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Efficient PSU

H

Hito Bahadur

[H]ard|DCer of the Month - December 2006
Joined
Jul 8, 2004
Messages
3,169
Guys,

Anyone have info on high efficiency PSUs? I'm thinking this is one of the ways to cut down on the cost of folding. So far I am looking at Seasonic.

Based on their literature: Seasonic PDF

I would think that you could knock 20-30 dollars off the electricty bill, not to mention the savings in your cooling bill by putting out less heat.

Edit for additional information.
 
Since our folding b0xen run at full load all of the time, I wonder if the ROI (return on investment) would take several years to save what little electricity that the new power supply would gain. The fan maybe a little quieter, again though running at full load all of the time it may not reduce the noise much.

Just a couple of thoughts on a slow Friday.

Fold On!!!
 
HoosierDad said:
Since our folding b0xen run at full load all of the time, I wonder if the ROI (return on investment) would take several years to save what little electricity that the new power supply would gain. The fan maybe a little quieter, again though running at full load all of the time it may not reduce the noise much.

Just a couple of thoughts on a slow Friday.

Fold On!!!
Click to expand...

Actually I was thinking that because they fold 24/7 the ROI would be quicker. Here are some quick numbers:

Figure 200 watt pull from the system.

Standard PSU
Average 68% efficiency
Waste Power (heat) = 32%x200watt = 64 watts

Seasonic
Around 75% efficiency
Waste Power = 25%x200watt = 50 watts

Delta = 64 - 50 = 14 watts

14w x 24 hour x 365 day = 122640wh x 1kwh/1000wh = 122.64kwh

Cost savings per year = $0.11*122.64kwh = $13.49/yr

Cost of standard PSU (~350w) = $19.99 (sale for Chieftec 360w PSU at Directron)
Cost of Seasonic PSU (350w) = $59.99 (Seasonic 350w PSU at Directron)

Delta = $30

ROI = $30/$13.49/yr = 2yr 82 days


I would say that that is not bad, especially when you factor in other factors like air conditioning savings, lower noise, longer parts life due to smoother power.

Comments?

Note: I'm being conservative with the Seasonic efficiency numbers due to 80% being the peak efficiency (i.e. at 350w). I don't have figures on the Chieftec PSU and it probably has a lower than 68% efficiency at that power draw.


 
What the manufacurer forgets to tell you is that their super power factor correction is already done by the electrical company.

I also doubt the claims of 80% efficiency, unless they have some sort of perfect transformer. There is too much flux leakage in any transformer small enough to fit into a PC standard form factor PSU.

Go with someone that's cheap but reliable, and doesn't bald-faced-lie to you about the product. Fortron is a good idea.
 
mwarps said:
What the manufacurer forgets to tell you is that their super power factor correction is already done by the electrical company.

I also doubt the claims of 80% efficiency, unless they have some sort of perfect transformer. There is too much flux leakage in any transformer small enough to fit into a PC standard form factor PSU.

Go with someone that's cheap but reliable, and doesn't bald-faced-lie to you about the product. Fortron is a good idea.
Click to expand...

Have you seen the problem Tom's was having with their Fortron PSUs in their stress test of the AMD and Intel systems?
 
I read a review of the fanless Antec psu at Silent Pc and it was really really efficient.

MN Scout


 
MN Scout said:
I read a review of the fanless Antec psu at Silent Pc and it was really really efficient.

MN Scout


Click to expand...

I also think it is pretty expensive.

Maybe Ice Czar would be a good person to ask...or computerpro3.
 
Hito Bahadur said:
Have you seen the problem Tom's was having with their Fortron PSUs in their stress test of the AMD and Intel systems?
Click to expand...

I haven't read Tom's in almost two years, so no. Others in this forum have had good luck with Fortron, and it's in the recommended list in the PSU forum as a good budget part. I take anything Tom has to say with about a tablespoon of salt.
 
mwarps said:
I haven't read Tom's in almost two years, so no. Others in this forum have had good luck with Fortron, and it's in the recommended list in the PSU forum as a good budget part. I take anything Tom has to say with about a tablespoon of salt.
Click to expand...

So do I, but if a PSU fails it fails.
 
Spectre said:
Don't buy an ultra ;)
Click to expand...
What about for people with bigger gardens... Do you think that some sort of main (huge) PS that is wired to each one of the boxen will have a higher overall efficency? I think this would only work for naked boxen, though, and i haven't looked into it, the thought only struck me while reading this thread. Just something to think about. I don't even know if they make anything like what i'm describing. If they did, it would probably be expensive as hell, though.
 
DatHak512 said:
What about for people with bigger gardens... Do you think that some sort of main (huge) PS that is wired to each one of the boxen will have a higher overall efficency? I think this would only work for naked boxen, though, and i haven't looked into it, the thought only struck me while reading this thread. Just something to think about. I don't even know if they make anything like what i'm describing. If they did, it would probably be expensive as hell, though.
Click to expand...

I don't know many psu's that are going to have 2 20pin or 2 24pin......I can look though.
 
