Nemesis999
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EU Probes Microsoft Again
- Thread starter HardOCP News
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I take it you can prove all those system's rely on a Microsoft Operating system newert then Win2000 then?
and also *cough* *NIX *cough*
L33t Masta
Gawd
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Please note how I said PROPER operating system. Not pile of trash. Thus Linux is out. And I'm pretty suure the majority of buisnesses rely on Windows foor their schheduling programs, accounting, server and shared storage, vpn networks, and everything else.
Actually, I'd bet most automated systems that you described are controlled by PLCs.
L33t Masta
Gawd
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I would assume seeing what my city uses that it's all a windows program that controls the lighting and manages the utilities. The EU would revert to a pre-industrial era state without Microsoft. They made everything possible with their revolutionary software and what does the EU do? Shows it's ungrateful by launching another probe on something Microsoft didn't do only to try and milk money.
Which city is "your" city? Which applications specifically do you run to control every aspect?
Why do you run Windows when a simple, much cheaper, PLC would do a better job?
No wonder half of the cities havve a budget problem. Idiots are running them.
Nemesis999
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I suppose "your" city would use Windows, because you're a fucking idiot. Go away, no one here cares for you blatantly ignorant verbal diarrhea. Judging by behavior you're probably 14 years old thinking you're hot shit because you just figured out how to overclock your PC and have decided that it makes you an expert on all things computers. Your stunning lack of knowledge would also seem to indicate a sub-par IQ, but, really, I think we all knew that from you name.
Maybe he's playing SimCity?
I realize the EU doesn't represent the majority over there. However, what does it take for someone to have the EU probe someone else, or a corporation? Who decides that Intel, MS, etc. need "investigated"?
aShrubbery!
[H]ard|Gawd
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And if MS is not pulling out of the EU market, then MS is clearly in the wrong.
But people here - especially the corporate loyalists out here - know more than MS HQs.
This is why they are staying there, despite all adminitions to leave the EU as a market.
If I have learnt anything about MS, is that they're not in the EU out of charity.
I would love to see MS retrieve all their products in the EU. Talk about a boost for opensource, in an market of over 500 million people.
Linux is trash? Wait until all the R&D for Linux comes out of necessity. Clearly, not the ideal capitalistic model, but I am sure they would want to reap the benefits of their investments somehow. To dismiss an OS like Linux is foolish, simply because MS has been here longer and has a bigger footprint and marketshare. The problem with Linux is that its potential is hardly being tapped into. It's not the popular choice. Is it the worse choice, however? No, not really. IF Linux was just as popular a gaming OS as Windows is, I would go Linux in a heartbeat. And so would many more people. This would cause more money and time to be invested in Linux from developers. And not just in the gaming sector, but also in the utilities and medical field, automotive, industrial. You name it.
What Linux needs is funding and a market. Which would be provided IF MS decided to leave the EU market.
All here would say that competition is good for the consumer, in the case of MS, there is no competition. Where is the alternative to Windows XP ( the best thing MS has ever come up with, which I use btw and am pretty happy with), and to VISTA (I hear many people went back to XP)?
There simply is no competition in the OS market. Some will say, there is no need for it.
In that case those who did just advocates the monopolistic rule of a corporation to dictate their rules and not the rules of the consumer.
I for one would love companies to vie for my business when it comes to OS. Some will say, it's ridiculous when you have MS.
I read, things like, AMD and ATI is good for consumers, because they keep - or kept, as they've been lagging quite a bit lately - INTEL and NVIDIA in check. I have yet to hear people, ATI and AMD are useless.
I for one wished that a company that has business within a certain territory should ABIDE BY THE LAWS OF THE LAND. It's hard to lobby in the EU, US style. They call it bribery over there. Not that it doesn't happen, but they don't try to dress it up and present it as something it's not; to petition politicians to defend a cause.
And the irony is that certain US companies that decide to file a suit in the EU to have their interest defended, and then the EU gets the flack by the 'wrapped in a flag' techies for investigating the matter.
To imagine for one second that a EU based company would not be under scrutiny for less than 1/2 of what MS has done, is either a sign of bigotry, arrogance or sheer ignorance.
But some will decide to wrap themselves in the flag, making the assuming that an attack on MS equals an attack on the US.
