Feds: We Will Search Your Laptop At The Border

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Traveling any time soon? Taking your laptop with you? You’d better make sure everything on your laptop is on the up and up because the feds say they will search it. Not the conventional “is-this-thing-a-bomb” search, I mean an old fashioned file search.

Following in the wake of February's news that customs agents were seizing electronics and making copies of all the files on cell phones and laptop hard drives, a federal appeals court has ruled on the legality of such searches. The result: Yeah, customs can do whatever it wants to your computer when you come across the border, without a warrant, and without cause.
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no respect for us citizens 4th amendment? Big surprise they already infringe on our uninfringable right to keep and bear arms.
 
Solution - encrypt/password protect your goodies. Or run a linux distro w/no gui, throw them off completely.
 
Hmm. I'm usually for added security, but I object to this. I wonder what the complications are for trade secrets and such? Political motivations? etc.

I just don't see the value in these searches.
 
To some extent I can understand this. How easy is it to move accross the boarder with illegal documents? Not talking about about mp3 or movies, but stuff like the blueprints to make a nuclear bomb or some other information that can't be taken to some other country? As it stands now can't customs already search everything that you carry through? ie if you bring a large crate with you can't they open it to example the contents? If so then this really isn't any different. They are just finally getting to the point of realizing what is possible with current technology.

ryang, You are aware that some places outside the US won't allow you to come in with encrypted data correct? I remember years ago when a few places wouldn't let you use IE 6 because its encryption was too strong for them. A country will only allow you do use encryption that they themselves can break. So for us our web browser can use 256-bit cipher, in some places it is only 128-bit. If they restrict your web browser based on its encryption level, i'm pretty sure a machine full of encrypted files that you refuse to let them view will be a big red flag that keeps you from taking your machine with you.
 
Exavior said:
To some extent I can understand this. How easy is it to move accross the boarder with illegal documents? Not talking about about mp3 or movies, but stuff like the blueprints to make a nuclear bomb or some other information that can't be taken to some other country? As it stands now can't customs already search everything that you carry through? ie if you bring a large crate with you can't they open it to example the contents? If so then this really isn't any different. They are just finally getting to the point of realizing what is possible with current technology.

ryang, You are aware that some places outside the US won't allow you to come in with encrypted data correct? I remember years ago when a few places wouldn't let you use IE 6 because its encryption was too strong for them. A country will only allow you do use encryption that they themselves can break. So for us our web browser can use 256-bit cipher, in some places it is only 128-bit. If they restrict your web browser based on its encryption level, i'm pretty sure a machine full of encrypted files that you refuse to let them view will be a big red flag that keeps you from taking your machine with you.
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You are aware that anyone who carries "spy" intelligence will not be loading it on a laptop and walking through customs right? There are much better methods.
 
is this only on certain boarders? cuz honestly.....wth would mexico or canada do with nuclear info? :p just playin guys! no but i can understand this to some extent... for illegal documents yes but its only a matter of time till they start yanking you out the the car and puttin guns to you and your families heads for downloading...
 
if it was me, i think i'd put secret data on a 16gb memory card and load that into a pda or camera. much less likely to be found that way.
 
I love it.....years ago everyone was afraid of Communists.

Now they run our country. B-E-A utiful.
 
ryang said:
Solution - encrypt/password protect your goodies. Or run a linux distro w/no gui, throw them off completely.
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Ockie said:
You are aware that anyone who carries "spy" intelligence will not be loading it on a laptop and walking through customs right? There are much better methods.
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or have online storage.

dualblade said:
if it was me, i think i'd put secret data on a 16gb memory card and load that into a pda or camera. much less likely to be found that way.
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they search them 2
 
great, we've weeded out the "DEE DEE DEE" terrorists....now we just have to figure out a plan to keep the ones who aren't stupid enough to not store their sensitive data remotely, and we'll be all set.



morons
 
Make a partition just big enough to install linux on and have the system default to linux before travel. The odds of them having someone that knows how to use linux is slim to none. And you don't even have to use the linux install, so there would be nothing but the default programs and system files.
 
I can see this blowing up in the Custom's faces..

we already know that the people they hire to do these kinds of searches know less than squat (reference TSA)
now lets allow that person to 'plunder' through an executives clients info, and FUBAR it all up.
@#%^ hitting the fan ensues
 
zip up files, then rename *.zip to *.dat

I think something as simple at that would work.... and throw encrypt on it for good measure if you need to.

