e4300 making me dislike intel

waltherone

Gawd
Joined
Aug 12, 2003
Messages
589
Heh, got this e4300 deal from fry's right?

Ok so I put it in my P5B deluxe board that I had, and the thing will never post anything over 360fsb basically. I figure meh, no wonder this board was an open box item at newegg.

So I order a DS3, I put it in today (with an HR05 on the northbridge, with an 80mm fan attached to it) and get to moving, but it's doing the same thing. Except slightly worse. The DS3 won't post at the 355mhz fsb I had the chip running on on the p5b deluxe. Won't post at 400, 401, etc. about 333mhz is the best I've gotten so far.

But what it does is weird, rather than just giving me a screen with no video (what I think of as the TRADITIONAL no post screen) the thing will just restart itself over and over. I put it at 355mhz, save and exit bios, and the thing will restart, never get a bios beep, then shut down the system. All is silent for about 3 seconds then it hums back to life, no bios beep, then shuts off. 3 seconds later, repeat. Repeat, repeat, repeat. Only way to get back to the bios is to reset cmos.

Now, in all my overclocking history, any time I was trying to boot with way too high a fsb for a chip's limits, the machine would still POST, it would just crash while loading, or in windows, running prime, whatever. But whenever they won't POST I've always chalked that up to the board not being able to handle the speeds.

So what gives?? What's with the repeated restarts with no post on any of them?

And, 3ghz seems about the best this damn e4300 wants to do for me, you guys think its the chip that's the problem?

I don't have any other chips to try with it really. The P5B ran fine with the pentium D that was in it before (middle machine in sig). 24/7 100% load (folding at home) on both cores and never a hickup. Granted, that was considerably lower FSB speeds, which is why I figured I had a board that couldn't handle the high speeds due to defect. But two boards in a row? Beginning to think it's the chip...
 
You're complaining about a 66% OC. Quitcherbitchin' and be patient. :p

I suspect e4300's are going to be very BIOS-limited for a while, because I've already seen someone with a BadAxe hit a wall at 266FSB- it worked fine up to 265, though, so I think the board flakes when it tries to change the strap. That of course presumes that Intel didn't cripple these intentionally, so the e4's wouldn't cannibalize sales of the e6's.
 
Heh, yeah I know, "be happy with any overclock" but I bought a whole new board for this damn thing, now I'm just angry with it.

Gonna probly be returning it methinks, and replacing it with a REAL core 2 :p

EDIT: Also it's not just the less than stellar overclock I'm referring to. I knocked the cpu multiplier down to 6x and put it at 400fsb, still no post, still the same problems.

Starting to think the chip just doesn't allow the number 400 :p
 
You bumped up the VTT?

Read the second part of what I posted above. BadAxe has trouble above 266, your GB isn't going over 333. It does sound like a BIOS handicap, or worse.
 
drop multi to 7 or 8 and see what you can do. upper 300's tends to be rocky, although it shouldn't be as bad as your're finding. perhaps ds3 is undervolting a bit more than the other board. try setting vcore to 1.4v if on stock cooler or 1.45v with a better aftermarket and see what happens.

edit: also, with the ds3, leave vmch on normal. it'll scale it automatically for you
 
drop multi to 7 or 8 and see what you can do. upper 300's tends to be rocky, although it shouldn't be as bad as your're finding. perhaps ds3 is undervolting a bit more than the other board. try setting vcore to 1.4v if on stock cooler or 1.45v with a better aftermarket and see what happens.
EDIT: Also it's not just the less than stellar overclock I'm referring to. I knocked the cpu multiplier down to 6x and put it at 400fsb, still no post, still the same problems.

Starting to think the chip just doesn't allow the number 400 :p
He tried it already. Like I said, I wouldn't be surprised if MOST boards are handicapped for now.
 
hmm, someone else was having similar issues, but it turned out they forgot to set the ram speed. you running 1:1?

what i'd probably do if i were in your position right now would be to try manipulating bsel flags to force 1066. it's a whole lot easier now with lga, and you can use conductive ink and white out to take care of everything. real easy and real easily removable
 
the E4300 is only designed to run at 200 MHz clock, not 266 MHz like the Conroes.

That is a huge difference.

People seem to think they are getting an E6600 for a bargain price -- no that's not what you're getting. You are getting a low end Intel chip. Why should anyone expect to get 400 MHz out of a chip that was designed to do 200 MHz ??
 
the E4300 is only designed to run at 200 MHz clock, not 266 MHz like the Conroes.