Is the probe justified? That is what they are investigating. If you have committed no crime, you should not fear being investigated. After all, companies should be scrutinized. Innocent until proven guilty, is the motto. But some here fear for MS. Like MS need them to feel for them.
MS doesn't care if you're having concerns about their OS. All they want you to do is buy them. If patches are needed, you will get them when MS decides to provide you with them.
Not a second earlier.
So, I think why MS is not leaving the EU market, and won't anytime soon. Their business model made them dependent on businesses and people to fleece with their inflated prices and licencing models. Not to say people shouldn't pay for MS products, but people pay what MS dictates, not what their products are worth. Also, their absence from the US market would bring a dreaded boost to Linux, which would fill the void MS left.
You have a saying in the US ' When you leave, don't let the door hit you in the back' (PC version).
But people here - especially the corporate loyalists out here - know more than MS HQs.
This is why they are staying there, despite all adminitions to leave the EU as a market.
If I have learnt anything about MS, is that they're not in the EU out of charity.
I would love to see MS retrieve all their products in the EU. Talk about a boost for opensource, in an market of over 500 million people.
Linux is trash? Wait until all the R&D for Linux comes out of necessity. Clearly, not the ideal capitalistic model, but I am sure they would want to reap the benefits of their investments somehow. To dismiss an OS like Linux is foolish, simply because MS has been here longer and has a bigger footprint and marketshare. The problem with Linux is that its potential is hardly being tapped into. It's not the popular choice. Is it the worse choice, however? No, not really. IF Linux was just as popular a gaming OS as Windows is, I would go Linux in a heartbeat. And so would many more people. This would cause more money and time to be invested in Linux from developers. And not just in the gaming sector, but also in the utilities and medical field, automotive, industrial. You name it.
What Linux needs is funding and a market. Which would be provided IF MS decided to leave the EU market.
All here would say that competition is good for the consumer, in the case of MS, there is no competition. Where is the alternative to Windows XP ( the best thing MS has ever come up with, which I use btw and am pretty happy with), and to VISTA (I hear many people went back to XP)?
There simply is no competition in the OS market. Some will say, there is no need for it.
In that case those who did just advocates the monopolistic rule of a corporation to dictate their rules and not the rules of the consumer.
I for one would love companies to vie for my business when it comes to OS. Some will say, it's ridiculous when you have MS.
I read, things like, AMD and ATI is good for consumers, because they keep - or kept, as they've been lagging quite a bit lately - INTEL and NVIDIA in check. I have yet to hear people, ATI and AMD are useless.
I for one wished that a company that has business within a certain territory should ABIDE BY THE LAWS OF THE LAND. It's hard to lobby in the EU, US style. They call it bribery over there. Not that it doesn't happen, but they don't try to dress it up and present it as something it's not; to petition politicians to defend a cause.
And the irony is that certain US companies that decide to file a suit in the EU to have their interest defended, and then the EU gets the flack by the 'wrapped in a flag' techies for investigating the matter.
To imagine for one second that a EU based company would not be under scrutiny for less than 1/2 of what MS has done, is either a sign of bigotry, arrogance or sheer ignorance.
But some will decide to wrap themselves in the flag, making the assuming that an attack on MS equals an attack on the US.
Is the probe justified? That is what they are investigating. If you have committed no crime, you should not fear being investigated. After all, companies should be scrutinized. Innocent until proven guilty, is the motto. But some here fear for MS. Like MS need them to feel for them.
MS doesn't care if you're having concerns about their OS. All they want you to do is buy them. If patches are needed, you will get them when MS decides to provide you with them.
Not a second earlier.
So, I think why MS is not leaving the EU market, and won't anytime soon. Their business model made them dependent on businesses and people to fleece with their inflated prices and licencing models. Not to say people shouldn't pay for MS products, but people pay what MS dictates, not what their products are worth. Also, their absence from the US market would bring a dreaded boost to Linux, which would fill the void MS left.
You have a saying in the US ' When you leave, don't let the door hit you in the back' (PC version).
Nemesis999
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MS isn't, and will never, leave the market for the simple reason that their monopoly produces massive profits. If MS tried to pull out of the EU, Apple would just release a standalone version of OSX that can be installed anywhere. MS's market share would drop to the 50% range and they'd have to lower prices to be competitive. Suddenly those ten billion dollar profit margins are one billion.