 
You guys are going at this all wrong. Like someone mentioned, why would a spy put stolen top secret docs on a laptop. If I was him, I would send it to my GMail account and then access from where I was going. Makes more sense than having to chance losing a laptop.
 
heh... had my laptop "dusted" crossing the border from canada to the states in march...

was a quick chemcial test for drug residue..

the guy after me had his camera dusted also.


not sure wtf they expect to find or are looking for in a file search.. Canadian customs asked me if I had any porn though... think the buggers wanted to copy it if I had any.
 
Exavior said:
To some extent I can understand this. How easy is it to move accross the boarder with illegal documents? Not talking about about mp3 or movies, but stuff like the blueprints to make a nuclear bomb or some other information that can't be taken to some other country? As it stands now can't customs already search everything that you carry through? ie if you bring a large crate with you can't they open it to example the contents? If so then this really isn't any different. They are just finally getting to the point of realizing what is possible with current technology.

ryang, You are aware that some places outside the US won't allow you to come in with encrypted data correct? I remember years ago when a few places wouldn't let you use IE 6 because its encryption was too strong for them. A country will only allow you do use encryption that they themselves can break. So for us our web browser can use 256-bit cipher, in some places it is only 128-bit. If they restrict your web browser based on its encryption level, i'm pretty sure a machine full of encrypted files that you refuse to let them view will be a big red flag that keeps you from taking your machine with you.
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Absolute Grade-A Bullshit. Now honestly, who will have "nuclear_bomb_schematics.jpg" on their computer? There's almost no way in hell Customs will be able to find anything illegal without opening each and every file. All this is going to do is harass the innocent.

I'm waiting for them to try and search someones laptop who has their medical records on it. HIPAA lawsuit FTW.
 
Guess I'll have to keep a spare hard drive with a bare install on it for when I travel abroad now, swap my regular drive in after board check. Its rediculously stupid and invasive.
 
Pogo said:
Guess I'll have to keep a spare hard drive with a bare install on it for when I travel abroad now, swap my regular drive in after board check. Its rediculously stupid and invasive.
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they will image that as well.

The best bet, and what my company is starting todo, is if someone if flying to the states for an extended period of time FedEx the HD across the day before flight
 
Exavior said:
To some extent I can understand this. How easy is it to move accross the boarder with illegal documents? Not talking about about mp3 or movies, but stuff like the blueprints to make a nuclear bomb or some other information that can't be taken to some other country? As it stands now can't customs already search everything that you carry through? ie if you bring a large crate with you can't they open it to example the contents? If so then this really isn't any different. They are just finally getting to the point of realizing what is possible with current technology.

ryang, You are aware that some places outside the US won't allow you to come in with encrypted data correct? I remember years ago when a few places wouldn't let you use IE 6 because its encryption was too strong for them. A country will only allow you do use encryption that they themselves can break. So for us our web browser can use 256-bit cipher, in some places it is only 128-bit. If they restrict your web browser based on its encryption level, i'm pretty sure a machine full of encrypted files that you refuse to let them view will be a big red flag that keeps you from taking your machine with you.
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Really? REALLY?!??! :rolleyes:

What stops you from encripting it at I dunno, say 8 megabit (yes, that is going to take you a while, but why not these are super top secret plans right?) with some custom software and then sending it accross the internet. Hell, just g-mail it.

The only people they are going to catch doing this is maybe some small time child porn idiots.

I'll make sure to leave 1,000s of 100% legal, 100% offensive files on my computer the next time I leave the country. Oooooo better yet, I'll just make sure I've got a virus on my computer. Now if it infects thier networks, it's not my problem. I'll make sure to warn them about it. (Like they'll listen)
 
I was watching an interesting piece on the news how more and more Chinese spies are stealing everything from small company secrets about how to make better software, all the way up to classified government military technology secrets.

Anyhow, this is pretty absurd. As we can see big government is getting bigger, and the people need to take back more of the power. They aren't going to find shit on laptops unless they know exactly what they're looking for and the person they single out doesn't have anything encrypted and obscurely renamed. It's only going to waste time and money, but hey, what's new.
 
I just see this as an opportunity to screw with security by naming horrible pictures (like "goat see") into names that would make them want to verify what it is.

Nothing would be quite as awesome as goat'ing the TSA, and getting away with it.
 
eeyrjmr said:
they will image that as well.

The best bet, and what my company is starting todo, is if someone if flying to the states for an extended period of time FedEx the HD across the day before flight
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are they gonna image ipods as well? what about other mp3 players? at the rate they're going, pretty soon my casio digital watch is going to get imaged. fuck this shitty corrupt country and their assinine policies
 
RE: "16GB memory card in your camera..."
ALL4AMD said:
they search them 2
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We can't really have security, it's foolish to pretend we can.