That is a huge difference.

People seem to think they are getting an E6600 for a bargain price -- no that's not what you're getting. You are getting a low end Intel chip. Why should anyone expect to get 400 MHz out of a chip that was designed to do 200 MHz ??

nah
 
the E4300 is only designed to run at 200 MHz clock, not 266 MHz like the Conroes.

That is a huge difference.

People seem to think they are getting an E6600 for a bargain price -- no that's not what you're getting. You are getting a low end Intel chip. Why should anyone expect to get 400 MHz out of a chip that was designed to do 200 MHz ??

Right. The problem then, perhaps, is the raised expectations from seeing reviewers getting 3.3 and 3.4ghz out of e4300's. I mean, how much time do reviewers really spend on this stuff? If they can get it that easily....

Maybe they had some better samples too though, since most of the reviews were done pre-release.

At any rate, I guess we'll find out once and for all, give me a week to get an e6400 or 6600 delivered to my door.

To not be able to get past 3.0ghz on an e4300, after all those sweet reviews, is, at the very best, disappointing. :(
 
Hello OP,

i got the same chip (aka Fry's $149 combo)

and here's my story:

i jumped on the Fry's deal of $149 for E4300 OEM + ECS p4m800pro combo, and then went and got the following:
- Biostar tforce 965pt (using beta bios 119 to get 400Mhz for memory)
- arctic cooling freezer 7 pro
- APEX AL-B500E ATX 500W
- Antec sx-635
- corsair xms2 2x1gb (675, 4-4-4-12)
- geforce 6100 turbo cache (yes, i know... saving up for geforce 8600)

after 2 days of tweaking, this is where system is stable at:
- 3G (9x334) (system wont POST with 333x9 for some reason)
- 1.475 vcore
- 1.4 Vfsb
- 1.45 Vmch
- 2.2 vdimm 5-5-5-15
- 36/56 idle/load from CoreTemp

i am also able to get system stable at:
- 2.83G (315x9)
- 1.35 Vcore
- 1.2 Vfsb
- 1.25 Vmch
- 1.8 Vdimm 4-4-4-12
- 24/44 idle/load from CoreTemp

i am afraid to go higher than 1.475 Vcore as i am reaching CoreTemp reading 56 degrees under Orthos Blend full load.

am i limited by:
- board?
- RAM?
- OEM E4300?

additional info:
- CPU's IHS seems concaved in... i need to apply a lot of AS5 (2 grain of rice size) to get good contact or CPU over heats and shuts down
- Freezer 7 Pro base seems flat, but it has really deep machined grooves
- still able to exchange/return parts, so i am not doing any lapping
 
I wonder if anyone has popped the ihs off a true allendale to compare yet
 
I have a D975XBX2 with e4300. Anything >265 won't POST, stable as a rock at 265 w/ stock voltages.

That's E6600 performance for <$150 with no effort ... I'm happy.
 
I have a D975XBX2 with e4300. Anything >265 won't POST, stable as a rock at 265 w/ stock voltages.

That's E6600 performance for <$150 with no effort ... I'm happy.

except you're missing half the cache. you could look into manipulating the bsel flags so that it thinks it's a native 266fsb, and go from there. it might force badaxe to use higher strap if that's the problem right now
 
I have the same cpu cooler, cpu, mb, but my ram is g skill ddr800 1.8-2.0 stock 5x5x5x12

I can get 355FSB but it fails orthos. I'm having issues at finding the best FSB. I've been reading about this set up and pretty much we will be EXTREMELY lucky to get 375 FSB with the type of set up with have. I think it all comes down to better RAM and temperature.

after 2 days of tweaking, this is where system is stable at:
- 3G (9x334) (system wont POST with 333x9 for some reason)
- 1.475 vcore
- 1.4 Vfsb
- 1.45 Vmch
- 2.2 vdimm 5-5-5-15
- 36/56 idle/load from CoreTemp

i am also able to get system stable at:
- 2.83G (315x9)
- 1.35 Vcore
- 1.2 Vfsb
- 1.25 Vmch
- 1.8 Vdimm 4-4-4-12
- 24/44 idle/load from CoreTemp

The only problem i see with the top one is the VMCH at 1.45 and maybe the 1.4 VFSB. Try the top one w/o the high vmch and vfsb. and do 250fsb. did you get the LATEST 119 bios? there are 2 more after the 1st 119 release.