Market share is so important to MS that they allow pirated copies to download patches to keep them from going to the competition. Of the tens of thousands of known mass distributed pirate CD keys, MS only blocks a few from downloading.
Anyone that thinks that MS should pull out of ANY market is flat out ignorant.
L33t Masta
Gawd
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Well aren't you polite. let me just report your flaming...and done. Now anyway, I'm actually 19 and I live in Alberta, Canada. And I know for a fact that the city I live in (No you won't get a name) runs Windows for their traffic software and the accounting for the ENTIRE CITY is done on windows. I asked the guy who came to repair the water main when it broke what they use to track possible problems and keep everything running smoothly and he said "We use a program custom made that runs on the windows computers and laptops we have back in the offices and down at the filter station". All the computers in City Hall have Windows on them. The hospital uses a windows based program and database to track patients and their server is a Windows 2003 server. I take an active approach to being a part of my city so I know these things. I'm also 19, I've overclocked MANY computers and KNOW I am hot shit simply because I actually AM hot shit. My expertise comes from using the Microsoft based programs all the way back to DOS 5.0 and coding applications into the BASIC editor that came standard on those computers. I also liked to play Rogue. That game was bitching.
L.O.L.Well aren't you polite. let me just report your flaming...and done. Now anyway, I'm actually 19 and I live in Alberta, Canada. And I know for a fact that the city I live in (No you won't get a name) runs Windows for their traffic software and the accounting for the ENTIRE CITY is done on windows. I asked the guy who came to repair the water main when it broke what they use to track possible problems and keep everything running smoothly and he said "We use a program custom made that runs on the windows computers and laptops we have back in the offices and down at the filter station". All the computers in City Hall have Windows on them. The hospital uses a windows based program and database to track patients and their server is a Windows 2003 server. I take an active approach to being a part of my city so I know these things. I'm also 19, I've overclocked MANY computers and KNOW I am hot shit simply because I actually AM hot shit. My expertise comes from using the Microsoft based programs all the way back to DOS 5.0 and coding applications into the BASIC editor that came standard on those computers. I also liked to play Rogue. That game was bitching.
L33t Masta
Gawd
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Now this reply has me perplexed. "LOL at me actually owning him or "lol" at me actually answering him or "lol" at what?Nemesis999
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I think it was more of "LOL", you're actually as mentally diminished and deluded as we all suspected.
L33t Masta
Gawd
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Nemesis999
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Mhmm. Grow up, kid.
L33t Masta
Gawd
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Nemesis999
This message is hidden because Nemesis999 is on your ignore list.
What's that? I can't hear you over the ignore feature of the forums.
This message is hidden because Nemesis999 is on your ignore list.
What's that? I can't hear you over the ignore feature of the forums.
Must be nice in yr world
L33t Masta
Gawd
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90% of the worlds software runs on Windows. Without Windows what would happen right now? CHAOS WOULD ENSUE!
I take it you have proof for that statement that 90% of the worlds software runs on windows?
Have you been across to sourceforge recently and seen the number of projects for software, most of which don't run on windoes?
Chaos wouldn't happen. Go check out netcraft and see what Operating systems actually runs the web. Even Microsoft's Hotmail runs on BSD cause their OS cannot handle the load
IF MS sent out their killswitch now I would still be on the internet and so would my work and so would alot of work places.
Those places that wern't would very quickly have linux installed or new apples (budget depenent). IF and when that happens I would in an instant leave my job as an engineer and make a shad load of money setting up linux systems for companies. Don't underestimate how far linux is within corporate world...
Sure the desktop might be MS's, but the server market most certainly isn't
L33t Masta
Gawd
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Forget sourceforge. How many of those apps are actually useful towards modern living? And the 90% figure is common sense. People don't develop GOOD applications for Linux and Mac. Entire cities would be without utilities, business people unable to access email and internet, and millions of people would be without internet access. Hospitals would be dead in the water, millions of deaths due to traffic casualties and hospital fuck-ups. We are very much dependant on Windows right now and if you can't see that you must be blind.
*sigh* What are you? 14?