Searching w/o a warrant is blatantly unconstitutional, it's as clear as a slap in the face. :confused:

They couldn't possibly have the time/people/resources to search all electronic devices with data. Are they going to scan all credit cards (could be data on that strip)? Are they going to check all your music casset tapes to see if they have data hidden somewhere on them? I've got private pictures of my wife naked from our honeymoon, they have a legal right to look at those, just because I'm crossing the border? BULLSHIT!

It's easy to send an email with encryption that is simply impossible to break (even theoretically impossilbe) - you simply can't "crack" one time pad X-OR encryption, that renders border searching pointless - except - to have a tool to selectively choose to prosecute whoever you want because almost everyone is going to have SOMETHING illegal on their computer whether they know it or not, even if it's not a file that they got themselves by choice. When you download files you don't always know what you're getting until after you've got it.

What if you've got MP3s, what if I've ripped my own CDs to my laptop, the RIAA tries to claim that we don't have a legal right to do that, if I'm going accross the border now I'm suddenly forced to clear that music off for fear that I might be prosecuted because some asshole RIAA lobbyist has finally bribed some congressmen enough to get them to start prosecuting all the people's files that had MP3s over the past 2 years worth of searches (I'm talking about what might happen a couple years from now).

This reminds me about the guy that dropped his iPod in the toilet while the plane was in Canada, remember that? Suddenly he's treated like some terrble criminal, and the police take this "out to get him" attitude, warning him "you better not have any illegal files on this laptop 'cause I'm gonna find them".

It's not uncommon to just download a whole news group, look through the articles/pictures/whatever at your leisure, then delete what you don't want when you're done. Newsgroups have all kinds of illegal content dispersed in various places, you could have downloaded a group called "Cougar Creampies" and find some foreign underage porn spam, so you put it in the recycle bin...

If you don't have some kind of "file shredder" then you could end up being arrested, even convicted all for having a file that you didn't even want to have, and didn't get on purpose, and as soon as you saw it you thought "oh shit, I don't want that crap".

It seems like there's some kind of whole witch hunt attitude where everone wants to prove that they're better than someone else because the someone else is "scum" for something or other that they've done. You take most of these cops who are scanning these laptops, look at THEIR private lives, I'll bet you'll find some imperfections, some dirty little secrets they don't want exposed. Humans are not perfect, we're all flawed, we deserve a little dignity and privacy, and to have those rights not violated without due process and probable cause.

How many people are going to be arrested because of files that they didn't know were there on a used laptop they bought? If that happened to me, I would have a personal vendetta against whoever came up with this dumbshit idea to search the private contents of computer files.
 
w1retap said:
^--feel free to move out
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People that say that really make my blood boil, as if they're better, like this is somehow more their country. I won't say the first dozen things I wanted to say, because that would be flaming.

Patriotism is to fight to protect the Freedom and Liberty that our forefathers fought and died to win. Not to buy into corrupt politician's propaganada. :rolleyes:
 
I think I'm talking Chinese I think I'm talking Chinese I really think so...
 
Pogo said:
are they gonna image ipods as well? what about other mp3 players? at the rate they're going, pretty soon my casio digital watch is going to get imaged. fuck this shitty corrupt country and their assinine policies
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So how long till the RIAA demands to see peoples files to see if they have violated thier copy rights. That would almost be smart, so the RIAA instead will sue the goverment for having billions of imaged MP3s on thier network!
 
Oh - sorry w1retap, I agree with your other comments, this topic as a whole just had be too upset and I replied to your post too hastily.

Though, I think the person you replied to with the "feel free to move out" comment shouldn't be judged to hastily - I think it's excusable to say something like that when you're in a fit of rage, which, we all SHOULD be when we read something like this.
 
Welcome to the rest of the world that has to also put up with erroded freedoms due to terrorist fud. Thank you very much.

I mean when things like this happen:

http://www.abc.net.au/worldtoday/content/2007/s2004540.htm

One just has to love the fanatical devotion to fud that causes a whole freaking airport to effectivly shut down due to just one thing out of whack. Great systems we have against terror on our domestic flights. :D
 
im going to put a 1tb zip file full of rick astly videos in my 1tb hitachi next time i travel lol
 
Actually we already have nuclear capabilities up here in Canada.
Anybody who's dumb enough to carry sensitive data, porn, illegal MP3's or whatever across a border into another country deserves whatever punishment is doled out. Whats legal in one country may not be legal elsewhere. Plus the idea of carrying any type of sensitive data on any portable device goes beyond stupidity. If your the accountant carrying mine and thousands of other peoples credit information on your laptop and it's stolen then there's only one word to describe the outcome for you, maybe two, slow death.
 
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