, so unless the hotel is planning on sending phone, video/VOD or other content to those floors, GigE will suffice.

I also agree that running every floor back to a central point, rather than daisy-chaining them would be the option in my opinion. Heck you could choose a floor in the middle to aggregate, rather than the bottom floor if you feel the copper distance will be too great.
 
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