Traffic lights do NOT run on Windows.. They are stand-alone systems controlled at most by a 16bit Zelog processor (at least in EU)
Medical equipment are all non-OS, backend servers are all *NIX based.
Ppl don't develop good applications for Linux/Mac
Man you are either a pathetic troll or a really nieve kid
Ever heard of Apache, Ever heard of Python, Ever heard PHP, Ever heard of MySQL... gosh it isn't like the actual internet runs on them at all...
Please stay inside you world, it is probably better for yr stability cause I would hate to think what you may do to yrself emo-boy when you suddenly realise all that you belieive are lies
YES things would be bad if MS pulled the plug BUT things would continue on very quickly (it would be more of the initial shock...) why do you think there is an increase in transfering backend servers to linux going on in Europe?
Desk terminals can easily be replaced and for a couple of days they can be down... backend servers, servers dealing with commerce however are different
again Netcraft if you don't beleive me
Also, just because MS would pull out of a market, doesn't mean they'd send a mass format command to every device running MS software.
On top of that, I did a QUICK google search. Public utilities in the western world do not RELY on windows for their operation. Sure, the guy putting in the helpdesk ticket saying something's broke may be running it, but as far as the controller, sorry, no dice, not windows.
If you can proof of anything you've said, please post it, I would like to see it. Especially since I'm in the business you're talking about.
lol look who's being the naive one.
Eeyjmr, you're full of yourself and you know it. Linux is not ready for the mainstream no matter how much you wish it so. And knock it off with the "boy you must be xx years old". It's fucking childish.
Maybe Apple is ready to take Window's place on the desktop if Microsoft ever vanished off the face of the earth (God forbid), but not Linux.
interesting... in what you quited of me, did I state Linux to replace those terminals... I think not
and btw yes linux is ready for the desktop and mainstream
L33t Masta
Gawd
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Do I have to point you to the post I made for Nemisis before I ignored him?
L33t Masta
Gawd
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I think you missed an extra "money" before the high pitched "MONEY!".
Uh, no he hasn't.
However, I believe you did miss my previous post, and didn't address anything I brought up in it. Care to now?
L33t Masta
Gawd
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Howam I going to get proof of how my city works?
"Hey guys, can I take pictures of your computer screens to post online? Just leave all that important information up. It's no bother."
And Google is ALWAYS right.
no such version exists
Actually the Version of Windows was the one with no Media Player
"Windows XP Professional N", as above, but without a default installation of Windows Media Player, as mandated by a European Union ruling
And yes it sold next to zero copies, in fact most shops in europe won't even carry it in the store as no one wants it.
I know that, but if you backread you will see it was IE that was mentioned that was stripped NOT WMP
Note the explicit mention of IE. Had he stated WindowsMediaPlayer I would not of posted, but since as usual FUD is being spread I have to correct.
And yet again I correct you
Prove these claimsHowam I going to get proof of how my city works?
"Hey guys, can I take pictures of your computer screens to post online? Just leave all that important information up. It's no bother."
And Google is ALWAYS right.
1) ANY city *requires* MS to run properly, in any fashion.
2) That TV and the internet would not work without MS
3) I'd like to see some of these apps that you coded in BASIC.
4) How MS simply halting sales in any market would cause millions of deaths, and cities to stop functioning.
Also, proof isn't something that you SAY. It has to be something that you can back up with fact.
This is dumb.. arguing that ie shouldnt be bundled with windows.. umm outlook express, windows messenger, notepad, remote desktop, freecell.. should none of that be bundled too because other companies make similar software packages?!
zomg nobody will buy crysis cuz microsoft bundled freecell. Give me a break, if your product is superior, that's the reason people should and will buy it.
zomg nobody will buy crysis cuz microsoft bundled freecell. Give me a break, if your product is superior, that's the reason people should and will buy it.
QFT. I find it highly funny how some people are so free to shout "but if MS has it free in their OS, why would people buy other software?" while Linux is free, and people STILL pay hundreds for Microsoft's OS.
Simply, if you don't like Microsoft, don't use their product. That's all there is to it.
Here is an idea, how about actually reading
1) the original artical
2) the whole thread
Opera have logged a complaint with the EU with regards to IE non-compliance to the web spec
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thread closed due to overwhelming asshatedness
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