It would be good for a cluster, but you would have to custom wire the things..... or you could create a power rail. It would be interesting.
 
Yeah, i'd do a little googling right now, and try to run some numbers like you did to see if it was worth it, but i'm trying to quickly do my homework before my 2:15 class ;). I will look though after class if no one has already.
 
Ok I think I found a supermicro PSU with 2 20pin's. I may need to look at server PSU's to find these.
 
Spectre said:
Ok I think I found a supermicro PSU with 2 20pin's. I may need to look at server PSU's to find these.
Click to expand...
I was thinking more like a massivly hi amparage AC->DC (That's Direct Current, not Distributed Computing :p :D) power supply, that you could hook up to a power bus? I just finished my reading, so i'll be on Google if anyone needs me. : )
 
DatHak512 said:
This looked kinda intresting. That's all i can come up with for now...
Click to expand...

Beyond my brain. I was thinking a server type PSU with a modded 12v rail.....
 
All that link was, was just a list of power sources, and since a lot of computers would require a lot of amps, i was looking at the <=1000W DC Power Supply near the middle of the page there. But that was something that would have to be custom made (read: expensive) so i think that's a no-go. And anyway, say a newer, diskless b0xen eats 200 watts minimum, that's only five boxes for every power source. Not that great of a solution, in my oppinion, unless the price turns out to be only a few hundred over a normal PSU. In any case, you would need heavy-gauge wire for something moving that many watts at a 12v maximum. I wonder, if you bought a 2-way server PSU like you were talking about, could you split that into feeds for 3 or 4 b0xen? Maybe that's not such a smart idea. Come to think of it, don't PSUs generally decrease in efficiently as their load increases?
 
DatHak512 said:
All that link was, was just a list of power sources, and since a lot of computers would require a lot of amps, i was looking at the <=1000W DC Power Supply near the middle of the page there. But that was something that would have to be custom made (read: expensive) so i think that's a no-go. And anyway, say a newer, diskless b0xen eats 200 watts minimum, that's only five boxes for every power source. Not that great of a solution, in my oppinion, unless the price turns out to be only a few hundred over a normal PSU. In any case, you would need heavy-gauge wire for something moving that many watts at a 12v maximum. I wonder, if you bought a 2-way server PSU like you were talking about, could you split that into feeds for 3 or 4 b0xen? Maybe that's not such a smart idea. Come to think of it, don't PSUs generally decrease in efficiently as their load increases?
Click to expand...

No they increase in efficiency. Max efficiency is at ~100% load. A reason not to oversize your PSU.
 
1 500w PSU could probably run 2 folding boxes. I'm going to have figure out the loads. Of course, 500w PSU's are more expensive that 300w PSUs, so..... it may be a no brainer.
 
Hito Bahadur said:
1 500w PSU could probably run 2 folding boxes. I'm going to have figure out the loads. Of course, 500w PSU's are more expensive that 300w PSUs, so..... it may be a no brainer.
Click to expand...

Yeah but you are going to run into the problem of needing 2 20pin connectors I think.
 
Spectre said:
Yeah but you are going to run into the problem of needing 2 20pin connectors I think.
Click to expand...
Could you just splice them manually? You'ld obviously need to buy the 20pin connector seperatly, but i think as long as you've got access to wirecutters+crimpers, or a soldering iron+heatshrink, you'ld be fine.
 
DatHak512 said:
Could you just splice them manually? You'ld obviously need to buy the 20pin connector seperatly, but i think as long as you've got access to wirecutters+crimpers, or a soldering iron+heatshrink, you'ld be fine.
Click to expand...

yes, I think you could. You could do it at the PSU, probably just get a 20 pin harness from a broken power supply.
 
DatHak512 said:
Could you just splice them manually? You'ld obviously need to buy the 20pin connector seperatly, but i think as long as you've got access to wirecutters+crimpers, or a soldering iron+heatshrink, you'ld be fine.
Click to expand...

Ok but both mobo's are going to require a 12v rail IIRC.....that means an atx2.0 PSU. They are going to be a little pricey....although that supermicro I found was a fortune :(
 
I say on some guys farm he was running ~12 motherboards off one AC/DC power converter. Basically a big box which put out 12vdc and 5vdc @ however many amps you want is what he was doing. I forget where I saw that at.

I wish you the best of link with these. One thing I've found with electrical things is certian laws apply. Ohms law and all the others. I run into these mess all the time in high end audio. Basically at the end of the day you can only fit 5 pounds of poop in a 5 pound dog, no matter how you slice it.

Many of these products claim to break the laws of physics, and that is just not going to happen. Unless your at my house then it's all fair game.... :)
 
Hito Bahadur said:
I guess we are almost talking about a poor man's blade server.
Click to expand...
Yeah....according to Ice Czar it should be possible to mod an atx2.0 PSU that to run two boxen since they have two 12v rails. So just need to get the scratch together to get one nad try it. Over time this might work well since the price on them will come down.
 
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