I'm also considering checking my artic freezer and maybe returning it. i don't know yet.
 
additional thoughts:
- heat/voltage issue - seems e4300 needs a lot of Vcore to get past 315FSB (at least for me) and heat doesn't scale well with higher V (again, at least for me)
- MB strap problem? read somewhere our MB has really terrible strap issue from 350FSB-420. but i am a newbie OC'er and i am not sure how to lower the mult and try 8x430 or 7x500 (maintaining my higher OC settings and simply changing mult to 8 and FSB to 430 does not POST)
- i could be limited by RAM, i am unable to find any OC info for my Corsair's revision (5.2)

all this makes me wish i ordered E6300, Asus 650i and Scythe Ninja Rev.B instead... T_T

p.s. but i guess i could numb myself with: the $$$ saved from the more expensive parts could be well spend in video card... (ie. my el cheapo E4300 setup + geforce 8600 ultra > E6300 + 7600GS! gaming-wize =P)
 
additional thoughts:
- heat/voltage issue - seems e4300 needs a lot of Vcore to get past 315FSB (at least for me) and heat doesn't scale well with higher V (again, at least for me)
- MB strap problem? read somewhere our MB has really terrible strap issue from 350FSB-420. but i am a newbie OC'er and i am not sure how to lower the mult and try 8x430 or 7x500 (maintaining my higher OC settings and simply changing mult to 8 and FSB to 430 does not POST)
- i could be limited by RAM, i am unable to find any OC info for my Corsair's revision (5.2)

all this makes me wish i ordered E6300, Asus 650i and Scythe Ninja Rev.B instead... T_T

p.s. but i guess i could numb myself with: the $$$ saved from the more expensive parts could be well spend in video card... (ie. my el cheapo E4300 setup + geforce 8600 ultra > E6300 + 7600GS! gaming-wize =P)


I do not regret my purchase. even if i only run 3Ghz, i know i purchased a cheap mobo, good ddr2 800 ram, and the lower end Core 2 Duo that overclocked at 3GHz is great for whatever i need to do. maybe towards the end of this year or early next year i can buy a faster Core 2 Duo and double my 2G of ram and still come out ahead. I may not be running 3.6 or anything crazy like that but with my every day use the difference between 2.8Ghz and 3.4Ghz won't really matter. I'm not folding@home or trying to create 3D rendering for Pixar. I'm just using my PC like 90% of the people and play CoD2, some WoW, and watch some DvDs. Does it really matter that I can't overclock 90% over stock speed? not for me :)

good luck w/ your overclocking. I'll stick to anything faster than 3Ghz. right now 3.05 works for me.
 
I have the same cpu cooler, cpu, mb, but my ram is g skill ddr800 1.8-2.0 stock 5x5x5x12

I can get 355FSB but it fails orthos. I'm having issues at finding the best FSB. I've been reading about this set up and pretty much we will be EXTREMELY lucky to get 375 FSB with the type of set up with have. I think it all comes down to better RAM and temperature.



The only problem i see with the top one is the VMCH at 1.45 and maybe the 1.4 VFSB. Try the top one w/o the high vmch and vfsb. and do 250fsb. did you get the LATEST 119 bios? there are 2 more after the 1st 119 release.

I'm also considering checking my artic freezer and maybe returning it. i don't know yet.

The MB strap problem is real - your northbridge overclocks like mad between 350-400, and the P5B doesn't have enough Vmch to drive it there. Once you pass 400 clock, all will be calm. For an experiment, try 1.45 Vcore, max out the Vfsb and Vmch. Set the clock at 401. Select the multiplier to 8, not 9 (these MBs allow you to do that, which is quite nice), so that your core speed will be 8x401 MHz = 3.2 GHz. Go easy on the RAM by setting it to the 1:1 clock (ie. DDR2-800 on the pulldown menu in bios) and easy on its Vdimm (2ish should be fine for that G.Skill bargain ram). You see it POST? Now gradually juice up the FSB and find your CPU's limit. You'll need to feed it a bit more Vcore as you go, and that limit will be determined by your cooling and personal risk tolerance for temp.

One major problem however is that by going past 400 where the next MB strap kicks in, your actual RAM throughput will be lower than good settings at 360. Try comparing using Memtest under each scenario. Depending on your ram, you'll probably find that this config gets better actual performance at a 9x multi with 350ish FSB than using a 8x multi at 410 FSB.
 
The Firingsquad review used $500 ram to get it past 3.58. So if you got $500 corsair C3 ram, and you can't get past 3.0ghz then you should be upset.
 
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